For the first time in four months I sat in a caucus today. And for the first time since being elected more than a year ago, I was engaged in it. Two hours of drinking ideas left me sated. It was renewing, refreshing, just what I’d been hoping for.
I was immediately invited to sit in on caucus committees debating tax, economic and trade policies. I was swept into a conversation on social policy alternatives. A wise and experienced guy took me aside to discuss the raging, noisy debate on the oil sands and the environment.
What a contrast there was between this room of engaged people, and the dour group meeting at the same time, in the same building, fifty feet away across a corridor. For the better part of a year I came to know caucus every Wednesday morning as a time when Conservative MPs gathered to listen to PMSH give an opening speech and a closing speech, with ministerial statements, threats from the whip and orders from the house leader in between.
No debate then. No discussion. The contrast with today could not have been more stark. Inside the national Liberal caucus I was struck at how collegial it was, a tone set by Stephane Dion. I was heartened by the ideas I heard flying around and the obvious willingness of people writing legislative changes and policies for the next election, to embrace mine. This bodes well, I thought. This is what caucus should be. This is where concepts and visions gain political life. This is what voters and constituents would expect me to be doing with other MPs. Finally.
So my second day as a Liberal took me into that room, where the welcome was emphatic, then into QP, where I was slagged by the Tories and cheered by the Grits. I posed my questions regarding floor-crossing and by-elections, and realized in the wake of them that the government will not co-operate. There will be no by-election in Halton before there is a general election. So I am staying in my seat, despite the huge encouragement I’ve received from Conservatives to resign. Ain’t gonna happen. Suck it up.
Besides, I did not make this decision to turn around and chuck the job. I made it because joining the party carries with it benefits for the people in my riding I could not obtain otherwise. I will now have my hand in legislation, not possible as a lone wolf Indie. I’ll be able to garner more support for my causes, like family income-splitting, from colleagues, not adversaries. I’ll be able to push for reform of political parties from the inside, to create a situation in future when independents will not be hamstrung and treated on the Hill as second class citizens. I’ll make better decisions on issues and votes I’m not expert on because of others around me with reams of experience. In the riding office, we’ll be plugged into a resource network that helps us solve peoples’ problems faster and get them answers more efficiently. And I’ll be spending less time on the phone trying to decipher the Parliamentary agenda in the House of Commons, and more time on the phone helping and listening to constituents.
These are among the reasons I did what I did. After today, no doubt. Right choice.
214 comments ↓
Wicked! Thanks for posting the vid of Stephan Dion and QP (Im a poor student, no tv).
For all of the people above who insist on complaining that Garth should resign his seat, watch the video on his homepage and recognize the fact that even if Garth resigned, there is NO guarantee that PMSH will call a bi-election.
Do you really think that it is a better idea for Halton to have NO representation at all, instead of Garth pushing his views on his constituients behalf over the next short while so that he can repsesent the people?
If PMSH says he will call, Garth will run. Without that guarantee, Garth cannot in good conscience leave his constituients un-represented.
You have to understand and respect that.
For a day or so now I have watched and observed some of the ill-conceived and disrespectful comments on this blog space and elsewhere. I write about this here: Garth Turner; R-E-S-P-E-C-T, and MAYbe a sneak peak ahead.
Dan Baril
Garth, your nuts but I like your style. Welcome the the Liberal team!
DW
Liberal Party Member, St. Paul’s, Toronto
It was nice to see you in action in the house today….I note no one from the conservatives took you up on your offer..keep up the great work…
Dear Mr. Turner,
As a resident of Milton – and one of your ardent supporters, I’d like to congratulate you on your new position with the Liberal party. I think you made the right decision.
I’ve been a consistently conservative voter, but I’m not happy with the Harper government – especially his appointment of an unelected senator to the cabinet! I’m also disturbed that Mr. Harper has drastically reduced the funding available for health research. This is a terrible decision that will significantly damage our research programs and our universities.
I’ll be casting my next vote for you and Mr. Dion.
Sincerely,
Steven
Thank you for being an independent voice in Ottawa regardless of what party you are in at this point. Currently I am “represented†by Colin Mayes-you know the person who apparently thinks a racist cartoon is a “good joke†and is the chair of the Aboriginal committee. It’s embarrassing sometimes.
Peter
Let’s be honest here…and we all know Liberals don’t let the truth get in the way of any showboating…the decision to call a byelection is yours, and yours alone. Don’t pretend it’s up to the Prime Minister while hiding behind some feigned premise of accountability. We all know how you really are, Liberals and Tories alike.
Hey, DBT, he hands me a date, I hand him a resignation. I think PMSH can understand that, don’t you? — Garth
This really comes down to one thing:
INTEGRITY
Garth Turner seems to be a man who lives without integrity to me. To hinge the right course of action on what would be a poor decision from the PM is pathetic.
I am a constituent of the Halton riding, and I hope that Garth can come to his senses and do the right thing.
Garth, I would prefer a vacancy to having a MP who does not give a damn about how he represents his riding.
Considering the crap that Garth has put us all through in Halton recently, its like we havent been represented. Everything out of his mouth has been about him and not us. For 13 years before him, we were under represented by Julien Reed…a Liberal. Seems Garth is intent on keeping THAT tradition going.
Nice hang up on CFRB today. Show you cant take it when youre not in control.
Consider me one halton vote against you in the upcoming election.
I thnk visitors would be interested in knowing the email address you have provided: “garth@garth.ca | IP: 64.20.43.134″. Nice work, blue team. — Garth
Garth, they should run this blog posting as an ad in the next election. It’s the only selling point I’ve seen on Stephane Dion yet.
I disagree with his environmental politics — Kyoto just aint right, but maybe he’ll make up for it elsewhere. [Net Neutrality maybe ]
I still think you should abstain from voting against the conservatives until the next confidence vote, though, because there are people who elected a conservative and they deserve their vote to be counted.
If the govt lives, and pmsh still wont call a by-election for halton, then I say you’ve done right by everyone.
As an alternate method, you might also make a recall promise with the voters of halton, such that those who want you out may try and collect sufficient support. I’m fairly sure this would fail, but it’s important for these people’s voices to be heard regardless of the state of federal recall legislation.
I don’t trust pmsh to call a speedy by-election, nor do I think it worth while if there will be another within 60 days. No election, no by-election, then welcome to the Liberals.
That seems definitively fair to me.
Garth,
“Hey, DBT, he hands me a date, I hand him a resignation. I think PMSH can understand that, don’t you? — Garth”
Actually, no I do not think he can…it is not in his “How To Build An Empire’ guidebook!
A wise and experienced guy took me aside to discuss the raging, noisy debate on the oil sands and the environment.( all you liberals must be talking about how to kill alberta economy as that is what your great leader will do. if you look in a room and everone looks sour but your not most likely you are the problem i am sure when they closed the door on you they were a lot happier that not all what they say will be on a self serving blog that night
Hey Garth,
. KIDDING! Yeah, I’m from Alberta 
.
Wow, I just finished going through all of your last post’s comments (like 130 or something) and couldn’t help but start (just start) to think that maybe they’re right about you resigning on your own instead of on PMS-H’s terms. Having read this post, Syd’s and the rest of this post’s comments, I agree that to leave Halton unrepresented would be worse. Why didn’t some of your constituents’ comments reflect that notion? Maybe Ontarians aren’t so swift
Anyway, I still think you should have gone Green. I saw your interview with Ms. May and can’t help but say f-in’ eh! to everything she says. She’s a smart cookie, smarter than Dion no doubt.
Keep up the good work though Garth; your blog rocks and has recaptured my interest in Canadian politics.
In politics, and particularly in representative democracies, accountability is an important factor in securing good governance and, thus, the legitimacy of public power. Accountability differs from transparency in that it only enables negative feedback after a decision or action, while transparency also enables negative feedback before or during a decision or action. Accountability constrains the extent to which elected representatives and other office-holders can willfully deviate from their theoretical responsibilities, thus reducing corruption.
If PMSH and Findley would have modeled the above principle Garth would still be a member of their caucus. Over the months we have witnessed how the decisions of the PMSH has caused a chain reaction until now we see Garth re-invigorated as a Liberal MP and back doing what he was meant to do as a member of committee and MP for Halton. It was a convoluted process that highlighted the failure of the Conservatives to walk the talk that has left a trail of broken promises and failed expectations that have hurt a lot of people. Now that we see the reality of their actions instead of their verbage we can appreciate the comparison that Garth refers to between the tone and atmosphere of the Conservative caucus and the Liberal Caucus.
Viva la Difference
Congratulations Garth and thank you for allowing me to see for myself.
Poor Garth. When I saw you ask your question today earlier in the house, I actually felt sorry for you. You appeared as a hollow man, a man without direction, without conviction. Your gestures spoke of someone resigned to the fact that you have sold yourself out, and now have little to fight for anymore, having tested all sides (PC, Conservative, Independent, Liberal), and having contradicted yourself along the way. I know that beneath that seemingly proud exterior is an empty shell, and I’m sure you are feeling a sense of loss now for having no choice but to join this losing party that you previously despised, and which opposed the ideals that you thought you stood for. This is your loss, Garth. I do feel sympathy for you. Life will go on, however. Politics may be over for you, but you have strengths in other areas.
Are you Dr. Phil? — Garth
Hey Garth!
Welcome to the family! I’ve always admired you, I have a special place in my heart for people who tell it like it is, especially when the one doing the telling is a politician. There’s plenty of room in the Liberal party for fiscal conservatives who have a strong social conscience, so stay true to your values and ignore the criticism from across the floor.
And as a side note; anyone who draws comparisons between Garth’s decision and those gutless moves made by Dave, and Wajid are out of their minds. Garth sat as an independent, was not enticed, and is willing to resign and run in a by-election. Remember all of these members will be judged and I have a sneaky feeling Garth will be the last man standing.
All the best!
Anthony
p.s. – if the election is outside the academic year, I would definitely be willing to travel to Halton to assist in your campaign
So now do you have to move out of your office? Could make a good MPTV episode…
How has your old riding association (the ones that continued to support you as an indie) been taking this? Are they joining you in the Liberal riding association?
When I connect with them all, I’ll let you know. But gratified so far with the support. — Garth
I am a Canadian living in the US, still interested in Canada and often read about what is going on up there. Once again this fiasco confirms my belief that Canada’s governmental system is nothing more than an elected dictator, no matter which party is in. What a sad state of affairs in a great country that’s supposed to be a democracy, but no one will change it! What a much better system there is in the US! Why must MP votes be along party lines? Why should there be any need/desire to “cross the floor”? Why cannot elected officials use their good judgement and sense to vote as they see fit? Unfortunately, that great country of Canada certainly has an inferior system. One it’s citizens do not deserve, or perhaps they do, don’t you usually get what you deserve?
…watched the qp today on cpac. Those answers Garth was given by “Pig-Vomit” where pretty vacant and pathetic. Anyways, how can it be that an MP (not even to mention a PM) does not have to answer questions addressed to them??
Don’t you have to resign for there to be a by-election? I mean you can use the excuse that Stephen Harper won’t call it immediately, but really, that is the hole you dug.
I still do not see what has changed in the Liberal party in the past few years that would make me want to shift my support to the Liberals. I first began following politics when I turned 18 back in 2000. At the time, the PC party was in shambles, and Stockwell Day was getting laughed at for his poor judgement. In the Liberals I saw people like Reg Alcock (the MP in my riding I was living in at the time), who was bullheaded and had little concern for his riding. I chucked a little when he was unceremoniously dumped last election. However, even though the PC candidate in my riding had no chance (he dropped out due to illness), I felt that Joe Clark led an honest campaign and deserved my vote. I think it is a great shame that people did not give him a chance to run the country for longer than a single year.
After the dissolution of the PC party, I was left with a bit of a quandry on who to vote for. I wish very much now that I had campaigned against the merger, but really, what could you do? The Alliance people were buying up PC memberships to ensure the passage. In the 2004 election, I ended up voting for the Green Party basically because I figured if a party was going to get my $1.75, it might as well be the underdog. It gave me great pleasure to vote against Paul Martin, at the very least.
Over the past couple of years, my hopes for any moderation in the Conservative Party have vanished. I have followed your blog since you were kicked out of the Conservative Party, with hope that you might be able to make some possitive changes to show the Conservatives that you deserve to be back in the party, and that they were wrong to kick you out. Now that you are a Liberal and not an independent, that is impossible. You gave up on trying to bring positive change to joining the party that uses the latest polls to bring about policy. For instance with the new tax on income trusts, it was an unpopular decision, but ultimately it was needed to prevent large corporations from exploiting this taxation loophole. An honourable person will do what is right, not what is popular. Although I disagree with much of Stephen Harper’s policies, you can’t fault him for not following what he believes is best for the country.
That being said, since I disagree with what Harper’s opinion on running the country is, I am now a member of the Green Party. If for some reason I happen to live in your riding, Mr Turner, I will campaign against you. Joining the Liberals was the easy way out. Watch in horror as you see the Liberals change their position based on what is popular, not on what is the best strategy.
So Garth, what’s the Liberal’s position on pension income-splitting? on GST reduction? on smaller central federal government? on oil and gas industry, in Alberta? in NFLD? in Sask? in Quebec?
Did you change you opinion on Quebecois is a nation within a strong united Canada?
We all want to know.
No change, Catherine. I still believe in those things you disagree with. — Garth
By Dark Blue Tory on 02.08.07 12:53 am
“Let’s be honest here…”
Sho ’nuff, DBT. We all know PMSH is turrible ‘escairt to call a by-election in the ridings Garth has enumerated. What’s your beef, other than a wish to have people go to YOUR blog?
Garth,
how can he hand you a date if there is no vacant seat???
You do you think it is ok for the PM to select ridings at random and force elected members out?
I’ve always liked you Garth. I was a Liberal for 14 years. However, the Liberals need sometime in the wildreness! I have been flirting with the notion of voting Conservative and told my local Conservative MP here in Peterborough that what they did to you was wrong.
But, I also think that the column your peers(that you use to work with) wrote in the Toronto Sun were right about your decision. They state:
Shortly after David Emerson defected from the Liberals for a cabinet seat in Stephen Harper’s new government last year, Turner wrote on his blog: “If you want to be a Liberal, be elected as a Liberal. All those things have honour but the honour is bestowed by the people, not by the individual.” Except, of course, when you’re Garth, apparently.
Again Garth I like you. I like the ideals you stand for. I like the fact that you keep this blog. I like you but I don’t like this decision! I think your love-in will be short lived. Trust me I know Liberals are famous for telling you what to think! They don’t give a damn what you think! Dion only needed you because he needed to prove he could capture someone as well. The novelty will wear off fast once the new car smell wears off. Prove me wrong Garth! But I doubt it!
Well, it is nice to see you happy at last, Garth. Being a supporter of yours from way back, but not inclined to vote Liberal thanks very much, I’ll be very interested to watch this blog for signs that you are not being stifled. If you become an apologist for Dion’s future gaffes (and yes, there will be some) you will get clobbered here in this blog. The last few weeks will seem like a picnic by comparison.
Good luck with that.
Garth, I watched as you said that you will now be a ‘team player’ and ‘ you can’t have 100 people all going off in different directions.’ Why the change in attitude? Why are you showing your new Liberal friends respect you never afforded to your long time Conservative colleagues? You just reported on this blog that your first time in a liberal caucus meeting was all sweetness and roses. How come you didn’t report about the liberal mps grumbling about Dion being a one issue man? You would have let it ‘all hang out’ when you were a Conservative. Only answer I can think of GARTH TURNER HAS BEEN STIFFLED!
I report what I see and hear, as always. And yesterday was a shocking study in contrasts form the Conservatives. Say, did you catch Stephen Harper waving his arms at me in the House of Commons. Very, very prime ministerial. — Garth
“Hey, DBT, he hands me a date, I hand him a resignation. I think PMSH can understand that, don’t you? — Garth”
Well, Garth, I am still having problems understanding.
As a resident of Halton, I would rather have NO representation than have someone who was elected under one party banner try and serve me under another party banner. Resign – Harper has 6 months to call a by-election. If he does not do so in a timely fashion, voters here can take it out on him and his party. YOU have droned on about integrity and the need to face the voters when one switches party allegiences. YOU are the one that switched parties. YOU should resign. Simple as that.
Gee, a Conservative voters who wants me to resign. What a concept. — Garth
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I’d be happy to continue to be unrepresented. For once, put your money where your mouth is.
My daughter was one of a group of young PC oriented people who worked for your campaigns in Halton-Peel in the early 90s. She has become disillusioned with the neocon agenda of the “new” Conservatives, and I’m sure she’ll be delighted with your decision.
As for me – I can’t vote for you now as I live in Carleton-Mississippi Mills. However you’ve always had my respect as a communicator and politician so I hope you’ll be re-elected regardless of your political affiliation. Choose the best person for the job has always been my motto in electoral politics.
Whooee! GarthFeller, you sure enuff stirred up a sh*tstorm, no two ways. I’m gettin’ a kick outta the Finley-Taylor Boogin’ Tories campaign here in yer boog’s House o’ Comments. I’m a Greenie an’ I was hopin’ you’d throw in with Earth Mother Lizzie May but I figger yer yer own bossman — moreso now that you ain’t under Harpoon’s thumb.
I recorded a little song I wrote yesterday — Rawhide on the Rideau — all ’bout floor-crossin’ an’ vote-whippin’. I reckon mebbe yer not gonna like the part where I rhymed “Garth” with “barf” but it’s all in fun.
I gotta hand it to you, GarthMan, ’bout yer cojones. I betcha yer the balliest boogin’ remember o’ parliment. I don’t think there’s anuther MP who’d take the comments you take on this here boog. Yer a credit t’ the Canajun boogeysphere.
JimBobby
Honorable Garth Turner MP,
As an American and a ‘fan’ of yours who has observed from afar the heavy handed tactics of the Harper Government, I applaud your decision to side with the Liberal Party. I believe that your courage, voice and logic will lend considerable backing to oppose some of the ‘Hugo Chavez’-like actions of this government, especially with MOF Flaherty’s unilateral and ‘nuclear’ approach towards gas and energy income trusts. I wish you the best in your endeavors and look forward to reading your website.
Rich Callaghan
Millburn, NJ US
“… my $1.75 …” – Evan at 2:57 am
Jeez, I just realized that my vote for the CPC to oust the Liberal Government means that I am continuing to support the neo-Cons!
Bring on the election! I want to put my money where my mouth is.
Fine by me that you are now liberal. You still have my vote. Keep on squawking – it (might) wake up the complacent.
I’ve lived in Canada 32 years and still find the politics a bit of a mystery. (I’m from the US). It seems the party is all that counts, followed by what an MP can gather for himself before he moves on to something else. The good of the country and the ordinary guy comes last if it is even on the radar.
I came from a system when the local precinct members actually chose their own candidates. Far cry from the way it works here.
Keep on pluggin’
Jen
Halton
I could have sworn I posted a couple of comments in the last few days, but they can’t be found now. I must have misplaced them.
Garth, please don’t forget your promise to make (future) floor-crossers stand for re-election.
Hi Garth,
I understand how you feel that the Conservative Party left you. Back in the
nineties, when I was in the Canadian Military, I voted Conservative and I admit
I even once voted for Reform Party (I realized my mistake of casting this vote
for the Reform Party and never did it). I feel that once Joe Clark left the
leadership of the Conservatives, the new party had deserted the Canadian people.
When my wife and I were living out of Canada for almost five years (end of Sept
of 2001 to Sept 17th 2006), all because a few people from Alberta did not like
what I had written. During this time, my wife and I ran into a professor from
UNLV in Las Vegas NV USA, who once said it best to us, as he aged he turned more
to the left. And as I have aged I have gone more to the Centre, where the
Liberals and the NDP are now at.
With this said, as along as you keep the voice of the people at heart and as the
reason why you are serving in Ottawa, you are following the true ideas of
democracy, which is by the people for the people and of the people.
Thank you for your time, and may your future be very bright and promising
Reginald
Hi Garth,
Congratulations on the steadfastness of your integrity and you commitment to the people you so ably represent.
I agree with much of your platform but I have real trouble with the concept, or lack there of, of same sex marriage. This is not an area that we should have sanctioned as being acceptable. This is an aberration of human sexuality. The idea being that it could also be acceptable to like small children. Except for its lack of persuasive backers this might also come to the fore as acceptable. These deviances from human nature are many and varied and will ultimately ruin more lives that they appease by being sanctioned by the legislature. Are all the people in you riding in agreement?
The key issue is to give these people their freedom in an environment of acceptance within our standards of decency. This means respectable marches and consideration for those around them.
Rob
No doubt this is the right choice for YOU, Mr. Turner. Unfortunately for your constituents, you are not the right choice for them.
Didn’t you absorb anything from your own town hall meetings? How many voted for you to join Liberal party, when asked? Any idea? Does the number zero ring a bell?
It seems more analysis needs to be done regarding background professions suitable for public office. Broadcasters and journalists are more interested in promoting themselves in the news, as opposed to actually representing other people.
Thanks for that comment from a Conservative supporter in Montreal. Hey, why don’t we just fill the Commons with lawyers? That would work out well. — Garth
Garth
Just wanted you to know that we are with you all the way and support your decision to go Red. We are happy to follow you into the Liberal world.
Garth we have never been involved politically before but, we have never had an MP from Halton who truly represented the riding the way you do.
My question is how do we get involved. We are prepared to assist you, join your team etc. to ensure you get reelected and ‘ Steve ‘ is sent packing.
Dave & Bev
Halton
Garth: I’d like all those good folks who have been interested in my actions to consider a few simple questions: What is PMSH afraid of? Why will he not risk calling by-elections? Why will he not be accountable? Why on earth would he not just pick a date, give it to me, and collect my resignation?
Response: Harper cannot call a by-election in Halton without calling one in the ridings held by Emerson and Khan and still save face. Plus Emerson and Khan will likely loose in a by-election so he doesn’t want to risk calling one in all three. Finally, why bother calling by-elections when he will engineer his own defeat while trying to blame the election, Canadians do not want, on the opposition?
In true Garth fashion you publicly challenged hypocrisy and stood up for we, the people.
Thanks, Garth.
Dear Mr. Turner,
I just watched your latest video clip on your website, as you explained your ultimate decision to join Stephan Dion’s team and hopefully win a Liberal seat in ANY upcoming election.
I appreciate your openness and agree with your evaluation of Mr. Harper’s government. I do not live in Halton region and therefore am not a potential Garth Turner vote. My MP is Dan McTeague. I am in my late ’50′s and have seen many governments come and go. It seems we Canadians are always voting a government out of office and hoping that the new government will somehow be different, only to be disappointed in the months or years that follow. I believed strongly in many of the Liberal platforms of the past. I believe in the rights of all Canadians, regardless of their race, religion or sexual preference. So if gay Canadians want to get married, I’m proud of the fact that they have the right in this country. I have tried to raise my children with the same value structure.
I admit to having many doubts about politicians in general as the truth seems to be the first casualty in politics, as in war. But then again, I suppose politics is a war of a different kind. I sincerely hope in your case, the truth will prevail and be a cornerstone of your success. I am aware of your political background and can only hope you will have the good fortune to become a Liberal MP and perhaps influence others with your example regarding the truth. I suppose that sounds a bit naïve, but I can hope.
Good luck to you
regards
Chuck
Dear Garth,
I was delighted to see you move to M. Dion’s camp – he is a good man. If we could vote for you, my wife and I would do so in a heartbeat.
Rest assured that we, and others in our situation, will work hard for the Liberals in the next election.
Best Wishes,
Joan and Werner
Of course you believe you made the right choice. And crazy people sometimes believe they are Napoleon. It’s hard to dispute yourself, isn’t it?
Unless of course your own words on your own blog show that your position today does dispute your position of yesterday.
Too bad you still haven’t learned that, though you have gained much strength by joining a party, that party will not support you if you start torpedoing them. Do you really think that the Liberals will help you with what you want if you don’t help them with what they want?
Of course you do. Those who do not learn from their mistakes are doomed to repeat them.
It was my understanding that the PM cannot set a date for a by-election unless and until a seat is vacant. If that is true then your offer to resign in return for a by-election date is disingenuous at best. Maybe you did not intend to appear as a slippery showboater but if that is indeed the law of the land, then how can reasonable people conclude otherwise?
Just wondering.
I will not resign without a binding commitment from the PM that he will immediately call a by-election. He has refused to do so. — Garth
Garth:
I have to wonder when Harper will drop the idiotic “selling soap suds marketing scheme” of the phrase Canada’s New Government.
As I understand it, Canada has had na official government since 1867 and whatever party is in power is the “current” government.
I wonder what it cost taxpayers for changing letterhead, etc.?
Funny , I left a comment yesterday, but dont see it posted?? Guess Garth only wants to post the good stuff.
Garth,
Would I ever be embarrassed to be a new Conservative given some of the postings with regard to you.
When we were going through the merger process those of us who were opposed were treated to the same sort of abusive language and realized at that point that it was a hostile takeover, by the angry and ideological elements in both parties, rather than a merger.
I can never understand why the National Council permitted the leader and his associates manipulate the process. I can never understand why Elections Canada allowed themselves to be used by the PC leader to suspend the Constitution of the Party and take over dictatorial power. This was all done with little comment.
The strategy of trying to seek and maintain power through verbal and other forms of abuse has characterized this new party from the campaign for its formation.
I cannot see how you could have missed this during the merger. Were you were unaware of how opponents of the merger were being treated and how the process was corrupted? How could people who acted like this during the merger be expected to act otherwise once in a position of power?
Bonnie,
“Why cannot elected officials use their good judgement and sense to vote as they see fit?”
Well, er, you see, I mean, they can, but then someone might not like them, and it would hurt their widdle egos, and besides, they want to have a future under the Canadian oligarchical system of shadow government run by unelected backroom party leaders who enjoy a lifestyle which the rest of Canada would like an opportunity to become accustomed.
Oh, and did I mention INTESTINAL FORTITUDE? NOT REALLY THINKERS OR LEADERS? SOCK PUPPETS (well used Sock Puppets actually)!
Just like many in the U.S. Congress actually, at least the former Congress that was goose stepping to every order Dubya gave them, because, as he said, ‘I am the decision maker!’
“Gee, a Conservative voters who wants me to resign. What a concept. — Garth”
Over my lifetime I’ve voted Liberal, Green, and Conservative. I will be voting either Green or Liberal in the next election, and I would like you to resign. You never said Emerson should resign if Balinda does. You never said that Emerson should resign after PMSH sets a bi-election date. You said it was a matter of principle that they resign, PERIOD.
Put your money where your mouth is, show that you have the courage of your convictions, and even if we are without representation for 6 months you’ll have my vote in the next election. Continue with these straw man arguments and my vote (and $1.75) goes to the Greens.
As a Milton voter I have no other issue with you crossing to the liberals, and in fact, would not even have an issue with this if you hadn’t made it a personal crusade, but “do as I say, not as I do” is a credo we need to snuff out of politics whenever we can.
Garth Turner has asserted that those who cross the floor should return to the voters. He has said that this is what he believes in and I agree. What Garth has said on this subject is clear and unequivocal.
You gave us your word. Now show us your conviction. Lead by your own example.
Since the parties in our area have not all chosen nominees, an instant by-election is not possible anyway as Garth knows. Halton will certainly survive not having an MP for a few months and residents like me are fed up with the endless wrangling. We want this issue brought to a conclusion and are willing to be without an elected representative.
It’s time that you proved that all of your fine words are not just hot air.
Show us what kind of a leader you really are? Do something that takes guts. Bite the bullet, and show us that you aren’t just a two-faced, self-serving opportunist.
Show me that you are the MAN that I voted for.
Garth
Thanks for your explanation of your linkage to the Sierra Legal Defence Fund as opposed to the Sierre Club.
Sorry for any misunderstanding.
I noted you did not answer my questions about Allan Gregg etc in my earlier posting at 8:15 am.
I think you should talk to Steve Dion about these issues.
There was major corruption in Victoria and Ottawa and a major cover up and Steve knows a lot about it because he was in Chretien’s cabinet.
Maybe Steve Dion and his Liberal pals were not forthright with you.
Watch your back.
All the best
John Carten, Vancouer
Say Garth – it seems to me if you were really as principaled as you claim to be your resignation should be unconditional. What does it really matter what others may or may not do – we are after all talking about your actions. The conditions you place on your resignation not only show a lack of courage, but a lack of character as well.
Regards,
Donna
How hard is this to understand?: I will resign immediately concurrent with the PM immediately calling a by-election. He refuses to do so. — Garth
Garth, It’s all about keeping your face in the news. Right?
Yup, everything’s super in the Liberal Party.
Then again, there’s also no way Garth would actually have anything BAD to say about the Liberals, because he would look like a tremendous fool if he did.
Hi Garth:
Until you were banished from the Conservatives I was largely unfamiliar with you as a representative in the house. However, it has been interesting to watch from afar as you travelled this road as an indie MP and now as a Liberal. While I agree with your critics who say that it is hypocritical for the most vocal opponent of floor-crossing to cross the floor himself (technalities aside), I found your demands in QP yesterday exceedingly reasonable. We expect all of our representatives to abide by one set of rules. Emerson and Khan should also have to resign and run in a byelection in their ridings, but Harper won’t risk it because he knows they can’t win.
“Say, did you catch Stephen Harper waving his arms at me in the House of Commons. Very, very prime ministerial. — Garth”
By Leasa on 02.08.07 7:47 am
Garth,
You are proving that you are an attention starved, vindictive little boy.
Grow up.
Laurie
I see that there is some very heavy censoring going on with this blog, shame. “Digit Democracy”, Garth’s style in action.
What censoring? Some jerk comments are not being published, understandably. Beyond that, we have posted almost 1,200 comments this week. Name another MP’s site that has done that. Or a party site. Or any site in Canada? — Garth
Garth, I think commentor’s IP addresses should display along with their names on your site. It’s obvious some pussies out there are flaming you, hiding behind anonymity. I mean everyone knows who you are, where you work, etc. It seems only fair to post some “real” info about the commentors, too, no?
Can’t believe how disrespectful some visitors are — don’t they understand the incredible service you are providing us, the Canadian public.
Anyway, to prove my point that some people here are pussies — CFRB Listener is surfing your site through a proxy so who knows whether or not he or she is really from Halton as claimed, from New Jersey where the Proxy is located or from Palmdale CA where the IP is registered or from the Conservative Party of Canada.
-R
So Garth,
What is the Liberal position on Income Trusts?
My position is that Faherty was extreme and unfair. I stand by my statements and actions. — Garth
“I made it because joining the party carries with it benefits for the people in my riding I could not obtain otherwise.” –Garth
Cash stuffed envelopes?
Big Steve showed arrogance in the extreme by refusing to answer your questions to him: I guess, as Stephen Colbert would say, you’re dead to him.
Thank you for posting your interview with Stephane Dion. The more I see of him, the more I admire and respect his ideas, vision, and his demeanor. He just seems so intelligent, thoughtful, and kind — I believe he would always do the best for Canadians. I also believe this of your new HOC neighbour, Ken Dryden.
You’re in good company. I’m glad you see the difference in leadership style so that you are confident about your move. Keep up the great work communicating with Canadians, Garth — I think M Dion should encourage all of his MPs to communicate as you do. After all, Canadians from coast to coast know more about you and your ideas than they do about their own MPs.
Garth why didn’t you meet with your constituency to discuss your recent move to the Liberals. You met with them when you were kicked out of the Conservative Party and had them vote on your options. I really admired that you held yourself accountable to the Halton constituency unlike David Emerson who not only did not consult with them but has not had any contact since. I have to say I am a little disappointed but I felt you showed integrity, a rare commodity amongst politicians.
All homes in Halton were sent a survey this week asking for their comments. Town Hall meetings are scheduled for March 5,6, 7. — Garth
Question Mr. Turner,
Will you again be directing a question to Mr. Harper about setting a firm date for a by-election in Halton today?
I think you should, but I trhink you should remove any weasel room for Mr. Harper. The question should be very straight forward, like;
“I will resign today, providing Mr. Harper is will to go on record that he will set a by-election date within 14 days of my resignation. Mr. Harper will you go on record and agree to this?”
Plain and simple, leave Emmerson and Khan out of it. Call Harper to mat and pin the weasel down. Make him sh*t or get off the pot.
I would also continue to do this everyday during QP until he stands and answers you directly.
Stay the course Garth. While I am still disappointed that you didn’t chose the Green party, I still understand your choice and understand that it allows you to better represent your riding. I just hope you continue to hold peoples feet in Ottawa to the fire like you did in the CPC. Hopefully you will have a positive influelance on the liberal party and bring about the changes you are looking for.
Zorph.
But the Burlington provincial Liberal riding association is ecstatic by the Turner move. “Are you kidding? Holy, Holy Toledo,” said a surprised John Boich, the association’s vice-president. He is a substantial person
in the sense he has such a grasp of the issues and he can play a significant leadership role in policy formulation. He is really a knowledgeable, intelligent and astute politician. This is a big gain for the Liberal party.”
I’d say the foregoing quotations pretty much sum it up VERY NICELY from an ACTIVE LIBERAL’S VIEWPOINT. We will see you on the hustings, Mr. Turner.
Welcome aboard….I always liked you and thought you were a very good person….always wondered what you were doing on the other side, I could never vote for you because of your party….NOW I CAN!!!!
Like Chretien always said “don’t worry about the little things, follow your heart on big issues” and you will always be on the righteous side
CIAO, Jerry
(•¿•)
Garth, be careful publishing personally identifiable information, like on that new jersey dude.
I’m not sure what your official privacy policy is, but collecting and moreso publishing personally identifiable information is a general no-no.
There are security implications to releasing IP addresses of those you don’t like.
The phrase ‘wont someone rid me of this meddlesome preist’ comes to mind.
P.S. Time for some posts on issues of the day. The PIPEDA review maybe?
Its really nice to see that you have found your peace. Welcome to the Liberal Party
You’re a turncoat, not to be trusted. I don’t like your style, and WE are not ready to follow the Liberals to the gas chambers. Thank you.
Last week the Parliament voted in favour of a motion that reaffirms Canada’s support for the Kyoto Protocol. Why doesn’t the government have to obey the outcome of this vote? After all a majority of Canada’s representatives want a ratification of Kyoto. Why is the government not obligated to listen to that majority? Is that how democracy works in Canada???
We all love ya’ Garth… at least someone stands up to PM Harpler.
You think nothing of publicly debasing the character of Harper. You accuse, ridicule and slam him like a jilted lover. You don’t trust Harper well I don’t trust you. You are one of the biggest game players in the political scene. You spin more than most. What you said about your first day in caucas is swallowed only by the gullible. You don’t have the ethics or humility to get my support. You represent all the lousy stuff of politics that you say is lousy. If you don’t have something worthwhile to say without knocking the other guy – then you don’t have anything to say.
The Garth Party – Committed to fairness in politics, but only if someone else is fair first.
The Garth Party – The Princpled Choice (offer only valid if matched by CPC)
Theres so many good slogans for Garths next run.
Hey Garth, care to inform your voters on the financial implications of your switch to the Libs? How much money will you gain for your next campaign?
Garth..you must think people are really stupid…..some very bad karma is heading your way!
HAH! I just saw baird on CBC. Totally pwned.
“How much money have you spent”
*laugh*
Dead-on guys. Dead-on.
I like the Baird/Lunn policy, but the budget is a joke. Take it to em, and maybe it’ll get properly funded.
Hey Garth,
Could you post the video of PMSH waving his arms at you?
Mr Turner,
you claim that you do not want to leave your voters without representation. Well, they ARE WITHOUT representation since they voted for an independent Conservative, NOT a Liberal.
Your sophistry cannot cover up your hypocrisy, Mr Turner.
Marek
Actually, about equal numbers of people in Halton voted for the Conservatives and the Liberals in the last election. Interesting, no? — Garth
Bonnie from the US
You have George Bush, Cheney ,etc and you say we have an “elected dictator.” At least we have more than two parties. Some choice you get down in the U.S.of A.
You truly are one of the most hollow men that I have ever laid eyes on.
You have simply lost your way and because you stand for nothing (beyond your own grand standing) you are now vain enough to fall for anything.
What a hypocritical prick you are.
Good Luck with the Liberals, you certainly deserve each other.
Garth, when your new twenty minutes of fame is over and the liberals get tired of your act maybe you can try tv again. Maybe you can play Al in the new Tooltime. Sorry what was I thinking Al had integrity. But don’t forget it’s all about you. Ps you better change your copyright. It says Garth Turner, PC. Shouldn’t it say Garth Turner EGO?
Mr Turner,
I will admit I have become fascinated by this story. I am a supporter of the green party and I have made a few comments earlier when the story came out for you to resign so the people can vote for what they want since they do vote for a party more often then the man. I can see that it would be easier to get re-elected as a liberal then as an independent or green party member and I hope that your words are true and this wasn’t the biggest motivating factor for your move. My biggest problem with your argument is that if PMSH decided to withhold the seat in your ridding for 6 months you would be doing a disservice to your constituents but would reflect the Prime Ministers image in a much harsher light since the responsibility lies in his hands. I do agree with you on many issues though and really like this blog and your personality. I can’t help but feel this is a mistake but I don’t think this is something that would stop me from voting for you. That is unless you become a power and prestige liberal that cares about appearance more then sound reasoning and logic. I don’t think i have much to fear in that regard.
Out of curiosity, how is the Liberal caucus vs the old PC one of the early 90′s? More/less lively? Given how many from the old Tory party have moved to the Liberals one would expect a lot of similarities.
They are very similar, from what I can tell thus far. — Garth
Actually, John-boy theres a grand total of 1 sitting MP in the LPC (not including Garth) who also sat as a PC, funnily enough, equal to the ammount of former Reform M.P.’s in the LPC Caucus
Another word of encouragement Garth. Don’t let the neoCON clap trap get to you. Its nothing but hot air from a bunch of guys too gutless to face you with their real names. Have the neoCONs called you a “whore” yet? How about “child molester”? No? Don’t worry, its coming: but think nothing of it. Just remember, foul comments flow from foul mouths.
thanks for your brave move. Now maybe we stand a chance on the oil and gas energy trust problem. Give em hell my friend !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Congratulations on joining the Liberal caucus. You have my support in the next general election (or byelection, as the case may be). I wrote to you last summer expressing my concern about Prime Minister Harper’s convictions on addressing climate change. I was dissapointed with the Clean Air Act last fall, and I doubt his new-found zeal for the subject. I think it’s the ‘socialist plot’ theory in his 2002 musings that shows his true colours.
I believe that the Liberal government of Mr. Chretien should have done more to address the problem, and this does give the Conservatives some ammunition. Having said that, Mr. Dion authored a sound plan with Project Green and made significant progress at the Montreal conference in 2005. The Conservatives, in my estimation, have simply reintroduced some of the Project Green initiatives under their own banner – and have wasted a year in the process.
Garth …. as a subscriber to your newsletter many years ago … I have always thought you should be front & centre in Canadian politics….even if its with the Liberals … then so be it. Glad to see you back …after being turfed by our megalomaniac PM … Steve (the chameleon) Harper …. who is everything to everybody (voters) … glad to see back in the fight …… the voters in Halton will be happy to support you…. regards S
It is interesting that we keep reading from many of the posts and even from Garth himself that conservatives and other in Halton have little right to even discuss this issue. (Note: Revealing people’s IP addresses is a violation of the Privacy Act)
Why are those who worked for you and voted for you not entitled to an opinion on this issue?
You are already doing what the Liberal Party has been doing for the last 10 years, denegrating and attacking your opponents rather than addressing the issues that they raise. This is one of the reasons that many of us have lost respect for the Liberal Party we once supported.
Rather than labelling and impuning others, why will Garth not just address the issue.
You have stated that any member who crosses the floor should resign.
You are now conditioning your resignation on the resignation of other members and on the actions of the PM.
The fact remains that you have stated that such members should resign on principle and you have not done so.
Garth,
Please tell us why you will not resign now that you are the one crossing the floor.
We are entitled to an answer whether we are blue, green or purple with little dots. Just give us a straight answer. No Emerson, no Khan, no Harper. Just an answer for yourself that explains YOUR actions or lack of action when you have clearly stated what you consider to be the only appropriate action.
Hmmm. We have some visitors who are apparently challenged at comprehension. Once again: I will resign concurrent with the PM immediately calling a by-election. So, email him. He refused, not me. — Garth
it’s funny how so few people remember that this is the same Garth Turner who accepted work as a paid presenter to prospective clients for a variety of investment companies, which attracted the attention of the Ontario Securities Commission – Turner was never a registered investment advisor – and the OSC launched but abandoned an informal investigation of his activities.
Turner’s investment advice has been suspect on occasion, such as advising people to buy Nortel stock when it began to decline in value, and would continue to do so until it was worth only pennies (although many other analysts gave the same advice).
I can’t believe anyone has an ounce of respect for you Mr. Turner…
Those who are supporting you just don’t get the entire story, and are too blinded by their Liberal partasanship to realize what the real Garth Turner is all about.
to all the old people out their complaining about the income trust switch… you’re all a bunch of greed mongers, who don’t care about the future of this country but only your fat wallets,
hey Garth… give us some advice on Income Trusts… seeing that you’re such a financial guru?
A few things to ponder (a) the OSC never investigated me, but asked me to provide materials, based on which they concluded my financial lectures and books were just fine, (b) Over the last few years I have written seven books which sold about 500,000 copies, full of practical advice, (c) I really wish the CEO of Nortel had not lied about his company’s financial statement, since almost all of us on Bay Street were deceived by his words, (d) the above email is a great example of why so few people in Canada want to go into public life. The bacteria is profound. — Garth
In my opinion your intelligent insight and perspective as a Liberal will be most welcomed by Canadians.
The Harper ideologues are of a bygone era.
I am retired and had invested in the trust sector.
I am not sure what is the best solution, but I do know that the way Flaherty has handled the issue has pissed off a lot of us seniors.
I am sure your voice on this issue will be most welcomed.
Bob
The world according to Garth…All of Canada knows politicains can’t be trusted so why should I let them down
The key to smooth transition between Conservative and Liberal party allegiance is now clearer.
All one needs to do is be completely oblivious to any and all detractors.
Constituents? Who cares about constituents? I don’t need any damn constituents, I’m a VI(M)P!
(Very Important Member of Parliament.)
“There are security implications to releasing IP addresses of those you don’t like.”
The IP in question simply points to a site that allows a Poster to hide their identity.
I can’t beleive the comments coming from the liberal side on this site.
So as I read it from the liberals posting here if your a conservative your a yankee loving, jesus freak, neo nazi… I love how the Liberal Party continues to show that is a big tent party… Where’s my barf bag.
“Hmmm. We have some visitors who are apparently challenged at comprehension. Once again: I will resign concurrent with the PM immediately calling a by-election. So, email him. He refused, not me. ”
Wrong again. Spin spin spinnnnnn – boy you WILL make a good Lieberal.
The PM CANNOT call ANY byelections until there is a vacant seat. You can whine and complain and shour with riteous indignation but the fact remains… YOU have to step down FIRST. Any suggestion to the contrary is just a distortion of the facts and is a dishonest attempt to convince those people who believed your position on floor crossing that you’re fully justified in NOT stepping down.
Since when is doing the right thing followed by “… as long as someone else does it first”???
Promiseskept indeed……
I will not resign and let PMSH call no by-election for six month. As I said, ain’t gonna happen. But if I get a date, I’m happy to campaign. I wish Wajid Khan or David Emerson had had the political courage to say this. — Garth
I think it’s funny that after only 24 hours in the Liberal caucus, Turner got an ovation from his new friends by promising to resign.
Dear Garth:
When my wife and I first corresponded with you last year we had indicated that although we had not voted for you in the election we respected how you ran your campaign and certainly how you have performed as our MP. This has only been reinforced over the past year. We actually joined the Conservative Party during the summer when you asked for assistance against the potential religious right nominating threat. We have since not renewed our membership and advised the Conservative Party to remove us from their mailing list – although they do not seem to listen which is a common complaint we hear from the grumbling electorate.
Just wanted to say that we both support you in your move to the Liberal caucus and we will continue to support you as our Member of Parliament.
Best regards
John and Sherro
Halton, Ont
The IP in question simply points to a site that allows a Poster to hide their identity.
Interesting — though I’m not sure Garth knew this before posting
I whois’d the address, but didn’t think to test it for a webserver =P
“Actually, about equal numbers of people in Halton voted for the Conservatives and the Liberals in the last election. Interesting, no? — Garth”
Nope. It is not interesting – and, it is not relevant. Halton elected a Conservative – whether by one vote or ten thousand votes. You screwed up and got kicked out of caucus. Fine. But, you crossed the line when you went Liberal – and decided you were not going to face the voters.
From today’s Toronto Star:
“Government Leader Peter van Loan instead issued a counter-challenge to Turner – quit first, and then the government will call a by-election to fill the seat.
“I will assure the member for Halton that if he wishes to see a by-election at Halton, it is fully within his control. He can resign today. I am sure we will comply,” he said. “I think his 15 minutes of fame are over. If he wishes to have a by-election, that is 100 per cent in his control.”
And would not the Tories love to have this Liberal seat – and this experienced member of Parliament – off the table until the next election? — Garth
Hello Mr. Turner:
I think what you did took a lot of courage to stand up to a bully like our PM.
By reading your blog and website . I think you will be very happy in the Liberal Party of Canada. It is a big tent that accepts all views and cultures just like our great country we call Canada.
Good job
Nick
Garth
As two of your constituents my wife and I are very pleased that you have not resigned and continue to represent us. We will have our chance to vote soon enough. Carry on the good work.
David and Deborah
I look forward to seeing all these pro-Liberal types posting here cry after the Liberals lose the next upcoming election. Even if they DO win, there will be no country left for them to govern because Alberta would surely vote to separate to avoid a resurgence of Liberal NEP extremism. Canadians will never accept a government that actually advocates shrinking the GDP. No political party has ever run on a platform that advocates sending the country into a deliberate recession. Mark Holland and Co. can take his 1% of GDP lost and shove it up his a..
Hey Garth let the pilfering begin! What endless trough have you been promised should you win? Maybe you’ll get assigned to something to do with Quebec where the real money is.
Good luck – you have our support—please keep fighting the fight for us Halton seniors who lost money in the income trust Conservative fiasco!
Took you a long time to jump ship, long overdue.
Harper and his supporters have lost me aprox $30,000.00 in Canadian looneys.
Politicians should be accountable for their words, I personally kept buying trusts based on governments, liberal and conservatives saying they would not tax trusts, Harper, and all like him are a scourge on the political system.I generally do not support people who switch sides after running as a canidate for one party or the other would prefer them to sit as an independant if they can not stomach their party. Think you can keep your head up, for the lack of judgement in supporting Harper in the first place.Hope the voters will be kind to you in the next election.
M. Lemon
Yup keep deleting them negative posts Garp:) How much is that costing the tax payers to have your blog spun in your pathetic image. No frigging wonder the Conservatives didn’t want your sorry ass in caucus…I’l say it again lad, I wouldn’t want you in my rifle company cause I’d never know when I was gonna get a bullet in the back from ya.
Stop arguing political semantics and just resign and respect those who elected you as a conservative instead of trying to portray yourself as a hero of the people and remaining on to ensure some representation until the pm calls a byelection…otherwise you are just showing yourself to be the self-serving weasel that you are.
God there is a lot of stupid investors posting here..
KPK, the libs, even if they won, will never pass the NEP type legislation they are preaching.
Alberta will make it very clear it’s just not going to happen, and that will be that.
There wont be another NEP — because the second it cuts into our economy — we’re gone.
They’ll get support on Carbon Royalties, they’ll get support on fuel-economy standards, they’d get support on just about anything that doesn’t equal a misguided shedding of jobs to iran and writing billion dollar cheques to Russia.
They lose that equation, and that’ll be that.
Kyoto’s broken, Garth knows that, but would rather send signals to Harper than propose real made-in-canada solutions.
Politics > Environmental solutions. Always has been, and its why the libs didn’t make any progress for the last decade they were in power.
We’ll see if they can put together a realistic environmental plan before the next election. Cap and Trade + Kyoto wont do it.
Consumer+Business Carbon Royalty + Nuclear energy to replace co2 sources is what will win this coming election in Alberta.
The Liberals could learn a lot from Gary Lunn. And Flaherty could learn a lot from the Libs.
“How much money have you spent” — perfect!
since when do ya need preconditions to take a principled stand Garth??
resign… and get re-elected.
Unless you think you can’t… or you don’t want to give up your cushy paycheck and benefits for a few weeks to a couple months while you wait for a byelection result.
To the people calling for Garth to resign. Garth is willing to resign with the promise from the PM to immediatly call a by-election. He is willing to accept a promise from the same man that promised not to tax income trusts. Seems like a very noble move in my opinion. Quit putting the pressure on Garth to resign and focus you pressure on the PM to agree to call a by-election as soon as Garth resigns. Doesn’t seem that complicated but people like Achnad and Tim D do’t seem to understand completly. Regards
Important point! This blog makes QP look like a tea party. It’s exceedingly, depressingly rare to find a
politician anywhere in the world, let alone Canada, who has both the guts and the technical acumen (not to mention ego and fireproof longjohns) required to do anything that compares with http://www.garth.ca. That’s why I really don’t give a darn what party Garth sits with, as long as he keeps bringing us with him.
Okay, dial it back a smidge there, pardner. I’ve seen 8-bit bulletin boards in small towns get as many comments. The USENET group “can.politics” gets far more articles, even ignoring spam. If this site were about a famous sybarite who couldn’t sing but did anyway, it would probably get four times as many comments as it does. (Not a suggestion, just sayin’.)
Still, it sure would be nice if we had a few more “digital democratic” MPs.
Garth, PMSH has officially announced he will call a by-election in Halton IMMEDIATELY after you resign you seat.
HE PROMISES HE WILL KEEP HIS WORD!!!!! HE HAS EVEN WRITTEN A PIECE FOR THE NATIONAL POST SO IT IS IN WRITING AND HE CAN BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.
…of course he did the same thing with Income trusts, so you’d be a fool to believe the LIAR!!!
GO GO GARTH.
I think the cons have nothing better to do but troll Garths blog. They have no where to go, Harper and his sheep don’t even have blogs or open forums for discussion. I feel sorry for the cons because they are lost. They don’t even know the agenda of their own leader.So let them post on an open forum here at GArths.
I used to be a Liberal supporter, and had switched to the Conservatives when I felt the Liberals had lost their way. Now with you, Mr. Turner, as a Liberal member, there may be hope for the Liberal party.
At least there is one party with an honest member, who has integrity, and walks the talk. I am now leaning Liberal again, but will watch their actions before making any committment.
I do not like the arbitrary direction the Conservatives are going in. I do not like their secrecy nor their total lack of respect for their constituents.
The only question left is do I vote Red or Green. The Blue have lost this persons vote.
After reading through the many posts here, I can only hope that all these people hold every politician that represents them, to the same super high standard that they are holding you to.
My guess is that many of the naysayers are simply Tory sheep. Why? How hard is it to understand:
1. Guarantee of resignation upon a date set for a byelection.
2. You were removed from the Conservative party.
3. You did not cross the floor, as it seems you have to belong to a party for that to happen.
I hope that your integrity, honesty and openness will rub off on some of our elected representatives.
Another important point geekwad is that good ole garth is editing comments of his dislike. That doesn’t make this blog in anyway ” exceedingly, depressingly rare to find”. It just makes it another cheap effort by a cheap politician at taxpayers expense to re-spin himself as is often necessay by self-serving politicians
I edit nothing. — Garth
Enough,
Let’s move on to something important!
Garth simple question – asked before with no answer…can the PM call for a by-election in a riding which still has a sitting MP?
If No…PMSH et al should realise they can stop your contribution to GHG’s..but of course the environment is not one of their priorities (Well done Mr. McGuinty, David that is, for sticking it to Mr. Baird!). Of course Mr. Baird retorted that they don’t sit around figuring ways to raise taxes. Funny, his finance minister Mr. Flaherty doesn’t know the definition of a balanced budget. But I digress…
Back to by-elections .. if yes….then PMSH realises he’ll need more than the NDP’s support after the by-elections should he call them.
So what is the answer, yes or no, can the PM call a by-election in a riding that has a sitting MP?
Geekwad,
I’d love to see Harper run a blog with a comment section that is as open as Garth’s
GMAN,
There is a delay on Garth’s comment section, and I still seem to reading lots of “negative” posts here about Garth, why I even read yours.
I heart Geekwad.
The only thing “exceedingly, depressingly rare to find” is a politician with scruples such as Garth
Some PM Harper is. He is too cowardly to even answer Garth’s question. What a total schmuck!
The postings by the CPC Hate Squad members have revealed why they love Harper…one and the same!
Anyway, all the childish behaviour in the HoC is grounds for a Class-action lawsuit against the MP’s for totally wasting our tax dollars.
I see more mature behaviour from my one and four year old grandsons, than the MP in Parliament! DISGUSTING!
Oh, and now we have another crisis The Hype Shortage! LMAO!
An aside: Would someone in the Conservative Caucus please instruct Ms. Ambrose to stop making cow eyes and blushing like a school girl every time Steve Harper stands up to speak?
She is embarassing herself and the P.M.’s wife.
Garth, thanks for not anwering my first questions.
So Garth, what’s the Liberal’s position on pension income-splitting? on GST reduction? on smaller central federal government? on oil and gas industry, in Alberta? in NFLD? in Sask? in Quebec?
Simple questions to answer – surely your new boss won’t mind that.
Ask the party. When you want to know where I stand, ask me. — Garth
I didn’t feel my post about Garth, Belinda and Scott Brison’s imaginary conversation while having a coffee break together was so extreme as to be deleted.
I guess this is very sensitive blog.
No, it still has a modicum of class. — Garth
Mr Turner,
I just left a blog on this site ( at 3:06), it appeared for a brief moment, and off it went!
Why?
After a comment is posted it goes into a moderation queue and is then reviewed and approved before it appears on the blog. While 99% of all comments are approved, those which are mindlessly personally negative, totally irrelevant, vulgar or from another planet do not make it. — Garth
Mr Turner has a once in a lifetime opportunity to redress a wrong,and be a decisive force in helping Candian retirees who got slaughtered by mr Flaherty’s about face on income trusts.I certainly hope that he will fight on behalf of all those who were unjustifiably impoverished on Halloween 2006.His background gives him the tools to address this issue efficiently and force the stubborn tories to back off and admit you should not renege on a firm commitment so casually.
Garth,
I have news for you – the date of byelections in Canada is determined by the Prime Minister….*you* are not the Prime Minister…..*you* do not get to dicate when a byelection will be called.
If you were to resign and Mr. Harper chose not to call an election for 6 months, that is his perogative….it would be wrong and outrageous and hopefully the Conservative party would pay the price in the byelection….but it is NOT NOT NOT your right to dicate when a byelection will be called!
You can spin until you are dizzy, but the bottom line is that integrity requires you to resign just like you said others should do. Your attitude that you have the right to dictate the date of the byelection reinforces the view many of us have that your ego has grown totally out of control.
And for the record..while I have voted Reform and then Conservative and will likely do so again, I am disgusted by the PM actions regarding Emerson et. al. The point is that his conduct is irrelevant to your integrity and your previous statements…you are simply establishing yourself as one more politician who talks a good game but turns out to be cut from the same cloth as most of the rest.
“to all the old people out their complaining about the income trust switch… you’re all a bunch of greed mongers, who don’t care about the future of this country but only your fat wallets, hey Garth… give us some advice on Income Trusts… seeing that you’re such a financial guru?”
Quick, get tested for rabies.
Question for Dodge et al:
How does David Dodge’s theory about enhancing knowledge-based companies ability to prosper come into play when BCE’s strategy merely consists of (1) reorganizing their corporate self for the sole purpose of creating a four year tax holiday (2) sell Telesat, Canada’s only satelite company to controlling foreign owners and the balance as a tax free trust in the Public Sector pension plan and (3) buying back $1 billion + in stock. How does any of this jive with Dodge? Good for stock option gains, hardly good for Canada.
Meanwhile, we read in today’s paper that Telus is the target of foreign private equity. Great..now these foreign private equity players will take advantage of the corporate deductibility of interest and load Telus up with debt and send all of Telus’s pretax cash flows south of the border and free of any taxation……then we will have big time leakage….DoF inspired self-induced tax leakage…these guys are the one’s Flaherty must have been referring to when he said “too cute by halfâ€. Afterall, there was no leakage to start with, that has become abundantly clear.
We certainly wouldn’t want Telus’s pretax cash flows ending up in the hands of taxable Canadians who are seeking some means to provide retirement income in a protracted low rate interest environment. Who cares, it’s only 70% of Canadians who don’t belong to defined benefit pension plans. No conflict here, since the decision makers in Ottawa (politicians? or bureaucrats?) are well taken care of on this score with gold plated pension benefits that are the envy of every Canadian.
Oh-oh, it appears the blog is broken, will now only accept positive comments.
Testing…testing…Garth is an honest MP who’s PRIMARY concern is the people he represents, not himself.
There, that should make it past the filter…
yep
Yep, negative posts are being deleted.
The response to request for donations has been insufficient.
Stephen Harper MUST be stopped and removed from office! Follow this link and send your donations before it’s too late! An election may be called any time, and the support of all new Liberals is required immediately.
That should tell you something about the chances of the “lieberals” to get elected.
Here’s a clue, at least find an issue to whine about that your party itself hasn’t ignored for the 13 years THEY were in power.
Harper is smart enough to understand that all problems can’t be solved in 12 months too bad you guys are not.
Garth,
The seniors across this land need you now more than ever to change the unfair rules on Income Trusts proposed by the Conservatives. They promised not to tax Income Trusts to get elected. It will be your Finance and Tax background that will haunt Flaherty like he haunted the seniors on Halloween night.
Go Garth go!
I have been a Progressive Conservative all my voting days–notice I said had been–this Conservative party is only a shell of what the PC party stood for–all contact with the public at large has been lost–other than by form letter dictated & sent to be issued in place of intellegent conversation during which views from both sides of issues could be heard.
If this is what Garth has encountered as a member of the new Conservative party , i can not blame him for making this move–my frustration has been UNBEARABLE just dealing on a local level with my own Conservative MP–without an exchange of ideas we do not have a democracy.
Go get em Garth–I may not be far behind you
GOOD PIECE MARCEL!!!!!!!!!!!
“All homes in Halton were sent a survey this week asking for their comments. Town Hall meetings are scheduled for March 5,6, 7. — Garth”
And, what purpose will this serve? You have already chosen to ignore the will of the people of Halton by CHOOSING to be a LIBERAL when you were elected as a CONSERVATIVE. You also chose to ignore your consultations with constiuents in the aftermath of your dismissal from caucus – no one wanted you to become a Liberal. Why would anyone in Halton fill in some survey you send them, knowing that if they were read, they would just be ignored?
By the way, who is paying for this “survey” – the taxpayer through funds from your office? The Liberal Party? Big waste of money, if you ask me! – wow, you really are a Liberal!!
Well, first I am berated for not talking enough to constituents (only 20 Town Hall meetings in thirteen months…), now you diss me for sending a survey to every home this week asking for comment. Man, make up your mind! Meanwhile, Tim D’Sousa, how is it you find the time to post a comment every ten or 15 minutes? Believe it or not, there is an actual world out there. — Garth
Mr Turner,
thank you for your answer.
Where did my blog fall – into “personally negative, tottaly irrelevant, vulgar or from another planet”?
Always respectful,
Marek
Planet. — Garth
By Judy on 02.08.07 4:10 pm – Great post, Judy. Anything relevant to say on a real issue?
“Enough, Let’s move on to something important! – By Howard on 02.08.07 4:03 pm”
Do you live in Halton?
Here in Halton, there is nothing more important right now.
Those of us who live in Halton see the weekly ads, newspaper columns and now a survey in the mail from our honorable MP Garth Turner. All of these activites are funded by tax payer dollars and are not counted as election spending which is limited by the Canada Election Act. Remaining in office gives Mr. Turner a strategic spending advantage over his electoral opponents.
I would have preferred that Mr. Turner had waited until an election had been announced to declare his intensions to seek the nomination of the Liberal Party and continued to sit as an independent until that time. I, however, am not a politician.
I must congratulate you on your strategy. Running an unofficial campaign, joining the only party that can assure you of a cabinet position, and undermining the credibility of your opponents all in one go.
You are truly worthy of success in the cut-throat world of politics. Machiavelli could not do any better.
Brilliant. Not something I can support or respect but nevertheless brilliant. One must afterall give the devil its due.
You receive nothing now that you have not since I was elected in January. And give me credit for this – unlike with every MP Halton had had for the past 15 years, not a single piece of literature from me to your home has ever carried a party logo. — Garth
In that case, you are practising censorship – how many blogs do you toss out (not that I should believe you)?
Marek
I just wait for yours. — Garth
Still waiting Garth:
What are the personal financial implications of you joining the Liberal Party of Canada?
What kind of support will you see from the LPC in the next election, versus if you ran as an independant?
No idea, actually. I have not even asked if the local Libs have any money. But I do know I left tens of thousands in the kitty for the Cons. — Garth
“And would not the Tories love to have this Liberal seat – and this experienced member of Parliament – off the table until the next election? — Garth”
The balance of power in parliament did not shift with your move; the Conservatives still need to play well with others to maintain the confidence of the House – before, as now, they have to work with at least one other party.
But, hey, what about the whole local thing? The fact that the people of Halton elected a Conservative and now have a Liberal – without an election in between?
I notice your posts are now 6 minutes apart. Tim, get a life! — Garth
Planet. — Garth
hah! Now I wanna see it =P
Garth, when do you think the signal-to-noise ratio will come back to earth.
Post a new thread already
Garth – I will when you resign
That only took three minutes. Maybe we should give you a daily allotment of comments, say ten. Down from the current fifty? — Garth
Yep, negative ones are being deleted.
All this chatter about the prime minister guaranteeing a by-election date before a member resigns seems not to have been a part of Garth’s standard sermon while he was telling us what a rotter David Emerson was.
Question for Garth: Do you think that Dion would appoint you to a cabinet?
Ask him. — Garth
Garth, can you take a stick upside Judy Waswasa’s (NDP Finance Critic) head. I just saw her on ROBTv parroting the bs Flaherty has spewed on income trust tax leakage as justification for screwing the income trust market and investors. It seems no matter how many of their claims are disproven some of these less than intelligent politicians will keep saying the same untruths.
Gawd I can’t believe the NDP are sleeping with the CONs. The green party is going to steal all those NDP voters votes away from the NDP!
Oops, forgot the sign off.
GO GO Garth.
P.S. I can’t hope to keep up with TD’s posting volume.
“No, it still has a modicum of class. — Garth” A modicum of class my ass Garth…you wouldn’t know class if it jumped up and bit you on the ass. If you truly had any class you would have resigned weeks ago ya cheap whiney sole
How small your life has become Garth that you need to sit by the computer and delete negative posts
Actually, I have an army of trolls to do that. — Garth
When is your next update Garth, looking forward to it.
A couple coming tonight. — Garth
Speaking of the Right Choice…Here is an excellent article with substance on how we can actually accomplish carbon capture. Gee, an actual and workable technology we have NOW!
I will not resign without a binding commitment from the PM that he will immediately call a by-election. He has refused to do so. — Garth
So this whole floor crossing MP’s should resign with the caveat that the PM calls a by-election is a case of “Catch 22.” — or hot air on both sides.
The script goes like this:
Garth – Will you call a by-election for Halton?
PM – I can’t call a by-election unless you resign. (Thought bubble – and I won’t ask Mr. Khan to step down!)
Garth – I’m not resigning unless you call a by-election.
etc..etc..etc..
The end result, as you and PMSH already knew from the beginning, you won’t resign because he won’t call a by-election, and the two of you will continue to trade barbs over the matter in the house.
Sorry Garth…no political points for this one…
Of course as soon as Flaherty presents his budget…you could resign right there, Halton would only be without an MP for maybe 2 weeks when the budget is defeated and an election is called, if you’re prepared to take the risk!!
Congratulations on your latest job! With your unique political background, perhaps Mr. Dion will give you a special role such as “Conservative Caucus Confidences Critic”?
Think of the press! The press!
I also hope you will vote your conscience and not allow yourself to be whipped into self-betrayal, or at least have a ready explanation if you should succumb. (Assuming you run next time as a Liberal and get re-elected, you may want to save that “vote your conscience” thing until after the next election.)
And please don’t forget to blog if anyone in the LPC caucus or even Stéph-the-Chef disagrees with you. (Again, that might have to wait until after the next election, in case, you know.)
After all, if it hits the fan with the LPC, aren’t the NDP, the Greens or even the Progressive Canadian Party future possibilities?
“Ask the party. When you want to know where I stand, ask me. — Garth”
Huh? are you part of the Liberal party or not? So when you go into the next election, will you run on your own platform or the Liberal platform? Now, I’m really curious. Thanks.
It’s business as usual, Catherine. — Garth
The Socon, Neocon, Reform, Alliance, so called conservaties, are a yappy bunch. Take notice: They do a whole lot of talkin’, and yet have nothing to say! Babble on, you partisans of continuous dicontent.
Congratulations Garth for making the move. Ever since I came across your blog, late in December, when I started my own little personal campaign against the lies and disinformation from Flaherty and Harper regarding Income Trusts, I have felt the citizens of Halton were well served. Keep up the good work. The Income Trust treachery is something that must be undone, and many of us are counting on the Liberals to be the catalysts for such change. Why you ever felt that a Hard right political party was what Canada needed is beyond me, but now that destiny has called, I wish you the best
CONGRATULATIONS GARTH!!!!!!!!!!
You have made all Canadians very proud. I hope for all the best for you with your new party. I believe it has been a long time coming. You are a man of dignity and honesty and you displayed this the day you joined the Liberals. I want to also add you look good having a seat in parliament where you can actually be noticed and not hidden.
kindest regards
jonathan beadle
pictou landing first nation
Apparently, Mr. Turner would like to tell me that I did not receive a survey in the mail yesterday from him.
Must have got pretty close to the truth there, eh?
Why not just admit that your media activities have increased lately. Ads, newspaper columns, interviews and now this survey.
Why does it need a logo to be electioneering? It’s obviously promoting Garth Turner, a product currently under licence to the Liberal Party of Canada.
Who’s kidding who?
We all know that an election can be called at any time. This seems to be the season for political posturing. Let’s at least, be honest about it.
Resigning would limit the amount of money that you could spend on “communicating” and “educating” us, Halton voters.
Oh, so you’re against an MP surveying constituents? Would you rather have someone who sent you PMO press releases with your own tax dollars? — Garth
“Actually, I have an army of trolls to do that. — Garth” Ya no doubt and at tax payers expense no less…why don’t you get a real job ya cheap sole!
My trolls work for free. — Garth
Darren Parker… wow.
Your beef with Garth seems to go a lot deeper than politics.
Garth, in an effort to break through the name calling, what are your thoughts on the question from Paul Crête to Maxime Bernier today?
Mr. Speaker, once again, the Minister of Industry is siding with telecommunications giants against consumers and is refusing to apply the principle of net neutrality, which guarantees identical upload or download speeds for anonymous blogs and big business websites alike. Real competition for sure.
Can the minister make a commitment, here in this House, not to make any decisions that would favour big businesses at the expense of consumers, thus ensuring that the Internet remains a democratic tool?
How will Garth.ca survive on a non-neutral internet?
Maxime responded
Mr. Speaker, once again, I would like to tell my Bloc Québécois colleague that, unlike the Bloc Québécois, we listen to consumers and we protect Quebeckers. We have here an Ipsos-Reid poll saying that 75% of Quebeckers support telecommunications reform. Not 50%, not 60%, but 75% of Quebeckers support telecommunications reform. Why? Because they know that competition will lead to better prices and better services.
Seems like the CPC has picked sides.
Where do you guys sit?
I do not know the Lib position, but will find out. I think you know mine, based on the existence of this site. I find Bernier’s reponse to indicate he had no idea what the question meant. — Garth
Well, posting your neighbors phone number here because you don’t like him isn’t really nice. Somebody might actually call him and blame him for your childish post!
That was an error and the comment has been deleted. I actually called the gentleman and we had a worthwhile conversation. — Garth
I guess this is very sensitive blog.
No, it still has a modicum of class. — Garth
Thank-you for the reply, Garth.
After looking up what modium means, I agree with that statement.
Chill Darren Parker.
Nice Darren parker, real nice.
Why would anyone want to call you in the first place.
What’s that phone# anyway? An ‘escort service’? A pizza joint?
Most people can spot ‘baiting’ a mile away. Now go back to playing with your tinker toys.
His number was posted in error. I apologize, and did call him. — Garth
Ya & I have some swamp land in Florida I’d like to sell you
Say, why does a guy in New Jersey spend so much time on this site? — Garth
“That was an error and the comment has been deleted. I actually called the gentleman and we had a worthwhile conversation. — Garth” Did you swap nudie images?
I guess Garth has never been to New Jersey. Most folks there stay indoors, for good reason
Of course he has no integrity. He’s a Liberal. Liberals, by definition, have to take an oath admitting that they don’t care about Canada. I’ve yet to be proven wrong.
I say this as someone who once had a ton of respect for Garth Turner. I wouldn’t be as disappointed as I am if he were to say, “I intend to run for the Liberal nomination in the next general election”, like Keith Martin (BC MP) did a few years ago.
Garth, there’s a reason why Sheila Copps has respect amongst a lot of people and you don’t. Remember when she resigned and re-ran and won? She didn’t wait for the Prime Minister to call a by-election. A resignation now would look a lot like Stockwell Day in December 2001, officially “resigning” the Alliance leadership.
You said people should resign if they cross the floor. You didn’t. This, sir, makes you a hypocrite, no matter how much you try to dance around the issue.
“Say, why does a guy in New Jersey spend so much time on this site? — Garth”
It’s called living abroad Garp…something your constitutients would perhaps wish you would consider on a full time basis
Nice try, Garth. Why don’t you admit that the only reason you decided to join the liberals is because you smell an election coming, and you need the Liberal cheque book to help with your election campaign?
That’s the least of my concerns. — Garth
Bang on Trev..excellent comments. I wouldn’t have a problem with Mr. Turners so called disloyality if he at least had the moral fiber to back up his convictions…Instead all I see is another self-serving politician in a cheap suit talking out of the side of his face to justify his existience
Cheap suit? Now that really hurts… — Garth
Man there are a lot of pissypant cons here! What are they going to do when Harper is booted from Ottawa ?
KEvin and gman will go postal!
Keep up the great work Garth and you definately get my vote and support.
Garth,
On the neutrality issue, I have a list of 750 digital signatures from the site that you might be interested in. You’ve got my email if you want them.
Garth you have said:I find it strange so many people coming to this blog can write, but they can’t read. I said unequivocably that I would trade my resgnation for a by-election date. So there is your answer. As for whatever the Lib process is, that’s fine with me (and the former incumbant is now a regional politician). – Garth
=====================
Every time you say it you insult us, we the public are not FOOLS! The fact is, if you RESIGNand then Harper has no alternative but to call a by-election. DUH!
How many times do you have to be told?
Jerry
Garth I have posted this post prior to this and have seen it posted and 20 minutes later it was removed, and it was not the first time I had posted it. WHY are you having my posts removed?
After you write a post it goes into a moderation queue for approval and posting. You do not see that queue. How many times do you have to be told? — Garth
Self serving blog indeed. And now a HypoGrit to boot.
It all fits. It’s all Garth all the time. Demands that people resign when they cross the floor but when he does there now has to be “conditions” on it.
I note that you aren’t reporting caucus minutes and discussions now that you’ve turned hypocrite, er I mean Liberal.
How very convenient of you.
You’re seeming integrity went out the window with your political expediency.
This whole mess also tells me a lot about Stephan Dion and how the Liberal hasn’t changed one iota.
Too bad, I had hopes after his election as party leader.
“That’s the least of my concerns. — Garth”
That is your main concern Garth, you can’t raise the money independently because you have no credibility left.
The party with largest chequebook showed you the way to exit door and you needed the only other way in.
Don’t take the electorate for fools Garth, we can see it as plain as day.
Obviously, you know little of this. — Garth
Trev: By your definition, Emerson and other Liberals who crossed have no integrity either. Do you welcome them to the Conservative fold?
TD: Ms. Ambrose’s lack of decorum in the House is a relevant issue. Surely I am not the only one who has watched Question Period and been privy to her obvious infatuation with Steve.
I gotta say Garth, after reading some of these attack posts you sure are doing a great job maintaining a sense of humour. I think the CONservatives have diverted some of their financial resources from the Dion Attack ads to go after you.
I smell the fear in their words.
GO GO Garth!
Garth Turner joining the Liberals. I’m very shocked and disappointed to see you make this move in the wrong direction!
After you write a post it goes into a moderation queue for approval and posting. You do not see that queue. How many times do you have to be told? — Garth
Is this part of the upgrade? Now I’m not complaining, I think this is necessary given some overly abusive comments. However, I have noticed that my posts appear immediately on the blog,
then disappear (most likely to the moderation queue) only to reappear once they’ve been vetted. I just went looking for one to see if you’d past comment. Can’t find it now.
Having said that, I bet this one won’t appear until after its vetted.
Have your techy guy check it out…
maybe you need to say “your post has been submitted to the queue” rather than having it appear on the blog when “say it” is clicked.
FYI….I can see my last post..immediately after “Say It”
But only briefly. Then it disappears into the cue. — Garth
Garth…congratulations on joining the Liberal Party. I’ll bet all the Conservatives are looking at you with envy as they can’t say anything without prior approval from President Harpoon.
We are Canadians therefore we do what Canadians does best…talk about issues and then get it done. In the 90′s the deficit was a big issue and the Liberals had to get our finances in order (Liberals as well as the Conservatives are both equally responsible for this fiasco). Liberals’ slaying of the deficit did hurt a lot of people along the way…no pain – no gain. Yet here we are, deficit is being manage by surpluses. Who should we thank for this – the Liberals. It would be nice to give some of that back to people who were hurt by this deficit slaying.
Now we are face with an environment spiralling out of control. What I see is mostly talk and no action. Someone should take ownership of this problem and it is obvious who should that be – our PM.
We are a peace loving nation and we should be doing everything in our power to broker peace agreements or the very least get them talking especially between Palestine and Israel – US and Iran as well as NK yet we are sitting there doing nothing except ad-lib. It wasn’t that long ago when every country looked up to us as a model…now we are just nobodies ad-libbing to everyone who, by the way, are not listening.
I do hope you get your wish to re-run as I know you will win hands down. We need someone who can help Liberals in a big way. Stick that in your pipe and smoke it PMSH or should I say the President.
Basil
Last time I looked Ms. Ambrose was a grown woman and a consenting adult. I thought the liberals supported the idea of the privacy of what goes on in other people’s bedrooms. I guess I must have gotten that wrong.
Anyone who can get interested in what Ms. Ambrose does in her spare time must consider a change in Belinda’s haircolour a major news item.
Looking forward to my post containing the words binary and cellophane appearing on your website. Another post that has mysteriously vanished.
I wonder why?
The post is now back again. Man, this website sucked. It’s more up & down than a toilet seat at a party.
Troll quality is just not what it used to be.
Once a post is published, it does not move or disappear. Our site architecture makes that impossible. Blame your browser, babe. — Garth
Garth:
Funny how many people believe in the “Party” instead of the person. You had so many CONservative (and other) supporters before, now many don’t say one positive thing. I don’t believe you’ve changed that much in one day!!!
How come the CONservative whiners are not crying for Khan to step down and let the people elect them? (they don’t care!) Politicians aren’t the only self-serving hypocrites, I must conclude.
I support your move, and hope you will be a force for better as you are now with the Liberal Party. Maybe they will be the next majority Government, who knows?
I defy these hard line CONservatives to tell me that PMSH is not a hypocrite for what he promised and then did about Income Trusts. Not too much talk about this, except “it had to be done.” Bull.
Garth, now you can work harder to get Income Splitting happening and maybe changing this bad Income Trust decision, not to mention many others. I wouldn’t want to be one of Harper’s puppets either.
Congrats!
Congratulations. I voted last time cons,but not this time.What they did for income trusts,mimics their whole style, a bull in a china shop. I hope you can shape the policy of the Liberals, to change the newly uninformed retrocative tax.
After you write a post it goes into a moderation queue for approval and posting. You do not see that queue. How many times do you have to be told? — Garth
I do not recall anywhere on your site reading the posts would first be moderated before posting and I had posted often in the past and it was not the case. I would see my post as soon as it was sent. Things have apparently been changed of late.
Sad that you would feel the need respond mokingly and to play games with those among us who may think you are not the good person you would have some believe you are. You are wrong on the issue of calling a by-election, resign and you’ll see.
Jerry
The comment moderation process has been in place from the first day this blog started. No change there. As for my mocking tone, I was merely mocking your mocking tone which was mocking me. Man, are you ever sensitive! Avoid politics. — Garth
Garth,
How do you keep your Trolls so lively and frisky, do feed them Troll Chow or what?
“Hey, DBT, he hands me a date, I hand him a resignation. I think PMSH can understand that, don’t you? — Garthâ€
Why are you seriously showboating this around like your “stuff” doesn’t stink? That’s not how it works, and you know it. If you were serious about your constituents and everything you’ve said in the past about integrity, etc, blah blah blah, then you know what you need to do. But please, some of us are smarter than you give us credit for.
I guess you’re called Dark Blue Tory for a reason, eh? — Garth
Mr. Turner, your request for the Prime Minister to call by-elections in your riding along with the ridings of Mr. Emerson and Mr. Khan is somewhat misinformed. The Prime Minister cannot call by-elections in ridings which are currently occupied by sitting members; to do so would go against parliamentary and democratic convention. For a by-election to be called, you must first resign your seat. I request that you cease misleading the voting public into believing that it is the Prime Minister’s inaction that is preventing a by-election in your riding, when in fact, as Minister van Loan stated, “the ball is 100% in your court.”
People have repeatedly pointed out to you that you are wrong on the by-election issue ..but then what the heck ..you are the sick controller of this blog.
Jerry
Is that any way to get more airtime here? — Garth
Congratulations! You’ve joined the party of the Sponsorship Scandal, HRDC boondoggle, and $50 billion EI rip-off.
And you know what? It fits you.
I’m getting worried that Garth is gonna strap on Astronaut diapers, grab some ammo, hop in his 8 cyclinder mega pollution emitting SUV and drive 2,000 km to Calgary to hunt down Stephen Harper. Man have you ever blown a gaskette Garthy!
Garth,
You say that it is my browser. If it’s the browser, why does the post reappear when I send another post just like you described to another poster. If it was gone, it would be gone.
The post was sent hours ago and still is not on the blog when I visit.
Still trolling for an answer.
Sent to webmaster for an explanation. I trust it was a nice, flattering post? — Garth
Garth Turner rocks he is another MP that I like a lot. About his floor crossing; I am not upset that he crossed the floor for several reasons some of which are pointed out in this video below. I also have laied out my reasons for accepting his crossing the to the Liberals below. By the way I liked him both when he was a Idependent and Tory MP.
First He was booted from the Tory caucus for speaking his mind. He did not leave the Tory caucus for a position of power which I further discuss in more detail in reason number seven below.
Second As he has advocated and called for he sat as an Independent MP for four months before he crossed the floor to the Liberal Caucus.
Third As he said when he made his announcment and in Question Period today that he would stand in a By-election if the Prime Minister called one so he could be held accountable by the voters of Holton for the decision he made to join the Liberal team.
Fourth As he rightly states that if he stayed as an Independent in Pariliment he could not sit on any parlimenatry committee.
Fifth If Garth Turner were to resigen on his owen without the call of a by-election by the Prime Minister who knows how long the people of the riding in Halton would be without an MP in the house of Commons. I highly dought that the Prime Minister would call a by election for Garth Turner or other MP’s who have recently crossed the floor because of the implifications it would cause the Tory government both Good and Bad.
Sixth There will be a federal election within the next 6-8 months. Most minority governments last on average only 18 months and so the people of his riding will have their say soon enough on what they think of his choice.
Seventh He nethier accepted or expected a major posistion as an opposistion critic for crossing the floor to the Liberals unlike defections to the government or opposisition of recent memory Mr. Turner and Mr. Dion should be apluaded for this.
In closing I think Mr. Turner is smart, hard-working and is one of the best MP’s Canada has or has ever had. I also like him for his bluntness and to the point style. I would hope the people of Halton would look at his recored of service when they make their election decision. I hope they return him to Ottawa after the next election because of the reasons I have listed above. Just so you know I would have voted for Mr. Turner if I lived in his riding no matter what party he is or was a member of this includes that Tories even though I am very glad he has joined the Dion team. So, Welcome Mr. Turner and keep doing what you do so well, that is being the best MP for the people and riding of Halton and standing up for what you believe in.
Just so you guys know I am an American studying Canadian politics at my University in Minnesota.
Don’t worry, Garth! Once the Liberals boot you out sometime down the road (or you get tired of them) there’s always the NDP! Better hurry though, because either way you’re going to be toast in the next election if the people of Halton judge you on your own (previous) standards.
“Obviously, you know little of this. — Garth”
I know far more than you might ever know Garth. And it has all become even more crystal clear with your politically expedient move. You call yourself a “progressive” Conservative yet when you ran for the leadership of that party, and lost, you were the most right wing of all five candidates.
I’d be very tempted to call your questioning of the Prime Minister in the House relevant if you hadn’t rendered yourself a hypocrite by placing conditions upon your own floor crossing that you never once placed on the other floor crossers.
You’ve become irrelevant Garth.
That’s the sad part. I sincerely thought you were different, not one of them.
Interesting how parties change, isn’t it? With many of the same ideas and priorities today as in 1993 (family tax return, income-splitting, tax reform, environmental action plan etc.), I am considered on the progressive side of the Harper Conservative Party and the conservative side of the Dion Liberal Party, as I was considered on the right side of the Mulroney Progressive Conservative Party. This is a good thing, since if parties do not shift priorities along with the population, they become irrlevant. As for my offer to resign, it stands. All PMSH had to do it give me a date, and he has my letter. How hard is that? If he believed in political accountability, h’e do it in a heartbeat. Maybe you should leave a comment on his blog, heh, heh. — Garth
I gotta say I’m in love with Garth’s trolls almost as much as I love Garth.
Keep up the great work replying with those sometimes humourous rebuts!!
Garth, Harper has a blog? You gotta be kidding me. Maybe you should have the webmaster redirect all these CONservative posts over this his blog/
In only wish. In the meantime, drop him a line: pm@pm.gc.ca. — Garth
Maybe someone can explain to me why all this support or criticism of one MP? All MPs in Ottawa vote as they are told and if they don’t, they are relegated to the back bench and the most meaningless of committees. Do you really think they are there to represent you? Wake up, vote for an independent. If we all did that, question period might have some purpose other than trying to embarrass the party opposite. We might actually have some civilized debate on the floor. Right now, all that is done there is mindless campaigning. The MPs are doing just fine for themselves, they are the smart ones, we, the voters are the fools! It doesn’t matter which party is in power, they are all the same.
If only Garth had remained an Independent…what a shame!
Phil – walk a mile in my shoes, buddy. Indies may be romantic figures, but they have zero impact on legislation on the Hill and almost no chance of changing anything. It looks like I am the first MP is decades to ever try and change that with motions in Parliament to make them equal to party MPs. Until that is accomplished, it strikes me trying to influence the parties that control the place makes a bit more sense. — Garth
Garth
Is there a camera you don’t like?
How can you serve Halton, when you are on the media constantly?
Be a man, resign, and if you want to be a liberal (or is it conservative? or is it independent? or whatever the hell you stand for) and get yourself elected.
YOU ARE A LIAR, HAVE NO ETHICAL STANDARDS, ARE IN LOVE WITH YOUR SELF, DON’T GIVE A DAMN ABOUT HALTON.
YOU ARE MAKE MAKES POLITICIANS LOOK BAD.
UNGLY POLITICIAN=GARTH TURNER
WHAT AN JOKE YOU HAVE BECOME.
Al, does York University know you are using their computer to send these messages of encouragement to me? Do they teach grammar there? –Garth
Same sh*t, different day! No matter how you spin your regurgatate diatribe Garth, you still come out looking like the cheap soul you are with no sense of allegiance or commitment to anything other then the delusion you call your life…Oh ya…and the wearing of cheap suits.
Your arguments in defense of your party disloyality make about as much sense as a birth control salesman pushing his wares at a lesbian conference.
So how much “sponsorship” money did you get Garth? What has Dalton promised?
Is this a Yuk-Yuk’s rehearsal? — Garth
Garth:
Indies may have zero impact on legislation as you say, but if we elect enough of them, they just may control the balance of power in the House. Furthermore, if we elect all independent MPs, the voters may be able to take their country back from the mud slinging party back room boys. Almost anything would be better than the present joke we call question period.
Is it too much to ask for some decency and integrity in our politicians?
I agree, and it is up to the voters to make this change occur. So long as we have a presidential system, however – voting for leaders instead of local candidates – that will be a long time coming. — Garth
Judy at 8:39 last night asked:
“Trev: By your definition, Emerson and other Liberals who crossed have no integrity either. Do you welcome them to the Conservative fold?”
The simple answer is no, because they were both Liberals at one point.
Speaking more generally, the present ranking of integrity of floor-crossers, starting with the worst, is:
Belinda
Emerson
Turner
Brison
Khan
Keith Martin
Let it be said still that of those six, the only one I have respect for is Keith Martin. He sat as an independent until the 04 election, ran as a Liberal for the nomination, won the seat. That is the way you do it. I don’t like that he switched to the Liberals, but he did in the most respectful way you can do it.
And to GMan, with the cheap suit comment, you should be careful. There is a society of cheap suit enthusiasts who would sue you for defamation for saying that Garth is one of them.
To all cheap suit enthusiasts and/or societies of the world, allow me to apologize for casting aspersions on your distinctive attire by including in your membership one Garth Turner. If I have cheapened further the cheap suit which I now see I have by this inclusion then I again apologize.
I should have said that it’s the man that makes the suit or as in Mr. Turner’s case, the lack of the man there of.
It interests me that so many people come to this blog to do nothing more than cut up a politician who is actually trying to provide a service that will promote democracy. I’m all for debate and opposition to political beliefs and actions (both of which, Mr. Turner has many to comment on), but can we try and keep this more civilized and progressive? Name calling, pointless remarks, and personal attacks are childish and accomplish nothing. Feel free to agree or disagree with Mr. Turner… it’s your democratic right to do so. But come on, Canada… show some maturity, education, and class when you post these comments.
I will continue to read the comments to these blogs with hopes that the users will provide more logical arguments, more mature comments, and foster discussion, debate, and above all else, democracy.
Cheers,
Sean
Oh we have no problem comprehending.
You want your resignation to be concurrent with the Right Honourable Prime Minister calling a by election.
Funny though, you never mentioned that condition with the other floor crossers, just yours.
Garth is now a true HypoGrit.
Had David Emerson made that offer, I’d have taken him roses. — Garth
Mr. Turner……now that you’re a Liberal, I’m curious as to how you feel about the comments made by Mr. Dion on how he’d push for more women MP’s up to and excluding men from being able to run. Isn’t that discrimination based on gender?? Below is the article. In addition, it was also made public on AM640 radio. I wonder if you’ll do the right thing and be outspokenly vocal on this issue, or will you let it slide as you don’t want to upset your new boss.
I an sincerely interested in your response on this.
Joan Bryden, Canadian Press
Published: Thursday, February 08, 2007
OTTAWA (CP) — Liberal Leader Stephane Dion is prepared to take “extraordinary measures†to boost the ranks of women candidates in the next election, including barring men from seeking nominations in some ridings.
During last year’s leadership race, Dion promised that under his watch at least a third of the party’s candidates in the next election would be women.
But campaign organizers have concluded that the ambitious goal will be impossible to reach without some intervention to secure nominations for female candidates.
So-called green-light committees, set up to run the party’s nomination process in each province, have been empowered to ensure the 33 per cent target is met. Among other things, the committees can set dates for nomination meetings and approve or reject nomination papers from those seeking to carry the Liberal colours.
Where necessary, the committees will be able to simply refuse to allow men to run for nominations in some ridings.
“We’re trying to find the techniques that are consistent with our democratic processes to the greatest extent possible,†said Gerard Kennedy, Dion’s special adviser on election readiness.
Local riding associations are being encouraged as much as possible to find women to seek nominations. But, with an election possible as early as next month, Kennedy said the party simply doesn’t have the luxury of a lengthy recruitment drive.
Consequently, he said the party will have to use more drastic measures to ensure a sufficient number of women wind up on the Liberal election roster.
“We’re still studying and discussing some of the techniques that we might use, such as women-only contests or what have you. But I think those measures will be somewhat exceptional,†he said.
The leader retains the power to simply appoint women candidates, bypassing the nomination process altogether, but insiders say Dion wants to use that power sparingly, if at all. Appointments have in the past set off controversy, particularly from would-be candidates who frequently had spent months preparing to fight a contested nomination.
Dion’s campaign strategists contend that declaring certain ridings off-limits to men at the outset will ultimately be fairer to all concerned. Still, they acknowledge that the measure is bound to be controversial.
“We’re going to pay some price,†Kennedy said.
“We’d like it to be a relatively small price . . . but the price we’re paying is because we didn’t quite make as much success as we should have (recruiting women in the past) and everyone has come to the realization that we have to take extraordinary measures, that the Liberal party has to become a political organization that reflects the face of Canada.â€
In last winter’s election, only 26 per cent of Liberal candidates were women, although women make up slightly more than half the Canadian population.
The challenge of reaching 33 per cent next time is all the greater because Dion has promised to protect all incumbent MPs from nomination challenges. Currently, only 21 of the Liberals’ 101 MPs are women.
Dion needs to come up with at least 80 women to run in ridings currently not held by the Liberals to arrive at 33 per cent overall. In other words, almost 40 per cent of the candidates in unheld ridings must be women.
Equal Voice, an advocacy group dedicated to increasing the participation of women in politics, applauded the move to reserve some ridings for women only.
“Right now it looks as if 80 per cent of the ridings are reserved for men,†said Rosemary Speirs, founder of Equal Voice.
“So I don’t see that this is imposing a quota or tokenism or anything else. I think it’s just an effort to make sure the party reaches out to women and gets some in there.â€
Speirs added that leaving ridings to their own devices to recruit candidates “doesn’t seem to work for women.â€
Canada has dismal record of female participation in federal politics. Only 20.8 per cent of 308 MPs are women, putting Canada in 46th place in the world — right behind Singapore.
Kennedy said any outcry over perceived favouritism toward women should be limited by the fact that all leadership contenders, including himself, echoed Dion in promising to substantially increase the number of women candidates, with the eventual aim of reaching 50 per cent.
Nevertheless, even men who support the goal of boosting the ranks of women aren’t likely to be thrilled if their own hopes of becoming a candidate wind up being dashed as a result.
“I’m sure everybody wants it to happen in all other ridings but not their own,†joked Richard Mahoney, a two-time Liberal candidate in Ottawa Centre who is still considering whether to make a third try at becoming an MP.
The riding, currently held by the NDP, has two probable, high-profile women candidates — Isabel Metcalfe and Penny Collenette. Scott Bradley is already campaigning and Mahoney may yet join the fray.
Some Liberals contend Ottawa Centre is the exactly the kind of riding where men should be barred from seeking the nomination, although Kennedy suggested there may be no need to intervene.
“In ridings where women are well established and don’t suffer any disadvantages and so on, there’s no reason why we can’t let a competitive outcome get us the result we need.â€
Mahoney said staging women-only nomination contests is probably the best way to resolve the under-representation of women. But he admitted it would “tough†to be told he can’t run.
Similarly, Bradley acknowledged he’d be “disappointed.†While he too supports the goal of 33 per cent female candidates, the 37-year-old said that has to be balanced against other worthy goals like renewing the party and bringing in new blood.
However, Kennedy said the party’s dismal record in recruiting women in the past “justifies disappointing some and requiring accommodations from others and generally doing a hurry up in trying to make us fully open and fully fair for qualified women who want to contest.â€
You might be interested in knowing that the Conservatives are doing just the same, with intensive, female-only candidate searches. Both parties are trying to reduce the 80%-male composition of the House of Commons and make it more representative of the population. That is a noble goal, and I support it, although I am concerned about reverse discimination. Next time just post a link, okay?– Garth
Thankyou for the response Mr. Turner. However, I question the comment about the Conservatives. I agree boosting the number of women MP’s is a good thing, and support any moves as such. My concerns have been and still are the methods by which this is accomplished. If you ahve evidence that the Federal Conservatives plan to do this by excluding men, then by all means please share it. I would be happy to read anything you may have on this. My original question still stands though. Do you as the MP for Halton plan to speak up against such discrimination to Stephane Dion?? If so, will you make this as public as some of your other complaints?? Sorry about the long message. I will endeavour to just post links in the future. I look forward to your response.
I will take no position on this until I see something other than a media report. This could be just as accurate as last week’s report saying the Tories were deep-sixing income-splitting, only to have the finance minister say it was not so a few days later. Experience teaches caution. Meanwhile I assert with certainty that the Conservatives are desperately recruting women to be candidates, for precisely the same reasons. — Garth
I’m not doubting that the Conservatives are trying to recruit women candidates. Are they doing so with the intent to exclude men as Stephane Dion has said he would?? If so, do you have evidence to support this claim?? That’s all I’m asking Mr. Turner. Now, hypothetically speaking, if Mr. Dion does intend to exclude men, thereby discriminating on the basis of gender, will you speak out against it??
Thankyou.
When I get some answers, I’ll comment. — Garth