I know you woke up this morning, turned to your sweetie, brushed away a curler and a crushed Bud can and said, “I really wonder how the potential electoral campaign in Halton is going…†Well, this is your happy moment.
Had a Globe reporter call me during House duty today to talk about just that. She told me the Conservatives, firmly in the grip of the famous Doug Finley, Scotland’s gift to corporate punishment, have now assembled a list of 40 must-win ridings across the country. These are the ground zeros where the coveted majority government could be won. Halton is on it.
But I knew that. So did you. After all, my coming electoral demise (if the Tories get their way), will be just the latest in the number of times they have killed me. Ousted from caucus, stripped of my nomination, barred from running ever again, banished to the distant Himalayas of the opposition benches, thrown from my office, and now routinely pilloried in the House and on all those red meat Conservative web sites, not to mention by the bugs who work at the Western Standard.
So it’s only natural and expected that the coming election campaign in Halton will be world class in terms of its vitriol. Already started, actually. Monte Solberg came in to diss me and say I had been rescued from indie oblivion by ‘the captain of the Titanic.’ Gee, wonder who that is?
Conservative MPs like Peterborough’s Dean del Mastro (who voted against having hearings into the income trust tax) and some cabmins like John Baird and the prickish Peter van Loan, have been flooding Halton with literature. We call then “ten percenters†– brochures MPs are allowed to send to 10% of their riding at any one time. Rules allow members to divert these things from their own constituencies and direct them elsewhere from time to time. And right now Halton residents are finding their blue boxes brimming.
And how about my Conservative opposition? Well, three guys have now declared themselves as candidates – two of whom I defeated for the CPC nomination two years ago and have yet to recover, and a newcomer whose platform is getting more federal funding for local sports. The local Conservative association, which has raised no money since the last election (other than the thirty grand my campaign left), and which lost half its executive (they’re now working with me), has yet to call a nomination meeting date. Word is there are seeking The Really Big candidate to knock me off.
At first it was believed to be a Mike Harris cabinet minister colleague of Jim Flaherty and John Baird, but he was sadly charged with weapons offences. Now I hear Finley is begging Don Cherry to run against me – which would make a lot of sense. I mean who wouldn’t want to trade public adulation, network TV and a fabulous income, for this job?
Anyway, I am sure some firecracker will come along and get the Tory nod, and it will be one hell of a campaign. There are at least 15,000 hard-core Conservative voters in Halton who hate me. That’s the bad news. The good news is there are 130,000 others who, like most Canadians, think about politics as often as it is deserved. It will be for the winning candidate to appeal to them, offering what all voters want in a local MP. That, simply, is a person who puts voters ahead of party; who is unafraid to stand up against a leader or a prime minister when the need arises; who’s knocked on thousands of doors; who is instantly responsive; who’s willing to champion middle-class causes; and who has the guts to be accountable in public meetings, regardless of how sharp the criticism might be, and doesn’t go hide in Ottawa.
Seems simple to me. But can I skate?
89 comments ↓
ah ha! I was right. Another Gartherite has oft tried to convince me (to no avail of course) that the cons would walk from this riding rather than attempt real battle with the likes of us. I, on the other hand believe that they are foolish enough (ESPECIALLY FINLEY!) to try. I’ll just bet Halton is near the top of that list! (Note: I’ll bet my hammer and staple gun on it)
Hope they send us their best meat, cuz I’m gonna just love pounding 10 to 1 signs all around e’m.
Eeeeeah…I’m getting giddy just thinking about it.
Go ahead Finley, …make my day.
Seems simple to me. But can I skate?
posted by Garth Turner on 04.23.07 @ 10:18 pm |
Ya got the red spandex ready? Will the Liberals let you have a cape? L
“who is unafraid…”
Grapes? Against The Garth? In Halton!?
LOL too funny. Cogecos ratings might go up? (man those debates would be fun though huh? Don understands the middle class about as much as we understand that jacket. You could always rip him to shreds in French while he comments on the boots?)
Naw, Finley, why don’t you just come yourself? I’d camp out overnight just to get in line to ask ol dougie a question at a debate here in Halton.
Ooooeee this is gonna be fun!
Leasa,
Cape? What for?
Doesn’t Garth have a Harley?
Black leather all the way baby!
Garth, how do you plan to vote on the bill to raise the age of sexual consent from 14 to 16 years? Will it be a free vote for the Liberal caucus?
I assume she meant make-up cape. Her leader likes to go under the brush, as it were.
What is it with DelMastro and his Con spam? Apparently it’s not enough for him to irritate (us in) Peterborough with his annoying mailers, now he’s stalking the mail boxes in Halton too.
Jeez, it’s so embarrassing to be represented by Canada’s dumbest MP… Mad Mailer DelMasto! The guy’s a local joke.
Don Cherry will no doubt get more than his fair share of TV exposure right now at the time of the Stanley Cup play-offs.
For him to move from a popular sport’s commentator to become a politician would surely be a major cut in pay for him. Will it be worth it for him to sacrifice his present salary for who knows what?
But then again, perhaps he needs a new challenge, and Garth might be just the perfect match.
In addition to the TV debates, we could set up, perhaps, a one-on-one hockey match where fighting would be allowed!
Now that would draw a crowd that people would be willing to pay big bucks for! May the best man win!
I can’t believe that liberal leader Dion wants to bring Taliban to Canada???
Has Mr Dion taken some heroin or crystal Myth?? What an assine remark.
So does Mr Dion know how the Taliban treat their prisoners of war??? Does the taliban give gifts to prisoners??? or do they torture??
Taliban gov’t record has been horrific in deed — torture and mass killings and Mr Dion is defending these guys???
Taliban has been shooting and blowing up IE explosives at our own troops!!!
Does Liberal Leader Dion believe that the Khadr family as being innocent even though this entire family confessed on the CBC that they indeed was part of the Al_qeada Terrorist network???
On the issue of Afghanistan I do agree with the liberal position on withdrawal of Canadian forces out of afghanistan in 2009. Why? Canada is part of Nato and the UN and as a result we must fulfill our duties and obligations to those bodies until 2009. After 2009 our obligation is our own — we did our part/duty.
Canada has already been in Afghanistan for 5 yrs and by 2009 it will be seven yrs.
I’m kinda tired why the afghan gov’t has not fielded an army and a nation police force yet??? To me its the afghan gov’t responsibilty to provide security for their own people not other nations (like Canada, Perhaps the afghan gov’t is like a teenager and doesn’t want to pay for the responsibility but just wants the freedom and want the parents (UN and NATO) to pay for the bills so that they can have a free ride ??? Hmmmmm
I knew what Dion said would be totally taken out of context (especially by Mr. Gossip Harper Supporter Mike Duffy).
I saw what Dion said – and he said that “something had to be done” – he mentioned bringing them to Canada BUT said this would NOT BE the ideal way to do it but was pointing out that something had to be done.
So Harper uses one line and the whole world is wetting their pants.
I’m disgusted more and more and more with this Conservative government that lies – yes, lies, because to me taken something totally out of context to give a false impression is a lie.
Don Cherry? Seriously? Sheesh, what is this country coming to?
I meant to mention that Jay Hills on Mike Duffy Live today said that “the Conservatives were pro-Kyoto and that they ran that in their campaign”.
Talk about an out and out lie. He looks like Fred Flintstone (well he does to me), but I don’t think Flintstone was a LIAR like Jay Hill.
Yup, Jay Hill is a blatant LIAR!
Nike – surely you are aware the liberals support raising the age of consent? In fact, they tried to fast track that bill but the conservatives objected. They refuse to pass this bill until their other legislation is passed (which they know the liberals will not support).
In other words, the conservatives think it is more important to play politics than it is to protect those 14 and 15 years olds from sexual predators.
Ok lets just pretend for a moment that Don Cherry does win in Halton.
How long would he last in a muzzled and contolled Harper Caucus? 10 seconds? 20 seconds on the outside before the fists would be flying and Cherry’s tongue would be wagging.
Cherry doesn’t want to go to a place where he can’t be the star. And Harper wants to be the star.
Ain’t gonna work. Nice jacket though Don.
Garth
A few questions. Will you be joining in the class action/civil lawsuit against the Western Standard? Spat!
Is the Blackberry all better now? What is a Titanic?
Anyways…carry on. I know how scary it is to leave the house late at night….let alone go to a nominination meeting.
I just know you hhave it in ya to fuzzify the mudification (with all due respects to the Foth.)
Syncro
I finally got a glimpse at what the cons are lining up for us here in what they think is votable material. This is what Don Bell is up against. And I guess indicative of Cons across Canada…big sigh.
http://www.northvanconservative.ca/images/DSCN1089.jpg
I don’t think I’d let any of these characters in to adjust my cable connection let take a stab at running the country.
Peter Krahn
One wants us to think he’s “green” but he’s not. Well, he’s been green about as long as Harpo has been. Really he’s all about babies and marriage and invisible sky folk and like that.
Andrew Saxton
The 2nd guy is rich and spoiled and ultra confidant political opportunist and his web site has his name at least twice in every paragraph and neglects to mention he spent years living in NY, and he parties downtown not on the shore. He’s a dilettante.
Doug MacKay-Dunn
The third I think is an ok guy. Not heard much. Yet.
School board experience. Not much else.
And with them is our Tri-Cities Timmie’s Junkie, Jimmy Moore, which I think is a Con job description, or it at least gets you brownie points (pun intended).
James Moore has porked up big time this past 15 months or so. Well, with 3 small cities so close with at least 3 Tim’s, 3 Mickey D’s 3 White Spots, 3 A&W’s, what’s a fat boy gonna do…Ooopps don’t forget there is a Starbucks on every corner and he looks like a frappachino kinda guy. And my kids just bought a place out that way. Oh Dear me.
Scott, during WWII Canada brought about 2000 Nazi POWs to Canada. We’ve only captured about 40 suspected Taliban POWs. Bringing them to Canada would probably be much cheaper than building a detention facility for them in Afghanistan.
Well I can’t speak for the 129,999 others but here is one vote you didn’t have two months ago! Unless, of course, they run Maurice Richard against you, that might be tough! Of course, where he is now, he would have easy access to divine intervention!
Taliban gov’t record has been horrific in deed — torture and mass killings and Mr Dion is defending these guys???
That would be a good reason for Canada to do the same?
The only thing Cherry needs to add to his routine appearance to be a credible CPC candidate is a red clown’s nose.
Fifteen thou’ hard-core Cons in Halton? There are 28,000 hard-core Libs and no doubt some undecideds eager to display their support for Harper’s Government. If Cherry doesn’t fancy those odds, Finley, pass on the red nose to the next star candidate.
I’d vote for Don Cherry.
I’d campaign for Don Cherry.
Anyone but you.
And exactly what I wouuld expect from you. — Garth
Seems simple to me. But can I skate? – Garth
Better get some lessons from your buddy Ken D.
But should Grapes prevail, I can just see the scene on the Rideau ice rink following QP, a major leaguer Ken D, vs. a minor leaguer Grapes…..can you say “Rock ‘Em Sock ‘Em!”
Taliban gov’t record has been horrific in deed — torture and mass killings and Mr Dion is defending these guys??? – PJW.
Wasn’t the whole point of invading Afghanistan to get rid of the Talibhan and their hardline enforcement of their fundamentalist ways, including torture?
Well if the current government of Afghanistan is allowing the same to continue, have we made any difference?
Maybe Mr. Dion’s suggestion of briging them to Canada was not such a good one, but if we are to abide by International Law, then once we have captured these people we are obligated to ensure their proper treatment. This includes protecting them from torture.
“Ousted from caucus, stripped of my nomination, barred from running ever again, banished to the distant Himalayas of the opposition benches, thrown from my office, and now routinely pilloried in the House and on all those red meat Conservative web sites…”
I think it’s just terrible how you are persecuted, and none of it your fault. You are always measured and reasonable. I think there is going to be a new ombudsman for victims, and you would certainly qualify, could even be the first case.
By the way, I believe you started out with a nice office… but hey, principle over luxury, right?
Eric,
do better than your 7:12 am, or don’t bother.
Garth,
Ah, to awake this morning to a pic of Don Cherry just was more than sufficient to make my eyes hurt! LOL
Now, I read in the Star Tories told to target the ‘Suzuki nation’ and am just sitting here, sipping some strong fresh ground java and thinking the ultimate question of the morn.
‘Would that be meaning the C.R.A.P. nation within the Suzuki Nation, or do they believe the majority of Canadians hold to the concept of the the Suzuki Nation being a nation within a nation of C.R.A.P.?
Perhaps here is a critical clue? Federal green plan should also be aimed at `Invested Materialists,’ report says
Rather convoluted to ponder I think, but enquiring minds want to know?
And top of the morning to you and all!
So does Mr Dion know how the Taliban treat their prisoners of war??? Does the taliban give gifts to prisoners??? or do they torture??
No…they just lob their heads off. There’s another poor interpreter of an Italian reporter that’s about to lose his head. L
Wasn’t the whole point of invading Afghanistan to get rid of the Talibhan and their hardline enforcement of their fundamentalist ways, including torture? – JAMES
No, the whole point was helping the victims of the Taliban. There is a difference.
We have to place priority on protecting victims and ensuring that they get justice. Liberals most often don’t see things this way. Their focus is placed on the criminal, their rights and their “proper treatment” (almost to the exclusion of the victim). Net result; victims get burned.
No, the whole point was helping the victims of the Taliban. There is a difference. – Eric Foreman
I don’t think thats’s what George W. had in mind. Just revenge for 9/11 and removal of the Talibhan. How this helps their victims, I can not see.
As for the treatment of criminals, I think we’re a long way past the lynch gangs. We have a system of justice, like it or not, both Canadian and International that says prisoners are innocent until proven guilty and that prisoners have the right to be protected from abuse. If we ignore those rights, we become no better than the Talibhan. Call me a Liberal if you like.
There’s a balance in the justice (not revenge) system. The balance has to be there to ensure the innocent don’t get convicted in our haste for justice (revenge). Since it is a balance, and those running it are human, it isn’t perfect and sometime the victims do get burned and the innocent are convicted.
Liberals most often don’t see things this way. Their focus is placed on the criminal, their rights and their “proper treatment†(almost to the exclusion of the victim). Net result; victims get burned.
By ERIC FOREMAN on 04.24.07 7:58 am
I believe if you research this, you might find the Liberals position ia adhering to the Geneva convention.
Herb,
do better than your 7:12 am, or don’t bother.
Surely you jest? Shall we ask him to fly as well?
Oh, Cherry is entertaining but Cherry representing people. That’s just scary.
Eric-there is no logic in your last post.You can’t help the victims until you get rid of the Taliban and secure the area.
Then you help the victims and do the reconstruction job.
No…they just lob their heads off. There’s another poor interpreter of an Italian reporter that’s about to lose his head. L
By Leasa on 04.24.07 7:52 am
Maybe we should go and get them in their santuary in Pakistan?
Leasa: Your assertions that the Taliban torture therefore Canadian troops should torture is a message we keep hearing from the Stephen Harper Conservatives. I thought we were in Afghanistan to bring democracy and rights to this country yet Harper decries any attempt to apply rights to all citizens.
So, next time you hear of the Taliban torturing or debasing, don’t complain, because you and the rest of the Cons condone and appear to encourage that behaviour.
Don Cherry!!! LOL-one interview and he would castigate the Quebeckers, the Europeans, the Russians and the Asians— Harper’s worst nightmare!!!
I say “Bring on Cherry”!!!
Eric,
You just did on your 7:58 AM post. Good one.
This entire Afghan adventure is looking more and more exactly like Viet Nam. The VC were not known for their ‘fair’ treatment of prisoners, not at all in compliance with the Geneva Convention.
Ask U.S. Senator John MCCain how ‘fair’ the VC were? The CIA, of course justified the same methods as does every such organization in a gurellia combat situation. Check with British Intelligence, perhaps the Mossad and ask ‘Do you employ torture in interrogation? Why, certainly not!’ would be the reply. Denial is not just a river in Egypt, and plausible denial is SOP for such organizations!
People need to realize that all the namby pamby beliefs they got from ‘Hogan’s Heroes’ is not reality.
POW camps are not Club Meds. They are brutal and ruthless places of incarceration designed to psychologically break the enemy to gain intelligence. Anyone thinking different is living in a dream world of idealism.
Contrary to popular belief Canad ais just as apt to use such methods as anyone else. all that is required is get the locals to do the wet work, turn your head and ears away, and let them have at it.
Sad reality, but reality just the same! People, even the best soldiers, like pay-back when their comrades are injured or killed. Such is the nature of ‘civilized’ mankind! The same ones that make road kill of animals and just drive on unfazed.
Eric,
wrong, as always. The aim of was to get rid of the Taliban as a shelter for al Qaeda. Helping the Afghan “victims” was an afterthought, a rationale subverted as a reason to make the whole thing palatable.
Herb;
One of the goals of the mission was to get rid of the shelter for terrorists.
However, a second goal was freeing the people of Afganistan from the Taliban.
Herb, your still a loser.
I believe if you research this, you might find the Liberals position ia adhering to the Geneva convention. – PJW
Are you still OK with the Geneva convention if terrorists blow up your family and are unable to be brought to justice?
Hi Eric Foreman,
In your opinion, who were/are the victims of the Taliban? Are they the Afghan women? Maybe it’s the poppy farmers? Could it be the local population? the Karzai government? How about the ground troops?
Curious to hear some original thoughts on this.
-R
I believe if you research this, you might find the Liberals position ia adhering to the Geneva convention. – PJW
Are you still OK with the Geneva convention if terrorists blow up your family and are unable to be brought to justice?
By ERIC FOREMAN on 04.24.07 9:13 am
Apples and oranges Eric, if you are so hell bent in getting them, why aren’t you on to the PM to take away their sanctuary in Pakistan?…Have you done that? Also I know breaking International law is not a great concern of yours but we agreed with many other nations to act in a civilized matter. To use your analogy, i worked hard all my life to get where I am now, some other guy robs banks,and lives better than I do. Should I take up robbing banks? Sorry but I don’t support terrorism and I don’t support breaking the Geneva convention, and I don’t see them as opposites!
James-Chatham,
I think we’re a long way past the lynch gangs. We have a system of justice, like it or not, both Canadian and International that says prisoners are innocent until proven guilty and that prisoners have the right to be protected from abuse.
I have two words for you to consider:
1. Guantanamo
2. Rendition
And Canada has allowed #2 to occur in Canadian airspace, and on our soil!
As to what the CF are doing in ‘Ghan…I think, having friends who have been there, they are doing what Eric said, but unfortunately, our political leadership has allowed them to become engaged in a ‘combat’ role.
I also note the Dutch lost ONE of their troops and the combat death rattles Holland
Note their view Rules, not courage, dictate Dutch role in war zone.
So, if Eric has described the mission correctly, and I think he has regarding the CF troop’s view, why is PMSH and O’Connor expanding the mission by buying more tanks?
Support our troops, question the mission objectives and methods, and rid Ottawa of bad leadership…that is OUR duty as Canadians.
I have never been a fan of Don Cherry, but then, again, it takes 6 billion people on this planet to make up the whole. We all have different perspectives, but we need one another to become more complete.
Wouldn’t it be interesting if we saw politics, not as a way to compete, but rather to complete one another?
Everybody has their place. Every one counts. Let democracy prevail.
Nike,
You take Don Cherry…he is all yours. Thank you very much!
I still reserve the right to discern and choose who I shall associate with.
Sorry, but I am not as idealistic as you, but I still repsect your position even though I think it very naiive!.
By Transcanada on 04.24.07 1:21 am
Cherry doesn’t want to go to a place where he can’t be the star. And Harper wants to be the star.
Gotta agree with transcanada on this one.The entertainment value would be wonderful.Don of course would need his personal makeup assistant as well.Ego clash,clothes clash.This Finley guy has lost it.
Taliban prisoners:I would love to know if the mistreatment of these prisoners keeps one Canadian politician sleepless in Ottawa.Hmmmmmm!!!My opinion.This is pretentiousness beyond the beyonds.
Garth I gotta tell ya, Dion’s Taliban prisoner-bring to Canada remark didn’t do you guys any favors yesterday.Thought he might have had one too many Newfie Screech’s on the rock this past weekend.Williams gave him a little support there.He’s has to choose his words a little more carefully and in some cases not at all.
Eric,
stop spitting Kool-aid.
PJW,
I like your points regarding doing as others do versus doing what you know is right. That is the key each of us must consider when contemplating actions. it is how I live my life always asking ‘How will this end up down the road?’ It called forethought by most.
Unfortunately, we are merely human beings, and sometimes, under highly stressful conditions, we lose our perspective, act inappropriately, and then one of two things occurs.
1. Remose and regret.
or
2. Denial and justification!
I, and I think most people are quite willing to forgive #1, and yet are abhored by #2. Perhaps it is our Judeo/Christian teachings that give us that imputus?
Now take the person who has lived under terror their entire life. Do they have the same perspective? I think not. The same frustration we feel with PMSH and his denials and lies, are the root cause of those feelings in anyone who perceives injustice and prolonged angst.
Add to that the lack of ‘outside’ philosophy, i.e., a more ‘civilized means of thought, and you have the makings of inhumane acts. How many of us have wanted to thoroughly trounce someone acting as a total arsehole, not so much because of their action, but more because of their attitude?
We all bear that emotional response, and the only thing keeps us from retaliating is our philosophy of personal accountability, and the consequences of the law.
We are, regardless of the date, still merely human. and we have natural responses which are derived from personal preservation. Some evolve to have a different perspective, and others never do.
Well, seems the City Council of Toronto has had their Messiah come through?
$7.8B budget passes, free golf and all
City councillors’ perks left intact despite warnings of financial crisis
Yeppers, no matter how dire the situation they will make sure their arses are comfy!
Herb, get your head out of you ass.
Don Cherry, Le Gasbag extraordinaire, versus Le Petit Gars de Halton.
People will pay good money to see that fight.
Garth – you should surrender if Cherry runs. It will get that obnoxious twat off of CBC and get a coach who has actually won Championships in with McLean.
Bill-you left out their free passes to the Zoo.Personally I think it’s a good policy to keep that.After all,visiting family is important!
By Judy on 04.24.07 8:51 am
No, actually Judy, the Prime Minister is looking into these allegations very seriously. However, we must be careful to let the democratically elected government of Afghanistan deal with terrorists captured on their soil as they see fit, in my opinion. I have not read to date or have I seen footage of the elected Afghan government beheading anyone. However, I have watched the video of Taliban be-headings of missionaries and reporters. The Taliban is our enemy, remember? L
Herb, get your head out of you ass.
By ERIC FOREMAN on 04.24.07 10:34 am
Show some respect you Kool-Aide swilling punk .
If Cherry(Grapes) runs we better put the polyester industry on high alert .
I think Don probably wouldn’t want to touch politics. He’s been asked before and refused. I believe he would win but that’s not the point. The point is, would he want to be a politician?
You’re certainly keeping a very close eye on this Garth, do you have a spy like last time?
Garth, so much for Dion and Kyoto saving the world, Cherry and hockey have a better shot at it.
The Libs are going to look awfully foolish bringing down the government with Bill C-288 but you`re locked into it now, gotta love that partisan politics.
The Bill specifically states the government must present a plan that meets the Kyoto targets which as I`ve said before, even if accomplished will make diddly squat difference in global warming.
There is only one answer, GIVTS
http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2007/04/24/china-emissions.html
China will overtake the United States as the world’s biggest source of greenhouse gases this year
China is a signatory to the Kyoto Protocol on reducing greenhouse gasses, but it is exempt from its restrictions
China’s greenhouse gas emissions will likely exceed that of all industrialized countries combined over the next 25 years
Smitty,
Bill-you left out their free passes to the Zoo.Personally I think it’s a good policy to keep that.After all,visiting family is important!
You are right on ‘visiting family’, but, hey, I didn’t write the article so the omission is not my error! LOL
Isn’t there a rule or law against endangering zoo animals though? We wouldn’t want the Council stealing their daily supply of food would we?
Now, it seems they are going to have a problem getting there as the Taxi drivers derail council meeting!
Boy, I bet Torontonians can barely wait for the City to spend that $40 million on Nathan Phillips Square, eh?
If we bring the Taliban prisoners to Canada, then how is the Afghan gov’t going to learn how the world expects them to treat their prisoners?
Leasa, are you for real? You may want to have your water supply checked. Don’t you get it? it is our reputation that we care about, during WWII we brought over more than 40,000 Germans and Italians prisoners. Now we do not want our reputation tarnised by the likes of our so called Minister of War/ lobbyist and his boss Harpo. Most of must believe in civil rights.
Hey, here is a scarey thought! Okay, so let’s imagine Cherry being elected as an MP, made the Canadian Ambassador to the UN, and then Harper could get a gift from Dubya for replacing Bolton?
Yeah, that would put Canada on the world map!
By Jacquie Gavarkovs on 04.24.07 11:59 am
Yeah, we also locked up everyone who even dared look Chinese. We didn’t have a democratic ally in Germany remember? Where would we have left the POWs?
In Afghanistan we have an ally, it would be an insult to take away their right to deal with terrorists, the very people who may have just blown up a bus load of children on their soil.
We are not at war with Afghanistan the country. We are at war with the Taliban. We were at war with Germany, the country, they did not have an ally in power.
Geesh. Ding..ding…ding. This was a clue, did you grasp it?
L
What I would like to know is, did Mr. Dion consult his party caucus before making such an outrageous statement? If not, why not? Its a huge thing to say with huge impacts on our economy, ie: paying for prison time, legal requirements and so on. It doesn’t sound like he thought this one out, not to mention that it would bring morale down not only to soldiers, but their families, and those of us who support our soldiers.
If he did, who exactly supported it? Did he listen to those people who don’t support it?
These are important questions to such an outrageous statement.
The statement, as I understand it, was offhand and spontaneous. I also understand Mr. Dion recanted quickly. — Garth
Show some respect you Kool-Aide swilling punk . – JCLH
Respect is earned, but I love you too.
Eric If your’e so cool why don’t you run against Garth?
Show some respect you Kool-Aide swilling punk . – JCLH
What exactly does that mean?
Eric If your’e so cool why don’t you run against Garth? – ROLF
Do I have your support?
Actually Mr. Dion made the statement followed in the same sentence with a qualifier saying he realized it might not be realistic.
PJW, I understand, its just really scary that he would even consider that and say it without thinking. Very oddballish.
Garth, I forgot to add thank you for your response.
Actually Mr. Dion made the statement followed in the same sentence with a qualifier saying he realized it might not be realistic. – PJW
Your an idiot and I hate you.
Oh, sorry, I didn’t mean that. I wasn’t being realistic.
Get the point? (i.e. a leader in that position should think before speaking).
GGF,
If we bring the Taliban prisoners to Canada, then how is the Afghan gov’t going to learn how the world expects them to treat their prisoners?
Well, we could drop pamphlets instead of bombs?
Hey, I have it. I will run right over to ‘Two-Tier’ Tony Clement’s local office and having them send one of their famous mailings to all the Afghanies.
Maybe something dealing with creating a gun registery, heck maybe even an IED Registry, eh?
Oh, BTW, Comedy Hour is on CPAC now!
Your an idiot and I hate you.
Oh, sorry, I didn’t mean that. I wasn’t being realistic.
Get the point? (i.e. a leader in that position should think before speaking).
By ERIC FOREMAN on 04.24.07 2:14 pm
There was a previous post where someone said they thought he recanted, I was just clarifying what I saw him say on the TV last evening. You might want to consider anger management…and you have joined the DNC list. Thank you.
You might want to consider anger management…and you have joined the DNC list. Thank you. – PJW
And, you might want to join planet Earth. What colour is the sky in your world?
WOW! BOLD and BEAUTIFUL.
http://caiti-online.blogspot.com/2007/04/bold-and-beautiful.html
Captain George,
I will just have to make a little detour in the coming days to see that beaut first hand. Thanks for the comment and link!
BTW, I note the Green Party said it straight ‘Mr. Flaherty’s plan is full of holes!’
Garth had makeup on for today’s QP. Don’t try to deny it, Garth – the glow on your whole face from the lights was blindingly bright
On a more serious note, if the Liberals are so concerned about our soldiers in Afghanistan, bring in a no-confidence motion on your oppo day next week. Go for it.
The vote will not pass so long as there is an alliance between the Conservatives and the separatists. As for my makeup, none used. I was just brimming with endorphins at hearing PVL speak. — Garth
“Sorry, but I am not as idealistic as you, but I still respect your position even though I think it very naiive!.”
–Bill Muskoka.
I try to balance idealism with realism. It is true that the real world is a crazy, mixed up place, but it is mentally healthy to also realistically dream and to envision what the real world could become if only there was more love and less hate.
Transformation is possible. What sustained Martin Luther King Jr. were those historic words, “I have a dream…”
I, too, have a dream, and I am sure that you do as well. Remember, the dream never stops, only the dreamer. We need a vision of what can be instead of simply what is, and you can dream again if you really want to of the world becoming a better place where every one counts.
All the best to you, Bill. I, too, respect your position where you are at. But let us also share a vision of something better than what is here and now.
“Well, we could drop pamphlets instead of bombs?” –Bill-Muskoka
I think you missed the point Bill. The point was that if Canada takes all the Afghan’s prisoners, then they won’t take responsibility for themselves. They won’t learn that they can’t abuse their prisoners. We need to teach them this concept. How is sending pamphlets over there going to help?
Nike,
but it is mentally healthy to also realistically dream and to envision what the real world could become if only there was more love and less hate.
I totally agree. I also have seen the horrors human being do to each other and themselves.
I remember Martin Luther King like it was yesterday. I also remember riding the train through Birmingham, Alabama in 1966 and seeing the horrid shacks the Blacks were living in. I remember the 5 X 7 inch signs in the store windows of Natchez, Mississippi which read in BOLD LETTERS ‘Al money received from sales to N…… will be donated to the United Klan of America’.
I remember very vividly the fact that those who were wounded or killed in Viet Nam, and all other wars all bled the very same red human blood. It mattered not whether they were causcasian, Negro, Hispanic, Asian, or Native American.
I remember that the surest way to repeat those experiences is to get too lax in calling things as they truly are.
Come up on my mountain mon ami, and I can show you the greenest pastures, the bluest skies, and the reddest rivers of blood, the putred rivers of pollution all for profits you can imagine…all reality.
So, as we progress along this timeline, what shall we look back and see on our own path? Dare some even look back!
My vision is peace, and even as a Marine we had a saying…’Peace if at all possible, but once the enemy is engaged they have one of two choices…Unconditional surrender or annihilation!’ That, Nike is the reality every single combat veteran faces. The reality every crime victim faces.
The only ones who escape such reality are the philosophers and the politicians who create the scenarios to begin with.
I have watched the savage become like lambs, and the quiet lamb become as a Tiger!
‘Be always willing to extend the hand of friendship, but always be vigilant!’
Nike,
but it is mentally healthy to also realistically dream and to envision what the real world could become if only there was more love and less hate.
I totally agree. I also have seen the horrors human being do to each other and themselves.
I remember Martin Luther King like it was yesterday. I also remember riding the train through Birmingham, Alabama in 1966 and seeing the horrid shacks the Blacks were living in. I remember the 5 X 7 inch signs in the store windows of Natchez, Mississippi which read in BOLD LETTERS ‘All money received from sales to N…… will be donated to the United Klan of America’.
I remember very vividly the fact that those who were wounded or killed in Viet Nam, and all other wars all bled the very same red human blood. It mattered not whether they were causcasian, Negro, Hispanic, Asian, or Native American.
I remember that the surest way to repeat those experiences is to get too lax in calling things as they truly are.
Come up on my mountain mon ami, and I can show you the greenest pastures, the bluest skies, and the reddest rivers of blood, the putred rivers of pollution all for profits you can imagine…all reality.
So, as we progress along this timeline, what shall we look back and see on our own path? Dare some even look back!
My vision is peace, and even as a Marine we had a saying…’Peace if at all possible, but once the enemy is engaged they have one of two choices…Unconditional surrender or annihilation!’ That, Nike is the reality every single combat veteran faces. The reality every crime victim faces.
The only ones who escape such reality are the philosophers and the politicians who create the scenarios to begin with.
I have watched the savage become like lambs, and the quiet lamb become as a Tiger!
‘Be always willing to extend the hand of friendship, but always be vigilant!’
GGF,
Sorry, busy day here. Okay, my point is that there are other ways to teach people how to treat prisoners, other than using them as Guinea Pigs. Pamphlets can teach the geneva Convention, etc..
I, personally, am not for transporting them to Canada, unless, it is to show them how life can be outside the Taliban. Certainly, not for incarceration.
As to their actions…Welcome to WAR! Humanity at its finest, and DAMN I hope people someday get over the Marquis of Queensbury Honourable Rules delusion they view war with.
War is a BRUTAL, merciless confrontational event caused solely by MAN! So are street fights, and all the other ‘macho’ idiocy in society.
Can you post Doug Finley’s phone number?
There is no actual party info on their website for some reason.
sux,
A new cause?
There is only one answer, GIVTS
You mentioned it before and I looked about but found nothing. Is this your own private idea?
Please provide a link or two if possible.
WOW! BOLD and BEAUTIFUL.
I hope they hang one of those in Vancouver!!
Well, I didn’t quite have the time to read all of the replies, but I read a good portion of them. I thought I would point out that the initial goal of the Afghanistan mission was to get them to hand over Osama Bin Laden. A few weeks after the war started, the aim shifted to ousting the Taliban.
Leasa: Oh, you mean that democratically elected rife with corruption Afghan government? You know, the one that has ‘elected” officials that are known Taliban sympathizers and war lord minions?
Yes, lets let this Afghan corrupt government tell us how they are treating prisoners humanely.
Yes, let’s continue to prop up and support this corrupt government.
Yes, let’s continue to fool ourselves into thinking this corrupt Afghan government will ever accept its responsibilites–Harper and O’Connor are turning a blind eye–their quest is not Afghanistan but what is yet to come in Iran.
lol Judy,
Yeah those guys. That *gov*. Who was put in place by Bush and is hanging about doing as they are told waiting for their slice of whatever oil or natural gas pie they are permitted. In the meantime, they get to live in a few of the old palaces that have been tarted up and they eat well and don’t go without.
And the old rules under the old names get revived, like the Department of Vice and Virtue. That’s the one that whips women if their hands or hair is showing just for starters.
The people in Afghanistan have no voice. Maybe some of the elected Gov. are true but how can one know? The top is rotten, how deep does it go? Karsai is Taliban. I’m betting some of his advisors and top guys are too.
If the 7 members of the Afghani Human Rights Commission cannot do anything for the hundreds of women and children in prison for stealing food because they were starving to death on the streets of Kabul, how they hell are they going to do anything to protect our troops from breaking the Geneva Conventions?
Leasa, you are such a twit, all of you.
Oh, did you dye your hair lately?
“Okay, my point is that there are other ways to teach people how to treat prisoners, other than using them as Guinea Pigs. Pamphlets can teach the geneva Convention, etc..” –Bill-Muskoka
Sometimes you have to learn by doing. You can give someone all the materials to read, but if they don’t see how it is done or understand why it is done, then they will continue to do it. Even in Canada, there are reports of prisoner abuses. All the guards go through the same training, but some just don’t understand why it is important… so I guess we agree that more education is required, but there also needs to be some oversight.
GGF,
so I guess we agree that more education is required, but there also needs to be some oversight.
Absolutely. One of my closest friends got back from Kandahar, is an MP Sgt, and was doing training of the Afghan troops.
Like any other training there is the written part, for initial learning and reference to the RoE’s / Conduct.
We will never, however, overcome centuries of ‘attitude’. The test will be when our forces have left, because the situation will not be resolved in any foreseeable timeframe IMHO.
Catch you in the new topics.