In the wake of last night’s Kyoto vote, there’s no doubt in this boy’s mind that my constituents (and everybody else’s) will be voting for a new government in May.
Already I thought it was in the bag. I mean, duh. Budget on March 20th chock full of impossible tax goodies, an environmental plan with gonads, bushels of money for the provs (especially Quebec), pension-splitting, a modified, friendlier income trust deal, tax cuts. That is followed six days later by a Jean Charest victory in Quebec, bolstering the federalist cause and nuking that irritating Boisclair guy, as well as kneecapping his pal Gilles.
Of course, PMSH has been boldly audacious about sucking up to Quebec voters, with all that cash, promises of addressing the somewhat-mythical fiscal imbalance, and last November’s shameless Quebecois-are-a-nation resolution passed by the Canadian Parliament. The Cons think almost all of their seat growth in the next vote will come in that province.
So, the plan in Doug Finley’s mind – Mr. Harper’s trusted battlefield general – was always to go in mid-April, in a post-budget blaze. That would accomplish a few goals, namely catching the Liberals without a new policy book and a new leader still consolidating his influence, being able to campaign on some headline initiatives (GST cut, accountability act, tax reform, child care cash, crime stuff, softwood lumber, throwing me out etc.) and also promising to replace the popular Kyoto accord with a made-in-Canada alternative.
But, ahem, that changed a tad last night. The opposition-driven move to force Ottawa to respect Kyoto by coming up with an action plan in 60 days for its implementation has layered a new urgency on the clansman Finley’s plan. PMSH and John Baird have no intention of doing this, no plan for achieving Kyoto and no desire to even try. They will continue to say fast-tracking a climate change strategy will put a lot of people out of work (last night the word “millions†was being used liberally – but lot Liberally), and reduce the size of the economy by a third.
This means the missing election ingredient for the Cons is missing no longer. And it’s a good one. Fear.
Always more comfortable standing on economic than environmental ground, the Tories now have their raison d’etre for forcing an election. Kyoto is an impossibility, we will be told, and will hurt you and your family directly and forcefully. It will drive jobs away, hurt the dollar, raise mortgage rates, destroy the real estate and stock markets and kneecap industry, especially the energy and manufacturing sectors. Why risk that, the line will go, when you can have sustained economic growth and a climate change strategy that is not radical, but good enough?
As such, the election will constitute a blank cheque for the Conservatives who, if they perchance win (and don’t count on it), will repeal the bill passed last night in their new majority government, slow-track environmental legislation, continue to rejig the country in PMSH’s image and give you four or five years of complete federal reconstruction. At the end of it, provinces will be far more autonomous, Ottawa’s powers will be reduced, the oil sands will have at least doubled in intensity, the Senate will be sort of elected, stem-cell research and gay marriage will be memories and, ah yes, Kyoto will be some place in Japan.
The challenge for my new party, of course, will be to offer a reasonable alternative that keeps environmentalism alive in the face of fearmongering, that gives working families a reason to believe we care more than the other guys about their daily lives, that justifies maintenance of a strong and unifying federal government, that puts tolerance and social progress ahead of prejudice and that has a realistic economic plan every shred as strong as the green one.
And, in sixty days.
I sense this election could be an intense, volatile and pivotal as the one almost twenty years ago. Then it was how FTA would change life as we knew it. Today it is Kyoto. Plus ca change.
114 comments ↓
I doubt that Kyoto is a job killer as is claimed by some people who are too lazy-ass to be creative and just want to continue to collect a lofty paycheque from Exxon. Quite the opposite is probably true. Money will need to be spent to build the new technology to adapt to a carbon-limited market and this will create jobs. Bob, the well driller, might have to re-educate himself and get a new job, but such market shifts have always been the case. Job killer? This might be one of the biggest job creators ever.
Can you come up with some kind of indication that our comment was accepted even if it doesn’t appear immediatly? It’s kind of annoying to have it just disappear and not see it posted, one is not sure what happened.
Well you summed that up nicely. Read a interesting article in the NP where the Liberals were saying in 1990 that it would cost 450k worth of jobs to meet kyoto. Wonders what the numbers would be now with the huge increase in GHGs to get back to the kyoto goals. You have any idea on that.
Garth said:
“I’ve already said here a couple of times why I supported this motion: While Kyoto has big flaws, the bill just passed forces the Harper Administration to address it, and come up with a strategy for implementation. The government may argue, in a plan, that it cannot meet the targets without economic consequences. Fine. Just tell us. Give us a roadmap. Bring it back to Parliament. Let’s discuss it, and get moving. Without this green gun to the Conservative head, you can bet a year from now we will still have no climate change strategy. — Garth”
That’s all well and good, Garth. But can you explain why your favorite new leader Dion did nothing on this file for years and years? The Liberals are the ones who signed this fatally flawed agreement. They did nothing to even try addressing the agreement they signed, except for hiring Rick Mercer to do a few feel good commercials. Even Bill Clinton was smart enough not to touch this one. What’s your excuse?
Yes, congratulations to the Lieberals for representing foreign interests against the good of Canadians. Dividing the country again so that they can grab power.
You guys should all go work for Putin since he’ll be getting a good chunk of our taxes if nobody stands up to you.
Good point, KH. For reference, I think this is the article you are referring to:
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/story.html?id=9c126e34-1a54-4f64-bae8-7206dc8af570
I find the following line in this story quite disturbing:
“Canada has already spend about $1-billion buying up Russia’s unused emissions room.”
Has Canada actually already sent cash to Russia to buy clean air credits? Ridiculous!
Garth, Quick question, Morph back to your investment adviser days. If and I say If Kyoto has the negative effect that some people are predicting on the economy what will be the effect on the Market and on Income Trusts in general. what would you advise now be to those who hold their retirement savings in these two mediums.
I cannot imagine life doing anything but get better for IT investors. As for the stock market, buy quality. — Garth
Garth, it sounds like you are already conceding the Conservatives will get a majority. Yes Fear is a powerful election tool if it’s backed up by facts. We will see if the governments facts stand up to scrutiny. I know the environmentalists facts won’t. They keep claiming we can meet our targets but don’t provide any facts to back up their claims – just rhetoric. Meanwhile the Liberals who had FOUR green plans over 13 years which never came close to Kyoto targets are expecting the government to come with a complete plan in just 60 days. Good luck convincing the public on the sincerity of this move. I’m still skeptical but open minded about meeting our targets by 2012. It’s clear the Liberal governments of BC and Ontario doesn’t think we can.
Where the hell did you read that in my oost? I have no doubt but the PMSH will do anything but! — Garth
Thanks for the reply Garth, I understand your busy but could you please explain why you think the life for the IT investors will better. I don’t pretend to be a Investment Broker but simple math tell me if the economy takes a hit, stocks lose values and people lose money, be it a paper loss or not. Will there be enough room for all the seniors to hide in IT if that happens
For IT investors either (a) Flaherty relents and does the right thing or (b) the next government will move to repair some of the damage. Either way, can’t be worse thasn it is now! — Garth
Now it appears that Hot Air Harper will not follow or respect the law on meeting Kyoto targets after it has obtained royal ascent. So much for the “law and order” government he promised (how many broken promises is that now?). Aparently, he will only obey the laws HE agrees with. I find this approach inspiring – in fact, perhaps we should all follow Hot Air Harper’s lead and only obey those laws we agree with. I’m against paying taxes, so I guess I can start by not filing a tax return. Speed limits on our residential streets? naaaawwwwwww.
“… complete federal reconstruction …”
gee Garth, seems to me you were in favour of this when you walked through my neighbourhood in Burlington …
Making provinces more powerful and gutting the federal jurisdiction? You must not have been at home that day. — Garth
Garth your post included this statement:
“Kyoto is an impossibility”, Garth Turner, 2007
Expect John Baird to read that in the house today.
On another note, when the Tories were in Opposition they said the Liberals were acting two fast on Kyoto. Now they say the Liberals didn’t do enough. Why is everyone letting them have it both ways?
I hear it is so cold in Ottawa that the politicians have their hands in their own pockets! LOL
Garth: too bad the Libs didn’t see fit to pass similar legislation in the decade after THEY signed Kyoto.
If you really are a government in waiting – why not show us an implementation plan? What are Pablo’s Lieberals afraid of? Come on Garth! You’ve had 10+years…show us the Red Plan to implement the targets or kindly STFU.
At least we will not be subjected to the battle of the SNOZ again…hopefully.
How about the Glut Gut vs The Snoz?
Another good reason not to watch TV and the STUIPID, CHILDISH, attack ads!
As expected Harper is only concerned with his lust for power, POWER, POWER!!!!!, and to Hell with Canada and its people.
I imagine his handlers were rather threatening last night when they found out they could actually be fined and jailed for polluting our environment.
I suggest getting to those Town Hall meetings, and participating in the discussions. Meet some Green Party candidates and listen to what they will provide.
Exercise your democratic right of being an informed voter this time around. It is the year 2007, and this may be our last best hope!
Garth: Only in Dion’s fantasy world do Canadians get rich from rushing to meet the y2kyoto targets. We simply waited too long. Perhaps if his Libs had passed last night’s cynical bill 10 years ago we’d have a fighting chance.
Reality is sending $$$ to Putin.
From Today’s National Post:
“Liberals appointed partisans
Tory judicial advisory selections follow pattern of previous government
Allison Hanes, National Post
Published: Thursday, February 15, 2007
Liberal Members of Parliament have in recent days repeatedly accused the Conservative government of appointing partisans to committees that vet judicial appointments, but a review of those selected by the previous government has found a significant number of them had Liberal ties.
In 2005, the government named at least nine loyalists to the bodies that help choose federal and provincial superior court judges, including a president of the federal Liberal party’s B.C. and Manitoba wings, a contender for the presidency of the Nova Scotia branch, a former Newfoundland Cabinet minister and unsuccessful provincial candidate.
Stephen Harper’s Conservatives have come under fire this week from opposition parties and lawyers for stacking retooled versions of the judicial advisory committees with political staffers and former Tory candidates.
Liberal MP Michael Ignatieff will attack the Tory government in Parliament, accusing them of attempting to hijack the courts to enact their law-and-order agenda.
An early draft of the opposition motion states: “That, in the opinion of this house, the government is failing to act in accordance with the democratic and open values expected of its office by imposing a narrow minded, socially conservative ideology as reflected in its approach to the judicial appointment process to dramatically increase the influence of right-wing ideology in the judiciary.”
But given their track record, some say the Liberals are on shaky ground.
“The Liberals could have difficulty getting on their high horse when it comes to partisanship,” said Lorne Sossin, a law professor at the University of Toronto……”
Garth, what are your thougths on this?
I’d still like to see the LPC plan that meets Kyoto. without 450K job losses, please.
Tim D,
Neither party can get on a high horse with me! I want to see them walking…as in walking the talk!
They should take a long look at the War Memorial across the street from Parliament, and note that those who deserve a High Horse actually accomplished something, and at their own peril!
Has Canada actually already sent cash to Russia to buy clean air credits? Ridiculous!
By Tom Szewkwick on 02.15.07 8:21 am
I would think the polluters that Russia are would have no credits to sell. Would we not need to buy credits from countries who earned credits by exceding their Kyota targets? If we ever bought credits from Russia, would it not have to be several years into Kyota after they have met and surpassed their targets? Or can countries sell credits not yet achieved?
On the issue of elections, I can’t imagine voting back in the Liberals, I am still not wanting thieves ruling Canada (think adscam, and they neglected Kyoto in the first place). Harper and his Cons have to be turfed. No way I’d ever vote NDP. Makes it a tough one this time around.
Jerry
Bob, the well driller, might have to re-educate himself and get a new job, but such market shifts have always been the case. Job killer? This might be one of the biggest job creators ever.
By Tom on 02.15.07 8:04 am
Bob might be busier than ever drilling for geothermal heat, a very slight deviation from drilling for water.
Jerry
Jerry,
Consider the Green Party.
Research what they stand for and watch Elizabeth May…she speaks clearly and decisively in answer to questions.
Back in the 1970s the big issue was acid rain. When environmentalists suggested something had to be done the nay-sayers predicted economic disaster. During that period George Bush, Sr. and Brian Mulroney signed an important agreement designed to control emissions. Between 1980 and 2001 acid rain emissions declined 63 per cent without a major economic disaster.
The real fear of people like Harper and his supporters is that technological changes might undermine the huge profits now available in oil production. For example, CanWest is reporting that individuals could supply their own hydrogen fueled vehicles for an initial outlay of about $1500 and about $4.00 a fill-up worth of electricity if there was a supply of hydrogen vehicles. This would be a nightmare for oil producers.
Ideologically, the new Conservatives oppose any policy change that might change the current distribution of capital. They call this kind of intervention “socialist” because of the influence of government policy on the potential redistribution of wealth.
The problem with the current new Conservative ideology is that is rejects progressive ideas. Its main economic concern is protecting the current distribution of wealth rather than encouring the development of new concepts. Unfortunately, the Liberals are not really much more progressive in how they seek to handle the environmental issue. That is because of the resistance of the economic elite to progressive change. For the economic elite this is the “best of times” and they are terrified of change and use “scare” tactics to try to maintain the status quo.
The marginalization of progressive voices in Canadian politics today is a major loss. There is some hope in that they are re-emerging in the United States.
Bob might be busier than ever drilling for geothermal heat, a very slight deviation from drilling for water.
Not for awhile he won’t. It cost us about 35K extra to go with geothermal heating when we built our house a year and a half ago. I don’t think there will be a huge demand for new and retro geothermal, just too much outlay of cash. Who would have thunk, a so called neo-con installing geothermal. Maybe we should be careful of all the labelling people seem so quick to throw around.
Kerry
Well now…isn’t this a SHOCK?
EnCana posts biggest annual profit in Canadian history
Hm…What was all that rhetoric about the ‘poor oil companies’, how the public ‘just doesn’t understand’?
BS! We have understood the price gouging the past several years and who was raking in the money.
Good, glad they have huge profits…they can use that to clean up their operations and contribute to the health of the environoment and all of we ‘gluttonous slobs’ forced to but their precious products.
So, Harper, where is my GST rebate for buying a new fuel efficient 2007 North American made vehicle? Where is that in all your money throwing, vote buying plans using my tax dollars?
C. B. Innes on 02.15.07 10:29 am
Excellently stated!
There is another issue that has me extremely worried and this is an ideological shift among the new Conservatives. When in opposition the new Conservatives were constantly complaining about the power of government over our lives and the lack of protection from govenment.
However, currently the new government is trying to increase the coercive power of the state through the appointment of judges and at the same time are claiming that they will ignore the will of Parliament. While they were adamant that they could not reduce our commitment to Afganistan because of our promises on the international stage they are ready to reject a signed international treaty, Kyoto, without even trying to meet its obligations.
Democracy, under the Harper Administration, has become even more meaningless than ever before. What has happened to the old democratic Reformers? Why are they silent now? What kind of reform were they looking for?
I agree Garth. The tories are done, nothing left to do but call the election and get the hell out of the way. The real party that Canada needs, and loves with come back to power. Then we can finally make this country better for those of us who choose the correct way of life. Not this priority based BS that has been running out of control. The tories are spending our money that we worked for 13 years to collect and hold on to on their priorities, how backward is that?
In the next election I’ll be happy to see the long overdue return of power to the rightful party, the party that know what the people of this country need.
Garth, it’s time for Canada to find out what the Liberals were doing on the Kyoto portfolio all those years. I truly hope it is more than just compact fluorescents and Energuide.
So you’re calling the election for May now? If you resign your seat now, Halton will only be unrepresented for 2 months. How about it?
We got lead out of gasoline, reduced effects of acid rain and tackled the ozone depletion-all done even when naysayers said jobs would be lost and the economy would be devestated.
Once again the Cons are using fear and baseless stats for denying us the right to clean air. Why are they so afraid of this challenge?
“Always more comfortable standing on economic than environmental ground, the Tories now have their raison d’etre for forcing an election. -Garth”
The same can be said for the Liberals. After doing essentially nothing on the environment portfolio during their 13 year reign, it can hardly be said that they are for the environment.
Just think Garth you would have been a part of the Conservative workings if they hadn’t kicked you out. How do you expect anyone to take you seriously when you write such nonsense! How long does it take for a grudge to wear off anyway? Finally do you agree with Dion’s position on not extending the anti terrorism laws or do you agree with Cotler, McLellan and Manley that they need to be there in case??
Spin what you want, but this blog will serve as proof that, as a member of the Tory cuaucs, I was pushing this government for a true climate change strategy. So, nothing has changed there. As for the anti-terrorism, my position has always been that the state should surrender powers it does not need and has not used. That simply gives we citizens more rights. — Garth
Who will police Harper’s response to Kyoto? According to Liberals, it will be the stupid voters that think satisfying Kyoto on a world scale will be the solution. (dearest Liberals, we have a population of 35M, U.S., China, India, Pakistan, North Korea, Iran, Russia, don’t give a shit about our role in Kyoto. Our admirable role is not achievable, its suicide. As an example on a smaller note, the Ontario Premier couldn’t even shut down a couple of coal fired plants, a promise made by THE biggest Liberal airhead liar.
“As such, the election will constitute a blank cheque for the Conservatives who, if they perchance win (and don’t count on it)”
Garth, What party do you think has the best chance to win and why? I am not a fan of the Conservatives but I can’t see the Liberal party being the winners. If voters are so forgiving that the Liberal party can steal money and get voted back in 2 elections later I might need to move to Indonesia where the corruption is not as well hidden. If however you would like the Liberals to win, don’t put my name on the envolope of cash but do put it in my mailslot. Regards
Garth,
Oh sure, McGuinty will just unplug megawatts from the grid before there are any replacement generation facilities.
Maybe Peter, aka Penetanguishene Pete, thinks we will just go string together batteries from Canadian Tire, eh?
I think Peter needs to be kept in a Dura Cell for a long time.
“RCMP Concludes Income Trusts Investigation”
http://www.news.gc.ca/cfmx/view/en/index.jsp?articleid=276859
But can you explain why your favorite new leader Dion did nothing on this file for years and years? — Wesley D’Haene.
Just for the record, M. Dion was the Environment Minister for less than 2 years (July 04 to February 06). In my book that does not count as years and years but perhaps for some neo-cons reality is an inconvenient truth.
Garth, remember yesterday I told you about that little bird from the RCMP? Today the RCMP criminally charged one of your Liberal buddies named Serge. You should pay a little more attention to what I have to say.
People don’t bother to really examine truths do they. McGuinty wanted to close the coal plants – yes, and BUT Harper didn’t honour the pledge of $593 million to Ontario to assist this process which HE PROMISED during the 2006 election campaign.
Instead of believing the Conservative rhetoric try pressuring them to keep up their promises.
Right now Harper is only interest in Quebec votes so they are getting what they want.
Quit bellyaching and do something about it.
No offense there Garth, but:
At the end of it, provinces will be far more autonomous, Ottawa’s powers will be reduced, the oil sands will have at least doubled in intensity, the Senate will be sort of elected, stem-cell research and gay marriage will be memories and, ah yes, Kyoto will be some place in Japan.
Isn’t THAT a little fear mongering as well? I agree that the chances are the cons will be using kyoto against the liberals, but stooping down to that level isn’t exactly the best way for getting people to vote for you, nor your party. I would LOVE to see a party actually take the high road and NOT beat up on other candidates. Maturity in government? It might be a little revolutionary, but maybe, just maybe, a good idea.
As far as I know you have been consitent with your comments about the environment. What is off the wall is your prediction the world will turn upside down if the Conservatives get a majority. The other day you talked about the differences between the two parties on input and voting issues. Yet I have never seen the Liberal members allowed to vote anything but the party line except the limited freedom to non cabinet MPs on the same sex marriage debate or years ago on the death penalty.The Liberals have always maintained a stangle hold on the MPs. Here is the difficulty. The Liberals appear to be all over the map on many issues so we the public are confused as to what exactly they stand for. Not so with the Conservatives. Their message is much clearer and unified. I expect pragmatism will cause any party in power to be somewhat different than when they were in opposition. I think minority parliaments are better. It prevents what happened under the long reigns of the previous Liberal and Conservative parties, namely complacency, pork barreling, waste and undisciplined management. In minorities we just have to put up with the extreme rhetoric, accusations and game playing which most of us in every day life call lieing, slandering and immaturity.
Garth, remember yesterday I told you about that little bird from the RCMP? Today the RCMP criminally charged one of your Liberal buddies named Serge. You should pay a little more attention to what I have to say.
Soooo the liberals are at fault for ONE person who is getting charged that ISNT even in the liberal party, but only worked for them? Ya. Ok. That makes plenty of sense there.
I guess that guy who keeps stealing all those office supplies is the bosses fault because he hired him…..
SLG, Harper didn’t promise Ontario anything. Ontario has always been responsible for development of it’s own power grid. The feds don’t subsidize these initiatives usually. Ontario Hydro now said the plants can’t be closed until 2014. If McGuinty was such a Kyoto fan, he would of raised taxes to pay for the shut down of those plants. Did he? No. So it becomes more of a leadership issue doesn’t it?
It will take 30 years to turn the country around on CO2 emissions. This is a scientific fact. It will not happen if we try to do it 6. What will happen is that a lot of our money will be given to large corporations to build almost useless wind turbines, solar panels, etc. The only way to drop C02 is to fully rework a large portion of the economy, which takes 30 years. We do, however, have to start today.
–Tom Andersen
Pete Rusin,
ask your RCMP birdie a couple of questions. One, who initiated the RCMP investigation? Two, who selected the timing of the Force’s announcement of the criminal investigation?
And three, since one senior civil servant(party affiliation unspecified) engaging in a form of insider trading for personal profit does not amount to much of a catch, is there more to come, or is that all there is?
Garth said: “As for the anti-terrorism, my position has always been that the state should surrender powers it does not need and has not used.”
Seems that some prominent Liberals have a different view than Dion in this matter, Bob Rae, Anne McLellan, Roy Cullen, Derek Lee, and Irwin Cotler, among them.
The consequences are open to debate, but this point is a good place to start.
“Terror act opponents problematic: Bob Rae hopes legislators will ‘take that into consideration’”
“VANCOUVER – A key investigative tool being used to advance the 1985 Air India bombing probe will be lost if provisions of the Anti-Terrorism Act expire as expected, B.C. Solicitor-General John Les said yesterday.
The RCMP’s Air India Task Force has been preparing for years to hold special investigative hearings allowed under the act, but would have to scrap them unless the law is extended.”
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=0b4c7280-08af-418d-bfa1-6b53a9a43715
And so begins the final days of Garth Turner – Liberal MP.
Tick tock, tick tock….. use your precious remaining time well Garth. When you finally have to face the voters as the hypocrite you are, I think you will look on with sadness as the CPC leads Canada towards a brighter future.
Maybe you can start a support group with Emerson, Khan, and Belinda?
Oh oh!
Income trust investigators charge senior civil servant
Can you spell C-R-I-M-I-N-A-L investigation?
And, but wait there is more!
Kyoto bill sparks constitutional questions
These announcements have been brought to you by the letter ‘C’! As in R’C'MP, CBC, Criminal, and Constitutional!
Look for our next letter predicted to be ‘I’ and ‘E’ standing for Indictment, Impeachment, and Election!
And we, once again, find that neither the
Liberals or CPC are to be trusted.
Privledged and unethical as they prove themselves to be.
“Just for the record, M. Dion was the Environment Minister for less than 2 years (July 04 to February 06). In my book that does not count as years and years but perhaps for some neo-cons reality is an inconvenient truth.” –
By Kevin, ON on 02.15.07 12:08 pm
hahaha. Okay, Kevin M, instead of Dion not doing anything for “years and years” – he didn’t do anything for “years.” Is that better?
Hey Judy! Who’s ‘we’?
We got lead out of gasoline, reduced effects of acid rain and tackled the ozone depletion
THANK YOU BRIAN MULRONEY, CONSERVATIVE PARTY OF CANADA!
Peter,
So you have insider info as well.
The RCMP should be knocking on your door next.And nowhere in that article did it say he was a liberal. He was a civil servant working for the government.
I think he is a conservative .
I have a plan:
1) Alberta places an export carbon tax on all oil being used in the rest of Canada and uses the money to fund the development of the infrustructure to sequester CO2 from the oil sands and other oil development.
The tax could not be added to the export price for oil that goes to other countries because they would buy elsewhere.
2) The federal Gov would apply an import carbon tax on oil so Canadians would not switch to lower cost imported oil. The money raised would be used to develop the infurstructure to sequested CO2 from Ontario’s coal fired electrical plants, metal smelters, and auto factories etc.
Estimated end cost to consumers $2.17 per litre added to gasoline prices.
“Just for the record, M. Dion was the Environment Minister for less than 2 years … -Kevin”
So the Liberals expect the Convservatives to come up with a Kyoto plan in 60 days that Dion couldn’t come up with in 2 years? Good luck explaining that one.
By LORRIE GOLDSTEIN
Toronto Sun
More than a decade ago, a brilliant American conservative thinker predicted exactly how the Liberal Party of Canada would handle the issue of global warming and the Kyoto accord.
Thomas Sowell in his book The Vision of the Anointed: Self-Congratulation as a Basis for Social Policy, was not addressing those topics specifically, but rather explaining how liberal elites — especially politicians — push issues onto the front burner of public discourse and keep them there, essentially through intellectual fraud.
Here is the process Sowell describes by which the liberal “anointed” — who typically believe they alone possess the wisdom to govern — constantly seek to impose their views on society.
Judge for yourself whether Sowell’s four-step process accurately reflects how the Liberals have handled this issue.
Stage 1: The anointed declare “the crisis” in which, Sowell observes, “some situation exists, whose negative aspects the anointed propose to eliminate. Such a situation is routinely characterized as a ‘crisis’ even though all human situations have negative aspects …”
Stage 2: “The solution” is proposed in which “policies to end the ‘crisis’ are advocated by the anointed” who dismiss claims by critics that their proposals won’t work or may even make things worse as “absurd and ‘simplistic,’ if not dishonest.”
Stage 3: “The results” reveal “the solution” chosen by the anointed either didn’t work, or made things worse.
Stage 4: The anointed give “the response” to their critics, in which they dismiss them for being “simplistic” and for “ignoring the ‘complexities’ involved as ‘many factors’ went into determining the outcome.”
Now consider how the issue of man-made global warming played out in Canada under the Liberals.
The then-Liberal government of Jean Chretien declared global warming “the crisis” (Stage 1) out of the blue, and then proclaimed Kyoto “the solution” (Stage 2). Thus, it signed Kyoto in 1998 and ratified it in 2002, but did nothing to implement it before the Liberals were thrown out of office in early 2006.
Today, we know “the results” (Stage 3) of this Liberal record of inaction.
By the time they lost power, man-made greenhouse gas emissions in Canada had risen by almost twice the rate of the U.S. — which refused to ratify Kyoto — and the Liberals were almost 35% behind their Kyoto target of cutting emissions to 6% below 1990 levels by 2012.
And what was “the response” of the Liberals to their own failure on this issue?
Remember, if Sowell’s four-stage predictive process of how “the anointed” operate is correct, “the response” of the Liberals (Stage 4) will be to dismiss their critics as “simplistic,” charge them with ignoring the “complexities” of the situation and stress that “‘many factors’ went into determining the outcome.”
Fortunately, we already know how the Liberals — in the person of new leader and former environment minister Stephane Dion — respond to their critics on this issue, even when the criticism comes from fellow Liberals.
When Michael Ignatieff (now deputy Liberal leader) complained to Dion during a leadership debate last year that “we didn’t get it done,” meaning the Liberals failed to reduce man-made greenhouse gas emissions as they had promised under Kyoto, Dion’s petulant reply was: “This is unfair … This is unfair. You don’t know what you speak about! Do you think it’s easy to make priorities?”
Game, set and match to Sowell.
“Just for the record, M. Dion was the Environment Minister for less than 2 years” Kevin.
Lol. 23 months and he couldn’t manage more than a Rick Mercer rant. Of course he was in cabinet since 1996. If he was so enamoured with kyoto, surely he could have forced Chretin to implement? In fact he could have done so from outside cabinet – as evidenced last night by that fool Pablo.
Mr Innes,
Hydrogen cars are indeed possible. At home you could set up an electrolisis unit to get H2 from water. (Best not do this in your basement – H2 systems evry difficult to keep from leaking – ever for trained technologists. So build a shack away from your house and heat it — all that water you are turning to H2 can’t be allowed to freeze.) To this you would add a compesssor to take the gas and compress it into a tank. You would retrofit your car to have a tank or the CO2 like the propane users do now. Since there are no stations around you couldn’t stry more than ahumered or so miles from home base. You couldn’t park in underground parkades. You would neew to hire a speciallized technician to maintain all that gear.
By golly – I think Dion is righ – Kyoto will create jobs — hope you can pay their salaries..
Bill,
Still waiting for you to keep your promise.
Canada is still dealing with the corruption of the past Liberal government/s as late as today when one of their trusted got charged with breech of trust…Lest we forget the Putine/Martin years.
It’s fitting Garth that you are so head over heels eager to be part of this image. I say go for it buddy cause in light of your recent self absorbed decisions, my opinion is you have the potential to one of the greastest bagmen ever.
Is that the RCMP I hear kicking in your door?
This is the first time I have contributed to Garth’s blog or any blog for that matter. I would appreciate if I could digress from Kyoto and ask Garth if he intends to vote in favour of extending the provisions in the Anti-Terrorism Act, for another three years as proposed by the Conservatives, permitting “preventive arrests†and “investigative hearingsâ€. The provisions were originally introduced by the Liberals for a five year term. I was stunned to hear that the Liberal party is divided over extending the provisions, as described in the National Post today. It seems like a “no brainer†to me that the provisions should be extended. Considering the break up of an alleged terrorist plot directed at Toronto and Ottawa in the past year and the recent announcement that the Canadian oil fields and oil production are a target for terrorists it seems that the interests of Canadian citizens would best be served by extending the provisions. It has been acknowledged that there has been no abuse of the provisions during the first five years that they were in place.
I will vote against extending. — Garth
Last nights “realty check” on the CBC (imagine that, the CBC of all stations) demonstrated yet again that the Liberal environmental rhetoric is all symbolism over substance…..
Say C. B. Innes and Bill-Muskoka
I have a del for you — lets trade some carbon credits.
I am retiring and will stop driving approximately 62km per day with my auto that uses 10 litres per 100km or 6.2 litres per day at 2.3 kg per litre thats 7.4 kg per day or about 1913 kg per year – Let’s say 2 tonnes. At $50 per tonne would one of you be willing to buy these carbon credits I have for sale so that you can offset those trips you make to Toronto or your cottage?
If not $50 per tonne what will you offer?
Garth you are hilarious. First you write this about the `Cons` using fear.
“”This means the missing election ingredient for the Cons is missing no longer. And it’s a good one. Fear”"
Then you write this;
“”continue to rejig the country in PMSH’s image and give you four or five years of complete federal reconstruction. At the end of it, provinces will be far more autonomous, Ottawa’s powers will be reduced, the oil sands will have at least doubled in intensity, the Senate will be sort of elected, stem-cell research and gay marriage will be memories and, ah yes, Kyoto will be some place in Japan”"”
The really funny part, you`re using your own personal assumption of what the Tories will use as fear propaganda while using your own fearful projection of what will happen in a Tory majority. Far too funny.
There are only two possible outcomes of an election. Either the Tories will continue in power or the West will separate.
Personally I think the Tories will put the Kyoto target plan to the public. How do you think Cdns will like the two choices?
Kyoto only has two possibilities, either shut down the country or send billions out of the country while pollution levels continue to climb while still not having any noticeable influence on the global emission levels or global warming. I`m thinking most Cdns would prefer a Tory majority.
Peter Rusin on 02.15.07 12:11 pm
Are you saying that you are purveyer of inside information before it is made public?
And now we see Liberals cleared in trust case and that the NDP and CPC owe the Hon. Ralph Goodale an apology, and the people another election IMHO!
“Thus ends a political saga that started just before the last election was called, when then Finance Minister Ralph Goodale’s office was initially accused of leaking information about how the government intended to handle taxes around income trusts.
It exploded into a full-blown RCMP investigation right in the middle of the election campaign, around Christmas, 2005, when an NDP MP asked for a probe and the Mounties obliged, with an unusual press release announcing that the government was under criminal scrutiny.
Now, 14 months later, the RCMP has found no political ties to the affair. The civil servant is alleged to have committed breach of trust for personal, not political gain.”
News flash -
Encana to pay largest tax bill ever to Fed and Prov governments = $1.7 billion.
Of course that does not include the 17% tax at the pump or the exsise tax or the GST at the pump. As well rolalties that are paid to Prov gov (NEP made those non-deductable from income tax)
Also all those rich oil workeres pay at the highest marginal rate of 40+%.
Now with the $2.4 Billion left they need to pay those poor old seniors a dividend of .8% or about $.50 per share. With 450 million shares that is 225 million. So 2.2 billion remains for what?
To fund some 6 billion of capital expenditures based on 2006 financial statement.
Soit’s either spent that money to bringgas on stream to heat your houses or on CO2 reduction.
Oh, and are the NDP and CPC willing to foot the entire cost of the next election?
Maybe the current attack ads, as mentioned in the article, can be used to obtain a court order to make them pay the $250,000,000 an election costs?
It’s an idea we should be considering as the public!
Peter Rusin, time to shoot that little bird you’re listening to!
You said “Garth, remember yesterday I told you about that little bird from the RCMP? Today the RCMP criminally charged one of your Liberal buddies named Serge. You should pay a little more attention to what I have to say.”
Toronto Star reports “LIBERALS CLEARED IN TRUST CASE”.
http://www.thestar.com/News/article/182200
Maybe Flaherty should stop listening to the bozos in finance that, in cooking the numbers to justify Flathead’s income trust tax, they excluded taxes that will be paid when folks withdraw money from their RSP’s….unless of course Flathead wants to truly make all our withdrawals TAX FREE from our RSP’s, otherwise the moron should go back to chasing ambulances. We don’t want him back in Ontario!
The polls showed that the Liberals got a real ‘Serge’ today.
Ah-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha.
Ah-ha-ha-ha-ha.
Hee-hee-ho-ho-ho.
Get it?
Peter Rusin from Burlington, Canada writes: Hold on everybody, Garth Turner has something to say about this………….Garth?…..Hello Garth? are you available for comment Garth? hmmm, Gaaaarrrrrrrthhhh. Sorry, looks like Garth may have left the building about one week too soon. Ha-Ha-Ha.
Posted 15/02/07 at 3:03 PM EST | Link to Comment
What the heck is this about? I just travelled back to the riding from Ottawa, kissed my wife and started processing all these comments! — Garth
What a dick Peter is.
The ecconomic powerhouse of Europe cut its GHG’s by 20%…Germany that is….maybe the media doesn’t want to report good news..but since they ahven’t reported bad news either..one can assume that the sky didn’t fall in.
So Mr. Chicken Little Harper your ecconomics fail you again!
Garth:
Good lodgic, buying Quebec at the expense of Newfoundland and Saskatchewan is a scam. The Conservatives know the voters are really soft targets. Take Senate Reform, they will simply offer up two or three of thier canidates and hold a vote, cool eh. Cowboy justice will be the order of day. All we can hope for is that the educated show up at polls. Garth, the debates will have more rules than you can shake a stick at and will be dull and then some, I already made my mind up not to watch. CBC is gone as is any other organization that does not confrom to the Wild West. Garth I feel real sorry for our beautiful BC beause I truly believe Steve will play cowboys and indians for votes. Oh what a sad country we will have should he get a majority. What a wonderful gal that Jennifer is, there in lies my hope for the future. I am getting long in tooth and do have the strength to fight other than a post or two on the web. Good Luck and you made the right move. One last note, please let all those who do not like the Canada they grew up in and want change. “Be careful what you ask for you just might get it” Kyoto, cost money, perhaps then again Iraq is going to cost the WTO TRILLIONS and WTO is you me and the next person standing next to us.
On another issue, manufacturing policy.
While 90% of the time I disagree with Buzz Hargrove, I do agree that the Canadian Government should look at trade deals with emerging markets to ensure that the flow of goods and services is free in both directions and that there are no artifical barriers.
From that point, the CAW and manufacturing folks will just have to be competitive with the rest of the world. In this case of the big 2 and 1/4 (they’re shrinking by the hour) make the cars they would buy…the rest of the world doesn’t want gas guzzlers.
SLG, McGuinty promised to close the coal fired electricity generating plants before Harper came on the scene, you know like in 2002 and 2003, that’s was the biggest proof of just how stupid the provincial Liberal voters were. Now, your federal bill C-288 is even more fantasy; if you can’t take down a couple of little smokestacks, then how can you meet the intent of this bill? Go back to school and take grade 3 math again.
[...] Garth Turner points out in a post last night: This means the missing election ingredient for the Cons is missing no longer. And it’s a good [...]
Civil servant charged with breach of trust; RCMP finds no political involvement
Feb 15, 2007 02:58 PM
Susan Delacourt
Ottawa Bureau Chief
OTTAWA — The federal Liberals have been exonerated of any involvement in the income-trust scandal that may have cost them the last election.
A civil servant from the Finance Department, Serge Nadeau, has been charged and the RCMP said in a terse statement today that the 14-month-old investigation is now closed.
Thus ends a political saga that started just before the last election was called, when then Finance Minister Ralph Goodale’s office was initially accused of leaking information about how the government intended to handle taxes around income trusts.
It exploded into a full-blown RCMP investigation right in the middle of the election campaign, around Christmas, 2005, when an NDP MP asked for a probe and the Mounties obliged, with an unusual press release announcing that the government was under criminal scrutiny.
Now, 14 months later, the RCMP has found no political ties to the affair. The civil servant is alleged to have committed breach of trust for personal, not political gain.
But the political fallout may be just beginning. The Liberals are already looking for the Conservatives and New Democrats to withdraw and apologize for all the times they alleged that the old Paul Martin government was enmeshed in criminal corruption surrounding this whole controversy.
Just this week, in fact, the Conservative party rolled out new attack ads against the Liberals, one of which features a newspaper headline blaring, “Goodale’s office under investigation.”
Liberal leader Stephane Dion said in a statement today: “The Prime Minister should immediately ask that his party withdraw their French attack ad that smears the reputation of the Hon. Ralph Goodale.”
Nadeau, 50, a director general with the tax-policy branch of the finance department, was charged with criminal breach of trust.
“It is alleged that he used confidential Government of Canada information for the purchase of securities which gave him a personal benefit. Breach of Trust, under Section 122 of the Criminal Code of Canada, is an indictable offence with a maximum penalty of imprisonment for up to five years,” the RCMP statement said.
Goodale issued a statement this afternoon: :I welcome the conclusion of this investigation. The investigation has indicated no involvement in this matter by me, my staff or any other political person.”
David Herle, the Liberals’ campaign manager in the last election, says his party was leading the Conservatives by 13 points and holding steady before the income-trust investigation was launched in late 2005.
Days later, the Liberals and Tories were tied and, a week later, the Liberals were down by six points in Ontario.
“We clawed our way back to win Ontario by five points – not enough to form a government but close,” Herle said an email yesterday.
“This is what the election turned on and it happened to be based on nothing.”
Next time just post a link please. — Garth
It took years to get leaded gas out of Canada. We at least need to try and implement Kyoto. The B.C. Liberal party just announced yesterday a 33% cut in greenhouse gas emissions by 2015. They want a Green Plan as tough as California’s. The feds won’t do anything. The eastern states are implementing Kyoto and 240 U.S. members have signed on to Kyoto. Clinton was at the last Montreal conference – he has seen the light as well. Scientists have sounded the alarm for the last 10 years. Now finally the media is giving it attention along with the U.N. There is no need to be fearful – without an environment you won’t have an economy. Look at Newfoundland – they overfished the cod, and the cod still haven’t come back. We all need to practice good stewardship individually and corporately.
Just for the record, M. Dion was the Environment Minister for less than 2 years (July 04 to February 06). In my book that does not count as years and years but perhaps for some neo-cons reality is an inconvenient truth.
Haha, only 2 years! Wow, I would like to have a job for 2 years where I achieve absolutely nothing and get paid.
It’s a good thing the Lieberals hypocrites give SH 60 days to solve the problem (to THEIR satisfaction and nothing less, of course). Talk about setting somebody up for failure. How stupid do you guys think we are? Really.
I find it outrageous what the so called “Canada Free Press” has to say about this topic. Generally always biased by conservative agenda, they are everything but free press
Garth
In the past I often read your posts on this website with interest as they offered common sense insights into most issues. I note that especially with today’s post however, that you have adopted the tired Lieberal strategy of trying to depict the Conservatives as a reactionary bunch of neanderthal rednecks: “stem-cell research and gay marriage will be memories” etc etc.
This is the last straw in your credibility, the first one being your conversion to a Lieberal after being elected a Conservative. You had always said that the thing to do in those circumstances was to quit and run for your new party in a by-election or the next general election. If the election is as close as you seem to think it is, it would seem that sitting as an independent for a few more months would have been more appropriate.
Too bad I don’t live in your constituency so that I can send the message on voting day. Let’s hope that the voters in your area do it for me.
Spencer – Sarnia, ON
And how long did you sit in the Harper caucus to know this? — Garth
“I would think the polluters that Russia are would have no credits to sell. Would we not need to buy credits from countries who earned credits by exceding their Kyota targets? If we ever bought credits from Russia, would it not have to be several years into Kyota after they have met and surpassed their targets? Or can countries sell credits not yet achieved?”
Russia had no intention of signing onto Kyoto. New energy plants, not enviro- friendly ones were in the planning stages. Then, Russia’s economy tanked and the new energy plants were cancelled. Russia quickly realizes without these new plants they now would be at the opposite end of Kyoto, receiving cash for credits instead of buying.
Thats the reason they signed onto Kyoto, in 2004 or 2005 i believe.
As for Garth, when can we expect to see you start criticising some of the Liberals policies? You know, balanced blogging.
Absolutely! — Garth
slg, McGuinty came into power in 2003. Which I believe was….. oh yeah, the LIBERALS! Please of time to have a plan and to start implementing it, don’t you think.
James, Here is some interesting reading for concerning your post about
Germany lowering its GHG output. Comments welcome after you digest this.
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/story.html?id=03445f57-0777-4554-ac7c-ec63cb073223
Garth have you read the Kyoto accord? What you think about putting polluters in jail? Is this how liberals are tough on crime?
JMCCAIN.
“How stupid do you guys think we are? Really.”
Now as stupid as you seem to think the posters here are!
Garth, I really feel the Liberals are picking the wrong battle concerning the Terrorist provisions. I do know that if something happens after 01 Mar and these provisions could of stopped it, a member of the liberal party of Canada will not be able to get elected as a dog catcher anywhere in the country. The fact that we haven’t used them doesn’t mean we don’t need them, we haven’t used our nuclear emergency response teams either but I feel much better knowing they are there if we do need them. Just food for thought, I think of them as another tool in the toolbox for our Police services, a dusty one but you never know when you might have use of it, kinda of like that tool you and every other Canadian male myself included keeps in the garage just in case.
It was obvious today that most Cons who commented on the RCMP finding that only one non-politician profited from insider knowledge still believe that the RCMP did not do their job.
Perhaps Mr. Harper would like to fire all RCMP officers and appoint his own gestapo. Maybe then he would be satisfied that the “law” had been upheld. (the law according to Steve,that is).
“I will vote against extending. — Garth”
Garth, you’re amazing! You’re the kind of politician we should have more of! However, there is just this one thing I wonder about… How could your views have ever been reflected in a conservative party? I mean, a party doesn’t have to be the conservatives in order to have a responsible budged. Because other than that conservatism simply means backwards thinking, desperately wanting to hold on to the “good old” values… you don’t fit that category (progressive or not.. P and C contradict each other anyways).
Anyways, congrats on your new born wisdom… and keep on going this route… you are greatly serving your COUNTRY (you know I don’t believe in that old-style writing-thing, since this is a federal parliament and not city hall!)
I’m wondering who beyond the taxpayers of Canada is gonna sponsor this lame assed blog after the voters of Halton give good ole uncle anus/Garth his walking papers….better take a snapshot of it now for ye olde nostalgic toilet scrapbook…where were you in 2007??…taking a crap and wiping my ass with Garth.
Hi Garth
Glad to hear the news of your switch to the Liberal
party. I was beginning to get worried of who we would
support in the next election! I am strongly supportive
of the Liberal Party, please contact me if need any
assistance during elections.
Why is it, that people like da “gman” feel it necessary to post here only to make utterly rude and disgusting posts?
I cannot for the life of me understand how people can come here and BAD mouth the one and ONLY politician that actually responds to Canadians.
Those who continually put down Garth with completely NO substance…. get a grip and get the hell out of here. I know I certainly don’t appreciate it. i cant imagine what Garth thinks.
JMCCAIN.
“How stupid do you guys think we are? Really.â€
Now as stupid as you seem to think the posters here are!
I am not sure how stupid you are but if you tell me that you believe that this hypocritical move by the Lieberals was not election time posturing, but rather a truely felt desire to comply with our ‘international obligations under Kyoto’, then I will have a pretty good idea.
Read Garth’s green platform where he says Kyoto is a redistribution of our tax money to foreign entities. It’s a good read.
􀂙 We have made the wise choice not to pursue the path of the Kyoto Agreement which would have seen Canada send billions of dollars to other countries in order to purchase pollution credits. That complicated and flawed plan would have cost taxpayers a bundle, while actually doing nothing to address our own environmental issues. Please contact me at the House of Commons, K1A 0A6, and I will send you a copy of the plan, for your comments.
Everybody should leave Garth alone for a few days. He needs a well deserved break from the action, give him a chance to recharge, it couldn’t have been all that easy this past week. So, let’s all kick back and watch Glenn Beck instead.
Sorry SJ. Didn’t realize the extent that Garth made you feel all googley down there…but if it’s any consolation I reckon Garth would make a great snake oil salesman or carnaval roadie if he’d just shed that cheap suit and pubic hair on his face.
Okay, that’s it. You’re history. — Garth
Dear Mr. Turner, keep strong, have faith, you are appreciated and all the PC writing in the paper need to remember that they turned their backs on you and you are the kind of person we want and need in the gov’t.
I would be honoured to campaign for you at anytime. and I am a NDP but I believe in your outlook and actions.
Thank you.
Alma
As such, the election will constitute a blank cheque for the Conservatives who, if they perchance win (and don’t count on it), will repeal the bill passed last night in their new majority government, slow-track environmental legislation, continue to rejig the country in PMSH’s image and give you four or five years of complete federal reconstruction. At the end of it, provinces will be far more autonomous, Ottawa’s powers will be reduced, the oil sands will have at least doubled in intensity, the Senate will be sort of elected, stem-cell research and gay marriage will be memories and, ah yes, Kyoto will be some place in Japan. – Garth
Great, where can I cast my vote for the Conservatives?
Q
Garth: The least you can do is tell the truth to everyone the real reason you were expelled from the Conservative caucus and party.
Your outspoken views were known and were a problem for all three Conservative governments you previously served under. So this was not the reason.
The real reason you were kicked out of the Conservative government and party was you were revealing confidential information gleamed from caucus on the internet. Part of the oath you took when elected, is to protect the secrecy of caucus. Your breach of confidentially is an indication that you cannot be trusted.
If you worked for a large corporation and revealed secrets to others or on the internet you would be fired with cause. This is no different, rules apply to all.
First, who cares? Second, you’re wrong. Third, if I revealed “confidential information…on the Internet”, then let’s see where it is. Fourth, there is not such oath. Fifth, buzz off. — Garth
gman writes on 02.15.07 8:40 pm
“I’m wondering who beyond the taxpayers of Canada is gonna sponsor this lame assed blog after the voters of Halton give good ole uncle anus/Garth his walking papers….better take a snapshot of it now for ye olde nostalgic toilet scrapbook…where were you in 2007??…taking a crap and wiping my ass with Garth.”
Yo gman…what do you do for a living? Shovel SHIT~!? Sure seems like it coming out of your loud ass mouth…
sincerely,
DK
I am really getting to Hate all this bafflegarb about green house gases.
Ether we start to clean it up NOW or our we start to die!
Think that is a wild statement?
Wilma was only a (excuse the pun) warm up.
As the energy in the oceans goes up it feeds into the atmosphere. Energy in the atmosphere appears as storms.
It is a simple recipe. Heat in = storms increase in power and frequency.
it has already begun.
It may already be too late to stop it. We have to try.
NO MATTER WHO IS IN GOVERNMENT!
So Judy, you’ve really reduced yourself to the gutter with your statement “Perhaps Mr. Harper would like to fire all RCMP officers and appoint his own gestapo. ”
You don’t know what life was like under the gestapo, which renders what you write useless and unintelligent.
Anyone who thinks that the next election will be decided by who has the best green plan, or more accurately, how well the parties smear each others plans/records is way off.
Funny thing abot partisan politics, they tend to only heat up when the media takes notice. Not because it is what the voters want.
Polls, shmolls, the only reason people talk about how important the environment is to them in polls is because the questions is squarely asked and saying that things like taxes, crime, and immigration are more important would have them looklike they are greedy or out of touch.
If a pollster would ask a thousand people what the most important issue is to them and not give examples, I bet we would have a different outcome. As a matter of fact, let me put that poll up on my web site, and although I will not get a thousand votes, I bet environment is not close to #1 on the list.
The next elec tion will be decided like the last. People will not trust the Liberals not to rob them, the NDP not to sell out the country to special interest, the Bloc shouldn’t be alowed to run federally because all the candidates are in Quebec only, the Greens are in the absolute best position ever to get a seat, but it wnt happen. Too flaky.
People want to be safe, keep the money they earn, no lose their jobs, and to raise a family. PERIOD. The environment ranks up there with the need for a National Portrait Gallery for most.
If your interested in the poll, visit my site.
You don’t know what life was like under the gestapo, which renders what you write useless and unintelligent.
Catherine, I personnally found it quite funny when she wrote the CO2 was hurting her kids’ lungs.
“Mr Innes,
Hydrogen cars are indeed possible. At home you could set up an electrolisis unit to get H2 from water. (Best not do this in your basement – H2 systems evry difficult to keep from leaking – ever for trained technologists. So build a shack away from your house and heat it — all that water you are turning to H2 can’t be allowed to freeze.) To this you would add a compesssor to take the gas and compress it into a tank. You would retrofit your car to have a tank or the CO2 like the propane users do now. Since there are no stations around you couldn’t stry more than ahumered or so miles from home base. You couldn’t park in underground parkades. You would neew to hire a speciallized technician to maintain all that gear.
By golly – I think Dion is righ – Kyoto will create jobs — hope you can pay their salaries..”
There have always been problems with any new technology at the beginning. As you suggest the new technology will create new jobs and new economic opportunities. I see nothing wrong with that. As well the economic benefits could be far more widespread.
As someone who lives in a rural area not having to drive 60 km to get fuel alone would be an energy saving.
In my area alone over the past few years the oil companies have closed down four closer stations by refusing to deliver to rural gas pumps.
Anyone who understands market economics realize that it would not take long for entrepreneurs to provide hydrogen for travelers. That is the way the economy should work. Instead, the large corporations work with government to prevent new competition. Consumers would then be given the choices they want not the choices dictated to them by a producer driven economy.
Catherine: I was commenting on Mr. Harper’s M.P.’s comments re: the RCMP investigation. They intimated that the RCMP hadn’t done their job. Especially when they didn’t indict even one Liberal politician.
I was suggesting that if Mr. Harper did not like the RCMP findings perhaps he could find a way to dismiss them and appoint his own gestapo-like investigators who only find the “truth” that their leader wants them to find.
Just as Mr. Harper is suggesting that judges should rule based on Conservative idealogy. When is Mr. Harper going to distance himself from the judiciary and let judges by objective? Him comments are alarming.
JMcCain: I did not say my childrens lungs would be harmed by CO2. I said that if Mr. Baird thought the economy would collapse trying to reach Kyoto targets, then perhaps it is our childrens lungs that would be collapsing if we don’t attempt to achieve targets.
Like most Cons, you only read/hear the statements that you want. Half-truths and out of context phrases are what you use as proof.
“Say C. B. Innes and Bill-Muskoka
I have a del for you — lets trade some carbon credits.
By Howard on 02.15.07 2:52 pm”
Since I am opposed to the concept of carbon trading you would have no taker here. My choice would be to find ways to personally reduce my impact on the environment which I am already working on.
Carbon trading merely tranfers responsiblity to someone else and I believe we should be responsible for our own imprint. That goes for corporations as well as well as individuals.
Kyoto will not cause job losses, may cause slavery, as our oligarchy has the legal right to exist, have a nice day.
Jesus Garth….you are so bloated with your own sense of self-importance, you have no room for common sense.
You know what kind of people make up the Liberal Party, and yet you joined them. You know that Harper is a fiscal conservative like yourself, yet you mock him. You no doubt prefer a wimpy nerd like Dion to be your leader, because the Conservatives had a leader who wouldn’t put up with your constant craving for attention.
Face it Garth….you left the Conservative Party no choice, they had to get rid of you. Any serious organization trying to accomplish something has no time for the pet projects of publicity hounds such as yourself.
You are an embarrassment to the people of your riding, and frankly, to any Canadian that considers public service an admirable calling.
What? Did I run over your dog? — Garth
“Mr Innes,
Good on you on two fronts.
1- Rejecting my offer to sell you credits. I have reduced my footprint by 3.5 tonnes of CO2 per year (More than the 1 Tonne Challenge) and could therefore in Kyoto style sell the excess 2.5 tonnes every year from here on. So you could meet your Kyoto style (1 tonne challange) target without doing anything but giving me money and the CO2 would not go down one bit more.
2) My point on H2 cars is that it is not simple and early adopteds will face many problems — But if you want to do it I can be done today with existing technology. Go for it and tell us how you make out.
Regards
Judy, while I don’t think Ralph Goodale initiated any income trusts leaks, why was he quick to state that he looked into the Finance Department and found nothing? As far as I’m concerned, Mr. Goodale should have the guts to call the RCMP himself. Or was he too scared to bring this in the light?
Judy, are you saying that only Liberal appointed judges can be un-biased once appointed? Surely, you are not implying that Conservative appointed judiciary are not to be trusted to be un-biased when rendering their rulings.
perhaps it is our childrens lungs that would be collapsing if we don’t attempt to achieve targets.
Like most Cons, you only read/hear the statements that you want. Half-truths and out of context phrases are what you use as proof.
Oh and these are emission targets of what exactly? I am not a con I am just not a ‘useful idiot’, and you can look that up too.
Judy still has this thing for John Baird, and if you read her carefully, she is in full support of Baird. Finally, we have a Liberal who likes Baird. Finally!