It was in my Campbellville mailbox a few days ago. It was in Esther’s Oakville mail slot, too. And my mother-in-law’s Mississauga post office. In fact, just about everybody I ask recalls having seen the latest piece of Conservative “information” on how the Harper Party is saving the environment, as opposed to the Liberals, who destroyed it.
Fine. Whatever. Blah, blah, smear, blah, blah, smear.
But, is it legal?
As an MP, I am not allowed to use my taxpayer-funded House of Commons printing budget to send political messages to people who live in other ridings, unless it is clearly identified as coming from me, and adheres to all the House rules. But this particular piece has a picture of “Stephen Harper, MP” on it, while not identifying who actually sent it. In Halton, it wasn’t the Conservative association, or the local Con candidate (nobody’s volunteered for that suicide mission yet), nor was it another MP against whose budget it’s being charged.
It is not the first time this has happened and, actually, the House of Commons right now is investigating several other instances of the Conservative info machine having strayed far into the integrity ditch. And one might ask: If this is a CPC spin document, then why isn’t the party paying for it? Why are you paying?
A local blogger provides much more for you to ponder, here.
So much for Canada’s new, accountable, open, transparent and morally-superior government.
50 comments ↓
I’ve received many of these flyers, though not yet this one, nor do I think they had Harper on the back.
I thought they were junk, photocopied, black and white…pretty shoddy for a Government. They were disingenuous, making claims without supporting fact, but the one you illustrate, surely crosses the line. I’m in Mississauga btw…so to receive a brochure from an MP in Alta….well that would be something.
They do push it at every occasion don’t they? It will be interesting to see where this comes out, vis a vis, integrity, let alone, legality.
So much for Canada’s new, accountable, open, transparent and morally-superior government.
Did you,really,buy that load of bollocks ?
Well, garth now that you are a liberal, you would know about illegal. I have to say I’m dissappointed in your reply to my challenge to discuss the Liberal record on the enviornment, liberal patronage and how much of a bully and liar Chretien was. I ask again, I would love to debate you, fact based, no name-calling. I have left this challenge throughout the Liblogs, actually got me kicked off of cherniak’s site. Also sent an email to your glorious leader asking for proof he lowered GHG, no reply. He must be busy learning english. Well, Garth, you loyal liberal, are you up to the task?
Sure, you sound like a reasonable chap. — Garth
Garth,
I have several I am going to email you. I raised the same question regarding Franking priviledges (as they are called in the States). I firmly believe these mailings are NOT covered under those priviledges and, if that is the case, should be investigated, and prosecuted with all vigor.
I got a similer piece like that black and white photocopied mailer from Stephane Dion a few months ago. It was regarding Kyoto and the environment and such. Seen as most products that use recycled paper advertise the amount of recycled paper on it, I would assume that Stephane Dion could care less about the environment as his mailer had no mention of any % of recycled paper used. So Garth, seen as you are a champion of the environment how much % of recycled paper do you require to be used on a mailer before you will have your name put on it? Do you put your money where your mouth is? I believe you also have a garage full of campaign bag signs for the election you thought would arrive in May as well. How much % of recycled plastic do you require for those signs to contain before you will have your name put on it?
Send me the Dion flyer, if you’d like. I will see if it complies with House rules. As for recycled paper, MPs do not have control over what paper stock the HoC uses, but I believe there is a large percentage of recycled material in every piece of it. I’ll find out. The plastic lawn signs, sadly, are not recycled. But they wil be re-used for several elections to come. — Garth
“garth now that you are a liberal, you would know about illegal”
and
“I would love to debate you, fact based, no name-calling”
And Jeff before you claim that you never called Garth a Liar, the meaning is clearly implied by your statement. You owe Garth a public apology.
Stephen Harper MP, Calgary Southwest, House of Commons, Ottawa, Ontario, K1A 0A6 – quite clearly on the back.
Is it really that difficult to identify who sent the piece? If you wish, I’m sure I can dig out many of the 10% ‘ers distributed in Windsor by various Liberals from across Canada.
If it is in contravention of House rules, it would be interesting to know exactly which ones are being broken.
His picture may be on it (as prime minister, not too surprising), but he’s not identified as sending it, which is contrary to the rules. Plain and simple, illegal. We actually have no idea who paid for it, or against whose Parliamentary budget it was charged. And, given the apparent distribution, there were hundreds of thousands of copies involved. Not a big deal. But for a PM who tells us he’s Mr. Ethical, an important one. N’est-ce pas? — Garth
My guess is that this is being paid for out of Stephen Harper’s constituency budget.
A few years ago a number of ridings were targeted in a similar manner and cards were sent out asking positions on certain issues. Voters in our riding were sent a loaded question for response on the equal marriage issue because our Liberal MP supported the Liberal Government position. The card came from the riding budget of a Canadian Alliance MP and that was indicated on the material.
The same thing was done when the Liberals were in power. At that time I lived in Peter MacKay’s riding and we used to get Liberal material from the riding of a PEI Liberal member. Rather than bashing the PCs it was material lauding the Liberals.
In both cases the practice was challenged but there was no apparent problem.
Where the problem may come is in using a Government of Canada website as part of the material. That would suggest an intention to mislead the public with regard to the partisan nature of the junk mail.
Garth,
Forgive me, but my satire lobe kicked in but I believe there is a large percentage of recycled material in every piece of it. Absolutely, recycled politicians and BS for sure! LOL
What Jeff…. you trying to say that Steve’s GHG plan is better than the Liberals was? http://tinyurl.com/2u7ynj LOLOLOL
Your fearless leader is not only a liar but a thief as well.
http://tinyurl.com/38jtmp
http://www.liberal.ca/story_12415_e.aspx
http://www.liberal.ca/news_e.aspx?&page=4
Of course Kyoto came into force 16 February 2005 after Deceivin Stevie formed his “newish” government. And what has the Steve done about GHG?
A few years ago a number of ridings were targeted in a similar manner and cards were sent out asking positions on certain issues.
By C. B. Innes on 07.04.07 7:32 pm
We have had the same sort of mailing from ‘Two Tier’ Tony Clement here. Unfortunately, I do not have a pet bird to use it on, so it went into the shredder for recycling. The questions were so biased they smelled worse than the bird would have after dumping on it.
I love the sound of shredding in the afternoon!
Thanks for the answer to my questions Garth. Sadly I cannot send the Dion flyer as I have recycled it already. Good on you for re-using the lawn signs wherever possible. I am sure the metal rods in those are all reused so that is commendable as well. There is a corn based biodegradable plastic like material which maybe you could consider if available in an upcoming election. Thanks again for the clairification.
Sure, you sound like a reasonable chap. — Garth
By Jeff on 07.04.07 6:47 pm
Difference of opinion on the meaning of reasonable .
Looks to me like we’re seeing an MO. from the New Government and the CPC.
Just like those big blue C tee-shirt wearing folks at the Canada Day celebrations for new Canadians, there PM and the CPC think they are one and the same as the Canadian Government, that two are synonymous.
Not. They have been given the priviledge of power to run the government until the next election. And that’s why those propaganda rules are there, just to remind the PM, the PMO, and the ruling party caucus that their party and the government are not one and the same.
To go down the road the CPC seems to be going is the same road that leads to a one party dictatorship.
At the next confidence vote its time to show PMSH the door and tell them not to let it hit him in the butt on the way out!
You can always put comments on the junk and send it back, postage paid!
Stephen Harper MP’s mailbox will be stuffed!
Garth you raise a good point about these kinds of mailings. Here in Niagara we have received lots of ‘junk’ put out by the Conservative party for quite some time. Supposed ’surveys’ of public opinion, for example, that are so blatantly slanted to produce the answers desired by the Conservative MP (Dean Allison) that they are an utter joke and not worth the paper they are printed on. All of them go into our recycling bin. The Conservatives have not been ethical with accounting for their campaign donations either. The NDP has a good web site that details some of these issues as well. (see link at the bottom of this posting scandalsheet). Readers of your blog may have an interest in the information. None of this matters to the hardcore Conservatives of course. They continue to rehash issues that are a decade old and not the least bit relevant any more….anything to deflect any accountability from their own party. It is a sad joke. The Liberals certainly had issues when they were in office but the last 18 months under Harper has been a complete embarrassment for Canada.
http://patmartin.ndp.ca/page/123
has some interesting tidbits about Harper accepting gifts contrary to his own stated policy.
http://www.ndp.ca/scandalsheet
outlines some disturbing trends from the Harper government and its lack of accountability.
Was the flyer factual about the Liberal and Dion’s past environmental record, as well as the current Conservative record?
Can you reproduce the entire flyer so we can see what it contained?
Not without more effort that it’s worth. Suggest you write pm@pm.gc.ca, and get your own autographed copy. — Garth
We got one of those flyers, and others as well. I’ve been trying to figure out how to send a message by sending them back to sender – but surprise, you’re correct, no one to send them to!!! Go figure.
For flyers that aren’t worth the paper their printed on, they’re sure generating a lot of attention from you Liberals.
Dell
I do not think that issues like this would be as important to be taken notice here had Harper not decided to raise himself on a pedestal that he did during the election. It is a known fact that Canadians expect politicians to lie, beg, borrow or steal to get back to their job. Granted some have more integrity than others, which I do include Mr Turner in that category until he proves himself contrary.
The fact remains that Mr Harper campaigned on the need for open, honest, and accountable government. From what I have seen is a gentleman, and I will use that in the loosest form possible, that has conducted himself in a manner that has started to mirror the governing style of Bush jr. Now given the most recent previous prime minister I am still undecided if he is an improvement. Granted he appears to have no big business tie that Martin did with CSL however whatever equities or stock he owns is beyond anything I have access to.
Being a very cynical adult, and trust me I was worse as a teenager, I hold all politicians in contempt and with high suspcion. Anyone that comes in riding on a high horse or morality usually ends up being the exact opposite. I can pray that Canada will not go through it’s form, 20 years later, of the moral majority movement in the US. Then again, I hope it does go through and we see how badly corrupt such persons of high moral standing really are when presented with the power they inherit.
So speaking of taxpayers paying for campaign style propaganda…
When you and your fellow Liberals visit the Conservative ridings, be it in neigbouring ridings or flying to other ridings (NFLD), who pays for the mileage, gas, air fare, and lodging? Is it the Liberal Party of Canada or does it come from your MP’s yearly budget, which really is for your own riding’s constituents?
I guess my meetings are effective. — Garth
Poor Garth got a mailer –
Awwwww,
He can dish it out in spades, but he can’t take it.
Poor Garth.
I seriously doubt it would have pointed out GHG emmissions levelled off under his watch.
How about Junk News as well?
PM says `we’re back,’ but from where?
Does Harper even know people have the freedom to think, and use it daily?
Petulant beginnings…too much heat?
http://www.hfxnews.com/index.cfm?sid=42347&sc=93
Keep at it Garth…expose the truth!
http://caiti-online.blogspot.com/
Difference of opinion on the meaning of reasonable . – HUNTER MARS
Of course he disagrees with your meaning of reasonable. He has an independent opinion (which is different than your option, Garth’s opinion and the Liberal Party’s opinion).
I love the whole “The Liberals did nothing, so we’re going to do nothing as well” theme of the Conservative campaign.
It’s the like the answer for everything is “Well, the Liberals…”.
Terrific. If I wanted a history lesson, I’d read the National Post.
Moreover, I can see our tax dollars (possibly), hard at work.
Poor Garth got a mailer –
Awwwww,
He can dish it out in spades, but he can’t take it.
Poor Garth.
By Haltonjohn on 07.05.07 7:03 am
Haltonjohn, how old are you anyway? Your comments are childish & not worth reading. They are nothing but attack remarks with no substance. That tells me that the Harper government is running SCARED & will resort to anything to distract Canadians. I’ll bet you don’t have the guts to say face to face what you do on this blog. Acts of a coward.
For flyers that aren’t worth the paper their printed on, they’re sure generating a lot of attention from you Liberals.
Dell
By Dell on 07.05.07 12:36 am
Dell,I totally agree with you on the flyers generating a lot of attention & that’s great. I think you guys are scared that Canadian voters will start asking questions on who’s paying for them & why campaign now if the next federal election will be in 2009?
Since the Conservatives don’t have a plan — at least one they could never implement with a minority government — all they got is distraction.
I’m really starting to dig minority governments.
No logical answer yet everybody especially Politicians seem to have the answer.
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20070705/greenland_dna_070705/20070705?hub=TopStories
Jeff wrote,
>Also sent an email to your glorious >leader asking for proof he lowered GHG, >no reply.
And you won’t. It appears Dion doesn’t reply to emails as the same thing happened to me when I emailed him about his non appearance at Vimy.
I am also beginning to wonder if he would have replied if I had wrote my email in French. If this is the case then he would be in violation of the Official Languages Act.
Catherine wrote,
>>When you and your fellow Liberals >>visit the Conservative ridings, be it >>in neigbouring ridings or flying to >>other ridings (NFLD), who pays for the >>mileage, gas, air fare, and lodging? >>Is it the Liberal Party of Canada or >>does it come from your MP’s yearly >>budget, which really is for your own >>riding’s constituents?
Garth wrote >I guess my meetings are effective.
Spin spin and avoid the truth because You didn’t answer the questions Garth. What’s holding you back? Fear perhaps of what your leader would do to you if you spoke up?
That’s right. I am shaking. — Garth
It appears Dion doesn’t reply to emails as the same thing happened to me when I emailed him about his non appearance at Vimy.
By Van on 07.05.07 4:09 pm
Perhaps because everyone but you knows why. You were being a troll like arse even asking, and you know it Van!
Bill wrote
>Perhaps because everyone but you knows >why. You were being a troll like arse >even asking, and you know it Van!
No I don’t know why Bill. Dion never even acknowledged my email. Garth at least replied when I asked for his assistance although he said he couldn’t help me. Besides I am only telling the facts which is.
I wrote Dion.
He didn’t acknowledge my email.
If he was a great a leader as he keeps telling us then he would have at least shown me the courtesy of an acknowledgment. I received one from the PM and I also received a reply from the Veterans Minister who btw passed my email on to Dion. But still no reply..
Finally, I strongly feel his no show at Vimy after being invited was a disgrace.
As was already pointed out to you, Harper did not invite Dion until the last minute when he was shamed into it. At that point Dion had already accepted to be the guest of honour at the Vimy memorial in Montreal, which he did attend. You are a disgrace, along with Harper, to be playing politics on the graves of our war dead. — Garth
>That’s right. I am shaking. — Garth
Sometimes being sarcastic is an attempt to hide the truth which I believe is the case here. So the only conclusion that I can come to is that you are indeed afraid to speak up and answer the questions that have been out to you.So now I will take your comments about Harper being a one man show with a grain of salt because apparently your new boss is just the same.
Garth you are the disgrace to all politicians because I just checked my emails and you didn’t tell me what you claimed to have done. Some people would call it a lie but I won’t.
Your accusation about me is unfounded and contemptible. You sir are disgusting to say the least.
I asked Dion a legit question and if you don’t like it tough. I use to have some respect for you but after your last comment any respect I did have for you is gone. It is unfortunate that you only like the truth slanted the Liberal way.
Van, are you really, really that uninformed about what’s happening or are you just an arse?
Quote-As was already pointed out to you, Harper did not invite Dion until the last minute when he was shamed into it. At that point Dion had already accepted to be the guest of honour at the Vimy memorial in Montreal, which he did attend. You are a disgrace, along with Harper, to be playing politics on the graves of our war dead. — Garth
Van, can you tell me what kind of PM waits until the very last minute to invite the leaders of the Opposition, Liberal, Bloc and NDP, to accompany him on such an historic Canadian event as this years Vimy? What kind of petty person does this? Especially since the PM KNEW that all Opposition leaders had made commitments since they were not invited to Vimy.
Van, shame on you and your esteemed leader for being the very worst kind of human being.
I have written to Stephane Dion Twice,and both times I received a HAND written response back! I was really impressed by that.
Spin spin and avoid the truth because You didn’t answer the questions Garth. What’s holding you back? Fear perhaps of what your leader would do to you if you spoke up?
That’s right. I am shaking. — Garth
By Van on 07.05.07 4:15 p
Peter Van Loan? Sure sounds like it.
Nice smear Emilie Kitteringham.
Please spare me the BS that Dion was a victim at not being invited until a week before the event. If Dion and the other party leaders really wanted to be at Vimy they would have made arrangements long before the event and would have been there. If Dion was a true leader he would have went come hell or high water and the PMH be damned. But No instead the Liberals blamed Harper and tried to make it a political issue. And Turner has audacity to say I am a disgrace for making politics out of our war dead.
All I can say to you and Turner and anybody else who thinks the same as you is look in a mirror before you go off and calling others the very worst kind of human.
Van: And why wasn’t Stephen Harper at the D.Day ceremony in 2004? Perhaps he wasn’t “invited”. But then Harper isn’t a “true leader”, is he?
by Van
Gotta tell you that personally I find that an awfully stupid question to answer gracefully so I can’t say as I blame him.
Van, I looked in the mirror and what I seen was a person who would never be as mean spirited as your fearless leader. His behaviour speaks for itself and it was evident daily while the House was sitting.
Anyone who plays politics with our dead soldiers is despicable.
http://tinyurl.com/2ktjt7
Stephane Dion asked Michael Ignatieff to go to Vimy since his father had been the Canadian representative on the 50th anniversary in 1967 when he was U.N. Ambassador. Dion thought that would be appropriate as he himself had a previous commitment with a Vimy memorial ceremony in Montreal, with General Romeo Dallaire. (you remember him, don’t you Van)? The Bloc and NDP also sent MPs to “unofficially” represent them since the PMO did not “officially” invite them to be part of the Canadian contingent.
And you take this issue and try to smear a politician and a political party when it was the PM who was playing dirty pool. The only ones who were on the official list was the PM, his wife and his kids. The rest were invited by the PMO because the media pointed out how despicable Harper was… again.
But I can see that by attacking Dion the harpercrites feel better about what a lousy leader Steve has turned out to be and how Steve has turned even Vimy into a political photo-op for just himself.
Go back to your vicious group/leader, Van.
By Van on 07.05.07 10:14 pm
Ever hear of a thing called protocol Van? You know how it works. One does not invite themself to an event represented by another.
You are sounding like Van Loan BTW!
The fact of the matter Bill is that Dion was invited, all be it one week before the event. As far as protocol goes he could have went as a private citizen and even as a citizen of France but one could argue that his ego got in the way. I will leave it at that.
I would have been satisfied with an explanation that Garth gave me on this blog and I would have let it go. I repeat once again that Garth’s explanation on this blog was the first and only time that he told me that.
Besides I am entitled to my opinion of Dion just as you and others are entitled to your opinion of Harper or anybody else. and his party will never get my vote even though I have voted Liberal in the past when Chretien before his governments became corrupted and Trudeau and Pearson was Pm’s.
Also Dion has not proven to me that he is even capable of leading a country thus far as previously illustrated with examples..He needs to gain more experience on the opposition benches to ensure that he will remain humble.
Emilie, all I can say to you is that when a person looks in a mirror they see an image of themselves. You are truly different because when you look in the mirror you claim to see an image of Harper. You may have a serious image problem. Secondly. did it ever occur to you that maybe Dion didn’t go was because if he went it may not have had the photo op that all politicians and I repeat all politicians seek. So all this crap about Harper’s trip being a photo- – op is a bunch of hot air because Dion would have done the exact same thing if the roles were reversed so please spare me the bullshit.Finally, apparently it is OK for Dion supporters to smear Harper but is is not OK for Harper’s supporters to smear Dion. Very Very hypocritical to say the least. That is another reason why I will not vote Liberal.
The Conservatives so called junk mail is not any worse than Garth’s very own spam I received in my in box about an upcoming town hall meeting in some town in Ontario when I live on the West Coast.
The only way I can figure out how I got on his mailing list is that I completed his on line survey a while back. Now what a sneaky way to get on a Mp’s mailing list. In fact I would say it is even worse then Garth receiving Harpers handout.
Second example was when I received a questionnaire from my Liberal MP to answer the question which stated”I do not support the Conservative stand on crime (there was no other option) or words to that effect.I was to fill it out the form with my name and address etc and send it to ” guess who” the big man himself Mr Dion.. I actually did complete the questionnaire but I changed the “do not” with “DO” because I do agree with the government’s position on crime. I also annotated the front of the questionnaire advising “Mr Dion” that printed answered had been change as stated above. I don;t know who paid for this little gem. The Liberal party or the public purse. If I recall it didn’t say anything about it being part of the liberal party but it was addressed to Dion’s office on parliament hill and it didn’t cost me a cent to mail back so I suspect that it was my tax dollars that paid for it..
Btw, Garth my MM is Blair Wilson the Liberal Mp for West Vancouver–Sunshine Coast -Sea to Sky Country, British Columbia
This just goes to show you that both parties are guilty junk mail and in the case of Garth spam. So Garth you really are pulling a red herring.
Well, my message to you was electronic, so there was no expense to the taxpayer, unlike the PM’s multi-hundred-thousand paper mailer in Ontario. Besides, all my messages have an auto-delete feature, enabling you to instantly sever communications with me. Please feel free to use it. Please. Did I say, please? — Garth
Hey, Bill don’t knock Van Loan he could very well be our next Defense Minister. That would make things really interesting especially if Dion makes McGuinty Defence critic. Hope he does because that would be titan battle between two people who dislike the other party pretty much 100%.
You can see the hatred in McGuinty’s face during question period or in committee while Van Loan on the other hand gives that silly grin.
I must admit I have enjoyed McGuinty’s and Baird tussles. They both remind me of two school yard boys duking it out to see who is the toughest kid in the school yard. You can just see the dislike they have for each other. Not nice but that is what happens when two similar personalities and big ego’s clash. Not much gets done but it makes for good entertainment and better then going to a movie.
HI Garth as you well know I have already communicated with you by email and could very do so again. Btw Thanks for the offer although I feel you are not really sincere but me being the nice guy I am I will take it at face value..
I notice that you never mentioned the expenditure of the Dion’s” questionnaire so Can I rightly assume that it was paid for my public fund? Yeah. I know you don’t know and I should “go ask Dion”. Sorry will not because I have already done that, been there and wear the tee shirt and besides we both know he wouldn’t even acknowledge my email now don’t we.
So I will ask you because one thing you do is reply one way or the other. Was the “Dion” questionnaire about the Conservative stand on crime paid for by public funds or the Liberal party?
My question to you is fair since you have made such a big issue about Harper’s “junk” mail expenditure coming from the public purse.
We both know public expenditure is permitted when the handout is government related just like local MP’s “Newsletters are permitted under the current rules and just like it free for us to write an Mp without cost under the current rules. But that is another debate whether is should be permitted or not at all..
Can’t comment on what I didn’t see. If you have a copy, send it to me, and I will get you the correct answer. — Garth
Sorry Garth I don;t have a copy because I mailed it in. I knew I should have went into Town and got a photocopy made. But hey who knew that I would be required to provide proof for something that actually happened and i no doubt we will hear the results of the questionnaire if they are favourable to the Liberal position. I will just chalk it up to another one of Liberal disappointments. I Perhpas you could phone my MP and confirm what I said is true. I am sure his local office remembers me because IO phoned their and tore a strip off them for sending such a biased question with no other option then to pick the one they had on the questionnaire. Unfortuantely, I forgot ot ask them who paid for it at the time beacuse they had pissed me off so much. I did the exact same thing with the Reform party except I tore up my Reform Party membership card at the time. I even let them hear the ripping when they used the same tactic about an issue that I differed with them and was unable to voice my position. So today I belong to no party and will not in the future.
I just wish that all political parties but especially the Liberals and conservatives would at least try and ask fair questions which permits opposing answers instead of just one sided ones. Then again who ever said that political parties leadership and back room had ever any brains or fairness in these types of questionnaires. It is just another issue that makes me even more cynical about our political parties and politicians in general.
I didn’t mention the NDP or Green Party in my rant because they don’t have a hope in hell of ever forming a federal government in my lifetime and likely anyone else’s on this blog and really the debates, arguments, slamings,smears, rants and whatever else is being written is restricted primarily to the two main parties.