Jamie Carroll likes to slouch. Kind of a personal signature. This night he was slouching on a chair to the window side of the big table in the boardroom of the Leader of the Opposition’s office. The room is ornately covered with hand-carved wooden panels and topped with a ceiling of carved and painted stone and beams. A row of windows looks out over the front lawn of the Parliament Buildings, this night patched with late-winter snow.
I left the table, went and sat beside him. It was a strategy session to discuss the Liberal party response to the Conservative budget about to unveiled. Around the table were the stars of the party, elected and otherwise, with a few more heavyweights on the speakerphone from Toronto and Montreal. I was convinced Stephen Harper was in the prelude to an election call, and while I sensed the leader, sitting opposite, agreed with me, there was a sea of skepticism around him.
Newbies get to do things others eschew. So I thought I’d go ask the strategist, quietly, what he thought should happen, three feet away at the table. He told me. I concurred. And I did it.
Smart guy, of course. Wired in to Dion, the party, but especially the blood sport of public life. He’s the typical youngish, experienced, jaded, talented, hard-ass, hard-ball political 24/7 junkie you want at your elbow when you’re a minister, a leader or a candidate for greatness. Until hours, or minutes, ago, he was in charge of the Liberal Partry.
You grow a dependence on that kind of person, as they become a sort of brash alter ego. The bond forged on the road, in the war room, under the gun and in the spotlight is a powerful one. Only the exceptional survive. But there’s always danger. When somebody’s gunning for your boss, but lacks the guts to take him on, the bullet is sometimes yours.
So, I only know what I read. What Duffy and Don tell me. The media panels say Stephane Dion’s in trouble. Suddenly some no-name party candidate from an unwinnable riding is an oracle on my TV. The pundits from other parties chortle and gloat. Reporters cluck. Bloggers moisten.
But does it mean anything? Beats me. But I don’t think so. My neighbour tonight still said, “Jamie who?†when I was lugging the blue box to the curb. Nobody in the Home Depot this evening in Milton who greeted me looked furtive or upset. And I’m sure if I’d been walking with Dion down the Rigid Insulation aisle, he’d have been mobbed.
After all, the events of the last few weeks have been intensely Inside Baseball stuff. They hardly make a difference if you’re worried about climate change, lost money on an income trust, had your mortgage rate increase, just saw your plant shuttered and your job disappear, can’t find day care or have a bum hip you dare not walk on and have to wait two years for a new one.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but I think voters want politicians to work on their problems, instead of constantly trying to screw each other. Just a hunch. I think Jamie’d agree.
114 comments ↓
The single most important referendum in Ontario history is about to take place changing our voting system and we have not heard or seen you comment on it once. If you are for proportional representation lets here it. Here in Halton we don’t know who Jamie is either nor do we care. How ’bout some pro rep talk.
Actually I was researching MMP today, trying to arrive at a reasonable conclusion on something that is clearly not perfect. The old mainline parties are opposing this because first-past-the-post allows governments to be created with an absolute minority of voters. Any form of proportional representation is lethal to them, since they know it will start to erode the influence of a system which is inherently and fundamentally flawed. MMP is probably a lousy compromise, but it is better than what exists. That’s why I am voting for it, and will be explaining that decision here very shortly. — Garth
Weird,
The political scene is so weird these days. I ain’t been here forever but I’ve been hanging out a long time. Ask me who was Dief’s second Finance Minister?
I don’t know. I do know that he wasn’t a dolt, and I know he didn’t need to have a social reporter watch him whip up a soufflé in the kitchen of his stone house as his wife corrected his early senior’s moments.
“I think voters want politicians to work on their problems, instead of constantly trying to screw each other. Just a hunch. I think Jamie’d agree.”
better each other than us
“inside baseball stuff”
You are about as delusional as that Cherniak kid.
Ah well, at least Dion has two friends left on the blogosphere.
Hate to say it but come Election night, pundits will point to you as the most disastrous political move by any Canadian politician in modern age.
You left being an Independent to sit under a Dion Liberal led party…WOW.
A place in history. Cool. — Garth
Yeah I’m voting Yay as well, same reasons, better than what we’ve got.
Too bad about young Jamie, wish he hadn’t threatened to sue for compensation.
Great blog Garth.
Mr Garth TurnerMP,
I agree, Less monkey bisness and more critical thinking about making thinks better for everyone sooner that later.
Some good old fasion long term planing would help aswell, and I don’t just mean until the next election.
Why do some people like PMSH seem to be afraid to ask the best and brightes for there ideas about the real important stuff to keep us all healthy and wise
on our one small planet?
A place in history. Cool. — Garth
A footnote in many future books about “How Not to be a Leader of a Political Party” is neither ‘cool’ or worth bragging about.
Then again, sure beats the guys and gal that have to live with the fact that they lost a Leadership race to Dion…
I was referring to the vaunted place you were ascribing to me – the biggest Canadian disaster. — Garth
the canadian voter likely isn’t very tuned in to all this. i agree. however, if dion and his peeps could find a way to change the channel for awhile, that wouldn’t suck either.
just saying.
Mr Garth TurnerMP,
Saddam offered to go into exile 1 mouth before war started report says, but Neo-cons unleashed carnage anyway.
http://www.truthnews.us/?p=51
Have you seen the Presidents WARNING
about the military industrial complex?
It’s at the start of the movie ‘why we fight’ you can see the hole show at.
http://www.sonyclassics.com/whywefight/
No one except the devotees to Duffy or Newman at 5:00 will know anything about the inner workings of the Liberal Party.
And those who watch will only know what “insiders” have told them.
You could ask anyone in my small town of 850 about Dion’s national party president and 99% of them would not have a clue. Most don’t even know our provincial candidates for Oct.10.
Backroom politics is fodder for pundits, strategists and spinners. It holds little interest for the ordinary citizen.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but I think voters want politicians to work on their problems, instead of constantly trying to screw each other.-Garth
How can you say that with a straight face? That has been your complete and total focus for a year. Screw all things CPC…either you have become a pathological liar or you believe your disciples are all idiots….
Well, the cat is out of the bag, and it is definitely in a pissy fit mood!
Dion expected to shake up Liberals
Ottawa to block state-linked takeovers: Sources
Seems that Steve’s bosses have had enough of Canada being sold out to foreign interests as well?
Had to be the corporate bosses, because neither Harper or Flaherty have enough brain cells betwween them to have seen the reality. Besides, Dubya hadn’t said ‘Stop’.
Ah, another day, another ‘What if?’
You’re quite right Garth, the average Canadians doesn’t know or want to know about Jamie Carroll, but grassroots Liberal party members are very concerned.
These are the people who work for the Liberal party during elections, and are well tuned into what is happening in the party executive. These are also the people who failed to show up for the Outremont by-election, and may even balk at showing up in Halton come the next election, all because of Jamie Carroll, Outremont, Garneau, and the fact that most of them did not want Dion as their leader during the leadership race.
So this new Liberal party debacle may not affect the average Joe, but it most certainly will affect the Liberal party grassroots members who must be very disappointed with Dion’s leadership.
Too bad your only learning that lesson now… I’m sure the next time you screw your party over the NDP will welcome you… I think you’ve carved enough wiggle room for that.
Tell the truth Garth, you secretly aspire to the top dog position. Why the hell would you have bothered otherwise.
Your record speaks for itself, twisting and turning, and eventually just pissing people off. Years of the same.
Yet here is a party that is weak. Management can’t make up it’s mind, can’t decide which flag to throw the support to, and where is Garth…
Hopping around the country, slapping hands and kissing babies… Liberal babies.
Frig, another few months of this, an election loss by Dion, and a new year convention, and you might just buy yourself some karma eh?
Well, good luck to you… You’ve been a royal pain in the ass to the Tories, but I think your a relatively decent, if somewhat self-serving, bugger.
I’m glsd you left us, but I actually think the Liberals could be worse off without you.
Turner a dark horse for the Liberal Leadership… I’ll piss myself laughing if you pull it off.
Call the election CONs! I dare ya!
The CONs havent broke 40% since July 2006.
If Dion is such an inept leader than why isn’t Lyin’ Steve overwhelming him?
A two week old poll.
I was referring to the vaunted place you were ascribing to me – the biggest Canadian disaster. — Garth
By John Frain on 10.02.07 10:53 pm
I would not say you were neither the biggest Canadian disaster nor the biggest Canadian success story. You were led by your ego like so many other before you.
Backroom politics is fodder for pundits, strategists and spinners. It holds little interest for the ordinary citizen.
By Judy on 10.02.07 11:13 pm
Except when it comes to Stephen Harper and the conservatives. Then ordinary citizens are aware of the inside baseball, eh Judy?
By John Frain on 10.02.07 10:39 pm
But he will be the sitting member for Halton!
I probably shouldn’t say this but I’m surprised what’s left of the inner sanctum of the Quebec wing of the Liberal party thinks it has any right to call call ANY shots at all but no, the old guard keeps marching and speaks out of school to get its way.
Worst part of it for the Liberals is their straw-bosses are making issues over nothing but sour grapes. The Liberals were outgunned in Outremont and the best candidate won. Maybe its time the Quebec wing lost its chaffe once and for all and the new generation stepped in. Whatever the problems are its not a lack of talent that’s holding things back. Turf the lot of them and if they can’t take it the party’s not worth leading anyways.
Politics is a dirty game. You can’t trust anyone.
Does anyone know when the parties started using moles to infiltrate opposing parties? It appears to have been happening since at least the 1990s. The Liberals have been quite successful until the last three or four years in keeping them out of potential damaging
positions in their party.
By WC Macdonell on 10.03.07 12:28 am
I know it is difficult for some to understand that someone might actually be in this game for the good of others and I can understand why. Politicians, in general, are not a respected lot, and for good reason, so it is hard to see the diamond in the rough. If you would for a moment put away your partisanship, it might become evident. Certainly if being the PM was the aspiration of Mr. Turner, he wouldn’t be spending 24/7 on a blog talking with people all across the country, he would be greasing up the power brokers.
Who knows, Garth, this might be a good thing.
IMHO Mr. Dion is (was) being overhandled. It’s like people are trying to make a name for themselves through him instead of working for the good of the party and, ultimately, for the good of Canada.
It’s time to unleash Dion.
-R
P.S. How does one get to be an advisor or strategist to a politician?
There was a good idea floated by a Liblogger that no one seemed to pay much attention to. So much focus on internal politics and not much on rebuilding the Liberal base and bringing in fresh members to help diffuse the old guard so embroiled in these infernal blood fueds:
http://farnwide.blogspot.com/2007/10/idea-for-liberal-party.html
If Dion is such an inept leader than why isn’t Lyin’ Steve overwhelming him?
A two week old poll.
By Transcanada on 10.03.07 1:47 am
Sniff, Sniff, Sob, Sob, Sob; Finally, some good news on a bad news day. I’ve always aspired to a career in communications … mainly the desire to write … Well, that was quashed by my grade IV teacher, who didn’t like my printing [chicken scratching]or my essays, [too brief.] Then, my singing career was crushed when I came to TO from the east coast. Before dinner, at the SA hostel, we were singing a hymnn, which I really got into with gusto. Everybody started laughing. The SA major came to me right away, quietly took me aside, and said, “Pyotr, it is clear to me, as it is to most, you were NEVER intended to be a singer.”
So, I have always had to defer to my older brother, Orion*, who not only has great talents for self-expression and singing. [like a chick-a-dee] He, like me, is more or less fixated on how we were screwed by Harper, Flaherty et al.
Lord Cross of Blacks Harbour from Blacks Harbour NB, Canada writes:
1. scott thomas from Canada writes: Puff piece.
2. Alex Inglis from Toronto, Canada writes: I would like to congratulate his PR staff for having planted the article. Very well done. I still can’t find it in my heart to forgive him for the stupid, regressive, ill-considered, unsubstantiated policy decision he announced as his Halloween trick-or-treat.
3. Gentlemen: My sense of it is virtually the same as yours. More particularly, in reference to Mr. Inglis, you must be speaking of the Halloween Massacre. [Income Trust Decision] Estimates range up to 2.5 Million people were hurt by that Betrayal of Promise by Harper and Flaherty … with resultant damages in the amount of up to $38 Billion. Then, as though they were not satisfied with the havoc they created, they created the Pallister Five: Comprising of Brian Pallister, Portage La Prairie, Ablonczy, Calgary Nosehill, Del Mastro, Peterborough, Dykstra, St. Catherines, Wallace, Burlington. Those five attempted to block Flaherty’s appearance before the finance committee. They were outvoted by other committee members. But, Mr. Pallister attempted consistently to block people who appeared before the committee who were there to defend seniors’ interests … because it was mostly seniors, who could ill-afford to sustain losses, who were hurt most.
The NDP committee member, Judy Wasylycia-Leis, merely played a follow-on role … later indicating Harper and Flaherty had done the ”right” thing.
Apparently, to the NDP, seniors who are attempting to provide and maintain a savings nest egg and their independence, don’t form part of the NDP natural constituency. In short, the NDP totally dismissed and ignored that seniors had been hurt very badly. This tragedy, which is a real personal tragedy, is deserving of more than fluff-piece treatment. I won’t forget this betrayal. Harper, Flaherty, Pallister, Ablonczy, Del Mastro, Dykstra and Wallace [ with Judy Wasylycia-Leis assistance ] DUMPED ON SENIORS!
For aspiring riflemen:
Neither the sight nor cross-hairs are moveable, you can adjust only … You must always move the rifle in an arc.
Compass reading for mariners:
The Harper government was on-course at 90 degrees E., now moving rapidly to 180 degrees S. In other words, headed straight downhill on stormy seas. Time to send out the coast guard.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FrYRY6kx550
Ah, another day, another ‘What if?’
By Bill-Muskoka on 10.02.07 11:33 pm
Have you heard the Howard Hampton economic plan for Ontario?
”We could have ham and eggs … If we had any ham … but, gosh, we don’t have any eggs either.”
Champagne Jack’s economic plan for Canada:
”How’dja like to buy breakfast for Olivia and me? We could start with ham and eggs, but we absolutely must have champagne and cake for the closer.”
Garth, Yesterday must have been a blue day all around. I found myself sitting in Tim’s in lu lu land not knowing just was up, now reading your blog, I see you had one of day also. Sorry lost me pal.
In any rate, CTV Late News….,,
General Hillier…..is now gonzo…as a ex vet of over 30 years and was serving when Admiral Landymore got the boot from then PM Tredeau, I can honestly say “Been There”
For those that missed it, General Hillier was “Spectactular” a true General in all respectss, first clip was O’Conner walking past one of those big Green Garbage Dumpsters, kinda looked the boss of duumpsters, (and that’s kind) General Hillier shows up late for the show of. A few troops were called out to in the parking lot (yet another slap at O’Connor) the last sceeen is reporters asking the General for a comment, to which the proud General, (No Cap on) says “No Commeent” smiles and steps into the staff car. “PRICELESS” oh by the way the General was in his #2 uniform, for the event, (Us old vets notice these things)…..
I have questioned General Hillier and spoke here on your Blog Garth of General Hillier, I did so always with respect, I know from serving SNCO’s he is most highly respected and is a “Soldier’s Soldier” to which there is no highier honour, he will leave the Army with the same respect that Admiral Landymore received and no Dam Civilian elected or otherwise will take that away from him ever! Our proud Canadian Army now has there true hero and all who served with him will be telling stories of his stellar service long after a few dozen or so PM’s have come and gone.
Admiral Landymore is still alive and well here in Halifax Camp Hill Hospital. and I remember well when the sailors lined the streets in respect, and with a token of thanks Admiral Landymore “Spliced the Mainbrace”
So there is no need to spectulate, PMSH made his more….he can lie, he can deny but it’s a done deal.
BZ
BT
Garth, I agree that the majority of Canadians couldn’t and do not care who Jamie Carroll is but they will react to the constant tearing down of Mr.Dion in the polls. This does not bode well for the LPC . The LPC needs to get a grip and fast.
How can you say that with a straight face? That has been your complete and total focus for a year. Screw all things CPC…either you have become a pathological liar or you believe your disciples are all idiots….
- John G
Just look at it this way. If things become too difficult in the Liberal party for Mr. Turner, he’ll go an join the Greens (or the NDP, or the Communist Party, etc etc).
Call the election CONs! I dare ya!
The CONs havent broke 40% since July 2006.
By Transcanada on 10.03.07 1:47 am
Careful what you wish for. They have a small legion of simpering droolers just waiting in anticipation of Der FuutSchtool’s call to tell them their script [grocery list] has been okayed.
Why aren’t election dates fixed so the government can actually get some work done instead of worrying about having an election called at any time. If it’s every 4 years on the dot then at least we’d get 3 years of work for our money. Instead we get constant campaigning and MP’s insulting each other like school children at recess. It’s great that you’re out there talking with the people but what have you actually accomplished in the past year? What has the taxpayer got in return for their $150,000? Just curious.
The upcoming referendum in Ontario is an important decision for voters, and one which should be thought about carefully. All the info available from the Ontario Citizens’ Assembly is positive, and in theory may work well if we had only two or three parties. However, we have six parties fielding candidates in this election. It is entirely possible that the three minor parties could be given seats in the house based on percentage of votes, without electing a candidate. If so, these seats could reduce the seats for the major parties, possibly resulting in a minority government.
New Zealand currently has a MPP system, and almost always has a minority government which makes it very difficult to govern effectively.
I believe that the proposed MPP system is a recipe for minority governments, and voters should consider pros and cons before marking their ballot on this issue.
MMP is one step closer to rep. by pop. and for anyone outside an urban area it is very, very dangerous to all things rural. We would lose our voice altogether. Right now there are enough rural seats to make the difference between majority and minority governments with our present system. Also, what will happen with MMP is that we can end up with a plethora of parties in parliament and end up getting nothing done and a lot of silly legislation in ‘deal making’. Also, a lot of good legislation will become even more mired and held up. Not a good idea for anyone.
Garth said:Correct me if I’m wrong, but I think voters want politicians to work on their problems, instead of constantly trying to screw each other.-Garth
Say what Garth? How many Conservative MPs have been roasted on this blog complete with pictures? How is that serving the best interests of your constituents?
Lastly, your pal Jamie. Didn’t he show his true colours when he threatened to sue so quickly? Gosh, he even suggested what amounts he may sue for! When so many people were asking Dion to seriously look at this guy and see if maybe his bestest buddy was the angst of the problems, he went up against them all supporting him. tsk tsk, now that’s not the way to ‘listen’ is it?
Do you think now that just because someone carries the ‘liberal brand’ makes them a good person?
You haven’t mentioned people like Marc Garneau what do you think of him and the treatment he received from Dion?
Garth said: he thought should happen, three feet away at the table. He told me. I concurred. And I did it.
Did what?
Leasa
Have you lost your job yet?
STOP BUYING FOREIGN!
They hardly make a difference if you’re worried about climate change, lost money on an income trust, had your mortgage rate increase, just saw your plant shuttered and your job disappear, can’t find day care or have a bum hip you dare not walk on and have to wait two years for a new one. – Garth
Maybe not the first thing on your mind. But if you blame the CPC for the direction set and how they’re going about fixing the woes of Canada, then you have to look at their replacement.
Question who runs the replacement? Is it the leader of the opposition, Mr. Dion? Or is he just a face for some backroom “experienced, jaded, talented, hard-ass, hard-ball political 24/7 junkie.?” You said it yourself, “Until hours, or minutes, ago, he (Mr. Carroll not Mr. Dion) was in charge of the Liberal Partry.”
So just as we ask who’s in charge of the government, PMSH or the backroom goons of the PMO, the same has to be asked of the Liberals.
Who’s in charge?
Green is looking good as a protest vote come the next election!
It all boils down to our pathetic MSM – who like little children get on a story over and over and over and over again because their too lazy, too weak, too stupid to write about real issues. I can’t stand the Canadian MSM anymore. No “balls” at all.
C’mon – look at Duffy and Taber – what a joke. He calls this Dion stuff “delicious”. Really? A big grown up man like little old lady gossip? Something’s wrong, terribly wrong. Ya, he answers to his Conservative bosses at CTV – Duffy is not a leader or a man with any guts whatsovever. I’m disappointed, I used to like him.
Garth, who did 2006 Liberal candidate Gary Carr in Halton support as Liberal leader at the Montreal convention?
Also who did the Halton Liberal members support? Was it Ignatieff??
Who cares? — Garth
Jamie should know BODY LANGUAGE says a lot.
The Internet will destroy Politians that lie, break promises or are dithering buffoons and it is about time. Take the sell out of Canada going on daily. Take notice because the CRAP are either endorsing it or JUST DON’T GET IT.
http://communities.canada.com/financialpost/blogs/francis/archive/2007/10/02/harper-and-flaherty-where-in-heck-have-you-been.aspx
Who do people like Carroll work for – the party, the country, themselves?
How do they get into and stay in positions of leverage out of all proportion to their responsibility and authority? What kind of a leader will allow himself to be led by such people? (Haven’t met Carroll, but had short, intense exposure to Goldenberg.)
Don’t we realize that “aparatchiks” are a good part of our political problem? They are the ones who create and push party strategy, who set the tone and pull the strings, who revel in the vicarious exercise of political power, who try to live their ambitions? Politics being all they have and are, they have to push it to the max, and are fireproof as long as the leader’s face shines upon them – unless they go too far, are exposed, and have to be dumped as political ballast (as in Reid, and now Carroll.)
How parties work is something that the parties will have to come to grips with themselves, but they will do so only through the process of hard knocks administered by voters. No serving aparatchik will put himself out of a job and future personal political prospects, or the corporate prospects his contacts garantee.
Change the system, vote for MMP, buy my bridge!
Not impressed
Leasa
Have you lost your job yet?
STOP BUYING FOREIGN!
By Leasa on 10.03.07 8:04 am
Then tell your hero Harper to stop selling off everything Canadian.Contrary to what you and the cons want the US is still a foreign country.
“i agree. however, if dion and his peeps could find a way to change the channel for awhile, that wouldn’t suck either”
The channel gets changed Tuesday night as Danny boy wins everything in sight on the rock, and then the coup de grace Wednesday as Dalton boy comes home with huge numbers.
Then the spotlight will be focused squarely where it should have been all along.
On the fact that short of Alberta, Harpo clearly has real trouble in electing members from just about everywhere else in this country, especially urban Canada.
Bring on the the election now. Most people do not give two hoots about about the talking heads, and just want a new government (no pun intended) and a new PM.
Certainly if being the PM was the aspiration of Mr. Turner, he wouldn’t be spending 24/7 on a blog talking with people all across the country, he would be greasing up the power brokers.
By pjw on 10.03.07 6:38 am
If only they’d give him the time of day. Apparently even the Liberal power brokers have their limits. Alternate strategy is dashing around the country, talking up grassroots liberals.
Grassroots Canadians, pal. I talk to everyone. — Garth
Re: comments by Leasa on 10.03.07 8:04 am
The most important issue I see that you addressed in this post is the attitude of the “star” Quebec candidates who became peeved because they did not receive the anticipated safe seats.
Comments from Liberal riding associations that they were waiting for Dion to tell them who their candidate would be says a great deal about what the Liberal Party has become. The concept of parachuting in “star” candidates and appointing rather than nominating or electing candidates is anti-democratic. It reveals how undemocratic the internal workings of the party really are.
Whatever method the hierarchy uses to control choice down the line it is still undemocratic. Those candidates leaving the party in a huff reveals just how much they expect the kind of special treatment that Chretien and Martin extended to what the media see as “stars.”
Garth,
there is something about your response to Kyle’s 10:25 last night that bothers me.
If the “old, mainline parties” were opposed to MMP, do you think it ever would have seen the light of day in Ontario? The provincial government assembled the Citizen’s Assembly, blessed its members, paid for it, provided material and experts for its deliberations, and no doubt could have steered it.
If the results were not to the government’s liking, the assembly would have been sabotaged, or the results shelved in the bowels of bureaucracy, where many interesting studies and reports have come to rest.
See how sceptical an experienced Canadian voter can become? Wasn’t born that way.
By Harry S on 10.03.07 8:16 am
If you really care Harry, you can e mail him at Halton region anytime, I am sure he would gladly respond.
Tip: If they are filming your retirement tribute, never let them manouvre you so that the garbage bins show in the background.
(Bad optics – great symbolism)
Ya – where are Harper’s bobbleheads these days other than planning to “buy us”. We’ve got the border guard situation and what does Doris Day say? He’s concerned. We’ve got American illegals pouring into Windsor – where is Monte Solberg? Windsor is already having its woes and Solberg’s done nothing.
Why isn’t Flaherty helping municipalities instead of laughing at them?
Crime package – Harper’s following the US and now Ted Koppel is doing a special on the US prison system in crisis – i.e. a prison in California has the capacity for 100,000 people and are overloaded with 175,000 people and the conditions are deplorable. Why? Because they have no anger management, rehab plans at all and the prisoners get out and do the same thing over again. Koppel says that politicians that want to re-educate, rehab, etc. don’t get voted in. I see what’s coming for Canada now – frightening indeed.
A little more attention to what is and what is not happening under Harper instead of silly insider nonsense would seem to me to be more important – but na, we have to act like (MSM) reportings overload of Britney Spears.
Sigh….
Go for it run on your team not just the leader. The conservatives are out of touch Harper won’t even let them talk to their constituents. They have no idea the anger out there. Their pitiful 750 million tax cut equals $35 per person per year that’s not enough to fill their cars. I know it’s not usually done on the throne speech but these are unusual times just get on with the election after your shadow cabinet shuffle but make sure it’s a good team because the conservatives are running on Harper only and his head is too big. The big head and the seven dwarfs is a picture that comes to mind or the three monkeys see no evil hear no evil and speak no evil. That’s Harper and his caucus!
Why aren’t election dates fixed…
By Dan on 10.03.07 7:54 am
Parliament passed fixed election dates legislation in the last session. The next election will be October 2009.
However the government always has to have the “confidence of the House” The opposition can vote no confidence in teh Government essentially any time they want to.
All the election speculation at the moment is based on the Liberals (along with teh two other opposition parties) bringing the government down.
Harper and his gang cannot do it – It is solely in the hands of the opposition.
David
Obviously, there are many opinionated and strong headed people in the Liberal party. However, what is needed is one strong head. Mr. Carroll has shown himself to be a gimme person. I was told that “gimme, gimme never gets. Sow a habit and reap a character. The only thing he should get is a swift kick in the rear end and let him sue.
Liberal insiders should know that if they don’t hang together they will surely hang seperately.
Garth, who did 2006 Liberal candidate Gary Carr in Halton support as Liberal leader at the Montreal convention?
Also who did the Halton Liberal members support? Was it Ignatieff??
Who cares? — Garth
By Harry S on 10.03.07 8:16 am
===============================================
I think you should care Garth, because you are now the Dion-annointed Liberal candidate for Halton, and you should know how the Halton Liberals voted in the Montreal leadership convention.
Care to inform us ??
Who cares? BTW, I was annointed by the members, not the leader. — Garth
How can you say that with a straight face? That has been your complete and total focus for a year. Screw all things CPC…either you have become a pathological liar or you believe your disciples are all idiots….
- John G
Hush, as a CONservative and Oh Mighty Lord Harper supporter, remember that you are officially muzzled and are not allowed to voice any opinion, since you do not have any. Just repeat the same old party line!
So SLG,
regarding your comments about how frightened you are of what we are getting from the United States, does that also include lower taxes, MRI’s on the same day as they are ordered, almost non existent wait times, national pride, stuff like that, or is it just the bad stuff we are getting.
If your party cannot even manage its internal affairs, what gives me any confidence you can run a government??? Dion is a disaster and the sooner he resigns the sooner Liberal fortunes will improve. Vote against the throne speech and put this loser out of his misery.
Don’t confuse media noise with reality. I am sure Dion was chosen by the grassroots members of the party, rather than its power brokers, for a good reason. — Garth
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 10.03.07 7:28 am
Speaking of ‘Ham and eggs’…Listening to political promises is like the story of the Chicken and the Pig.
There they were walking along, when the Chicken sees a big sign that says ‘Ham & Egg Charity Breakfast-Donations Welcome’
The Chicken says ‘Hey, let’s go make a donation?’
The Pig replies ‘For you its a donation, but for me it’s a total commitment!’
Pretty much describes the ‘If elected…we will spend…over the next 5 to 10 years.’ No real commitment!
Harper and his gang cannot do it – It is solely in the hands of the opposition.
David
By David on 10.03.07 9:59 am
Of course Harper can do it….he can make the Throne Speech so unpalatable that he knows it will be defeated. Therefore, Steve will have orchestrated his own defeat and this is just what he’s DROOLING over. I say to M. Dion, “Let the New Government of Canada swing in the wind for 6 more months and then take them to task on Liberal terms.”
“The Cons haven’t broken 40%”
Hah… check you history, it’s been a while since the Liberals won a majority with 40%.
By Kerry B on 10.03.07 10:08 am
Ever lived there? I am from the Great and Benevolent U.S. Try telling those of us who know all about how great American healthcare is?
Go, sit down, and make this choice if you are not covered by some corporate insurance plan…’Do I want to live or file bankruptcy?’
Our OHIP works very well. Medical care is not a McDonald’s Drive Thru. It takes coordination and timing.
Can it be improved? Yes! Would I trade it for the American way? Absolutely NOT! Been there, done that.
Perhaps if people ceased wasting doctors time with minor cuts, bruises, and sniffles, and started thinking a little bit, there would not be overloads.
We have a very good system, and like all systems, there will always be room for improvement.
Separating the system into a Two-Tier’ system is NOT the answer. getting rid of over paid Administrators is the real answer.
Let the practioners get the pay they deserve, not some paper pusher feeding the mindless bureacracy of other paper pushing non-productive politicos.
Get the PACS system as mandatory for all OHIP providers.
Liberal insiders should know that if they don’t hang together they will surely hang seperately.
By Michael on 10.03.07 10:04 am
An American principle to be sure. LOL And a very sound one.
Bill,
I didn’t say I wanted two tier (btw, its already here), I said the good part of their health care. Ours works fine in part, but if we can cherry pick the parts that are working good in other countries, and find a way to make it work in Canada, great. But that wasn’t the point of my post, I was trying to put alittle moderation into the post regarding the big, bad boogeyman living just south of our border.
Careful what you wish for. They have a small legion of simpering droolers just waiting in anticipation of Der FuutSchtool’s call to tell them their script [grocery list] has been okayed.
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 10.03.07 7:47 am
Nice wording you have, do you always compare conservatives to Nazis? I thank God that you’re the extreme and most people aren’t like you.
Sheesh, Mr. Turner. When are Canadians going to get all these good things the US has got? It can’t be that we’re already part of their declaired Axis of Evil, can it? Would David Frum to that to us?
1. Invoke a terrifying internal and external enemy
2. Create a gulag
3. Develop a thug caste
4. Set up an internal surveillance system
5. Harass citizens’ groups
6. Engage in arbitrary detention and release
7. Target key individuals
8. Control the press
9. Dissent equals treason***
10. Suspend the rule of law
*** See Cindy Sheehan and her protest of the Iraq war and her attempt to memorialize her son, Casey.
Who cares? — Garth
Garth;
What is your problem? Obviously, the person who posed the question cares or else the question wouldn’t have been asked.
Maybe you should change your reponse to “I don’t care” or “I can’t be bothered”.
“I think voters want politicians to work on their problems, instead of constantly trying to screw each other. Just a hunch. I think Jamie’d agree.â€
better each other than us
By got rope? on 10.02.07 10:30 pm
Rope, I normally don’t agree with you but that is a post I do appreciate.
Leasa
Have you lost your job yet?
STOP BUYING FOREIGN!
By Leasa on 10.03.07 8:04 am
Ok Lease, first off I hope you don’t buy your cheap discount made in China crap at Walmart. If that is the case, then sadly enough you are a poster child of hypocracy. I would buy more Canadian, hell North American, made goods if the quality was going to last longer than Chinese made junk. I recall a documentary on the CBC about how Japan overtook North America and it was based on quality. You can have the best service staff available and the cheapest costs of replacement parts and labour but I don’t want to buy something of inferior quality. So, if GM, Chrysler and Ford were smart, which I really don’t think they are, they would be in much better shape with their vehicles IF they put quality parts into them.
While I am deeply sorry for the poor buggers that were working at GM or soon enough will not be, it is difficult to be too sympathetic when the idiots at the top can’t realize what it takes that the public wants and they can’t deliver.
For the record, my wife shops on occasion at Walmart and it will be a cold day in hell before I step in any store or vote for Harper and his cronies.
And now from the Rat Pack.
http://www.torontosun.com/News/Columnists/Copps_Sheila/2007/10/03/4545774.php
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, usually it’s a duck!
I amused watching Judy et al, including Garth’s, futile attempts to spin the Jamie Carrol story as not damaging to their illustious leader.
(Alfred E. Neuman- “what Me Worry”? Now finally, Mr. Turner gets some insight into the value of public loyalty to a political leader. His public attempts to damage his previous leader is very analogous to what is happening to the LPC today- good on him.
Lewis
PS Does Garth still practise censorship on his blog, we will soon see. By for now Garth.
There’s always a place here for historical revisionists. — Garth
Hey y’all, come on over for some turkey and catch a ball game.
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=0821a06b-a34d-4e76-aaf9-b3015c1a37bb&k=66020
Kerry B: And how many American families do not have the $700. monthly to cover insurance?
Did you figure that into your “lower taxes” statement?
And did you also remember to point out that their is line jumping in the U.S. based on wealth, not need?
Garth,
A few months ago when your bloggers were clamoring for some substance I suggested pollution would have more voters appeal than Kyoto. About a week later the Conservatives jumped on the pollution band wagon and now UBC has released a report that they say shows pollution kills 25,000 Cdns a year.
Perhaps the Libs ignored it because it`s hard to find something to bash the opposition into losing, Perhaps there was another reason but ignoring real situations while expending all your time and energy on bashing the opposition doesn`t have the same impact on the voter.
Here`s another, sole custody. The Conservatives have always be at the ready to take this on and as more Cdns become concerned about youth crime rates, the causes, the root of crime, the Libs could be setting themselves up for a bashing if they don`t get on the childs rights train.
Just a thought, I`m pulling for ya, at least a minority.
Perhaps if people ceased wasting doctors time with minor cuts, bruises, and sniffles, and started thinking a little bit, there would not be overloads.
It’s all well and good to criticize the American system, and I think the fact that everyone in Canada effectively does have health ‘insurance’.
What bothers me, is that under certain circumstances, it is the US system that is our emergency fallback. If our system fails to accomodate a patient, for whatever reason, our healthcare system avails itself of the US resources to cover the gap. I believe that there was a recent multiple birth case where no resources were available in Canada, so the patient was sent to the US.
As far as wasting resources is concerned, I have always believed that the patient should receive a statement of what the treatment actually cost. There is a huge disconnect between the patient and the medical system: we don’t know how much it cost to have that bruise looked at.
Perhaps, if we knew that that consultation was $XXXX, we’d think twice before doing it.
Rope, I normally don’t agree with you but that is a post I do appreciate.
Leasa
Don`t let your personal experience block out the bigger picture. I could send you a ton of testimonials much like yours with the gender reversed. Here`s a couple of pages just to let you know you`re not alone, we`re all in this together.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/1/story.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10396934
Where only one partner in a relationship is violent, it is more likely to be the woman, University of Otago researchers have found.
http://pubpages.unh.edu/~mas2/ID16.pdf
I agree too. Stop washing dirty linen in public, when it isn’t even soiled,
Grassroots Canadians, pal. I talk to everyone. — Garth
By Chris on 10.03.07 8:59 am
And most likely former cons who got conned by neocons flip flop promises.
By Kerry B on 10.03.07 10:31 am
I agree, and the Greens believe ‘A good idea is a good idea, regardless of where it comes from!’ So do I.
The problem is the little minded egos of some who always are more interested in their personal turf than society as a whole.
The doctors want to give their patients the very best care, but fight the failures of facilities due to poor management, and the medical community elite who refuse to relenquish things like Nurse Practitioners, etc. They are finally getting modernized, but way too slowly.
The major Regional health Centres are too few, and too far away for most of rural Ontario. The GTA ones are swamped with too many patients.
I just went through the experience by having to drive all the way to Peterborough for a test, and doing it twice because the first time the equipment was broken. Then down to Newmarket for another consult.
Thanks to McSquinty removing the Muskoka from Northern status, I cannot even claim travel allowance. Then we have the local in hospital labs being threatened with closures and tests being sent way south. Some tests, like the cardiac enzyme present during a heart attack cannot wait for such times. Decisions must be made within a narrow window of 15 to 60 minutes in order to administrer the Clot Buster meds which save lives, as well as minds from strokes..
Yet, the administrator, who makes about $150,000 a year, cannot find the money to pay for the lab techs, which would cost…Miraculously…$150,000 a year. They can find money for fancy new offices, but not staff.
I can find the money in a heartbeat…Fire the friggin’ administrator. LOL We need people who do the work, not paper pushers. Stop building monuments to bureaucrats and politicians, and spend the money on treating people.
But then, I use my mind for real things like finding solutions.
If the doctors and nurses had their way, everyone would be on a healthcare plan. Such a plan is never free, but it should not be dealt out based on people’s work, employment, or any other factor than they are human beings. That is what medicine is about.
We can say that this is only a local issue that does not concern us, but any issue that affects Stephane Dion affects the entire Liberal Party of Canada, and that affects of us us. Reality is inter-connected between the whole and its parts. Let’s face reality here.
Stephane must act to shake things up in the LPC. He must act decisively, and he must act now. He must show the partyn who the leader is, and the direction that he is going.
He must then act like a real leader, and bring the government down, and then give Canadians a real and a clear choice.
Those who do not support Dion’s leadership should get on the other side of the fence, and vote for the ultra-left NDP.
Now we have a candidate who was set to run for the Liberal party who called The Canadian Press without any prompting – saying he was asked to do so by a well-known Liberal – and announced he was no longer interested.
Paul Leduc, a three-term mayor of a large Montreal suburb, says that he’s changed his mind about running for the Liberals and that one of the party’s household names provided him with phone numbers for journalists and urged him to go public with his story.
The former Brossard mayor had been endorsed in April by the Liberals’ provincial election commission to run without a contested nomination – but he said Dion kept him cooling his heels all summer.
Now we have the Marc Garneau situation, a star candidate who is also has decided not to run. This thing is snowballing and getting out of control.
Where will it stop? When will it end? When will we say “enough is enough” rather than to pretend that this is a local matter only. Dion must lead, and act decisively and assertively, and soon.
Many people are watching and waiting. They are looking for leadership.
Perhaps if people ceased wasting doctors time with minor cuts, bruises, and sniffles, and started thinking a little bit, there would not be overloads.
It’s all well and good to criticize the American system, and I think the fact that everyone in Canada effectively does have health ‘insurance’.
What bothers me, is that under certain circumstances, it is the US system that is our emergency fallback. If our system fails to accomodate a patient, for whatever reason, our healthcare system avails itself of the US resources to cover the gap. I believe that there was a recent multiple birth case where no resources were available in Canada, so the patient was sent to the US.
As far as wasting resources is concerned, I have always believed that the patient should receive a statement of what the treatment actually cost. There is a huge disconnect between the patient and the medical system: we don’t know how much it cost to have that bruise looked at.
Perhaps, if we knew that that consultation was $XXXX, we’d think twice before doing it.
By Ed Brooks on 10.03.07 11:56 am
Don’t really thing they would Ed. We’re paying taxes for the service – some have to use it & some don’t. Long gone are the days that a Dr. would do a house call. (much cheaper) but Drs, I realize, have a life too. Now many are forced to go to ER (much more expensive) because Canada doesn’t have enough Drs available and the CMA & gov’t aren’t progressive enough to put in an adequate program to get Drs from elsewhere Cdn accredition. (Many people can’t find a family Dr.).
I think US TV influence on Canadians over the last 20 yrs has caused much of the rush to visit a Dr. with a sniffle, bruise, etc. And, I might add, so has the Cdn media in the last 10 yrs., maybe more. There’s hardly a day goes by that there isn’t something in our media about ‘if you have this symptom, you should check it out with your Dr.’.
Personally, I would never change the Cdn system for an American one, even if we might have to wait longer to get treatment. Seems to me that now 40 million US citizens have no universal health care. Believe the only country in the G7 or 8 without one.
Although France supposedly has the best, it has gone too far I think. My PIL have a literally a pharmacie. Think they are the most medicated of the G7. Big business!! everywhere.
Thanks to McSquinty removing the Muskoka from Northern status, I cannot even claim travel allowance. Then we have the local in hospital labs being threatened with closures and tests being sent way south. Some tests, like the cardiac enzyme present during a heart attack cannot wait for such times. Decisions must be made within a narrow window of 15 to 60 minutes in order to administrer the Clot Buster meds which save lives, as well as minds from strokes..
Sorry Bill to hear about that. Hope you are a OK.
But, I thought paramedics could administer the clot buster drug. If not, could they not learn to do it. Recall my BIL talking about that many years ago when he had his 1st heart attack.
We too have problems with medical treatment in rural areas. Hence my BIL’s desire to stay in Halifax. BTW he’s had a triple or quadruple bypass.
Hope all eventually turned out OK.
Tho I don’t need hip surgery yet, I’ve been fortunate in getting immediate medical attention for cancer – surgery and chemo. And, when I hear tomorrow or Friday from my Onc (who has cared for me & several others I know – is fabulous BTW) I believe I shall receive the same care as before. My DH calls her the Energizer Bunny – she literally runs down the hall way to see her patients. Her onc nurse (a neighbour) thinks the world of her too, saying she’ll do anything within her power to see that patients recieve the latest and best treatment possible. And, that too gives me confidence.
STOP BUYING FOREIGN!
By Leasa on 10.03.07 8:04 am
NO NEED! THEY,RE BUYING US!
I think you should care Garth, because you are now the Dion-annointed Liberal candidate for Halton, and you should know how the Halton Liberals voted in the Montreal leadership convention.
Care to inform us ??
Who cares? BTW, I was annointed by the members, not the leader. — Garth
By Harry S on 10.03.07 10:04 am
==============================================
Simple question for you Garth. Who did the Halton Liberal members vote for in the first round in the Montreal leadership convention?
Surely you are aware of that significant political position of Halton Liberals.
Garth wrote;
than its power brokers, for a good
I don’t think this is about Jamie Carroll at all but rather about Dion’s Leadership in Quebec.
First Dion’s persanl hand picked candidate gets beat in a by election.
Secondly, The Liberals get trounced in the other two ridings.
Thirdly, Now Jamie boy is being forced out just a week after Dion gave him his support and said he was going any where.
Fourthly. Dion is shaking up his inner power brokers and and changing his shadow cabinet.
Yes, everything is Ok with the Liberal party. Sorry I don’t think so.
Surely you are aware of that significant political position of Halton Liberals.
By Harry S on 10.03.07 2:08 pm
Why don’t you ask these significant others you are refering to?
Of course Harper can do it….he can make the Throne Speech so unpalatable that he knows it will be defeated.
Nice try, but that would make the CPC look stupid and PMSH & Co will have hung himslves, then they would have to flip flop once again, going from the frying pan into the fire>
So many do not think, Halton County is not behind Gartth Turner, O/K I bite, tell us who the CPC canidate is and his chances of winning…go for it>
On a side note the local Conservative guy lost, NDP win, then he said you will be sorry because a NDPer can not do anything for you, this from a man who refused to associate himself with Rodney or Stevie boy….what a losser, sounds like sour grapes to me.
By Harry S on 10.03.07 2:08 pm
Simple Question Harry, why do you need to know? Are you supporting the Liberal candidate?
By Bill-Muskoka on 10.03.07 10:21 am
http://www.nchc.org/facts/coverage.shtml
If’n you[z]e wants her, you must make a BID WITH A HEAVY EMPHASIS ON CASH.
You know, Bill, when I was in the 82nd. I never tumbled to the fact that my treatment in a military hospital cost anything. It did, of course, but it was not even on the radar then. HMO’s and the administrative overburden, and denial of service is a travesty. ”Sure, you’re dying, but we all die, don’t we?”
Meanwhile, NUMBNUTS CLEMENT is devoting himself to denying needles to drug addicts … ‘cos that’s the PMSH gooberment approach to getting tough on crime.
Folks, maybe no one knows who this Jaime dude is and maybe no one cares. That isn’t the issue.
The issue is simply Dion has no control over the Quebec wing as well as Iggy and his people and Rae and his people and on and on.
What does that mean to Joe or Jill Canadian. On the surface, nothing. On the campaign trail it means everything. It means the liberal infrastructure is crumbling and will not have the ground troops to organize and campaign effectively. It means the well oiled, well funded, well organized conservative machine will take Quebec as the bloc becomes more irrelevant. It means enough seats to form a majority. It means for those who have experienced the decades of liberal nepotism, patronage, partisanship, central Canada control will be free for at least 4 years. It means the provinces will regain at least some of the constitutionally granted control over their affairs that the liberals have stripped from them.
It means the beginning of the restoration of Canada.
The Harper doctrine of rampant decentralization and shifting of powers to the provinces will hardly lead to a “restoration” of our country but to a balkanization, ultimately rendering us all weaker. The destruction of this nation-state is something I will oppose endlessly. You are the enemy. — Garth
By KPN on 10.03.07 1:24 pm
My experience has been, with one exception, and I chalk that up to the doctor’s old age and probably past the time to rest, is that Canadian’s are in medicine because they truly care.
Same for most in the U.S., but I can vidily recall listening to doctors and dentists yak away about their bloody portfolios. Too much focus on MONEY in too much of the U.S. medical profesion. They have no guaranteed income, so it becomes highly competetitive. Those who really care tend to end up in government hospitals treating the least fortunate of society.
I almost went into medicine myself, but decided to stay in the engineering field instead. I did experience what it is like through an excellent program, and got to work in all areas of a major hospital. That will really change one’s view of medicine fast! The pressures are extreme for many, and they simply burn out going through internships and residencies. But, those requirements are still vital to proper clinical experience. The last thing you want a surgeon to say is ‘Oops!’
As to Paramedics adminitering the clotbusters. Yes, some can. but only after a doctor certifies it is okay. There are many parametres involved, and the newest one, guaranteed to give to the Extreme Clot Buster Drono treatment is a once in a lifetime use.
Oxygen and Nitro spray remain the standard first approach, as far as i know. They have two others that have been thorugh massive testing, and I think it is TPA that won out for the Paramedics. Been there, and done that. No fun whatsoever.
We have a dear friend who went through breast cancer, a partial mastectomy, chemo and radiation treatment. The care she got was nothing short of fantastic, and she is clean.
Her poor husband was in Afghanistan with our CF, and unable to get back in time for her operation, primarily due to a mandatory three day decompression period for all returning troops. They have been through Hell this year, but the doctors and nurses cured her. He will need a little more R&R to re-coup from the trauma of combat, cancer, and frustration, but he has made most of journey now. Having friends that care, talk with empathy, but sincerity, made all the difference.
I am doing okay, but still waiting to see what exactly can rationally be done. Feeling good now after several new meds, but the problem remains. I was extremely thankful for the excellent care I received. The bedside manner of all was exceptional, and that makes a huge difference when there is good and honest communication between the staff and patient.
They are Tops in my book!
Being self-employed, had I been in the U.S. without coverage I would either be dead or insolvent for the rest of my life, if I even survived. That is not a choice anyone should ever have placed on them in a time of critical need. Yet, the U.S. still dithers around the issue, and can always find BILLIONS to waste on War. That is as insane as it gets, and they have mastered it for decades.
Even a farmer keeps his herd or flock healthy. One would think the U.S. government would at least consider the profitability of keeping the taxpayer base the same? Maybe, they just need more Vets, eh?
Nearly 82 million people – about one-third of the population below the age of 65 spent a portion of either 2002 or 2003 without health coverage (3).
Who was it, on this board, who suggested the US system was a full 2-tier? What tier do you fit into when you don’t have health coverage? The 3rd.
tier? Ya, he’s here, ER stack 14-7. We move the most critical to the top of the stack, ‘cos we know we probably won’t get to them in time. Eighteen months ago the US national debt was 57 trillion … not including unfunded medical liabilities. Is that what Canada should have for a 2-tier system?
Thank Prime MInister Stephen Harper and Health Minister Tony Clement for their ‘’spin.”
By KPN on 10.03.07 1:02 pm
In the U.S. they have the Fear du jour. If there is not something new in the news that will kill you, then just wait. There are so many ‘paid for’ studies, that the validity of most are highly questionable.
Funny how the announcements coincide with the newest drug some company has ‘discovered.’
Then there are those who lack attention and thrive over having a medical problem.
Take CAD (Coronary Artery Disease) which has brought forth all kinds of new diet based food products. Then the anti-smoking, anti-drinking, anti everything marketeers. The current cul-prit du jour are transfats, the need for Omega-3 this and that, avoid this and that. I wonder how the heck we ever survived all these millienia?
The bottom line is that the major causes of CAD are genetics and stress. The society is so dysfunctional, and so stressed out, but God forbid that should be mentioned because then the labour force would revolt. Human beings were never intended to live 24/7 on adrenalin, which is there for emergencies only. But they do, and it restricts the cardiovascular system. Some studies are finding it also interacts with cholestrol to cause it to settle out which form the blockages.
No one really wants to address that issue, because it woud mean people telling their arsehole bosses to shove it, walk off the high stress job, and live a normal life.
In short our society is killing itself with all the materialism and competition for prestige and power. Not to mention commutes on a daily basis, rushing from one activity to another, etc. Some would call them Fools!
Have a good day.
Hypochondriacs are a major part of medical overburden for all doctors. They can even manifest psychosomatic symptomologies which mimic the disease du jour.
We need more Dr. House’s I think?
Garth who?
I threw the pollution idea at you and the Conservatives picked it up a week later now UBC says it`s killing 25,000 Cdns/year.
I`ve read all the comments on how the Libs won`t expose their plan on almost everything until the writ is dropped.
Smilin Jack has no problem tossing out ides and if the gov picks up on them he says, `the NDP forced them to act`.
To be truthful Garth I don`t buy the Libs excuse. It appears more to bashing the opposition into losing than being the opposition. Bitching without a solution is only bitching. It has never stuck me as the LPC having a shortfall in vision so where are you hiding it???
Here`s a little vote getter for the LPC.
Today marks the 19 anniversary of the unification of Germany. Tap your foreign affairs critic and suggest that N and S Korea put a unification plan together for a years time.
Be quite the global party with a 20 year anniversary and a wedding.
Can`t imagine any better press for N Korea joining the global community and if it looks really good perhaps world leaders might want to declare it a global holiday so we all can reflect on war and isolationism.
‘cos that’s the PMSH gooberment approach to getting tough on crime.
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 10.03.07 3:04 pm
Yes, they want to get tough on all crime, but their own of course!
It is far rmore important to arrest, convict, and imprison someone for stealing food or smoking Wacky Weed, than millions from investors. Lots less paperwork too, which I am sure Harper sees as a ‘green’ policy saving trees.
Remember the three biggest oxymorons on earth are:
1. Governmental budget
2. Military Intelligence
and the classic
3. Legal brief
Have a great afternoon
Re: comments by Ike on 10.03.07 12:39 pm
Looks to me as if the Liberal Party is far too centralized. As someone who comes from the PC tradition where the federal and provincial parties are administered separately the idea of a provincial party dictating the federal candidate is strange. Especially in places such as Quebec and BC where the provincial party is full of Conservatives.
I will continue to reinterate that Dion needs to do is give back some elements of democractic choice to the riding associations and the rank and file of the party. He should have done this months ago. Locally contested ridings tend to reinvigorate a party.
The Harper doctrine of rampant decentralization and shifting of powers to the provinces will hardly lead to a “restoration†of our country but to a balkanization, ultimately rendering us all weaker. The destruction of this nation-state is something I will oppose endlessly. You are the enemy. — Garth
By Jim on 10.03.07 3:13 pm
Jim is the enemy because he supports constructional rights?
Restoring the provincial constitutional rights is a destructive force?
Upholding the constitution is balkanization?
The constitutional foundation gives us the rule of law based on common law before the Charter cancelled democracy.
Have to agree with you Garth, no point in upholding the constitution when a handful of lawyers decide what our constitutional rights freedoms are.
btw isn`t that the opposite of balkanization?
Marxism is alive and well in Canada.
Canada does not have a constitution. — Garth
On a side note the local Conservative guy lost, NDP win, then he said you will be sorry because a NDPer can not do anything for you, this from a man who refused to associate himself with Rodney or Stevie boy….what a losser, sounds like sour grapes to me.
By David Bakody on 10.03.07 2:47 pm
This candidate made several fatal errors. The first was that he did associate himself too closely to the federal Conservatives by listening to Peter MacKay rather than his provincial colleagues. Rodney had to counter in the media some of the claims he made about the feds.
The second error was the one you mentioned because what he said goes against party policy and he said it before election not just after.
Both of these were serious mistakes.
That being said he certainly cut into the NDP majority.
Canada does not have a constitution. — Garth
By got rope? on 10.03.07 3:53 pm
Then I don`t know what it`s called but it contains such things as who can legally collect direct tax or excise tax etc.
It formed the basis of confederation, the reasons the provinces joined and it sure as hell wasn`t to let Ottawa dictate.
The sorcerer’s apprentice and Canada’s New Improv Government
I have some bad news for our new Apprentice Industry Minister as he attempts to deal with the consequences of his sorcerer’s income trust policy to raid seniors’ nest eggs. The news is this: The horse has left the barn as it pertains to Abu Dhabi Energy. You have two choices facing you, both of which will result in political egg on your face
Choice #1. Allow the $5 billion Abu Dhabi purchase of Prime West Energy to proceed thereby revealing in true technicolour the absurdity of your income trust policy whose only policy outcomes are the loss of $7.5 billion in annual taxes, the loss of $35 billion in Canadian retirement savings and major league hollowing out, or
Choice #2. Disallow the Abu Dhabi purchase of Prime West Energy. Believe it or not this may be the less desirable policy choice as the hypocrisy and sleepy nature of your government will also be revealed in technicolour by such a miscalculated move. Why the sudden concern with Abu Dhabi? Why no concern from Canada’s New Improv Government over Abu Dhabi’s $2 billion purchase five months of Canadian energy company (Northrock) from US based Pogo? We all know this asset would have normally been sold via an income trust IPO but that isn’t the point. The point of hypocrisy is this. Why are Canadian investors being denied the very sale alternative that was freely available to a US company, Pogo? Why are you again flailing Canadian investors? You had no problem with Northrock’s purchase by Abu Dhabi a mere five months ago. Same size. Same industry. Same government. Same buyer. What gives? Are you really serious about this improv policy on the fly? How much thought has really gone into it? Have you even evaluated the consequences. Do you actually know what you’re doing?
Either way, we anxiously await your improvisational policy response that no doubt will be wholly based on doing what’s best for your party’s politically tenuous future.
PS. I wouldn’t recommend using the words “in the national security†to be the basis for how you will arbitrarily and whimsically determine which acquisitions will or will not proceed. It’s far too reminiscent of the reasons invoked by your sorcerer when he refused to release the analysis behind tax leakage and told Canadian who lost $35 billion that they would have to be satisfied with 18 pages of redacted nonsense in the name of “national securityâ€. What utter nonsense, both then, now and in the future. Your government has proven that it can’t be trusted with administering such loose concepts
More like ” This government would love to stay the way it is”
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20071003/harper_071003/20071003?hub=TopStories
Canada does not have a constitution. — Garth
Garth – I know you are under a lot of stress these days (i.e. your rudderless leader), however, you of all people should know that Canada indeed has a constitution act!
http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/Const/index.html
You may get re-acquainted with the follow section:
52. (1) The Constitution of Canada is the supreme law of Canada, and any law that is inconsistent with the provisions of the Constitution is, to the extent of the inconsistency, of no force or effect.
http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/Const/annex_e.html#VI
Canada does not have a constitution. — Garth
By got rope? on 10.03.07 3:53 pm
Well you`ve really got me riled Garth so I`m really wishing for at least a Lib minority in the next election.
Here`s a few tid bits. The federal government does not have the legal right to collect a direct tax, that is the right of the provinces only under the terms of confederation. The federal government only has the right to collect certain indirect taxes such as excise. You`ll not on cigarettes in BC it says excise paid even thought there made here in Canada and never crossed a border. You`ll not in cases were smuggling occurred between provinces the charge is related to the excise tax. A good defense includes the fact that they never left the country so no excise tax is due and charges are usually dropped. That`s defrauding the province out of its right to collect the direct tax falsely labeled excise tax.
Then we have GST, another direct tax collected by the feds. Income tax is interesting. When I first brought up income tax was provincial jurisdiction Premier Campbell said ” We asked the federal government to collect it” Hey no problem with the feds collecting it, they just can`t keep it. They should expect a fair percentage to cover the costs but keeping it,,, It`s illegal.
What does all this mean? The premiers can simply give Ottawa a letter of intent to separate on the grounds the rules of confederation have been broken, wait, shattered by the federal government and were outta here. I suggest a very public forum for the west to analyze the future of Canada under the current unreformable system and then have a referendum.
The west wants change, very big change and reform still stands proud.
By got rope? on 10.03.07 4:53 pm
These continuing threats of western separation are really silly, how many folks are advocating separation? I have always maintained if the majority of people of any province want to go…I say have a good time. Quite frankly, I don’t think the majority of Canadians in any province want separation, I think they would like to stick it out and work it out. But dream on!
Ok Lease, first off I hope you don’t buy your cheap discount made in China crap at Walmart. If that is the case, then sadly enough you are a poster child of hypocracy. I would buy more Canadian, hell North American, made goods if the quality was going to last longer than Chinese made junk. I recall a documentary on the CBC about how Japan overtook North America and it was based on quality. You can have the best service staff available and the cheapest costs of replacement parts and labour but I don’t want to buy something of inferior quality. So, if GM, Chrysler and Ford were smart, which I really don’t think they are, they would be in much better shape with their vehicles IF they put quality parts into them.
While I am deeply sorry for the poor buggers that were working at GM or soon enough will not be, it is difficult to be too sympathetic when the idiots at the top can’t realize what it takes that the public wants and they can’t deliver.
By Steve on 10.03.07 11:04 am
I’d buy N.A. cars too Steve if the quality was there. Unfortunately, it hasn’t. Got talked into buying a Horizon once because it was a German engine in a N.A. car. What a fiasco that was. It was my 1st & last non-Japanese car(Honda, Toyota & a Mitsubishi) & that goes for my DH also. We now buy slightly used ones – save those large depreciation costs once you drive off the lot with a new one – and are pleased with them. Neighbours bought 2 new Japanese ones this year as well, fed up with their N.A. ones.
By got rope? on 10.03.07 4:53 pm
These continuing threats of western separation are really silly, how many folks are advocating separation? I have always maintained if the majority of people of any province want to go…I say have a good time. Quite frankly, I don’t think the majority of Canadians in any province want separation, I think they would like to stick it out and work it out. But dream on!
By pjw on 10.03.07 5:01 pm
OK now you`re being silly, just because the reform turned alliance then joined the pc to become conservative doesn`t mean the grassroots reformers have gone anywhere.
We`re still here, we still demand reform or else.
“stick it out and work it out”
Perhaps you`d be so kind as to point out what the federal government has done right over the last forty years, you know what I mean, give them something to stick it out for. Don`t feel silly just because you`re stumped, I`ve asked the question on this blog several times without anyone remembering a single thing that worked as promised.
Garth wrote;
>The Harper doctrine of rampant >decentralization and shifting of powers >to the provinces will hardly lead to a >“restoration†of our country but to a >balkanization, ultimately rendering us >all weaker.
What a crock. What Harper is doing is giving back to the Provinces which is their under the constitution.
“stick it out and work it outâ€
pjw on 10.03.07 5:01 pm
I doubt if you`ll come up with anything to convince us to stick it out.
Here`s what we`ll be sticking it out for.
Over the next generation, health care costs will quadruple leaving virtually no money for infrastructure and not enough for education and our prised and envied social programs. Seniors will outnumber our youth. This youth minority will also have to deal with an ever increases youth crime rate and child poverty. Immense transportation problems and probably the biggest issue that scuttles any hope of success for the next generation, the complete collapse of investor confidence in Canada that started in 2002. Got some oil, copper or iron hey good for us but it won`t be near enough for the next generation to overcome just the obstacles I`ve outlined.
Garth won`t even address the economic consiqunces of losing international investor confidense let alone the root causes so forget about working it out. Not very much to stick it out for is there?
You stick it out if you want but under our current system you`re only sentencing future generations to, who knows what! Me I`ll support reform or separation, whichever comes first.
By pjw on 10.03.07 5:01 pm
There in his basement, that is all he hears, from the Big Three ‘Me, Myself, and I’. Were he in Penetanguishene Institution, he would be seeing his meds increased.
By got rope? on 10.03.07 5:23 pm
Well it appears you have the government you wanted in Ottawa for one…even though they sold you down the river, it was what you wanted at the time. The NEP was scraped after you yelled like hell. Just because the federal parties have raped their constituents doesn’t provide a good reason for 10 separate counties to appear. Maybe it might be an idea to form a government by some other means, as you have suggested from time to time by appointed members from the provinces. Looking backwards is an exercise in futility, looking forward would do us all a better service. But having 308 members is about 290 more than we need. So I say, stick it out, work for the end of the party system and a truly accountable and transparent federal government, then maybe we can attack the provincial governments in the same way. What we have now doesn’t work for naybody but separating is silly. It solves nothing.
What we have now doesn’t work for naybody but separating is silly. It solves nothing.
By pjw on 10.03.07 5:55 pm
If you recall my suggestion of an alternate form of federal governance then perhaps you might also remember my comments on international investors and what the feds mean when they say `we have strong economic fundamentals`.
It means government has a ton on money from resource revenues. That`s it, that`s all. Consumers are broke, over taxed, over saved and over mortgaged. As stated one burp in the globally priced commodity prices and the average Cdn is done. If you`ve looked over the list I think you`ll have too agree, we take a commodity price hit soon or the next generation collapses under the weight of `sticking it out`.
We need massive change and we need it now. The decades of bashing the opposition or waiting for the economy to collapse to oust the government is over.
Reforms still here and standing proud.
btw if you plan on sticking it out under the current system, cash is good.
By Catherine on 10.03.07 4:37 pm
Sorry, but that is called The British North American Act of 1867. Garth is still correct. The document may have been given a name change, but it granted the right of dominion to Canada from British rule.
It is an Act, not a Consitution per se.
LOL, Rope wants to turn Canada into a mini-United Nations or maybe it is something like Paul Martin’s concept for a G-20.
Right wingers want the control government as far from the people as possible or restricted to local affairs only. This is designed to further empower the private sector as controlled by global corporations.
Garth wrote:
>Canada does not have a constitution.
Garth,you have lost it. We in fact have a constitution and they are called the Constitution Acts of 1867 and 1982. Don’t take my word for it check it out for yourself. I am surprised that an educated MP like yourself didn’t know that. They are located here: http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/const/index.html
Btw, If they are not called our constitution then what are they?
“In the U.S. they have the Fear du jour. If there is not something new in the news that will kill you, then just wait. There are so many ‘paid for’ studies, that the validity of most are highly questionable.
Funny how the announcements coincide with the newest drug some company has ‘discovered.’”
Agree with you there Bill. New, and improved, cause they changed one minute thing, yet its also been proven that some of the older drugs were actually better.
“Take CAD (Coronary Artery Disease) which has brought forth all kinds of new diet based food products. Then the anti-smoking, anti-drinking, anti everything marketeers. The current cul-prit du jour are transfats, the need for Omega-3 this and that, avoid this and that. I wonder how the heck we ever survived all these millienia?”
Disagree Bill in that ‘our’ generation, at least here in Canada, I believe, were not as seduced by fast foods as those in the US & all kids today. We didn’t have all those fast food outlets on every corner. We ate well balanced meals at home. And, from the age of 14 I made most of them during the week as my Mom had to go back to work. Only junk food we ate was my Mom’s weekend baking.
“The bottom line is that the major causes of CAD are genetics and stress. The society is so dysfunctional, and so stressed out, but God forbid that should be mentioned because then the labour force would revolt. Human beings were never intended to live 24/7 on adrenalin, which is there for emergencies only. But they do, and it restricts the cardiovascular system. Some studies are finding it also interacts with cholestrol to cause it to settle out which form the blockages.
No one really wants to address that issue, because it woud mean people telling their arsehole bosses to shove it, walk off the high stress job, and live a normal life.
In short our society is killing itself with all the materialism and competition for prestige and power. Not to mention commutes on a daily basis, rushing from one activity to another, etc. Some would call them Fools!”
Can’t disagree with you there Bill. My Dad had his first major heart attack at 44 – I was alone at home at (9 or 10 years old) when it happened. He had a stressful life (6 kids) & job which he loved. BTW, he was given 5 years (Drs. told my Mom) and was also told ‘no more cheese’. Dad said if he couldn’t have his cheese he didn’t want to live. Sounds selfish I know. Well, out of all the other heart patients in with him in hospital, he was the sole survivor after 5 years. Actually lived till 69 – with his cheese & booze.
“Have a good day.”
You too Bill and glad to hear you’re OK.
By Bill-Muskoka on 10.03.07 3:34 pm
By got rope? on 10.03.07 5:44 pm
Looking forward, a really good start would be to not vote for any politician that has a party affiliation. Now how many people would be willing not to vote Lib or Con….we have voter apathy, we have voters who vote party regardless of the candidate, and do you really think we can interest people like this in separation…I think not…why don’t we concentrate on getting people to vote for someone who is independent!
why don’t we concentrate on getting people to vote for someone who is independent!
By pjw on 10.03.07 6:34 pm
cash is good
By Steve on 10.03.07 11:04 am
Walmart does not get one cent from me. I wouldn’t buy the last widget on earth there. Especially not after what they did to Bicks last year. Offering farmers less than cost of production on pickles is an insult. I hope they choke on that crap from India. L
Bill wrote
>Sorry, but that is called The British >North American Act of 1867.
It hasn’t been called that since 1982 when it was combined with the Constitution Act 1982 to become known as Constitution Acts 1867 and 1982.
>Garth is still correct.
He is oh so wrong.
>The document may have been given a name >change, but it granted the right of >dominion to Canada from British rule.
It became part of the constitution in 1982.
>It is an Act, not a Constitution per se.
Not in the manner the American achieved theirs because they are a republic and our form parliamentary system is very different and thank goodness for that.
All our legislation is achieved through Acts that are approved by our parliament and senate members and given royal assent by the Governor General of which our constitution 1867 and 1982 are just two. They have been combined to form the Canadian Constitution. I suggest you check out the link I gave in my previous post.