I’ll be driving back to the riding this morning, after one of the more interesting weeks of my short reincarnated political career. All you have to do is have a gander at the last couple of postings here to get a sense of the craziness that has been aswirl in Ottawa. More than 500 people posted comments yesterday, and about a million came to visit. In one hour yesterday I received 350 emails, many of them hundreds of crafted words in length.
It was the web-enhanced culmination to a few days which had a story line like this: Tory MP drives to Ottawa. MP (and rest of country) surprised at cabinet appointment of defecting Liberal and unelected party organizer. MP’s constituents react badly. MP blogs and quotes voters. Media scrums MP, who suggests defecting Liberal minister should actually get elected as a Conservative. MP chewed out by party. Chewed out again. And once more.
That’s pretty much it. And yet by last night I was being called everything from a left-wing moron to a folk hero. My crime at first was answering some media questions about Minister Emerson. But that was only the prelude to the main event, which turned out to be an MP’s actual job in this town. Seems the party and the PMO deemed me to be extremely unhelpful, and wished me silenced. But many others saw this in a different light, since when an MP is shut down, the voters he or she represents suddenly fade to black.
I found it ironic this afternoon in talking to one veteran Tory MP– who called me in support of my stance against the party bosses – that we’d almost reversed roles. Here I was, a former Progressive Conservative, in trouble for talking about the need for more democracy while key former populist Reformers around here were fighting for less of it. But as this guy said, “I didn’t hang around Ottawa for 12 years in opposition to be told to shut up now.â€
No, and I didn’t drive here on Monday for that, either. David Emerson may be on record this week as saying he regretted getting into politics, because of the controversy, but I have a different story to tell. I worked my butt off for eight months, knocked on 25,000 doors and campaigned my way through two pairs of cowboy boots to get the letters “MP†after my name. I am proud of it, take my constituents very seriously, and understand my job here is to represent them while I fight to empower MPs and thereby give the voters more voice. From time to time, MPs may be inconvenient for the newly-minted prime minister’s office, but I think they’d better get used to it.
Now, not everyone buys my view of things. Criticism abounds among people dropping by this blog, and there are some serious concerns. Some people call me a fool and a showboat who likes to chase reporters, but this week it was the media that found me.
Others say I am a disturber right now because I didn’t make it into Harper’s cabinet. But I invite you to read back on this blog a month ago, or four, or six, and see for yourself. I never coveted cabinet, never lobbied for it, never asked for a promotion and was actually relieved when it passed me by. I’ve been in cabinet before and – thank you very much – I prefer being free to do my job as an MP instead of singing from the Team Government songsheet.
Some critics are accusing me of screwing up the best chance Conservatives have had in 13 years to change the country, by raising concerns about a floor-crossing Liberal, and then about MP freedoms. Fair enough. But explain that to a constituent of mine who remembers the comments when Belinda bolted, who wonders why this is so different, and just voted out the last MP who sent around brochures telling people the government was unqualifiedly great. The voters get it.
This Conservative government will do big things for Canadians when it blows open the doors and windows of Parliament, giving back responsibility and authority to all the representatives of the people. More free votes, more powerful committees, more cooperation (needed in a minority government) and less totalitarianism by the PMO could re-energize this place. I’m proud to be an MP, dammit. Just let me do my job – from being able to ask relevant questions, to bringing in that Middle Class financial agenda I’ve been working on.
There are 308 bright people here, costing taxpayers a bundle. What a radical notion if we treated them all like somebodies. Almost like – you know – they represented an entire country.
Anyway, I’m on the 4o1 now. The best view of Ottawa today is in my rear view mirror.
208 comments ↓
Hello All
I have just read through the hundreds of postings that Mr. Turner has received over the past few days on this BLOG. I read passion, I read support and I read long absent Canadian political process participation. The recent issues have sparked that passion – Mr. Turner was only a catalyst.
I am a Halton constituent and received from Mr. Garth Turner MP, during this last election, a gift that I will cherish forever. Upon an email request, he came to my house and answered the questions that were poised by me and about 25 other people in the area who wanted to get to know who he was, and his position on various issues, better.
Here is what we learned, that night:
Mr. Turner, at first blush, appeared to us to be somewhat aloof, a tad arrogant and, for some, somewhat condescending in his media pieces. This first impression and perception was totally and absolutely reset when we actually interacted with this truly special, gifted and passionate man. The truth that was revealed to us during our evening together was that, Mr. Turner is solid in his own skin, principled in his perspectives and unconventional but measured in his passionate actions.
He is bred and “wired” to be our national voice and constiuency representative. He demonstrated that he would use his past political knowledge, his skills in issue dissemination and adjudication and his extensive business acumen to make the right decisions. (Note: he did not promise to always do or represent what we think we want – but he did promise that he would look to and fight for what we actually needed. Big lesson for me! My opinion may not always be right – I would hate to think that I was responsibile for forcing my MP to make wrong decisions.)
Here is what he promised us, that night:
Mr. Turner promised that he would, first, listen to us. He offered to join us again, assuredly annually and if/when requested, to again listen, to consider and then to respond. He promised to do what was right on the national scene – not what was easy. He promised that he would represent the needs of all of the constiuents in the predominantly middle-class Halton.
He promised that he would innoculate himself, and try to protect against, catching (again – as he did in his first stint as MP) the “political disease” that infects every new MP; an incidious outbreak whereby the trappings of power and the honour of the position of MP become the prize and the constituent becomes a nuisance. He promised that he would be a true leader for the constituents of Halton, and that he would not sit quietly by.
Here is what we we have seen, since that night:
Mr. Turner held a Town Hall meeting during the election to show us how he would reach out to and communicate with consituents. He has fufilled his promise to continue this BLOG – Note: we didn’t ask him to post everyday – we only asked that this forum be retained for us to post and communicate with him and to him. He has done what he thought was right – not what he thought was easy. He has been real.
Thank you, Mr. Turner. We need you to keep it real, for all of us. As you say above, do your job.
Still can’t help but feel you are doing more harm than good for this country. Can you not go ahead with your work but stay away from the media for a couple of days, I am getting a little tired of seeing you blast your party on TV every 8 seconds!
Fool on the Hill? Well said!
I read your blog for the first time today, led there by references to it in the national media, who are feasting on your “principled carcass”. They just lap up your suggestion that your “seat in the House of Commons will be visible only during lunar eclipses”.
Lost in all of the indignant self-righteous finger pointing is the thought that, perhaps, our country would be best served by Mr. Emerson’s talents in his assigned portfolio. Just weeks ago, Mr. Emerson was serving in the Martin cabinet in the same role and apparently, at least in Mr. Harper’s estimation, doing a fine job of it. Now suddenly, one election later, he is totally unsuitable for the responsibility, accordingly to Liberal standard bearers and party hacks.
And with the lukewarm reception given by some Conservatives, one wonders if they have missed the point. He was elected to serve our country, his province and his riding. He is Vancouver-Kingsway’s man in Ottawa, not Ottawa’s man in Vancouver-Kingsway. What difference does it make if he wears a blue tie or a red tie to work. Is he or is he not qualified to serve our country?
Is our country well served by a “national” government which contains no representation from Canada’s three largest cities? If no effort had been made on the part of our newly-minted Prime Minister to resolve this dilemma, one can be quite sure that political junkies from sea to shining sea would have bemoaned this lack of representation at the table of power, and would have decried Mr. Harper’s lack of imagination in providing a creative solution to the problem.
This argument is not about a move that shifted the balance power from one party to another (Ã la Ms. Stronach). The Conservative Party of Canada clearly had the plurality of seats, by a good margin. This is more about where Mr. Emerson can best serve the interests of his country, his province and his riding.
It occurs to me that Mr. Emerson is less driven by party ideology and dogma, and more by wanting to contribute something to the country that has provided him with so much over the course of his career. And the constituents of Vancouver Kingsway, it seems to me, would be better served by a voice at the table, than one on the opposition benches. After all, that’s what opposition members do. They oppose and object. They don’t do. Government’s do. And David Emerson has proven himself to be a doer of the first rank.
Let us lay aside all this partisan bickering and look to he and his colleagues to get on with the job of governing in the best interests of our nation. If they do a marvelous job on our behalf over the coming months, perhaps we can reward them with a majority position at the next election. And if they are found wanting, we hold them accountable by voting for some other party.
I wish you and your colleagues well. Though you, my friend, have a mighty deep hole to get out of. I am reminded of a comment that Preston Manning made back in the early nineties when asked to comment on the state of the federal finances at the time. He said, “The first thing you have to do if you want to get out of the hole, is to stop diggingâ€. Well said!
Although I am a big liberal, I appreciate what you are doing by going on Canada AM and discussing how everyone is upset at Harpers moves thus far. I hope he does not shaft you that bad because if you were a liberal than I would back you at my full capacity of canvassing and such.
Are you more critical of Minister Emerson or the PMO? The former Liberal was wooed after all, and, unlike a fellow Conservative ex-MP from BC, Mr. Emerson wasn’t wearing a wire.
There’s more than one fool on the Hill. But that’s okay, Garth; we ( the electorate ) are used to being fooled. Political parties always decry the insincerity of their opponents but, once in power, behave in the same manner. Does this sound cynical? Gee, I wonder how I got that way?
I am reminded of the Swan & Flanders line, ‘ Always be sincere, whether you mean it or not! “
I am a Liberal. I would vote for you rather than Emerson any day of the week – you embody what democracy should stand for. ( as I say this I ask that you consider…I am a gay canadian planning to marry shortly, so have some strong views on upcoming parliamentary issues).
Now, don’t presume I would agree with your politics, but certainly your sense of ethics in this matter.
Harper bought Emerson. The transaction was unethical, and betrayed the voters in Emersons riding, and the integrity of Goverment.
The folks in Emerson’s riding should be petitioning for his removal from office.
Harper should rescind his cabinet posting and apologise to Canadians.
You may end up “ostracised, alienated, and ignored” by the Conservatives for allowing character to stand in the way of compliance, but the place you will have in the minds eye of the voters, the people who are in theory represented on the hill, will indeed be far larger.
Ever thought of being a Liberal?
Best of luck ‘on the hill!
A quick quiz. Which is more effective: working in the caucus to build a consensus for your ideas, then having them introduced and adopted by the Government? Or working your issues through the media, creating dissension among your peers?
Nobody has a problem with an MP with ideas, and who is willing to raise the issues on behalf of their constituents. But if you don’t know how to influence people you won’t your ideas advanced very far.
How can empowering MPs do more harm than good for the country??
Harper is not God, is not King, is not President. He is only Prime or first Minister.
When the un-elected and unaccountable back room hacks like Doug Finley have more influence and power than elected MP, then the system needs to be changed – and the Liberals are no different.
As Canadian author Bruce Hutchinson wrote, ” for we are young my brothers and full of doubt, and we have listened too long to timid men”
Stand up caucus members. Don’t make your first act as a government member one of being on your knees before the alter of potential promotion. You may never find your feet again.
Like the ads said, “STAND UP FOR CANADA”
Having campaigned so long and so hard for reform and accountability, it is unseemly for the PM to be calling Mr. Turner to task for saying what MANY people in this country (many of them Conservatives and former Reformers)are feeling about Mr. Emerson (and what many Conservatives said about Belinda Stronach). Mr. Turner will face party discipline? Shades of Jean Chretien. I thought you guys were supposed to be different from the Liberals. Was Mr. Harper spinning a line of BS all along or does power really corrupt that quickly?
“But explain that to a constituent of mine who remembers the comments when Belinda bolted, who wonders why this is so different, and just voted out the last MP who sent around brochures telling people the government was unqualifiedly great. The voters get it. Time Ottawa did, too.”
This constituent of yours must be as unintelligent and uncritical as you. The difference between the two is that (1) Emerson is qualified for the job in the cabinet, whereas Belinda was not; (2) Belinda was wooed on the eve of a confidence vote which the government had been avoiding for weeks, whereas Emerson switched at the beginning of the mandate, when there was no threat of the government collapsing. (3) Emerson brings experience to the cabinet, while belinda only brought her pretty face;
Really? — Garth
It helps to know that there are still a few honourable gentlemen in our government. I’m an old guy who had almost given up on Canada as a true democracy (one-party states are not democracies) until this latest election. Now, with unprincipled arrogance that rises to the Dingwall standard Harper has likely provided all the ammunition needed to defeat his government and return us to a single party existence.
I hope that Mr. Turner is able to somehow help the Conservative Party recover from the black eye that our new Prime Minister has given it.
And here I thought our boy Stevie would be different, oh the naivety.
Kudos Mr. Turner. At least one of you had the guts. Hello? Numbers 1-123? Anyone home? Nope. Figures.
I really couldn’t care less what political banner one stands under. As long as the voices of the constituents are heard and represented in Government, I will support your efforts.
I had hoped that a CPC government would begin to show direction away from this partisan bullsh*t and begin allowing the voices of Canadians to be heard regardless of issue or assumed insult. Perhaps, government reform at the federal level is beyond repair and we should be rebuilding at the provincial level.
Like Quebec has.
Garth my Dad used to say “a wise man listens and waits for the perfect opportunity to speak”. The constant bullshit coming from you is starting to make me gag. You are starting to sound self rightous and will not make a bit of difference in the big picture. I wish you were in my constituency so I could start a petition to get your sorry ass out of Ottowa.
Maybe the next time you have a problem with a member of your team, Mr. Turner, you could do what we always suggest others to do as a first step in any conflict resolution in business:
Talk to that person first; maybe get a better idea of some of the reasonings; even express your displeasure. Maybe suggest a solution that would have been more palatable to you.
If you had asked Mr. Harper for a meeting to express your concerns and he had bullied you or ignored you or not been considerate then you could have gone to the media to get them to help you stab him in the back; meanwhile recruiting the Liberal, NDP and Bloc opposition to help you twist the knife.
Maybe next time your policies don’t match the party’s that you ran for you could get on a committee that works to change policy.
Just a thought.
I have been a long-time Liberal supporter, although I did not vote for them during this election and the previous one. I abstained in the last two votes because I could not make up my mind on who to vote for, and I did not want to give it to a party that I would throw half-hearted support to. The Liberals governed the country irresponsibly at times during their 13-year tenure in Parliament Hill. I could not get myself to vote for them again. It was encouraging to see that a Conservative minority government was elected, because the party’s campaign platform was predicated on integrity–free of the ethical blemishes that tainted the Liberal brand.
Harper’s appointment of the duo, especially David Emerson, shattered my confidence in his ability to run a responsible and accountable government. This man decried corruption and cronyism within Liberal ranks, and now he and Peter McKay are spinning this questionable move as a need, rather than want. Irregardless of the need for regional representation, we have by-elections to redefine the electoral representation within a government. Fostering political cross-overs is the most unethical and undemocratic way of accomplishing change in the electoral makeup of government. It undermines the confidence of voters and is an insult to the process of democratically electing a member to represent your ideological discourse in parliament.
I may not see eye-to-eye with the ideologies that most Tories share, but as a Canadian citizen, I expect accountability and integrity from any member who represents a Canadian riding.
Mr. Turner, you are an honourable man for speaking out against undemocratic acts of governance by the Tories. If 307 other members had your discourse and courage to examine and criticize every single act of corruption, Canada would be in a better state than it currently is in. I encourage you to continue to speak candidly when your opinions are sought after, as you are the voice for the wonderful people of Milton. To tow the party line and distort the voice of your constituents, is to defeat democracy at its grassroots. Now if only others will follow your lead, will Canada then be governed by a truly democratic government.
I’m not sure if this is a stupid question or not – perhaps someone older and wiser than I could answer…
If Emerson was so valuable, could he not have been appointed to cabinet as a Liberal? Especially in a minority government when the common wisdom is to appoint a speaker from an opposition party in order to reduce the number of votes against you, why can’t you just appoint any MP to cabinet? Why was it necessary to “cross the floor” to serve the Canadian people? Maybe it’s time for the PM (now and future) to start making his government less partisan and more inclusive by appointing members from all parties. Just think, we could have a green party cabinet minister…
Now that i think of it, i’m pretty sure it’s not so stupid after all.
IF YOU’RE SO UNHAPPY, PLEASE LEAVE!!!
EVERYBODY HATES A LITTLE CRY BABY LIKE YOURSELF. I’M SURE YOU COULD CROSS OVER TO THE LIBERALS AND YOU CAN BECOME THE HYPOCRITE YOU SO RICHLY DESERVE TO BE.
I live in the area of Emerson’s riding and I am glad to see all of the talk and debate arising from this issue. I am glad that the country is talking about these issues and not just my neighbours. Debate is always healthy but standing up for what you believe is right is not always easy. Thank you for speaking up Mr. Turner.
“Really? — Garth”
Which of the three claims I made are you questioning?
The sexist one. — Garth
Mr. Turner (and all readers,)
As someone with a bit of an understanding of politics, I truly appreciate your situation. You decided to take the high road – the moral road – and look what it has cost you. In a true democracy, individuals run because they believe they can make a difference for the people, and run for a party because it’s ideals match their ideals. The ideals that Mr. Harper ran on are very different than the ones he has demonstrated since he has been in power. I won’t go so far as to say this is proof he has “a hidden agenda” but the implications are there.
It has been said that Harper is a smart man, that he understands policy. Fair enough. Karl Marx was a smart man who understood social inequity. What neither of these men understood is people, what they need from their politicians and what they deserve to expect.
Mr. Harper might have formed the ideal government. Time will tell. What is known right now is that he broke his principles – betrayed his word – to deliver it. What the people of Canada need and deserve right now is not a government that practices good policy – the Liberals did that. What we want is a government that is able to understand our concerns about democracy and respect them. Concerns about honesty amd commitment. If the new Prime Minister breaks his word now to acheive a goal, how do we know he won’t do so in the future? If he refuses to address the public now, how do we know he’ll do so in the future?
Canadians want democracy. They want to believe in their politicians, more than they want “the ideal policy.” As a democracy, in the end, all Canadians want is to participate. The current situation of not just two members, but two ministers who fly in complete disobedience to Mr. Harper’s supposed principles is not just troubling – it is frightening.
Mr. Turner, in expressing your point of view – which you were elected to do – you have drawn the wrath of the party upon you. Every press release that is against you, you will have to wonder who wrote it. Every e-mail that paints you as a traitor (for disagreeing with the behaviour of a true traitor) you will have to wonder if they are the words of a constituent or a Conservative Party Staffer trained in wordcraft and ordered to destroy your reputation. What you have undertaken, in short, is the end of your political advancement for the furtherance of what you believe.
It is what we expected froom Harper, but did not receive. Bless you for your fortitude. Though your political career may wither, your conscience is clear – and Canada stands with you.
I respect you Garth, a lot. But I hope the party can heal this split/situation and you stay in the party and influence the government towards positive parliamentary reform.
good luck!
I am a youth living in the Vancouver Kingsway riding. I would like to say thank you for standing your ground and speaking your mind in regards to the David Emerson situation.
The blatant hypocrisy demonstrated by members of the Conservative are shameful.
Please continue to advocate for democracy, calling for the resignation of David Emerson and a subsequent by-election.
Garth, until his death, Chuck Cadman was my MP. I did not always agree with him on the issues, but he always listened to my — and everyone’s — concerns. The best thing he did, and he always did it right, was to represent his constituents to Ottawa rather than make excuses for what the government had done to us.
I really miss him.
You remind me of him.
Garth, I’ve been a supporter of yours for years, read most of your books and have always admired your principles. Thanks for speaking out on the Emerson/Fortier cabinet appointments. However, as you say, I think it’s time we all took a chill pill and moved on. You’ve said what needed to be said; please don’t make the mistake of grinding this axe much further. We don’t want your important voice blunted in Ottawa because of partisan matters.
Emerson is probably the most qualified person for the job given his background and if he can resolve the softwood lumber file with the US, he’ll likely become a Canadian folk hero. Does the whole process have a bad smell? Sure it does. However, I’m willing to give Harper the benefit of the doubt. I believe he thought he had to make an unpopular decision for the good of the country and hopefully time will prove him right. The man’s not an idiot, I’m sure he realized the poopstorm he’d stir up.
You’ve said many times that you’re in Ottawa to represent the people rather than the other way around. The same could be said of Emerson. There’s a certain irony in the fact that you don’t put the Conservative logo on your website. If you sincerely embrace that, why would it matter whether Emerson was elected as a Liberal? After all, it’s his constituents he’s representing, isn’t it? And how would he better server them: in government or in opposition?
Food for thought…
During my years of involvement in public life I have observed that people who move from leadership positions in business into elected office draw on experience and practice that can sometimes lead to problems. They mistakenly think there are similarities in the way of doing things that are really not there.
What is acceptable practice in business is not – or should not be – in public office. When I was a candidiate for office I sometimes had business people who were working as volunteers on my campaign say things and suggest approaches that I considered totally unethical politically. In fundraisning, for example, one person asked me, “Dave when we ask for donations from business owners what can we say that you will do for them?”
When told them to say that I will do the best job possible as Mayor of the city, they would ask again, and press me on the issue. No, what can we really say that you will do for them, once you are elected? When I realized that they were not asking about public policy, but business favours, I had to insist over and over again that they could not promise anything like that, only that I will do my best to implement my publicly stated proposals and directions.
This was not true of all business voolunteers, but I did hear it quite often. I believe that Mr. Emerson ran into a similar clash of culture, when he assumed it was no big deal to leave a leadership position in one ‘company’ – i.e. Liberal government, and move to another – the Conservative government – something that happens all the time in the business world. In doing that recently he forgot one really important factor, namely, his accountability to the people in his constituency.
I do think there are valid and ethical reasons to change parties, but this recent example of switching lies on the extreme opposite end of the spectrum. If a party changes its direction from what was set out in an election, and that becomes a major point of principal for an MP, then that MP is on solid ground to switch or move to an independent role. In the case of Mr Harper, it is he who has changed direction on points of principal that he so recently expressed with vehemence – just weeks before the elcetion.
All the best to Garth Turner. Hold the; stick to your guns.
Hats off to Garth Turner for
Until there is a change of rules all Parliamentarians are free agents and can choose any party they want to in order to serve their constituents.
My question- is there any similar democracy to ours where floor crossing is banned?
If yes- how is it working?
Maybe a little research on a committee examining this issue could be undertaken by Mr. Turner and then he could provide a reasoned rationalle to changing Canada’s parliament.
If Mr. Harper doesn’t like what Mr. Turner says, why does Mr. Harper not look for another job? Mr. Turner represents what Canadians are longing for more than anything else in the jellyfish bowl on the Hill: Backbone!
Other than that, however, everyone seems to be barking up the wrong tree, i.e. posing the wrong question. The question is, is a constituent supposed to vote for the candidate or for the party. If he/she votes for the candidate, Emerson’s constituents may not be served bad after all. If Emerson’s constituents voted for the party i.e. Liberal, they truly must feel betrayed.
There is no answer to this dilemma. There is only a solution and that is electoral reform!
As I understand, in Germany for example, every constituent has two votes. With one vote he/she elects the party he/she would like to see in Parliament. With the other vote he/she elects the candidate of his/her constituency. Probably makes too much sense around here.
A quick fix would be that MP’s may cross the floor, following their believes and values, however, can not be appointed to cabinet. Do away with the carrots!
I have to say Mr. Turner I’m extremely disappointed in your performance over the last 24 hours. You could have stated you don’t support floor crossing and ended it there instead of providing media fodder for the opposition. I sincerely regret voting for you on Jan. 23rd.
Garth,
I can certainly understand why you oppose the appointments of Emerson and Fortier, and I can’t fault you for giving voice to constituents who were disillusioned by them.
But as someone who voted for and wants a Conservative government that will last more than simply months, who believes in it’s plan and once wants to see it be put into the action, I cannot say that I entirely appreciate the way you’ve gone about this.
You would be right to say in your piece in caucus. You were right for passing on your concerns to the Prime Minister. But you’ve gone beyond that now.
No, you have to “sing from the PMO songbook†per se, but constantly beating your own leader down on your blog, for the whole world to see, was simply unnecessary. And after you write a post that you titled “Moving On,†you continued to dump on him.
Now, in the haze of being put through the painful rigors of party discipline over the past two days, I can’t blame you for feeling angry. But you ought to remember that the whole premise for opposing Emerson’s move is that he was disloyal to his party. The outrage is predicated on the idea that the people of Vancouver-Kingsway weren’t just voting for David Emerson, but for the Liberal Party, and that the party label he ran under ought to have meant something.
Just as Emerson was elected as a Liberal, you were elected as a Conservative. Emerson chose to stand behind Paul Martin; you chose to stand behind Stephen Harper. And despite what either of you have come to believe, you were both elected because of your party label. We don’t vote to simply send 308 independents to Parliament, we vote to choose who will form our government and who will be a Prime Minister. As the saying goes, the name on the front of the jersey is just as important as the one on the back.
I think you really need to take a step back, assess the bigger picture, and ask yourself: “do I want this Prime Minister, and this government to succeed.†You need to ask yourself if throwing aside discretion and endlessly blaring your opposition to these appointments to any and all who will hear it is worth serving is worth sacrificing all the good things that this new Prime Minister and this new government were elected to do.
I don’t know about you, but I want those things to go ahead. I want the Accountability Act to succeed. I want the GST to be cut. I want mandatory minimum sentences. I want to see the end of conditional sentences for violent criminals. I want to see parents get the childcare money that was promised to them. I want to see our military to given the tools it needs and the respect it deserves. I want to see the fiscal imbalance addressed. And yes, I want to see Senate elections.
I voted for these things. I believe in them. And I believe in the Prime Minister who will deliver them. And the idea that could all be thrown away because Conservatives yet again become more consumed with turning the knives inward than actually getting the job done really upsets me.
Because that is exactly what is going to happen if this goes on. The Liberals can only be looking on and laughing, salivating at the notion that their triumphant return to government is just around the corner. And rest assured, if that happens, any chance of changing Ottawa for the better will die with it.
So with that, I will say yes, fight for your principles. Yes, fight for your constituents. Yes, fight for democracy. But dammit, try to exercise a measure of discretion from here on out. As admirable as your motives might be not set out to sabotage the leader you chose to stand behind, and the government you chose to serve in.
We have a common cause and a common enemy. And that enemy’s name isn’t Stephen Harper. Do not forget that.
Garth. You are a big man in my eyes and in my opinion, a true politician with integrity. I support you 100 percent. Hopefully some of your peers will support your courageous stand.
I feel deeply betrayed by Harper and while what he did with Emerson and Fortier may be legal, in a democracy, I believe it is immoral and unethical. He is the king of hypocracy in my opinion. With his inflated ego, he forgot that he was elected by the will of the people and Emerson and Fortier were not. It is time to give the NDP a chance to prove there is a political party with integrity because so far, the Conservatives who make the decisions certainly don’t seem to have any more integrity and ethics than the Liberals they spat on. Maybe somebody should tell Stephen that the end doesn’t justify the means.
A note to all the Liberal and NDP supporters posting here:
Garth Turner wasn’t elected as a Liberal. He wasn’t elected as an NDPer.
He was elected as a Conservative. That is something to keep in mind.
I’ve spoken to a few of my Conservative friends who live in Emerson’s riding. Overall, the people of Vancouver did not want a Conservative representing them. Period.
I’m a Conservative volunteer and I’m also strong enough to admit when we’ve made a mistake. Harper made a HUGE mistake and he’s going to pay a political price for it.
At the end of the day, it’s the everyday Conservatives (like you and I) who will pay this price. Ontario (I believe) was warming up to the Conservative Party. I don’t think this is a nail in the coffin, but another mistake of this magnitude could easily have us back to the ‘Kim Campbell’ days… and that’s no joke
Wow, I am impressed by your principled stand. You actually seem to understand what ethical behaviour means. No wonder you are being villified by those who simply follow their rigid ideology. Garth, do Canada a favour: sit as an independent!
Thanks for calling BS when you saw it Garth!
I thought Stephen Harper was uber-smart, how did he not see the uproar this would create? I personally don’t care if someone crosses the floor, but the hypocrisy of appointing to the senate and now conveniently forgetting you said that floor crossers should have to resign and run in a by-election is too much. Or is it more of the same…
I cannot believe that there are people who actually think like you. You are not from Cuba are you? You are the one who does not get the point, “He was elected to serve our country, his province and his riding.†……..His riding did not elect him on this basis, as the outcry from his constituents is proving, it seems very likely he will have to resign under public pressure from said constituents. What difference does it make if he wears a blue tie or a red tie to work…….. That comment does not even merit a response. Is he or is he not qualified to serve our country? No! Because this is not cooperate Canada were a talented executive is fair game to be head-hunted to work for another organisation, with incentives like signing bonuses, increased salary & perks. He is not honorable & as we can see from his own mouth he arrogantly dismisses the feelings of the very people who worked for him by saying they have a sickness, I think that comment needs to be directed at himself, it is known amongst ordinary people “conceitâ€. Finally, you are either his personal PR consultant (which would explain why he is in the mess he is in), or David Emerson himself writing under an assumed name!
Sorry the above posting was directed at the comments by Paul Kristensen.
“A note to all the Liberal and NDP supporters posting here:
Garth Turner wasn’t elected as a Liberal. He wasn’t elected as an NDPer.
He was elected as a Conservative. That is something to keep in mind.”
Right. And Emerson was elected as a LIBERAL! Why don’t you keep that in mind, Brandon?
It’s not what you say, but how you say it.
I applaud your courage in stating that although you are a conservative you do not agree with this decision of your leader. As an MP you should be free to occasionaly question decisions and to at times disagree. How you do that is what determines the degree of respect you get. In this case you lost my respect – not for your stand but for how you presented it.
I respect the way Myron Thompson let us in his riding know, he did not approve of crossing the floor without going to the voters. I believe he said something to the effect of – personally I don’t think people should be allowed to cross the floor and I am sure I will get an earfull from my constituents. The point made. We know his position and he has represented us well. That was enough said. Most of us are still very much behind the Prime Minister, but on this one decision we may not agree.
The saddest words I have read in a long life of reading are those of Canadians who eagerly participate in the degradation of electoral democracy for purely partisan reasons, whether Liberal, Conservative, New Democrat, Bloq or Green.
Boy the “you know what”, really has hit the fan, right across the country, just one example:
http://www.torontosun.com/News/Columnists/Goldstein_Lorrie/2006/02/07/1429221.html
I am convinced Brian Mulroney must be Mr. Harpers senior advisor/PR consultant, that can be the only explanation for this PR disaster.
Mr. Halton, let me begin by saying that I’ve never voted Conservative, nor do I plan to, because of the policies that the Conservatives (in general) tend to sponser. That said, I think that you’re doing an excellent job at being a MP; MPs aren’t elected to obey the PMO, but are there to do their damnest to represent their constituents, and Canadians in general. You’re taking a principled stand against actions the PMO has taken that are morally and politically reprehensible. It’s good to see that there are still MPs that give a damn about their job, and are willing to fight for democratic responsibility in parliment. Congradulations on your first week in office, and I hope that you continue to seriously involve yourself in the democratic system as you have this past week!
There are a few issues here as I see them:David Emerson ran under the Liberal banner and was elected by the people of Vancouver/Kingsway as a Liberal. To cast off his Liberal affiliation with as much ease as he apparently did is an insult to the people who worked and voted for him.There is absolutely no reason why Stephen Harper could not have appointed David Emerson to the cabinet as a Liberal. I believe, in fact, that this would have been seen as an innovative and inclusive move. That his switch in allegiance does not affect the balance of power makes the switch in party affiliation all the more puzzling to me.Stephen Harper ran on a campaign of honesty and integrity in Ottawa — a change. His missteps this week fly in the face of his political promises; in less than one week his government is already showing signs it’s willing to play politics as usual in Ottawa, which doesn’t inspire any confidence in me personally that anything will change at all. Different pigs, same trough.All that said, I admire what Garth Turner has had the intestinal fortitude to stand up and do, and am disappointed by Stephen Harper’s reaction to it. I did not vote for any of the major parties in the last election (I voted Marijuana in protest), but if there were more people with the integrity and principles that Mr. Turner is demonstrating in Ottawa, I might have.
Having said all of that, I should also say that I really really don’t want another election anytime soon, and I hope we can all get past this and let the Conservatives have a try at it. I am still prepared to give Mr. Harper the benefit of the doubt here; I try to never ascribe to malice that which can be explained by ignorance, and I’m hoping that this is the case here.
I’m hoping too that David Emerson is worth the fuss; we need a good man in charge of the portfolios he’s been asked to oversee, and I would be very disappointed indeed if all the kafuffle that’s been raised was only the beginning of a long painful road.
So, in short, I’m disillusioned (but I was before), I’m not sure I trust Stephen Harper (but I’m not sure I did before), and I hope it all works out in the end (but I did before).
Here’s hoping my first two points of view change.
as a liberal, i still feel it isn’t a case of how qualified emerison is for the cabinet posting … thus, i applaud any member of parliment who stands up to represent democracy. if emerison was so good, why didn’t harper give him the cabinet and let him stand as a liberal; or atleast humour us for awhile and have him change parties after he had been in parliment a bit longer after the election.
and if harper converts some washroom as / for your office, just have him leave the paper … you’ll need it to clean up some of the mess harper creates. good luck!
Garth, your dignity and bravery are an example to us. I am amazed at the people who are telling you to shut up and sit down, and toe the party line.
You’re standing up for yourself and your constituents. I agree with what another poster said:
Stand as an independent. Any party that engages in this week’s shenanigans doesn’t deserve a man of your caliber.
And I say that as someone who voted Conservative in this election.
Mr. Turner: Thank you for restoring to me some faith in what a politician and public servant should be. I salute you for your honesty and integrity. You show that you were elected to serve the people not to serve any masters or masters’ master. Thank you again and I wish you the very best.
Sincerely, Joseph Cheng- Ajax, ON
“…and less totalitarianism by the PMO…”
Wow.
You’re a quick learner, Garth. Critics of Harper will always be sought after by the media. I hope you lose your nomination before the next election.
And think about looking up the definition of “totalitarianism.” I knew you were deficient in your understanding of Parliament and investing (yo Mr. Nortel). I’ll just add this to the list.
You blog some more tonight. Quoting (but not naming) a 12 year Alberta MP who agrees with you.
Shouldn’t be too hard to figure out who that would be. Likely not anyone named as a Minister or Principal Secretary.
Benoit, Epp, Hanger, Mills or Thompson.
How does one of your colleagues (or the PM) have a private conversation with you without it ending up on this blog and then in the newspaper?
The media is printing your blog almost verbatim.
Are you going to be a pipeline straight out of every caucus meeting?
I just can’t see that working out.
Garth – I didn’t vote for you specifically because of the party you ran under. However, I now applaud your integrity, and am glad to have you represent my family in Oakville.
Hi Garth – Many years ago, you spoke to our Sales and Ad Club in Kitchener-Waterloo while I was on the speakers committe. I have valued your opinion for many years as a result of our meeting.
As for the Emerson “transition”, while I agree that a by-election should be held before an elected official can “cross the floor”, the law does not currently require such action.
Therefore, I believe that at most you should only be advocating changes to the election act.
Thanks for listening and continued Good Luck.
To me, the issue is a simple one. Garth shows respect for the voting Canadian. David Emerson and Fortier show disdain for the voting Canadian.
A politician speaking for his constituents!?What a refreshing rarety these days.My hat goes off to you Garth.Whatever the future holds for you in the Conservative Party you will be among the few that can walk with your head held high.As far as Emmerson,how can he expect to face his constituents!!When one places a vote are they not voting for the person/party that shares their views and the direction they wish to see the country go?How is one to believe they are going to get what they vote for anymore?Shame on Emmerson.Shame on Harper.Shame on Stronach!
Mr. Turner, as a Liberal with certain conservative views, I wanted to say just how impressed I am with your ethical standpoint. I too was disgusted by many of the recent Liberal appointments and saw the Tories as a breath of (accountable) fresh air. While it seems I was quickly proved wrong, members such as yourself should be elevated for taking such a principled stand.
of course the liberal voters and MSM support you-you’re criticizing the party they love to hate.
don’t think it is any more than that, because it is not. Before you spoke out against your party, did they even know who you were or regalled you as a “folk hero”?
Nope.
Hang in there. Integrity is everything. And your boss’s complete boneheadedness is stunning. What is it your party has against being in power?
I expect nothing less from a Joe Clark Red Tory. My suspicion is this media love-fest that Turner has going at the moment is his 15 minutes of fame. He fully expected to be annointed to Cabinet and when he wasn’t, boo hooo to the media. I’m just hoping like heck he begins to find his voice as grating as I do and finally shuts up for a while.
Garth,
I can hardly believe Harper made such a blunder so early on with Emerson.
It goes against everything Reformers wanted when they started so many years ago. It’s so, well, Liberal of them.
Anyway, you are a breath of fresh air and have taken a brave stance early on. Honesty and integrity are everything, and in the end, all we have that is worth anything.
Keep up the good work and hold your ground. You will be rewarded.
Garth, you say your crime was to answer media questions. I would say your crime was not do some analysis before feeding the media frenzy. Your actions were knee jerk reactions, as seen in the last Liberal government. If Emerson and Fortier issues didn’t exist, the media would have started another media shark feeding frenzy on the fact there were no Conservative cabinet reps from Vancouver and Montreal! As a side comment on the media reporting – they missed the point that in Vancouver-Kingsway, the electorate were to lazy to get off their buts to go out and vote; only 58% bothered to exercise their right; only 20% voted for the Liberals. So those people shouldn’t complain too much about democracy!
You say you worked your butt off. Well, Stephen Harper did that too! He and his family has endured quite a lot of public slurring. He has been ridiculed by the media (cowboy outfit). He has been slurred (right winged neo-con, wanting to destroy Canada, leaving children in the cold, letting people “fend for themselves”, ice-man, shaking hands with his children, etc).
Stephen Harper is not a stupid man nor is he an insensitive man. Stephen Harper probably had to calculate the risks by reaching out to ensure Canadians are represented in the decision making of his cabinet. A true leader does not do the most easiest things to get everyone to like him and accomplishing nothing. We saw that in the previous Liberal government. Tons of priorities and either nothing done or things done mediocraly. My expectations of my leaders is to lead and not to dither or flail as the wind blows (dictates of a special interest group after another).
Garth, you’ve been around the block a few times, so you must know, that usually one esculates his concerns first to his colleagues, then, to his leader. And if nothing is resolved then to his constituents. Media should be last place to go to. These days, the media is just a source for sensations and not true reporting, as that type of reporting actually takes time and may not make the news headlines/deadlines or the 10 second sound bites!
Having said all that, Stephen Harper will be judged in time when his government starts to deliver their vision. Let’s see if the two risks Stephen has taken will be beneficial to all Canadians.
Garth Turner for Minsiter of Complex Files!
http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2006/02/10/shorter-garth-turner/
Like Garry Smith said (in these comments) go sit as an independent. I’m sure you’d be very principled and take a by-election for it.
Not all great candidates have such an ability to cut down the party that brought them and have the possibility of being re-elected by constituents, or dividing the majority of your voting supporters between you as an independent, and someone who will work within the CPC to make such changes to parliment without stabbing their own caucus.
At the end of the day, you are right that you represent your constituents; however, the present rules ensure you have the freedom to represent those values. Even you need to switch parties to avoid the heavy hand of a contraversy you couldn’t bear to support. Switching parties includes becomming an independent.
Real change would be building those policies through grassroots and through the party. By changing the rules to reflect what you are arguing are required for modern democracy. Changing the rules actually get’s things done for your country.
Perhaps you just haven’t noticed that you are no longer in the opposition seats. Time to work for change, and not at the expense of values and policies our country needs.
Well done Mr. Turner. You stated view point clear and unambiguously. Your constituents voted for accountability and you are delivering. Stating the truth is not always popular, however, it usually ends up being the right lane on a crowded political highway. Stick to your guns sir. And if the frying pan gets too hot, move down the highway to London and help us clean up this “white tight assed little town that thinks it is much bigger than it actually is”.
I have to state first that ideologically, I sit on the left. I work in the financial industry and that means when voting time comes around, I weigh all issues and then cast my vote to who best I feel is good for Canada. I have cast my vote to the NDP, Liberal and the PC and in each of these times, I did what I thought was best for Canada whether federally or provincially.
I did not like Paul Martin and his coup against Chrétien and I wanted to invest my vote in the Conservative camp, but Harper represented everything I do want in my Canada. In the 2004 election, I invested my vote in Paul Martin to save my Canada from the Prairies Taliban. Next time around, I also voted Paul Martin wishing and praying that he loses the election to a minority Harper. In a sense, I hoped for two things to happen:
1: We get rid of a corrupted government.
2: Give the people of Canada (including me) a time to test Harper against his pre-election ideals.
My prayers were answered. I was ready to vote Conservative but without Harper as its leader. I would have voted Joe Clark or Peter MacKay on the head of the Conservative but not Harper. I wanted to invest in the Conservative party but on Harper.
The present composition of the House is exactly what I wanted. This way people will be reviewing the decisions they made in the last election and making up their mind for the next elections. You, my friend will be judged by your principals and not by your association with Harper. You have shown what it means to have a principal and standing by it regardless of the payout. You may not be rewarded by Harper, but your constituents will reward you and you know that is what worthy to have.
What now?
My hope is Prime Minister Harper will see this as an opportunity to rectify an abhorhant practice.
He should introduce legislation to have floor crossers sit as independants before having a by election, Harper could offer Minister Emmerson up as the first case.
Even if Mr. Emmerson loses the by election, the Coservatives are no worse off than election day.
There are ways of expressing disagreement that would be considered taking a principled stand, Gary, this is not one of them. It is at best ‘taking a stand’. It’s almost funny that you characterize those who do not take umbrage at the use of a perfectly legal and time-honoured part of the traditions of our parliamentary democracy as following their rigid ideology, I thought it was Garth the self-righteous who was acting the part of the ideologue here.
It is not the mere crossing of the floor that is odious, it is the manner in which the floor is crossed that must be judged. I’m not jumping up and down with joy at the thought of Emerson’s crossing, but I’ll belay judgement until I see him in action.
Garth Turner, however, I’ve just seen in action. He has been weighed in the balance, and found wanting.
Phil – you just don’t get it do you? Harper and the leadership team were given a golden oppourtunity to do something new/refreshing/creative with the start of a brand new Conservative government. But they chose to throw it away and do the usual “political” crap.
If Emerson is so good and wanted to help Canada so much, then why not show that Conservatives are different? He could have been brought in as the Parliamentary Secretary for that portfolio under an ELECTED minister and sit in the House of Commons as an independant. That one act would demonstrate to all how different and creative a new Conservative governmnet could be.
What a shame our leadership chose the easy way out. I’m glad Garth didn’t.
For me, this issue is done now – let’s hope that it’s also the last one that causes such bad karma among Tories. Our country needs good government and I still believe that the CPC can deliver it.
I almost wish Garth was my MP. Principles matter more than parties, and I think we would benefit if 120 or so other principled people on the government benches were to stand up and be counted.
Overall, I dislike the power of parties, and don’t feel overly excited about Emerson crossing the floor either way. In a democracy, I feel that people should vote for the person who best reflects their principles, and who will do the best job representing them. Not for whoever happens to have the correct party name on the ballot. So if you voted for Emerson, then you got what you voted for, didn’t you? Someone who is pragmatic, to say the least.
Garth, please continue to represent all of your constituents, and, to a lesser extent, all Canadians during your time in government. For your next move, I would recommend that you work towards ending the appalling imbalance between government spending in government ridings versus opposition ridings. Put a stop to the pork-barreling.
I simply wanted you to know that I applaude your efforts in questioning the actions of a man who has clearly undermined the democratic process. Bravo. Keep up the good work!
I would like to be Stephen Harper’s worst nightmare … I’m going to be in his face.”
International Trade Minister David Emerson on election night.
Unfortunately , this may turn out to be accurate.
Although I believe Mr Emerson to be an excellent choice for the the Ministry of international trade, the circumstances of his nomination within two weeks his election as a Liberal leave a bad taste.
It may be best for Mr. Emerson to do the honourable thing , to resign as MP and run under the Conservative banner to legitimise his situation.
Garth, you have gained a lot of free publicity.
The Liberal Party is struggling to have anyone commit to be their Leader.
You would be able to achieve your vision by throwing your hat into the Liberal Leadership race.
Quite obvious your career as a CPC member is going nowhere but downhill.
“The best view of Ottawa today is in my rear view mirror.”
Indeed. And may the residents return the compliment to you, when in a few weeks or months, the press gets bored with you and moves on to another publicity seeking demagogue.
Garth Turner. Your 15 minutes are almost up. Tick, tock, tick, tock.
Is this how you’ll handle every situation that you disagree with? Stamp your feet and look for allies? You’re letting down your constituents by not working for them within the Conservative Party. What’s different about you and Mr. Emerson? Mr. Emerson’s belief is that people voted for him the man, to continue what he started. You’ve kept this issue alive and well out of proportion. You’re the Liberal/NDP best new friend. Talk about hypocricy. I’d certainly expected more from a “seasoned politicin”. In the context of business, you would be fired for your insubordination. Not because you disagreed and tried to make your concerns known, but because you are disruptive, distructive and unfortunately completely self-absorbed while gathering allies of people who really haven’t taken the time and don’t have the full information to assess the situation. You have definitely contributed to my cynicism. If the Sun Newspaper is right this morning saying you’re ready to step down – how are you going to deal with your constituents who voted Conservative? What are you going to do with the money you raised from these people?
I wonder what PM Garth Turner would have done if he had been in the same position as PM Stephen Harper.
Hopefully, one will never find out.
This all sounds like childish “sour grapes” to me. I’m sorry that you didn’t get a cabinet posting…..oh, I just changed my mind…..I’m not sorry at all.
RZ
Thank you, Garth, for what you’re doing. I hope this blows over quickly for the sake of you and your family. You’re better than you’ve been treated this week.
Minister Peter MacKay’s argument this week makes no sense, when he claims this is not as bad as what the Liberals did last year because it “took place in close proximity to the election”, as CBC is quoting him.
Doesn’t the fact that the election has just happened make this much more of a bait-and-switch for Emerson’s constituents?
He’s probably a great guy and will make a good minister, again. But that doesn’t make this right.
“Politics is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs.” Hunter S. Thompson
Whenever those in power betray the people who put them there, they never like that fact pointed out. The person who speaks the truth will be unpopular with the power brokers and may be persecuted. What is not changed by spin, or backtracking or silencing an honest voice, is the fact that the people know the truth, even if no one dares to speak it. The Conservative party doesn’t stand a chance in the next election if it’s members don’t stick to the promises they made to get elected. That’s the truth. I’m a voter. Ignore me at your own peril is all I can say.
Mr. Turner, you’ve proven yourself to be a decent, honest person and you’ll never go wrong if you follow your own conscience.
If only there were more people like you in all the parties.
Thank you.
I think you should chose a better hill to die on, Mr. Turner.
I apologize for all of my spelling mistakes in my former post. I feel anger and frustration, and that leads to my mistakes…All during the campaign, I appreciated your blog (and other blogs) and your readers’ comments. I felt this was a great way to ask questions, learn perspectives and think about issues raised. Unfortunately it appears that you are now misleading your readers. You have people supporting you for defending democracy. If you look at the Ipsos-Reid survey today, you’ll see that 54% of Canadians are willing to give Mr. Harper the benefit of the doubt – out of respect for his intelligence, and knowing they/we don’t yet have all of the facts. You may consider yourself a politician, but you’re definitely not a diplomat. Please calm down and think about your tactics and your motivation. You’ve created an unnecessarily dramatic situation. The media loves you. The Liberals/NDP love you. What does that tell you?
Turner for you to think that people voted for you because you are Garth Turner “the next coming of who knows what” is really funny. People voted for you because they wanted change. Most of the people supporting you on this blog are Liberal supporters that voted over 100 crooks back in office. You are really getting carried away with your self-importance and I for one would like to see you out of the conservative party and sit as an Independant. Don’t worry the press will still “chase you” for quotes. I used the term “media whore” to describe you before and you continue to prove my point. This blog is an insult to the intelligence of most voters (I will exclude “Garths Gang” or disgruntled Liberal voters in this (your fans). I am not sure but isn’t this a different riding for you than the last time you ran?
Garth,
Please remain in the caucus. You represent what I believe Tories stand for. We need to know you’re out there. Hopefully you’ll be out to the PC Policy Convention next weekend.
When you quit the CPC and become an Independent, will you run in a by-election?
Or is your principled definition that it is okay to rob voters of their vote for one party as long as you don’t give it to another.
I know you like to think that everyone voted for you and not the CPC, but if you quit and sit as an Independent you will be no different than Emerson.
Not everyone who voted for you voted for the individual.
Not everyone who voted for Emerson voted for the individual.
Some people who voted for you voted for a party or a leader.
Some people who voted for Emerson voted for a party or a leader.
Woe to you and your principles if you quit caucus and sit as an Independent.
Maybe you should call a byelection now. Your mouth has certainly crossed the floor. You being a CPC member seems more a technicality every day.
Furthermore, do you recall the PM telling Mansbridge that without floor-crossing a sitting PM has TOO MUCH power over their MPs?
I hope your constituents see that their only voice in government is one vote and exposure for their MP in the media.
Your influence to change the minds of people with other votes is gone.
Three jeers for Garth Turner, Court Jester of Parliment.
Garth
I just want to thank you for having the courage of your convictions in regard to Mr Emerson.
You didn’t screw up any changes for Conservatives to run the country…our new Prime Minister did that himself by not even waiting a nanosecond to demonstrate to Canadians that he is no different than the unprincipled former Liberal governments and that “accountability” is a nice election word only.
You are representing the people who voted for you, and unfortunately, some of us who are now represented by your Caucus colleagues. I wish my own MP, Dave Batters, had the fortitude to do what you are doing.
The argument that Emerson did “cross the floor” for the good of the people is not a valid argument. There was no “floor” to cross as the government did not sit on the House yet.
I remember Ms. Copps who returned back to the people in a byelection to prove a point.
Regardless of crossing the floor or not, when Emerson changes his position in a issue with such a magnitude and this fast, he better return to the people and ask for a byelection.
Funny how all the people who wanted the Conservatives in so we could have accountable and ethical government are now falling over themselves to defend actions that violated that trust. It doesn’t matter whether Emerson is the best person for the job or not until he stands as and is elected as a Conservative for his riding. Similarly, with Fortier. Promises were made, implicitly, if not explicitly, and they were broken, and a lot of Conservative supporters, myself included, feel betrayed. The real irony here, is that when you have an MP who actually is standing up for accountability and ethics, which you would be applauding if he were doing it in opposition, now that he is in the governing party, you want him to shut up and play the game the way the old “corrupt” Liberals did!
I say, keep up the good work Mr. Turner. You are doing exactly what I and a lot of other Conservative and ex-Liberal supporters elected your party to do, i.e. not just govern, but govern accountably and ethically.
Garth – You’ve made your point and now it is time to move on. Crossing the floor to sit as an Independent is no different than what Emerson did, and, if you are true to your word, you would quit and run in a bi-election. His constituents voted for a Liberal and they deserve one, as your constituents voted for a Tory, and deserve one. To leave the party to stand up for your principles could be the same argument that Emerson can make, afterall, his constituents will be better off with him in government.
While his constituents may feel betrayed, having a representative from Vancouver at the cabinet table is, in this particular case, better for the country as a whole. Arguably, this may be considered under the banner of “politics of inclusion”. Your leaving the Tories would be an Emerson-like betrayal (Emersonian? – new word perhaps?) to those who voted for a Tory in your riding.
As for your seat in the House, remember the wise words of a certain politician from Halton, “There is no bad seat in the House of Commons.” Wise words from a wise man who is needed in Ottawa,as a member of the government, to make a difference.
Thanks for the straight up approach and honesty Garth. Ethics is contagious…and it will infect every corner of the House in the next little wuile. Heck maybe even a few Liberals might get bitten by the ethics bug…nawww, just kidding…”I am entitled to my entitlements”.
Garth,
I don’t recall you being elected as Prime Minister. It is your job as a member of the government to be a team player, not a lone ranger. You are singing sour grapes and committing political suicide.
Please cross the floor and sing from there. You obviously are of no furhter benefit to the Conservatives. The Opposition (ie. Liberal) side is where all of your ilk eventually end up anyway.
Hello, again, I forgot to mention the public opinion poll in the National Post about the Harper Governments first week in power….QUOTE Still, his overall approval rating of 54% suggests the furor over his selection of Mr. Emerson and Mr. Fortier merely put a “dent” in his government’s popularity, Mr. Bricker said. UNQUOTE
Mr. Turner,
I hope that if you drop out of the Conservative caucus you will resign your seat and stand for re-election in a byelection. Crossing the floor in either direction is still crossing the floor.
Your actions, not words, will determine whether you are a man of principle or a crybaby.
ps. I do not wish to insinuate you are a “crybaby”, in using that term I’m responding to comments by others above.
It is my true hope that you will demonstrate that you are a man of principle. I voted for you – prove us right.
This debate is over!!!
In light of the new Ipsos poll, the majority of Canadians approve of Harpers first week. That’s it done!!!
So what have you accomplished really? Your blog comments are overwhelmingly filed with die hard Liberals and Dippers. That is the support you obviously seek.
With all do respect Mr Turner, I am very familiar with Harper’s history. Unlike people who comment anecdotially, I have read his views and prophetic policy statements from the last 20 years. He has always been years ahead of everyone else. He clearly represents the most brilliant PM we have had in years. I trust his judgement to put Canada first and himself second. You on the other hand have performed in typical Liberal fashion. Me first, I’m entitled!!!! PMSH is a breath of fresh air!!!
Garth – keep it up! We need more people like you in government, in every party.
I am shocked that there are people posting here that put the PM and their party before Canadians. That is completely self-serving and disgraceful – I hope that these people are not in government! (Hard to tell as they don’t have the courage to leave their full names).
Also, if Emerson is really the best candidate for the job, why didn’t Harper just appoint him as a Liberal cabinet minister??
PHIL: “This constituent of yours must be as unintelligent and uncritical as you”
That comment is pretty pathetic Phil – YOU don’t seem to GET IT. When is insulting a person’s constituents and the constituent’s MP good politics?
You seemed to have forgotten that people run a democracy through their votes. The first thing a Member of Parliament is accountable to are the people in his or her riding.
MPs and MPPs have stopped listening long ago – and when they stop listening you get voter apathy – once you get voter apathy they stop voting – once they stop voting you get corruption.
You’ve gone out of your way to explain Harper’s rationale on this blog. So why doesn’t Harper go out of his way to explain to those that voted for his ethics package why he felt it was necessary to put individuals in office that were 1) NOT ELECTED by the people or 2) Were NOT ELECTED as a Conservative.
Perhaps you need a refresher: Democracy is government BY THE PEOPLE usually through elected representatives. Democracy also means practical or social equality as opposed to aristocracy.
A leader can’t run on a platform of ethics and accountability if there is the appearance of the lack of it when he/she starts out of the gate. The first rule or fact in politics is perception and in this case the perception is bad.
No, there isn’t anything in the CPP’s platform that makes reference to elected Senators (not that I have found yet) – but that doesn’t make Fortier’s appointment clean by putting him in charge of Public Works.
All Harper has to do is just address Canadians and give his reasoning why floor-crossing is good and why it was ok for the CPP to do it and not the Liberals (or anyone else). Once Harper explains himself (and not Turner by having a microphone stuck in front of his nose) then we’ll all stop pointing the finger of Hypocrisy at him.
Don’t forget, there are a lot of individuals, including Liberals and natural NDP supporters, who voted for the CPP for the first time in this election.
This is a case of Harper not trusting the grass roots – as we know this is what we have all heard about him. We this is a case where he has to learn to balance.
Yes, grassroots can sometimes result in tyranny of the masses (like the Harris regime in Ontario did) – when constituents are calling on their MP to break the law then that’s when those in power have to understand where the limits are. That is why we have laws, a Constitution and an opposition.
But then there is the attitude that MP’s and government are so elitist that they feel contempt and arrogant towards their constituents – much like comments. That’s when democracy transmorgifies into dictatorship. We don’t want that hidden agenda.
The People put Harper and the CP in and they can take him out – you yourself should learn a lesson in humility.
I like Burlington and the people there (unfortunately I live in Hamilton where MPs and MPPs choose not to listen to their constituents because they appear to be in politics for themselves – Judy Marsales is one that comes to mind)
These ARE intelligent and very caring people in Turner’s constituency and he is fortunate to represent them.
The Conservative Party should be happy to have been chosen as their representative in Parliament and not be so ungrateful about it – because that can change all too quickly.
If the CPP doesn’t stop harassing Turner then he always has the option of running independent in the next election removing those votes from the CPP.
If I were to run in politics I would run as an independent. If I had a choice to vote for an independent, I would.
Garth, I am a conservative and voted for change in January’s election. I still have not given up on Harper, although I think he’s certainly started off on the wrong foot with these appointments.
For what it’s worth, I applaud you for taking a stand. You have the support of many of us conservatives that voted for accountability, integrity and ethics.
Keep up the good work and don’t let the vitriol from your detractors make you waiver.
What’s really remarkable about reading the postings in your blog Mr. Turner is that you’ve made Canadian politics interesting again. You’ve got people thinking and caring about what happens in government again. Whether they’re attacking you or showering you with rose petals, whether they are Liberals, NDP, Conservatives or Anarchists, whatever the reason they are commenting here, the true democratic spirit of debate and discourse has sprung back to life. Just when a lot of us were beginning to feel like we had no voice in government and there was no point voting or trusting what any politian says, we have in you, an example of what politicians can be and do if they are given a free voice. Maybe it’s out of your control now and the press is playing a bit of a tabloid telephone game with your comments, but the fact remains you’ve started something quite remarkable that I hope will continue. You’ve re-energized the democratic dialogue in this country. So please don’t quit the Conservative Party. I believe most of the other members of your party and many in the other parties too still believe in the principles you were elected on. Many undecided voters supported your party on the accountability issue alone and it’s something PM Harper should not lose sight of. I hope he won’t trade short term gain for long term pain. In any case, we need you to stick around and continue to remind us why we’re so blessed to live in a free and democratic country. We can all disagree and argue without blowing anything up. We can push for change and get it. No matter how hard things seem now, no storm troopers can come and take you away in the night for speaking your mind and standing up for what you believe in. I think sometimes we forget how lucky we are to live in this great country. With all our political and regional differences, it’s amazing how we all want a chance to have our voices heard. I’m glad someone’s finally listening again.
When can we look forward to your resignation and running in a byelection as an independent? Or does your convictions only go so far?
As I commented above, I am weighing the best options for the party and Parliament, not myself. This is not a career for me, but a chance to do the right thing. — Garth
Some critics are accusing me of screwing up the best chance Conservatives have had in 13 years to change the country, by raising concerns about a floor-crossing Liberal, and then about MP freedoms.
That calls it like it is.
Garth, you had your say. We heard what you had to say. The CPC are not perfect but they deserve a chance to prove their platform.
The media is having fun pulling your chain, and you are confirming what a puppet you are and playing every move they make. Whose interest are you looking after?
Most of what you say about helping the middle class almost makes me want to vommit. What makes you so different from all other politicians?
May I suggest Mr. Turner’s most honourable actions this week are NOT, as some have suggested, Mr. Turner’s payback for being overlooked for a Cabinet post, but rather an inspiring indication that a certain breed of a politician with integrity and scruples does in fact still exist. I believe we would have seen those exact same scruples at work even if Mr. Turner was in Cabinet, and that is why Mr. Harper did not pick Mr. Turner to be on his team of favourites. It would appear Mr. Harper believes he can survive with Mr. Turner’s scrupples at work as ‘only’ an MP, but knew all might flounder if expressed as Cabinet Minister. As far as I can tell, we only have reasons why Mr. Turner should be part of the Cabinet, not excluded from it. No one else seems to want to ensure Mr. Harper does not speak from both sides of his mouth. The Liberal’s, if they can now get their act (leader) together quickly, will be poised to do well in the next election which may come a lot sooner now than we think, save for one seat, Garth Turner’s. That ridding has found its gem in a person that says what he means and means what he says, both before and AFTER the election. I think I will move to Halton. Finally, I can already hear the chorus of Conservatives that will blame Mr. Turner for standing in the way of finally getting back into power after 13 years inthe waiting. What? You expected him to shut his mouth and go along with one of the very behaviours we booted the Liberal’s out for?
I am stunned at the vicious attacks on your character. The way I see it, you are delivering what Harper promised. Honesty, accountabity and respect for the people who voted for you. Isn’t that what ‘Stand Up for Canada’ means?
Mr. Turner, you had no problem coming out and speaking with the media, on a number of occasions, about Mr. Emersons crossing the floor. Will you now speak to the media or simply post something here to the effect that you will indeed run in a byelection if you choose to sit as an independant? I have not read all of your posts so I am not aware if you have answered this question, if not, I look forward to your reply. Or you can reply Here
As I commented above, I am weighing the best options for the party and Parliament, not myself. This is not a career for me, but a chance to do the right thing. — Garth
I salute you Mr. Turner. You are one of the honest political people. Maybe you should run for leader in the next leadership convention. It sure would be nice to see some honour in politics. If you get shafted over this remember you stood for the people and we will remember that.
After just reading/reviewing the many, many comments here, I find it very telling that the only support for Mr. Turner is coming from the NDP and Liberals (Duh??). Mr. Turner, I think you do need to cross the floor but not as an independant – as a Liberal. Oops, I forgot, that would go against the very principles that they are praising you for here. With “friends” like you, who needs enemies!
Habam, what part of Mr Harpers explaination don’t you understand?.
He explained his decision on day one. You obviously chose not to hear it!
People hear what they want to hear!!
To all the people worshipping Garth Turner on this blog I say 3 words….”Get a Life”
An experienced and qualified M.P. (Emerson) crosses the floor and you’d think based on all of these silly rantings that he’d declared war on PEI.
This is so Canadian. Sadly.
This is an insult to democracy made doubly sharp by the fact that it has come from a party that has promised us reform. Like pigs to a trough, they are all the same.
Regardless of whose party you support, wrong is simply wrong. It was not right when Belinda made the jump; it was not right when David made the jump.
If you do not agree with your party’s position, vote against it. Speak your mind. Represent your constituent’s beliefs. Decide to sit as an independent even, but to cross the floor?
Do these people not read the party platforms before they run for a party? Are they not aware of what they are representing? Especially so soon after an election… it’s just filthy dirty.
If you want the youth to start voting, if you want the electorate to believe in their system, if you want to reduce corruption in government, if you want to make the nation a better more free place then put forward an ethics package that has some punch and includes the requirement for all party crossing MP’s to call a bi-election to ensure they are still carrying the will of the people.
Reduce the opportunity for opportunistic behavior, and reduce the inclination for opportunistic corruption. Like anything that is wrong, the first step is always the hardest. Remove the first step and you remove much of the problem.
Good on you Mr. Turner!
Calling Emerson what he is – a profiteer – shows guts and integrity.
If you are pushed aside because of your views, it will only show the adolescent “mob rules” mentality of party politics.
If your boss wants to be perceived as morally superior to the Liberals, he better propose brighter ideas than rewarding profiteers and unelected party organizers with ties to Montreal business.
It stinks already.
Sean Murphy
Montreal
The fact that a Conservative MP can’t stand up for integrity without getting slapped down just goes to show you that, with the exception of gay marriage because it’s convenient, there will actually be no freedom in parliament for Conservative MP’s.
Thank you Garth, thank you for not playing the “bait and switch game”. I am a true “leftie”…some in your party thing of that as a bad thing (although they never explain why)…I probably never will vote conservative, but, I am a believer in doing and saying the “right thing” (even if that’s the left thing). I am long time Milton resident who remains active in this community on many levels and, today, I am proud that Halton is on the news for having a guy willing to put it on the line for what’s right…history shows the leaders who act this way, well are actually leaders.
P.S. I notice on the Conservative Party of canada website…your phone number and website is NOT posted…just coincidence?
G. Shepherd
If you want to make a change and play a part in history, let’s make our new PM pony up and give us fair and accountable government. Below is a link to a web site where you can help the people of Vancouver Kingsway have their justice. Visit. Read. Sign.
http://www.petitiononline.com/RDE/petition.html
The liberal party is in total disarray and the in-fighting is picking up momentum, plus there is some thinking where more liberal MP,s are willing to cross the floor. The liberals are doing everything they can possibly do to nip this in the butt.
The liberal core wants to punish Emerson, forcing him and hoping for a resignation, which will send a strong signal to other liberal MPs.
Regardless how this turns out, Harper is the winner.
Fool on the Hill? Ans: Garth
With his actions this week, Harper has shown that he is no better than any of the Liberals that preceded him. He promised good and fair government. What about those people who elected a Liberal candidate and now have a Conservative in his place?
I totally agree with Garth Turner. Politicians who switch allegiance to another party should be forced to go back to the electorate to see if that is what they want!
THIS SHOULD BE A LAW!!!
I am thrilled to see the amateuristic ineptitude of the Conservative party has set in so soon. I was hoping for a conservative minority government so that they could showcase their talents without being able to effect any real change. (or damage if you will)
But the fact that they managed to put the lie to most of their espoused principles of accountability and loathing for the corrupt liberal machine by outdoing them in their first minutes as government has surpassed even my wildest dreams.
Stronach for Prime Minister!!!!!
I guess the 20 or so Liberals who were so disgusted by their own party and would have considered crossing the floor to the Conservatives have now been scared off by this contrived rightousness. Now they have to stay in a rudderless sinking ship that will be facing scandal after scandal as Stephen Harper looks into the books.
How can they serve their contituents with any degree of confidence. They will be consumed by leadershiop fights and the number one priority for the Liberals is fundraising to get them 30 million out of debt.
Canadians with Liberal MPs will be poorly served. This circus around a perfectly acceptable parliamentary solution has fed right into the Liberal party war room of fear and smear.
How very very sad for Canadians.
To Harper strategists now trying to infiltrate this space by suggesting the ends justifies the means, is this not simply adscam and the sponsorship scandal under another name? Wasn’t that Chuck Guité’s response too when he was first questioned about his role? Did he not say “when you are at war, you play by different rules?†These are the very reasons why we booted Martin (who claimed he had no knowledge) out of office. Harper now saying Emmerson/Fortier are best for the job and how this justifies Harper’s decision and his ultimatum to Garth Turner that we move on for the sake of the party, or else, is the EXACT SAME sense of entitlement I thought we were getting rid of. If Harper felt that strongly about Emmerson/Fortier there was no need for the secrecy. He could have announced formally the first 24 ministers on Monday, and requested Canadians understanding in supporting the other 2 on Wednesday, including calling for by-elections within say 6 months. But instead, Mr. Harper and what I suspect are a group closed-minded yes-men incompetent advisors think they have all the answers, including how to squelch Garth Turner. My advice to Mr. Harper is that he needs to make peace with Mr. Turner, and in a hurry, not the other way around. Mr. Turner has something on his side, it’s called true integrity and Canadians in droves are recognizing it when they see it. Mr. Harper, you don’t seem to get it, it’s not your judgment Canadians are now questioning, it’s the ill-advised process you appear to think you are entitled to use, including bullying.
Wow! I agree with you about the crossing the floor to a cabinet post in wrong, it sounds like a payoff. So it was just plain stupid of the PM to do it. He said he wanted representation from the 3 major cities I understand that but don’t get some to cross the floor. Now let it go. His riding will take care of him now or the next election. Get back to doing your job for your riding. Don’t let the media lead you around. They follow you because you say stuff they can print and get good ratings. The media is not your friiend.
Welcome Home Garth!
You have done well in Ottawa voicing our (Halton) concerns. We put you there to do exactly as you are doing.
By the way, this Blog is the most excellent unbiased way to speak us directly. I have never attended a townhall meeting but I think I just may in the future.
Keep up the great work.
Regarding David Emerson, floor crossing is currently allowed. It is my opinion that the voters’ intentions of voting for the party should be considered in addition to voting for the person.
Therefore, I would support removing the practice of floor-crossing in the interests of democracy.
Garth, re: the other MP from Alberta.
He will choose to be a team player. The Alberta CPC worked very hard to win this election and now is not the time to dwell on the petty issues.
Can you please explain something to me? If Harper really thought Emerson had something important to contribute, couldn’t he have appointed him to chair the relevant committee, rather than making him a cabinet minister? Can you answer this?
Here are the most likely facts.
Garth Turner was interviewed for a Cabinet job. His qualifications were found wanting (his bizarre advice on Nortel stock being only one of many strange utterances from Mr. Turner in the past), and it was deemed that a Kim Campbell Cabinet Minister is not really qualified for anything.
His request for a Cabinet post was denied. Now, we see the wisdom of the Transition Team in rejecting Garth Turner.
Garth Turner is finished in the Conservative caucus.
Done. End of story.
Time to go, Mr. Turner – the sooner, the better.
The ethical issue will NOT go away here folks.
Mr Emerson was doing EXACTLY (in Cabinet) what he is doing now, only with a different government (and party).
One of the BIGGEST ethical issues with this whole defection thing is that Mr Emerson was/is in a position (while considering the CPC offer while STILL a cabinet minister) to help his friends make MONEY.
Yes, that’s right folks, “insider trading” could have occurred and Mr Emerson, knowing he was going to cross the floor and go RIGHT BACK INTO HIS OFFICE, could have easily manipulated the situation so that he or his friends could have padded their wallets with PROFIT from this knowledge.
International Trade isn’t small potatoes. Someone who knew there would be a SEEMLESS transfer of power in that Department could MAKE MONEY knowing that there would be “consistancy” in the decision making process!
Where is the RCMP when you want them again? Didn’t we go through this during the election with the Liberals?
Makes one think JUST HOW DIFFERENT Mr Harper is. Not that much, apparently!
Hon. Garth Turner,
Not knowing really who you are and what you have done in the past, I had high hopes for you to provide the leadership being one of the more “mature” politicians by mere consequence of you being a member of the tired and old former Progressive Conserative party led by Hon. (?) Kim Campbell. Since you were out in the political wilderness for so long and remained silent on a number of issues for sometime, I would have surmized that you have learned your lessons from the past appearance in the Privy Council. Alas, your current attention seeking quest for new found righteousness have proven yourself more of a media seeking attention getter politican of the old. I call upon you to make the choice if you are really so indignant and so impatient of the current CPC government. Since you were elected as a Conservative and now feels you no loinger represent their views, maybe it is time that you should tear up your affiliation to the CPC and call a by-election in Halton so you can sit as an independent or become a Liberal or a NDPer if indeed this is what you and the people want. This way you have made your stance and point and you can now call yourself the principled MP that you pride yourself as these days… This is the HONORABLE THING TO DO…
“Turner wrote in his blog that his new Ottawa office will be a “renovated washroom somewhere in a forgotten corner of a vermin-infested dank basement.”"
Isn’t that where you would expect to find a RAT.
Horny toad
Good for you, Garth. Stephen Harper might not realize it, but he has left an extremely bad first impression as Prime Minister of Canada. He has come across as arrogant, dismissive of the electorate, and gallingly hypocritical.
He is still behaving like a small-minded partisan, rather than like the political leader of a country. Let’s hope he gets the big picture soon, or his government could short-lived indeed.
Stick to your principles, Mr. Turner, and defend the interests of your constituents. That’s what most people — those trying to make a better life for their families, not those pathological cynics who treat politics as nothing but partisan sport — want from their elected representatives.
I never thought that I would agree with, nor even be on the same page as Garth Turner. I am a strong left of Centre Canadian who has voted for both the NDP and Liberals in the past. This time around, I voted for my local Liberal MP in order to block the Harper train, knowing full well that he would form the government. The only solace I had in Harper and the Conservatives was the promises of a cleaner government. No more BS and a place where an MP could be an MP. A representative of the people and where people earn the right to represent their constituents. Emerson is a dingbat who never earned his seat. He was appointed by Martin (good to have friends who are so loyal eh Paul?). He never ran for the nomination. Secondly, he won becuase he was a Liberal (could have perhaps won as an NDP’er) but never as a Conservative.
So the double move by Harper to (a) bring Emerson into the Cabinet, and (b)go hard on those who oppose this dumb ass move, just confirms that he is no better or worse than the Liberals. By his actions, Turner has proven to be a man of great integrity, who has earned the respect of many Canadians, even those who avoid blue. In effect, he has shown the finger to Harper and told him that the Conservatives cannot be just the black cats (i.e. Douglas – black cat/white cat) in this Country.
Good for you Garth!!!
Garth, I have very much appreciated what you’ve written on your blog and your attempt to do politics grass-roots style. But over the last few days you have made such a cynical effort to carve yourself a little rebel niche that, well, the real grassroots (i.e. those who don’t comment on blogs all day) are pretty uncomfortable. Speaking out against Emerson was good. Making a big deal, prior to anything actually happening, about how much of a martyr you were for doing so, how your office was going to suck, how you would never make cabinet now, etc., was transparently self-serving. You worked hard to get here, but you didn’t get here by yourself. So say what you think, but don’t knife your team for no reason. That’s just petty, and it makes you look like you’re in over your head. I thought I was the only person who felt like this, so I called some other folks I know in Oakville (some who voted for you and some who didn’t). They all expressed essentially the same thing.
If you want to be truly independent, don’t let the media play you so hard. It’s embarassing.
Anyways, I’m looking forward to the digital democracy initiative.
Cheers,
Mark Graham
Garth you need help. You need help to make a decision on the future of our great Country. The change of government with PMSH at the helm is the future of Canada. Without this change and fresh leadership we were doomed. Not all Canadians realized this on Jan. 23 but they will over the next few months. Your decision is whether to get back in line and support your leader and rejoin your caucus, Work your way back into favour so you can promote your ideas or continue your mis-guided self-promotion and whining. If you think you have plenty of support here on your blog now, wait until you repent and rejoin the team which is attempting as best they can to save our country.
Did Emmerson have something to do with the cancelling of the Ridley Terminal sale. As for Garth and the dilema here, he should cross the floor and run for leader of the Liberal party. After reviewing SH first works am not sure the Cons will survive for long. DUMB egghead, with a runny yoke.
Christopher Ryan you ought to be ashamed for your last insulting and derogitory comment regarding our fair country. You are a disgrace and rude.
Hi Mr. Turner,
You always struck me as being a sensible person, but I fear that you, like so many others have been brain washed by the CBC which is only slightly to the right of Leon Trotsky.
Where was the outcry when Belinda and Scott crossed the floor??
I thought that Mr. Emerson’s recruitment was a brilliant stroke of political genius. I remind you that shortly after the election the outcry was that the Conservatives did not have a mandate to govern because they had no representation in the three largest cities. When they cover two of those bases the screams are even louder. How can you win.
Well, the record shows that you Conservatives rarely win because you have not learned the FIRST RULE: the objective is to gain power. The SECOND RULE IS: MAINTAIN POWER.
The Liberals have learned these rules well which is why they are in office four times as long as you are.
Remember John G. Diiefenbaker? Well there is a lesson there: stop sabotaging your leader and pull together. I for one do not want another 12 years of a do-nothing, corrupt Liberal government!!
The National
Your Turn with the party leaders
Stephen Harper, Conservative Party
Jan. 19, 2006
Peter Mansbridge: Next question is coming from a city you’re very familiar with, from Calgary.
Colleen Belisle: Hello, my name is Colleen Belisle and I have a question for Stephen Harper regarding the accountability issue. In the past 18 months, I have noticed a number of MPs crossing the floor after the election. This makes me wonder why I should, as a voter, go and vote when my MP can change parties after the election. Mr. Harper, are there any policies that you plan to enforce after the election regarding this issue? Thank you.
Stephen Harper: My short answer is no. And I understand the voters’ frustration. You can imagine I feel that frustration as much as anyone. I was the victim of a number of the particular incidents that the voter is referring to, that Colleen’s referring to, but the difficulty, Peter – I know that many members of Parliament have put forward various proposals that would restrict the right of MPs to cross the floor, force elections, or whatever. I haven’t seen one yet that convinces me that it would create anything other than a situation where party leaders have even more power over the individual members of Parliament. And, as you know, I’ve said that, of course, I’ve said that for a long time that I think our members of Parliament need more authority, need to be able to represent their constituents’ views, and they may make very bad decisions in crossing from a good party to a bad party or, more particularly, a winning party to a losing party. But that all said, I haven’t seen one yet that I’m convinced creates a bigger problem than it’s actually trying to fix.
Peter Mansbridge: Do you think voters are as uncomfortable as Ms. Belisle points out when these kinds of things happen? Because if they are, one assumes that they are looking for direction from their political leaders to prevent this from happening. As you pointed out, some parties, the NDP has said it would force an immediate election. Do you think something has to be done?
Stephen Harper: Let me give a concrete example of an alternative situation. The Conservative Party of Canada, the new Conservative Party was created because people left actually no less than three separate old caucuses, two old parties, and joined with a new party, and I think there is widespread consensus among not just members of the old parties, but members of the public as well that this was a good thing to create a stronger opposition, to end the fragmentation of the conservative movement in the country.
Now, you know, this kind of law could have forced us into a situation where we were having 75 byelections. So, you know, that’s a problem with any of these proposals. We understand, I understand why people want them, and, believe me, there’s a couple of cases that have happened where I’d love to have a law like this, but there’s also a lot of downsides when you think it through. As I say, in a practical matter, I could see how party leaders could really abuse that particular provision to make it even more difficult for members who may disagree legitimately with their party to operate within the party.
All right Garth. We get it. You’re unhappy about getting chewed out for publicly castigating the Prime Minister and the government. Enough of the wounded deer routine. Help the government get to work and stop stoking this issue. There are very real issues to be dealt with. Your colleuges and your constituents have heard loud and clear of your hurt. Enough.
I have NEVER voted Conservative but if you were running in my riding, I would vote for you. Well done. Please keep exposing the hypocrisy.
Garth – YOU ARE TRULY AN IDIOT!
I am not a Liberal or Conservative supporter, but I appreciate what you’ve done- hypocrisy is gross- especially when what what Emerson has done is worse than Belinda’s action given that it happened right after the election. Dirty renovated washroom office or not, you can still make a valuble contribution to the country by speaking out when you need to. If you get ill-treatment from your Mr. Harper’s office, then perhaps you should sit as an independent. This parliament is as fragile as the last one, and you can represent your constituents in an honourable way by removing yourself from the power trap of a ruling party.
We use the Charter in this Country for everything. Does Emerson not have the right of freedom of expression to chose the politics he wants and to cross the floor if necessary. Just a thought.
Garth,
I live in your riding and will admit to having aprehensions about this new Conservative Party.
The fact that a mere days after the election a member has crossed the floor is unacceptable as it shows Mr. Emerson was after one thing and should have run as an independent if he wanted to “choose” his party after the election.
Keep up the fight, as Mr. Harper should start paying attention or his time in Ottawa will surely end come the next election.
Mr. Emerson should resign, return funds to his local Liberal riding association used to get him elected, and then seek a seat in a by-election.
I am a conservative supporter who was very disappointed with Mr. Harper for wooing Emerson. I the searched for what Harper said when Stronach crossed the floor and every quote I found said he wouldn’t ban that, that if you did it would in effect take away an MP’s ability to leave if he/she felt their party wasn’t operating in a manner they could support. As much as I disagree with his decision, he isn’t being a hypocrite. I do not know you so I can’t make a judgement on you but I am sure that you don’t consider yourself a hypocrite either. As a result of your clearly stated beliefs then I am assuming you will do the unhypocrital thing by resigning and running in a byelection if you choose to leave the Tory party. After all, your constituents voted Conservative not independent just as Emersons riding voted Liberal, not Conservative. You have expressed your view, the appointment is done and continual talking in the media won’t change what has happened. I suggest the best thing you can do now is go to caucus and support and encourage the government to implement the promises they made in the election (none of which dealt with members crossing the floor) or if you feel you cannot support the government then resign (as you have stated floor crossers should do) and run again.
Sadly, I AM CANADIAN. And a Westerner. And a Conservative. And are we really back to letting those Mulroneyites run the show again? I thought we got rid of those guys! You know what they say about Stephen Harper now? You can take the boy out of Toronto but you can’t take Toronto out of the boy. What we have here is a failure to communicate. And once again the right hand doesn’t know what the left hand is doing and Reform values are undermined by slippery old-skool Muylroney style government.
Better open that forum soon before someone does declare war on P.E.I.
To all who are dissenting of Mr. Turner’s recent public disagreement; this man was not elected to parliment to tow the party line, to suck up to his bosses for a higher standing in the government nor to stay quite for the “good of the party”. Mr. Turner was elected to represent his constituents to the best of his abilities. To speak out in what ever way necessary so that parliment will here their voices. His election was also to do waht is best for his country. By calling out the unethical behaviour of Mr. Emerson and the conservative party, he is speaking for most Canadians. As a conservative, I voted for a party with much higher ethical standards than what has been displayed. Shame on your critics Mr. Turner, keep it up. You may yet turn out to be a true Canadian folk hero!
Having been involved with the Reform/Alliance/Conservative parties since the late 80’s/early 90’s while living in Calgary, I started out being absolutely outraged at this situation. Now, I am just very, very sad. It was always my belief (as Mr. Turner pointed out) that the MP was the constituents’ representative to Ottawa. At least this is what the “blue book” said. Now, it appears that the party’s founding principles are being sold out by the party leadership, all in the name of power. The people of Vancouver Kingsway chose the representation they wanted in Ottawa, but Mr. Harper knew better than the voters what was good for them. Ergo, Mr. Emerson. Thank goodness we have Mr. Turner, who has the integrity and honesty to speak his mind regardless of the consequences. It makes me wish I lived in his riding! Thank you, sir.
Garth, I have been a long time libertarian and I say good for you, stick to your beliefs and don’t back down either. I remember you were the guy back in the early 90’s with the DDT (Debt, Deficit, and Taxes) campaign, unlike some people you have not changed your beliefs.
Garth, as an outside interested observer, I was blown away at what a fantastic campaign you ran to get yourself elected in hostile Toronto-area territory. You did win your riding with hard work and dedication, and I was mightily impressed. However, you also won by being part of the Conservative Party of Canada. There would be no Garth Turner MP without Stephen Harper and the CPC. If you think you would have won as an independent…I think you should check your temperature.
While you have spent the past few days earning kudos from Liberals, NDPers, Mulroney-era hacks, uninformed populists, and the left wing media, you have done serious damage to the party that brought you where you are. You made your thoughts known during a scrum, and you should have left it at that. Now you sound petulant, ungrateful, and jealous, as well as contemptuous of the voters who lent you their vote because they wanted a Conservative and they wanted a government MP in their riding. The danger of your grass-roots populism is that you end up listening far too closely to the loudest voices in your ear, no matter whether their opinion is right, wrong, or, as in this case, overblown and hysterical.
Emerson is not Belinda. Harper is not Martin. Floor-crossing is not vote-buying. Senate appointments are the law of the land.
If you leave caucus, you will first and foremost be letting your constituents down – and far more seriously than Mr. Emerson has, who will at least be giving Vancouver-Kingsway a strong voice in government. Secondly, you will be embarassing only yourself, not Stephen Harper, if you leave, when you discover that your 15 minutes have suddenly expired. Thirdly, you will be giving up any power you have to help implement your middle class agenda if you end up sitting out of government.
Why did you work so hard, knocking on 25,000 doors, if you were just going to quit when the going got tough?
Say it ‘aint so, Garth.
The idiots, Mr. Potts, are the apologists for Stephen Harper who are willing to accept the moves Harper has made. It is exactly the sort of thing we would expect from a Liberal government.
As a lifelong Conservative, I expect better from the Conservative Party. If we want to be re-elected by a majority in the next election this is not the way to start.
It just feeds in to the cynicism of the electorate, who can say without argument, that once in power we are no different from the Liberals.
Garth has at least shown that there can be a difference. That honest politicians with integrity do exist. What a shame that so many of the idiots posting here think that honesty and integrity should be drummed out of the Party.
Again, as a lifelong Conservative and a constituent in Garth’s riding, he has 100% of my unequivocal support. He is what the Conservative Party needs more of.
The money to elect Emerson was paid for by the Liberal party and those that privately donated to his election fund.
In short, he stole this money from those who were supporting him.
Now consider that Harper has repeatedly cried out for responsible, honest and accountable government yet actively headhunts for seats that his party isn’t entitled to.
Emerson didn’t cross the floor on his morals, he crossed when Harper held up a carrot.
This is just not right, and Garth Turner should not be hung out to dry for pointing this out.
I am glad you are speaking your mind on this issue Garth. Everyone knows there are more than just 1 Conservate MP thinking the same thoughts, but are too afraid to say them out loud.
It is only FAIR and DEMOCRATIC that Emerson should have to face a by-election. How democratic would our system be if an entire party were allowed to switch colours once it got elected? It would be like a political coup! Guess what voters, that IS allowed in our system.
The only way that jumping from party to party without going first to the voters is acceptable, is if we had an extemely non-partisan government. With no MP forced to vote along party lines.
Harper has the collective balls of his party in a jar. You’re the only one who is man enough to say it.
Garth’s private members bill to end party-switching would have my vote, and I would find it hard to believe that most people on this blog would not support it, regardless of their political beliefs.
It’s time to end this kind of crap.
Garth DONT QUIT NOW WAIT 6 Months untill you have your 5 years in for the $100000 a year pension!
Mr. Emerson is an insult to the people in his riding. These people gave money to his cause, as did the Liberal party.
He won on their money, and now needs to return that money and leave the political arena of his own volition.
Shame on you Mr. Emerson.
I thought your party was running on the premise of cleaning up corruption, bringing belief of the political system back to “the average Canadian”. A breath of fresh air up in our capital etc… I thought fair enough, there is now a new party in charge of the house of parliment,lets give them a chance to put words into action. However once it is in position of power the “New Conservatives” appear to be just another “political party” not practicing what they preach. Remember back in time “The Who”, well they said it correctly, “Meet the new boss, the same as the old boss”. Well you guys have just re-inforced the other part of the song, “We wont get fooled again.” Let them put whatever spin they want, words me diddley. I do commend you on your actions and I support you on your goal, too bad there is not a shadow of any political party out there that will support it. Take your blows but know that even though I am not of your political stripe, if I was called up to support you on this issue I would be there in a moments notice. Probably like most “just average Canadians” that want actions not words. Pass this on to Mr. Harper, let him know the “average Canadian” is watching how he treats our real concerns.
Maybe Emerson owes the Liberal Party the money back, but the Liberal Party got $1.75 per vote that should be subtracted from it.
Funny how the Liberals on your site forget so soon that when the NDP introduced the floor crossing bill only 1 Liberal of more than 130 voted to even let it go to committee for further review and research.
No BLOC supported it even going that far. All NDP were whipped to vote for it and about 40 Conservatives who had free votes did vote to take it to committee.
The first reading was voted down.
You talk about freedom in parliament? Banning floor crossing removes the vital freedom of choice the parliamentarian has now.
There are definately two or more sides to your stance. Perhaps you have not thought it through.
Perhaps you should before speaking about this anymore and destroying other people’s reputations along with your own.
Thoughtful debate is encouraged.
We have had enough empty rhetoric based on inciting reactions more than on careful analysis from the Liberals to last for the next 100 years.
Garth, why are you waisting your time and money trying to justify a wrong?
Go for the top spot. Start with winning the Leadership race in the Liberal Party and then demonstrate your political skill as being the official Leader of the opposition. Next step is Prime Minister?
You have demonstrated the natural love for public attention. The entitlements and potential for having access to big money in the public sector is worth it. Go for it.
You do have a choice.
Don’t talk about it, DO IT.
Your detractors apparently believe that the end justifies the means. They are wrong.
Mr. Harper created this problem when he chose to break pre-election promises he made.
Thank you for really standing up for Canada.
Since the Charter was brought into the discussion, I find it interesting that it was applied to Emerson’s right to express himself by switching parties. What seems amiss, amid all these pleas for Mr. Turner to “shut up”, is Mr. Turner’s unequivocal “freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression”. This is the freedom that allows all of us to debate here, and also ensures that even our politicians are not silenced.
After thinking about this for the past few days, what I am intrigued by is the silence of the 40 CPC MPs that voted in favour of bill C-251 on the second reading. While that bill was flawed in how it attempted to control the definition of a party, the substance was not all that different from a requirement of a by-election after a floor crossing. It will be interesting to see how Mr. Turner’s possible private member’s bill on the matter will differ from C-251.
Thanks for speaking up for the common man. Good luck Garth
IPSOS POLL!!!MAJORITY OF CANADIANS LIKE PM HARPER’S FIRST WEEK!! Debate Over!!
Don’t you love how Lberals always start their post with “As a long standing conservative voter” LOL LOL
This is not about how best to serve the interests of Halton constituents.
It is about an arrogant and egocentric MP on the outside looking in.
Halton gets no benefit from this situation having been created by an independent minded / maverick MP.
Thank you for taking a stand. In doing so, Conservatives across Canada have circled the wagons, and instead of shooting inwards (as they did Monday-Friday) they are now shooting outwards. Maybe not so good for you, but very good for the CPC.
Garth Turner needs to get over himself.
This issue is not more important than being back in power after 13 years.
Belinda bolting wasn’t the be all and end all for goodness sakes.
Get over it.
When you craft your byelection bill, please look closely at the history of your party.
The DRC left the CA over disagreement with Mr. Day. This included many current cabinet ministers like Mr. Solberg, Mr. Strahl, Mr. Lunn who are now in cabinet with Mr. Day. No byelections in these cases, even among these early Reform party memebers.
Fast forward to the reunification of the right by the CA and the PCs to form the CPC.
Get over it Garth. Crossing the floor is and always will be a tool in the democractic process. It may be correct to question the reasons someone crosses the floor, but to outlaw it by forcing a byelection is not workable and not democratic.
If byelections are so firmly your policy, then run now as an Independent.
I’d rather see you stop providing ammunition to media (who are not your friends- haven’t they proved that to you yet?) and get around to bringing the first round of change to government.
Don’t find tomorrow’s battles today, and definitely not in the media.
I voted for you, Garth, but I also voted for the Conservative party. There are many others who did the same. If you should decide to leave the party, these constituents’ votes will be annulled, at least in part. There is much you can do inside the caucus that you can’t do outside of it. Please keep that thought in the forefront of your deliberations.
I’m all behind you. Keep up the good work! If honesty is not helpful to the PMO, then so be it. Canadians need honest MPs, not servile heralds for the PMO.
So Garth, according tob you if you get booted out of the party you plan to sit as an independant.
You sanctamoneous jerk!!
On one hand you think Emerson is wrong yet you plan to do the same thing. /And don’t give me this “its different” song and dance. The fact is (according to your reasoning(that the good people of Halton voted in a conservative. If you get booted you should run in a bye election to give the voters a chance to see if they want you as an independant. But when they see the STUPID things you have done you will be toast.Pass the butter.
Oh, and don’t quit your day job. No wonder your wife was crying the other day.
Horny toad
Dear Horny: Do not believe everything you read. I have said nothing about a plan to sit as an independent. I was elected as the Conservative member for Halton, and the last time I checked, there was no change to that status. And my wife does not cry. — Garth
Keep on speaking up Mr. Turner. You represent my riding, and you got my vote, and I’m very pleased with your actions.
It is remarkable how you stuck to your pre-election principals and you’re now being CRITICIZED for continuing to stick with them. For those who seem a bit confused, the media went to Garth because he had a prior record of stating that floor crossing should be grounds for a by-election. He actually has the honesty and principal to still believe it even after it is his own party. I think every honest, trusthworthy person would feel the same, and wouldn’t immediately alter their perspective in self-serving, transparent ways.
Much like Canada in the Iraq war scenario, in the end you will come out vindicated, Mr. Turner, and your prospects are much brighter because you have conviction and credibility. The noise of the peanut gallery “party faithful” is just that — noise. I doubt any of them have ever touched foot in this riding (the highest income riding in Canada, I believe. We’re all just dumb yokels though, I suppose).
It is quite ironic that Mr. Harpers first peace of legislation is going to be the accountability act & that the Conservative Party may well be it’s first brief!
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060210/ndp_emerson_060210/20060210?hub=TopStories
The winners of the next election will be……. I have been giving this mess a lot of thought & it occurs to me that the Conservatives have already lost the next election! Here is why. Many voters cautiously gave the Conservatives their vote to see what they would do. They already know the answer to that, these undemocratic appointments will not go away & will come back to haunt them over & over again, as the media show sound bites of what Harper said before the election & his subsequent actions on his first day. Remember “read my lips, no new taxesâ€, we still hear that today more than a decade later. Can you see what is going to happen at the next election, the voters will be thinking Liberals? Oh yes! Sleaze, corruption, cronyism, patronage. No, I don’t think I will vote for them. Conservatives? Hypocrites, liars, no integrity. No, I don’t think I will vote for them. NDP? I really don’t know about them, but I think I will give them a chance & vote for them, they couldn’t do any worse than the others. It is possible that the Conservatives & the Liberals have already handed the next election to the NDP. Think about it, since the Conservatives have already gotten themselves branded as liars & hypocrites, what party is going to sully themselves by supporting any of their policies in order to get them through parliament. They will not want that thrown in their face at the next election!
John G,
What planet are you on? Inside the Conservative party there is tremendous dissent about this situation, and many long-Conservative rags (the National Post, which I subscribe to) have been extremely cynical over the past week. This has been a -disaster- among people “in the know”, and it is pure idiocy to think that the MESSENGER is the problem — the problem is the message, which something has to be done about (and I assure you that something will be done about it).
And who started their post with “As a long standing Conservative voter”? Sounds like a nice little strawman invention of yours.
Indeed, this election was the first time I’ve voted Conservative at the federal level: I’m not a head-in-the-sand habitual voter mindlessly waving a flag for my anointed party, wearing the t-shirt and acting like it’s the hometown team. Instead I vote for who has the most to bring to the country, and in this election I truly believed that it was the Conservatives. I believed they would bring some credibility and trust back to government, and would eliminate the cronyism and party trough slurping.
Garth, you of all people should know better than spout freedom of this and freedom of that. Where did you ever expect to find that freedom?
Teams are developed to support a single thought (group think). The power of the team is the big club to keep the team members in line. Thinking and expressing a view outside the box is not encouraged when inside the box. You will never be able to beat them. Your option now is either join them or leave them.
Harper had to made difficult decisions in selecting his ministers. You did not make the grade and at this point not a potential candidate for any meaningful job. Younger, more educated and better qualified MPs deserve the higher profile jobs and minister position.
A cabinet minister position in Kim C team does not carry too much weight today. In fact it might be a negative.
Suck it up.
My wife and I both voted Conservative in our riding this past election and it makes us proud to see Conservative MPs such as yourself speak out with integrity such as you have been doing.
We just hope your courage does not come at the expense of your career in politics as we’d hate to see you squeezed out by those whose standards don’t match yours.
I am impressed that you are standing up for Canada like your slogan said too bad your 2nd boss does not think so. Your first boss will be happy and will re-elect you in the election that will be not tpo far away if Mr Harper continues to make the dumb moves of the past week. Congratulations keep up the good work on behalf of your constituents.
Hey, the next federal election is right around the corner. Emerson will be gone, the conservative party could be in or out – but dollars to donuts, Garth, you will be elected again, by the people – whether conservative or independant. A principled stand is what the conservatives ran on – I am pleased to see you take one.
Well – just had a little chat with someone who knows about such things – Mr. Turner even violated ethics by reporting to any and all who want to read all about it here about his meeting with the Prime Minister.
You were a Miister under Kim Campbell? Your kind of politician is the reason people left the PC party in droves seeking an alternative. Your old party is the reason the right was split for more than a decade.
Now you’re baaaack. And within a few days same old same old but now you are spouting old Reform party rhetoric rather than your old red tory rhetoric.
And, you know where your “help” got Kim Campbell. I know the people of Halton need a strong voice – but IN government would be a good thing for them don’t you think.
There are serious issues out there – your petty distractions are keeping the focus off billions of wasted, pilfered taxpayer’s dollars.
Please do the right thing.
Just like to get an opinion on this: Is it traditional parliamentary procedure to vote for the man that will best serve your needs? If your needs are best served by that man moving to another party, what’s the problem, has he undergone some major internal change?
Or do you vote for the party, regardless of whether the man in your riding is a poor choice and you believe that he will not serve your needs?
Those being answered to your own satisfaction, what is the position of the person that becomes discontented and sits as an independant. Where do they fit in? They were not voted to be independants so how can they become one with some kind of moral high ground persona. They’re neither fish nor fowl in this process.
“Proud to be an MP” LOL “bullshit”by shooting your mouth off you have alienated your constituents and how will you fix that? You have lost your most valuable asset “credibility” in the house. Will any other MP’s ever speak to you in confidence? not likely!!! Harper may be lonely at the top but you my friend will find yourself very lonely at the bottom good luck.
(Forgot to add this last paragraph to the above posting, my apologies)
Seems to me that crossing the floor to better represent your constituents is the moral thing to do. That after all is why people voted for you, and I do apologize for having the “vote for the man” view.
Are you not aware that you are part of a weak minority government that is perilously close to defeat at any moment?? Do you have no understanding of the power structure in Ottawa and how things work there?? Are you so naive to think that the Liberal MSM will portray your utterances as done in good faith and principle??
If your weak minority government is quickly defeated and Canadians return the Martin Liberals back into power, will you commit political hara kiri as penance for your obvious stupidity ???!!!!
Conservatives should be concerned. Why did not Harper put in the senate and elected senator instead of his buddy. And after speaking out about floor crossers and many Tories calling Belinda a whore, then turn around and bring in a floor crosser. Poor optics, produce a memory of this in the minds of doubters. This will not fade from memory or many. Garth has a point, and I think every one in the caucus is offended at this boob move. To those bashing Garth, your party exploded in you face. Stephen Harper has stuck a pin in his own ballooon. LOL
I can’t C&P the current Net image of Harper as Moe, Fortier as Curly and Emerson as Larry.
You know: The Three Stooges.
The real conservatives would see that Garth has a point, a good point. The rest of the people crying here are disgruntled Liberal supporters who can’t find a Liberal blog to cream themselves over. Boredom sucks, doesn’t it?
Any idea how I can post the Three Stooges jpg?
1)In an election campaign a candidate outlines a number of policies he supports or would like to see enacted.
2)After he is elected a certain issue that this candidate supports is presented to parliament.
3)A clear majority of his constituents then contact him and tell the MP they are not in favour of that specific policy.
4) Should this MP vote in favour of that bill?
5) Before you answer, remember, that the MP campaigned in favour of that policy.But note that a clear majority of the constituents(the people this MP represents) are not in favour.
6) Now apply the same “principle” to an MP crossing the floor, one who is able to say with a certainty; “this is to better represent my constituents”.
I think it’s time to pull out my autographed copy of “Garth, Just what the hell is going on in Ottawa.”
Stick to your guns Garth. You are dooing what’s right for the country, and our party.
Prinipled be damned..If all parties lived by the same rules then principles are great. Howevever, Liberals have no principles and they will use every advantage to weaken their opposition. You may be right but you won’t win the war by shooting yourself in the foot. Stay with the party and work to get the rules changed that is what democracy is all about. The media cannot change the rules or the government can. Work for the changes within rather than on the outside. Quit falling into the clutches of the opposition. Keep your mouth shut in public, fight for what you believe in within caucus and help bring to reality those things that you were elected on.
Garth:
Surely you’ve been around long enough to know that most of the expressions of support on this blog are BS.
As much as people love the idea of a maverick or underdog standing up to the “man”, we all know that very little, or more likely nothing, gets accomplished when everyone does what he or she thinks is “right”.
I believe it is important for people to take a stand on principles, but maybe you should what more than 4 days before you start staking out your own political alamo.
I, and I daresay Steven Harper, can understand someone giving an honest, if impolitic answer, to a journalism during a scrum. But since then, you’ve been running around like a media maven, on talk shows, etc., and crying the blues on this blog.
Don’t throw your pearls before swine. You had a bad first week – we’ve all had those. Now take your lumps like a man, put your head down, go to work, and get rid of this blog.
Your last few entries contain more whining than some highschoolers blogs I’ve seen. Get rid of this thing and communicate with your constituents the old fashion way – householders and handshakes!
It’s not too late to save your bacon.
Signed: Some Guy who gets it.
After taking time to review these blogs – not out of boredom, but rather out of interest – I must say that from the comments, it doesn’t seem that most know exactly what they’re protesting or what they are defending. (Comments quoting sensational headlines don’t qualify as facts) There has been no Conservative hypocrisy or unethical behaviour or secret agenda. The NDP is entirely off base asking for a costly investigation – Of what? To retain a Cabinet post? Mr. Emerson will serve his constituents and his country well with admirable motivation (not simply selling his vote in return for a promotion). Mr. Emerson was a successful businessman, chosen by Mr. Martin to serve in a particular capacity in Cabinet, and he performed well. How could the Conservatives be perceived as offering an incentive, when all Mr. Emerson is being asked to do is to finish the job he began in Cabinet? As he said – Mr. Martin moved on…now Mr. Emerson wants to complete what he began – in government. Consistently during the election and even at the time of Stronach’s crossing, Mr. Harper has said he’s not prepared to stop MP’s from crossing the floor – since that prohibition would give too much power to the Leader. He’s always said there needs to be more debate around this issue. Where’s the hypocrisy? Mr. Harper does want to introduce for vote in the House, the issue of elected senators. In the meantime – Mr. Fortier (an extremely well qualified individual) will serve until the next election at which time he’ll step down and run for election. As Mr. Fortier himself says – It’s an imperfect solution, but it is a solution. Don’t fall for the line that he can’t be held accountable! The Prime Minister is accountable for this portfolio as with all portfolios. Even Mr. Chretien acknowledged where the buck stops. Mr. Fortier will answer to the Senate and to the House as required. Hopefully Canadians will recognize that Mr. Harper is honest, intelligent and is entirely committed to keeping his commitments to Canadians. Please! Take the emotion (and media frenzy) out of this and it’s clear that the best is yet to come for Canada – honestly. Take a look…Mr. Harper is using all ethical and legal means available to him to create the strongest government possible under the existing situations. He is committed to improving the rules and the procedures for the future. Give him the room…Why all the artificial indignation?
Garth, I’ve been reading, with dismay, newspaper reports suggesting that you may leave the Conservative caucus. Please let voters know you’re not going to be doing such a thing.
I, like you was disappointed with the Emerson and Fortier appointments this week. But we cannot lose sight of real opportunity that exists for the Conservative Government to give Canada, especially its middle-class, a fresh-start.
You have a much better chance of accomplishing your middle-class agenda from within the Conservative caucus than as an isolated independent MP.
Garth, as a Halton constituent of yours, I say that we in your riding and the middle-class throughout the country need you to be working from inside the new government to get some middle-class relief.
Over 30,000 Halton voters voted for the Conservative approach to resolving national issues. We embody the Conservative values that we chose. Please, for our sake, do not leave your political home.
Thank you for the concern and advice. I will be posting on this issue within an hour. – Garth
Read all about it!
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/story.html?id=02061bf1-32f6-4098-a026-ff6b267fa343&k=86225
Mr. Turner – On your Home Page you claim that the blog messages are unaltered and that 99% of them are supportive of your “stand”.
On other blogs posters are reporting that messages they have left here have been removed. One of mine was as well.
Some of the removed posts were re-posted on other blogs. They were not supportive of your recent party mutiny.
So if you are, in fact, serious about this open discussion being trul representative of this issue maybe you could explain why you have removed posts that did not flatter your position.
Just curious.
You posted versions of the same basic message. Given the volume of traffic this site is receiving, we are trying to keep from letting people be repetitious. I think there is plenty of diverse comment here – positive and negative. — Garth
Phil Romanenko: Yes good lateral thinking. Just one problem, we are not in Zimbabwe!
I do not care what position Mr Turner takes on any issue. His position does not represent the CPC.
I want Mr Harper to open the books and expose the waste and corruption enjoyed by the Liberals.
The taxpayer deserves a little bit of respect too.
I’m sympathetic to those who wish Mr. Turner had chosen to work from within his caucus rather than going to the media. Still, I’d argue that Mr. Turner has presented himself not as an enemy of Stephen Harper, but as an enemy of political cynicism. After everything this country has been through with its politicians in the past few years, I really think we need that a lot more than we need another government backbencher toeing the party line.
I am sorry to read the vitriol levied at you by Conservatives who have abandoned both their party platform and their sense of ethical conduct in defense of a liar who they would have condemned under similar circumstances mere weeks ago. Shame on them. And kudos to you, Mr. Turner, for embodying the best of what Canada has to be proud of in this era of “goose-stepping politics.”
Helen Hollingsworth: I am so glad that I don’t vote for any party, voting for some people seems to take away both their integrity and their ability to reason. Stephen Harper completely created this problem. He has gone back on promises that we all saw him make on television just a few weeks ago. Why are you insulting & castigating a man who is supporting the very policies that Stephen Harper expounded just a few weeks ago? Why don’t you direct your anger at Mr. Harper, do you not feel betrayed and disappointed that you have been completely hoodwinked? If you calmly look at your own posting you will see that what you are saying doesn’t make any sense. “Work for the changes within rather than on the outsideâ€. Mr. Harper asked us to vote for change, now you want us to change the change!!!! I’m confused!!
Thats exactly my point, the primary responsibility of the MP is to represent his constituents position on any and every issue,
Smitty – what policies did Stephen Harper promise a few weeks ago that he has reneged on?
Floor crossing is not a CPC policy-he was personally against banning it. That is public knowledge.
Elected senates take time – for now he has a temporary solution to regional representation – the same kind of solution that has been used by PM’s for many many decades.
What “change” is it that YOU want. I personally want changes to prevent the theft of millions of taxpayer dollars.
And you?
Try this for lateral thinking: If Emerson was needed because he has considerable business experience & had to be brought in over the heads of Conservatives in BC that worked hard to get voted in, but had to be passed over because of lack of experience. What does that say about Mr. Harpers loyalty to his own people? How do you then explain away the fact that almost none of the cabinet ministers have any experience whatsoever in the area to which they are going to be responsible for making decisions, in most cases costing many billions of dollars during the life of a parliament? Before you pull out your trump card, “they will have senior civil servants & expert consultants to advise & direct them,†the same could have been said about any of the actual conservatives MPs that were voted in in BC.
Still reading comments… it’s all very exciting seeing this many people actually passionate about an issue! Today, however, it occured to me that the Right Honourable Steven Harper could have been a hero rather than a zero on this whole issue. If Emerson was such an asset, nothing at all says that he couldn’t have worked with Harper’s cabinet in achieving the ends that he purportedly (according to the spin) was in the best position to fulfill. Appoint him to the relevant committees and actually listen to what he says, hell, make him the chairperson. If he’s so important to the softwood lumber negotiations with the US, make him the negotiator and give him the power to make decisions. There’s no reason why he couldn’t be working on the Olympics either. I can’t help but think that the good people of Vancouver-Kinsgway would be ecstatic at the value they were receiving of having sent Emerson to Ottawa if things had gone that way.
If this had all happened, Harper would have been praised for his inclusiveness, and his respect for the opinions and skills of MPs, no matter what their political stripes. I can’t help but think that it would also strengthen the minority and give it more power to execute the mandate it was given (or some compromise version of it… it is, after all, a minority).
Where things stand now, the residents of Emerson’s riding will probably be presenting petitions very shortly after Parliament resumes sitting (if not on the first day!). Although Canada has no “recall” legislation, if I was the NDP and the Bloq Quebecois, I’d be telling the Prime Minister that he’d better either listen to the constituents in Vancouver-Kingsway and hold a by-election, or be ready for the next general election as soon as your party tries to pass critical legislation (the Liberals certainly don’t want a general election at this point in time, but the NDP and Bloq could make huge inroads if a general election was called very quickly over something like this).
Hope you had a good drive back!
Garth,your constituants voted for a Conservative member to support a Conservative government. Yet here you are, being anything but supportive. It seems to me you should put your contrary attitude before your constituents to see if they still want you as their representative. Therefore, I think you should be the first to resign and re-run. But first, of course, there should be another nomination meeting. The real problem here is that you, and others, insist on putting Party before the Person. Our system is a representative – not party – democracy. Over the past few decades we have seen the importance of the representative fade in increments. Our ballots used to have just the candidates names. Now we’ve added the party affiliation. Parties used to rely on supporters for their finances. Now they are supported by taxpayers. Now, many are suggesting “proportional representation” – and so have MPs chosen from party lists. And so on. This trend must be stopped.
Elected senates take time? Alberta has run elections for federal senate and have some persons waiting to go into the senate. A Mr. Byfield is one, and this man was passed over.
Mr. Turner, you should be commended for having the courage to state publicly what the majority of Conservative MPs are thinking privately. The hostile response of your critics reminds me of the way that some PCs treated opponents who criticized the merger with the Alliance on the grounds that the process was not democratic.
Peter: As I said I don’t vote because nothing changes. Mr. Harper kept saying, “vote for change†I don’t understand this strange contradictory logic in your posting “the same kind of solution that has been used by PM’s for many many decadesâ€. I thought things were supposed to change, not use previous president to justify why you are not changing. As regards Mr. Harpers promises, the TV has already shown examples of what he said just before the election i.e. elected Senate & then how he contradicted it during his press conference after the appointments. There will be more to come. Debate is healthy eh!
James B on: A very well thought out, intelligent and reasonable posting.
The similarities abound…..
alec mckinnon – you’re wrong. i am a halton resident and we voted for garth the man, not the conservative party. historically the conservatives have not done well here – a milquetoast liberal held the riding and almost won it again this year despite doing no campaigning. Garth worked hard to convince the people here to take a chance on a conservative MP. you owe him an apology.
Remember when Harper’s conservatives called Belinda Stronach a “prostitute” when she crossed the floor?
And here I thought the new PM would bring integrity to Ottawa.
As a Conservative voter I for one am VERY dissapointed with the way this new government has started.
Emerson should be forced to submit to another vote. THEN we’ll see who gets what cabinet position.
Note to the idiots who think Alberta had a democratic and ‘free’ election for Senator’s in waiting .
It didn’t happen as only neo-cons ran for the mythical positions .
Yea, so what Link Byfield won one of the positions.
Link the John Birch Society misses you.
Hannibal Alberta
Also, it was Myron Thompson who agreed with Garth and did so publicly on the same day as Garth did. He has been such a staunch Harperite that it really surprised me but at least he had the guts to state it outloud too.