I’m surprised anyone came, but a few did. Outside, the hotel parking lot was thick with ice as the freezing rain fell, and inside we talked about what the hell’s going on in Ottawa. Here in Woodstock, Ontario, in the shadow of a spanking new Toyota plant, and surrounded by struggling auto parts manufacturers, there were many worries at our Town Hall meeting about the manufacturing heartland of Canada. Down the highway to the west, 600 good jobs have just been lost, while a few exits to the east, 1,900 more are disappearing.
The high Canadian dollar, rapidly slowing US economy, the dip in consumer spending and an uncompetitive tax structure in this country continue to take their toll. And now that Ottawa’s blown the budget surplus on the latest GST cut, its capacity to help industry and workers to survive tougher times seems imperiled.
Another victim is the truth. People, not surprisingly, know not who to believe.
The finance minister said just three months ago the economy was as strong as the Canadian shield, and yet thousands of jobs are being shed. How could that be?
One woman raised her hand with a question about climate change. The Conservatives say Dion was environment minister for 13 years and yet nothing was done about greenhouse gases, she said. So why should we believe him now?
Gently, I pointed out he’d had that job for a year only – in which the Libs brought in the greenest budget ever, and when Dion triumphantly knit nations together at the Montreal UN climate change conference.
Then why don’t you say that, she asked?
Yesterday the only remaining Harper minister with economic credibility, Jim Prentice, did it again. By the way, Prentice is the new Flaherty. The current finance minister, should the Harperites win another mandate, is toast. Prentice stood in the Tories’ giant campaign HQ in Ottawa and gave reporters a 67-page book which claimed the Liberals would spend more than $90 billion in new money, if elected, and add $62.5 billion to the national debt.
This spectacle came just two days after Dion had unveiled a plan to rebuild the country’s urban bridges, roads, waterways and transit systems, and was obviously timed to discredit that platform plank. Liberal finance critic John McCallum immediately called it a lie, and was able to disprove a giant hunk of the Con argument. But you can bet this is just an opening shot in yet a new assault on Stephane Dion.
In fact, the Conservatives have launched a further TV attack ad, the fourth in a series, and will be spending more billions in the pre-writ period to get their message out. It’s designed to keep the Liberals busy fighting off lies and disproving untruths, instead of articulating their alternatives for a better country. The Stephen Harper school of leadership, evidently, is to destroy your enemy instead of improving yourself. Thus, Canadians have been told Dion is soft on criminals, supports the Taliban more than our own troops, lacks any leadership qualities, will raise the GST, uses the Senate to thwart democracy and, of course, will spend the country into oblivion. Oh yeah, and he screwed the environment.
Lost in this barrage of negative communications is the fact the current government has been in office more than two years, and has a track record of its own. No climate change strategy. More spending than any government in history. A betrayal on income trusts, Kyoto, Kelowna, and the Atlantic Accord. No child care spaces. No income tax cuts. And one of the most controlling governments ever – muzzled MPs, fired civil servants and hobbled regulators.
The defence against those failings is an offence. Confuse voters. Intimidate opponents. But is it working?
Ask me in 15 days.
240 comments ↓
Leadership
The ability to spend millions in negative ad campaigns to convince everyone that you suck less than everyone else.
That is Harper Leadership in action, and according to Harry S., what makes a good leader for Canada.
Combat the lies with truth, and stay on a positive message. This simple strategy will remove Harper from power. Once Harper loses power, his own CPC will turn on him and feast on his bones (right wing neo-cons are famous for this behavour)
Anyhoo Garth, why wait fifteen days, come March 1st once the Senate refuses to pass C-2 doesn’t the Harper Government fall? I’m sure there was a big hub-bub confidence vote on that issue, right?
Here is what Lawrence Martin portrays as the discussion in the Liberal Party on whether to force an election or not:
http://ago.mobile.globeandmail.com/generated/archive/RTGAM/html/20080218/wcomartin18.html
Is it so, Garth?
Please people, do not respond to any of Harry S’s postings. If no one acknowledges him, it will drive him crazy not knowing if he is being read and ignored or his posts are not being read.
Excellent post, Garth. You’ve nailed it!
“It’s designed to keep the Liberals busy fighting off lies and disproving untruths, instead of articulating their alternatives for a better country.”
Obviously this is a strategy of some of the Conservative trolls on this blog. The best strategy in both cases is to not waste time and energy disproving untruths.
Keep up the good work.
Troops out – 3 years at the latest!
The entire CONs ship is listing badly. As an ardent reader of political blogs I have seen even hard core CONs supporters reach the proverbial final straw. The ‘dogfight’ bombing in Afghanistan illuminated the hypocrisy of Canada’s involvement in the illegal and immoral war costing $100,000,000. per month to Canadians.
$122,430. stolen by flaherty.
carpenter lunn’s Nuclear reactor debacle.
baird’s serious legal issues.
harper’s involved in the Greek Conspiracy’ in a case before the courts.
Going from bad to worse. With the impending economic slowdown, Canada will start putting two and two together.
Strauss School of Economics calls for ’stay the course they will simply repeat their previous lies and Canada is tired of hearing chicken little. Look at Giuliani in the US – 2008 is the year the neocon bubble burst.
Don’t pull the trigger yet -
“In fact, the Conservatives have launched a further TV attack ad, the fourth in a series, and will be spending more billions in the pre-writ period to get their message out.”
I am no political pundit but I cannot recall ANY government actively slagging the opposition party(s) in paid for advertising outside of an election period, certainly not to the extent seen with this government. Can anyone say if this has happened before and to what extent. It says much about their priorities when a government put this much effort into trying to discredit the opposition, doing their job does not seem to be high on the list!
Let the “new” government stand on it`s record.
Is that toast that I smell!!
Dr Mike–a former life-long Conservative.
PS–Garth–My wife & I thoroughly enjoyed the Town Hall yesterday–I appreciate the fact that you let us ordinary citizens haul out our soap boxes like this from time to time.
To all those I bored to tears , I do apologize.
posted by Garth Turner on 02.18.08
The high Canadian dollar, rapidly slowing US economy, the dip in consumer spending and an uncompetitive tax structure in this country continue to take their toll. And now that Ottawa’s blown the budget surplus on the latest GST cut, its capacity to help industry and workers to survive tougher times seems imperiled.
…………………………………………………………………………….
Interesting points, Garth …. but poor solutions. The high Canadian dollar is an inevitability now, and no amount of interest rate reduction will bring it down to previous level. We must live with it.
Consumer spending did not dip significantly in Canada, only in the US. Nobody wants to buy SUVs or pickup trucks any more because they are environmentally bad.
The uncompetitive tax structure you refer to is the Ontario business tax which are at the highest levels in all of Canada. Why doesn’t McGuinty reduce penalizing Ontario business taxes ??
The GST cuts were a benefit to all Canadians and were meant to boost consumer confidence. Your assertion that the GST should be used to prop up the failing Detroit Big Three in Ontario, amounts to even more subsidy to Ontario auto factories and jobs.
If the Ontario auto industry is in tough times, why doesn’t McGuinty raise the PST by 2% and allocate the money raised to the Ontario auto industry?? Why should PEI and Yukon taxpayers subsidize Ontario auto workers ??
So what is it Garth ?? … Lower Ontario business taxes and raise Ontario PST to save all those Ontario auto industry $100,000 auto jobs … or tax all of Canada for the benefit of Ontario ..??!!!
“the economy was as strong as the Canadian shield, and yet thousands of jobs are being shed. How could that be?’
You know full well the governments perspective on the economy is how much revenue the government is bringing in and Canada is awash with royalties and the jobs created. It has nothing to do with the financial health of the general population.
“the Liberals would spend more than $90 billion in new money, if elected, and add $62.5 billion to the national debt.”
This is absolute foolishness. No Cdns will believe that even if the Liberals create the programs they will fund them so there won`t be any $90B spent.
What plans do the Liberals have if Obama gets elected and tears up NAFTA?
Here’s an idea for a campaign strategy, Garth: Come up with proposals for working in partnership with citizens. Don’t fall into the trap of making promises to spend money. The parties have to get past treating people like, well, idiots, no matter how well it worked in the past. We are moving into new territory. Come up with some proposals for working in partnership with the people. I’ll leave it to you to work out the details!
The messages in stump speeches during an election campaign are so very different from the messages now in political blogs. As Scott Reid writes in today’s Toronto Star …
Obviously, neither “Thoughtful on Crime” nor “Stand up for the Integrity of a Bicameral Parliament” are electoral slogans that spark Liberal dreams of victory.
On the other hand, Harper rousing the troops with “The Liberals are soft on crime” and “The Senate has to change or die” sure do play well.
Prentice is just road-testing some of the upcoming election-time rhetoric and messaging. Get used to it Garth, for as long as an election is a distinct possibility. If Dion folds again at budget time (as Lawrence Martin predicts in the above link), then Prentice et al will go back to “governing” talk.
Sheeeesh!!!!!
I thought I was really burned-off on the evening of Oct 31st 2006.
I thought that I could not get any more Burned-off than I was that night.
Well , guess what , I am.
The Conservative party has no interest in doing what is right for Canadians –well , unless you are Michael Sabia or Gwyn Morgan or Dominic D., then the skies the limit.
It appears that attack adds are all that these guys know , except of course our Finance Minister Jim Flaherty who does have a good eye for a fine speech writer.
All I can say is that I now know why I am a former conservative–I will never travel down that road again as long as they are represented by people who care not a whit for anyone but themselves or a few of their select cronies.
Dr mike–a former life-long Conservative.
By Herb on 02.18.08 12:44 pm
Oh, that? Just another example of how the media is Liberal-biased. ;-0
Hey Garth, This Conservative attack cannot go unchallenged. It’s like the swiftboaters attacking John Kerry on his Vietnam record.
It’s audicious, but it will be effective. That’s why, and I repeat, this attack cannot go unchallenged. An attack on the Conservatives now will be seen as self defense.
I really hope I get to see Mr. Dion assert himself confidently. He should go public and challenge Mr. Harper in the media, by saying this:
“If Mr. Harper wants to make our economic records an issue, I challenge him to come right here, right now and debate me man-to-man over which political party has an economic record to be proud of.
Mr. Harper, stop hiding behind attack ads and press releases and debate me face-to-face.”
I’d love to see that happen.
-R
Hi Garth…is there any way that you can move the bloggers’ names to the top of their postings on your blog? If you could do that I think the majority of us would simply pass over postings by Harry S., Leasa, and ignore these obviously moronic neoCon trolls that inhabit your blog.
The defence against those failings is an offence. Confuse voters. Intimidate opponents. But is it working? – Garth
As the lady said, “Why don’t you say that?”
Everyone on this blog at least knows how the Libs view this CPC governments lies and failings. But Joe and Jane Canadian do not.
And if its on the TV. it must be true.
However, there’s still time to get the message out.
If the last thought before you hit the ball is “don’t hit in the water” then that’s where its going to go.
So maybe PMSH is shooting himself in the foot (again) by starting the negative ads so early. That gives the Libs the opportunity of being the last to be heard. May I suggest a two pronged attack. First, “This is what we would do, what would the CPC do?” And when the CPC start making their promises in reply, throw the IT lie sound and video bites in, plus all the other lies and mismanagement. There’s a darn sight more proving their management incompetance than there is proving, “Dion is not a Leader!” Just because they say it doesn’t make it so.
Harry S on 02.18.08 1:10 pm
“The uncompetitive tax structure you refer to is the Ontario business tax which are at the highest levels in all of Canada.”
McGuinty was boasting the corporate tax structure of Ontario was the lowest in the great lakes region. If they can`t compete with the lowest taxes against their competitors then it`s time to consider what I`ve been saying. The lack of investment is creating a loss in productivity which even a 5% tax reduction will not make up for.
Harry, I can understand why the Liberals hide from this truth but why are the Conservatives???
Another well pointed post Garth, as for Reform (Haper) Alliance (Harper) and now Conservative (Haper) WRT negative talk verus postive political talk, let’s all negative! oh, PMSH has the most expensive motor gage in the history of Canada, even GWB is proud!
By the way the ladies an gentlemen our Navy and Air Force is grounded (remember the 24M & 26M front page news on the fuel shortages….”It’s even worst now” and there is little or no recruiting for the Navy and Air Force wrt to many special tades shortages……the ships have been tied to jetties for months, trade schools are empty ….but hell defence contractors are busy trying to spend the bags of money dropped off for speeial projects? yup this Bully on the hill has CPC friends singing that ode tune ” Hey big Spender, spend a little time with me” and so he does.
Lana…I agree about ignoring the likes of Harry S., Leasa and other neoCon bloggers who post blatant falsehoods on Garth’s blog. They are obviously no better than the party they slavishly serve – falsehood upon falsehood upon falsehood. I just hope that the NDP, BQ, Greens and Liberals take the Conservatives to task during the campaign and help to educate the general Canadian public on the neoCon’s litany of misrespresentations and falsehoods. It’s a wonder that Dion has not sued them for slander.
When the election is called there’s no doubt that Garth’s blog will get a boost in readership. That makes it even more important to research the media and re-post articles that highlight the transgressions of Herr Harper and his cronies.
Appearing before the committee on Tuesday, Mr. Doucet explained that he first got paid by Mr. Schreiber in 1990, when he was hired to lobby the federal government to support a light-armoured vehicle factory. “I believe I got on the payroll in February of ‘90,” Mr. Doucet testified.
However, a photocopy of an invoice and cheque that had been unearthed by German authorities more than a decade ago showed Mr. Doucet’s consulting firm was paid $90,000 by one of Mr. Schreiber’s companies about 15 months earlier than his testimony indicated.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20080216.wdoucet0216/BNStory/National/home
Garth,is there any chance to turn this around, but going to the venue accepting negative (flagrant lie) campaigns rather than have to be in constant counter-attack?
Most voters are fed up with these tactics, yet they cannot be completely ignored either.
From the CBC’s site
ADVOCACY ADVERTISING
The term ‘advocacy advertising’ refers to any message that advocates a point of view or particular course of action on issues of public interest or concern. CBC accepts such messages because it believes that the democratic rights of Canadians will best be served by policies promoting freedom of speech. The criteria used for the approval of advocacy messages are based on the protection of the fundamental rights of all parties and on the principles of honesty and good taste. Advocacy advertising is subject to review and approval by the Office of Programming Policies.
Advocacy advertisements are subject to the following restrictions:
(a) Advertisements of partisan, political character will not be accepted, except during general election campaigns.
(b) Advertising considered to be defamatory, misleading, deceptive or contrary to law is unacceptable.
http://www.cbc.radio-canada.ca/docs/policies/advertising.shtml
Tories say Liberal promises add $62.5 billion to debt
Andrew Mayeda, Canwest News Service – Sunday, February 17, 2008
http://tinyurl.com/ypktjt
The Conservatives also estimate the Liberals’ pledge to honour the Kyoto Protocol would cost $10.9 billion over four years, because the government would have to buy greenhouse-gas credits from other countries to honour Canada’s commitments.
……………………………………………
Garth… Are you in favour of a Dion Liberal government buying Carbon Credits from countries such as China and India while the Canadian auto industry in Ontario and in your riding of Halton are facing a grim future ???
Should Canadian taxpayer’s money be sent to China and India where they will be better able to compete with Canadian industry and jobs, while exporting their cars into Canada ??
Wasn’t it Canadian Liberal icon Maurice Strong who is promoting the export of Chinese Cheery cars into N America ??
Really Garth … you should broach such questions instead of all the soft-ball stuff you hear at your town hall coffee klatches ..!!
For some reason, the Cons must think we’re stupid or something. What’s up with this nonsense? Can the cons not get anything right?
Thanks Garth, your web page is one of my favorite sites to visit. Almost always makes sense to me. Maybe you can give those cons some advice or something that could help them understand human behaviour.
Thanks
remember people, do not respond to Harry S., all he is doing is provoking you. Give him time out (forever)
Garth… Are you in favour of a Dion Liberal government buying Carbon Credits from countries such as China and India while the Canadian auto industry in Ontario and in your riding of Halton are facing a grim future ???
By Harry S on 02.18.08 2:16 pm
Harry, do you even understand how Carbon Tax trading works? I’m being serious here, do you under stand where the money is to come from? Do you understand on how it is spent? Do you understand how the money is to be used?
This is choice…first the CPC try to link Dion with all the controversy of the past Liberal leaders, and now they try to make it look like Dion had nothing to do whatsoever with the past Liberal government.
These Harper Conservatives are pathetic…their only strategy is to spread lies and misinformation in order to achieve their not-so-transparent goals.
The Harper Conservatives CANNOT BE TRUSTED.
do you even understand how Carbon Tax trading works? Do you understand on how it is spent? Do you understand how the money is to be used?
By Zorpheous on 02.18.08 2:55 pm
It`s a carbon copy of the oil for food scam.
(intentional pun on carbon)
It`s time for my election rant, just to help you with your vote. Besides Molly did say she wanted the sans sugar coated version. I will only do the one even if there`s no election till next year as what I`m about to say will be only too painfully clear by next year. There won`t be any need after that because the two paths are clear and the options list to date contains only one item.
The first path starts with the next generation as they start off on a two decade long entrenchment of retreat for the global economy.
The demand for raw resources has reached the bubble stage with little opportunity to maintain current prices. Our economic future is on very thin ice. With todays currency rates China and the US, even with Nafta, will have the global trading advantage over corporate Canada further reducing our manufacturing jobs. To date there is no hard data that suggest the downward trend of US currency has reached its conclusion increasing US global completeness over ours. Russia will need to produce cheaper lumber which puts our forestry industry down for a very long time.
During the slowing economic times health care costs will quadruple. Crime will continue to escalate, and to top it all off they will be outnumbered by seniors. That is the first path and if you don`t believe the world can cope with decades of global economic uncertainty and strife then increasing global conflict is the path you`re on. The $12T in cash accounts desperately looking for an investment will turn to the old standby, war. I said that last year and over the last 12 moths there`s been a noticeable global buildup of arms. You have to wonder why Obama will abandon the position of America as the shield to the free world if it wasn`t to bring the troops home to defend American soil. Even Cdn companies knew reinvestment in Canada is a poor bet long in advance of the current dollar parity, smart money always knows these things. Do you really believe politicians don`t know long in advance that war is inevitable as the global economy slows. Well if they don`t you can bet your bomb shelter the smart money does and bullets are a prime investment.
The only option on the table to avert both a global economic slowdown and ensuing strife is at this blog at which place I`ll be posting it as the last entry. I see no need to go into the details of how we got to this point as the truth that we are here takes precedent.
http://poppavox.blogspot.com/
Be brave.
Harry, do you even understand how Carbon Tax trading works? I’m being serious here,
By Zorpheous on 02.18.08 2:55 pm
It has been explained to “Cousin It”, numerous times. “It” either doesn’t remember or doesn’t want to, or for the life of “It,” can’t understand.
The Tories certainly have been going overboard on the TV ads against Dion; one of the reasons I voted for them last time was that I was tired of the shrill, over-the-top accusations coming from Liberals about what a Tory government was going to be like. I still hear that from them, with the anti-American rhetoric coming on even louder and stronger (now even from you, Garth, I’m disappointed to say). The Tories, unfortunately, since they’ve come to power, have started behaving the same way, with ridiculous assertions about what a Liberal government would look like. It seems that all federal parties (and indeed every single MP, from what I’ve seen of them) go through the old routine of claiming to be above politics, but turn out to be just as filthily partisan as the next one. MPs should be made to visit the NS Legislature & witness provincial campaigns – politicians from opposing parties are actually civil to each other, and from time to time they even agree. This happens during campaigns, too — it’s bloody marvelous.
I’ll have to see who’s running for each party in my riding — the merits of the local candidate are, or should be, the most important decision in the voter’s mind — but at the moment I have to say that I’ll probably vote for the Tories again; from a moral standpoint they’re now just as grubby as the Grits, but the Liberals (along with the Tories) have been drifting leftwards for the last few years and I can’t really agree with too many Liberal policies anymore. The PM has been throwing dirt at the Grits for a year, but the anti-Americanism & elitism that wafts from the Liberal ranks is not particularly enticing either. If there’s a good Liberal candidate, though, I’ll vote for him.
When it comes to specific policies, I must admit that I’m quite a bit like you, Garth (or like you were when you sat as an independent) – it seemed odd to me that you cited the Tories’ drift right and the Liberals’ drift center/right as one of your reasons for jumping ship as it seemed to me that both parties were lurching further left. Cutting sales tax over income tax, for instance, is a classic left-wing policy – Trudeau & Chretien cut sales taxes in the ’70s, and in 1993 all parties & organizations of the left advocated abolishing the GST altogether. High levels of government spending (although as a share of GDP it’s actually dropping a bit) are also out of the instruction booklet of the Liberal Old Guard.
Your own policies seem to be sliding leftwards as well over the last year – the sweepingly ambitious Kyoto plan, subsidies/bailouts for manufacturing & appointment of women candidates were all rather surprising coming from you. (The policies I just listed may not be completely accurate – I haven’t seen any specific proposals from you on any of them, but what you’ve been writing suggests, at least, that you support them). I’m not as much in agreement with you now as I was when you were an independent, but now that you’re back in a party I suppose that a bit of official prodding has been influencing your posts (for example, you have not criticized the Liberals at all since you joined them). In our political system, that’s understandable – the choices are Tory toadie or Liberal lackey, to put it perhaps a bit bluntly.
Sorry for the ramble, but there’s a lot to say.
The Harper Conservatives CANNOT BE TRUSTED.
Quoted for truth
(b) Advertising considered to be defamatory, misleading, deceptive or contrary to law is unacceptable.
http://www.cbc.radio-canada.ca/docs/policies/advertising.shtml
By TS on 02.18.08 2:16 pm
………………………………..
You mean like ’soldiers with guns on our streets” Liberal election ad..??!!!
It never aired. — Garth
Like you, Garth, I am shocked that Jim Prentice has allowed himself to be sacrificed on Harper’s altar. He was one Conservative that I had some time for but now he has totally destroyed his creditability as far as I am concerned.
Even the Conservative supporting CTV has been amazed at the lack of ethics involved with taking one of Dion’s short phrases totally out of context and putting it in an attack ad in another context.
Are there any rules or laws with regard to that kind of behaviour? They do it on comedy shows like “This Hour…” but if there is no law against this kind of deception there should be.
When the Conservatives claim to be a “principled party” it certainly is not ethics they are talking about.
Stay positive.
Keep sending out the vision and plan for a better deal.
Do not trash PMSH; rather, provide an acceptable option.
If the next election becomes “he said / she said”, the Cons will keep the upper hand.
Lets vote FOR something instead of against something.
I think the electorate is more intelligent than the parties give them credit for, and when presented wit ha realistic option, they will react.
You mean like ’soldiers with guns on our streets” Liberal election ad..??!!!
It never aired. — Garth
By Harry S on 02.18.08 3:31 pm
……………………………………………………………………………..
You are correct, Garth, it was never officially aired, but the CBC did show the ad on their ‘news’ broadcasts so the Liberals got ‘free’ advertising from their friends in the CBC. Then there was the Liberal Soprano-type ad with the S&W handgun pointing at the viewer and being subliminally discharged into our faces. The Liberal mafia was desperate in 2004 and 2006 elections. I wonder what they will produce for the upcoming election while they hide Dion as long as possible from public view.
Martin’s excuses over these ads was disingenuous to say the least. The fact that Liberals even produced such despicable attack ads gives us an insight into their desperate state of mind. What do your Liberals have in the can for this next election … Harper kissing Bush’s arse perhaps ??!!
Here is what the CBC has on their website on Liberal ‘attack ads’ :
“As we predicted, the Liberals have stepped up their campaign of negative and personal attacks on our leader and our party,” said Conservative National Campaign Co-Chair John Reynolds. “These latest ads are similar to the ads that we saw in the last campaign – guns pointed into people’s faces and dishonest misrepresentations of our policies.”
Indeed, not long after the ads were released, one that claimed Harper would would put more Canadian “soldiers with guns” in Canadian cities was yanked.
Liberal Leader Paul Martin was asked about the ad following the leaders’ debates in Montreal. He said it was never intended to air publicly.
“All political parties have ads which they don’t play,” said Martin. “That’s one that was not played.”
http://www.cbc.ca/story/canadavotes2006/national/2006/01/10/liberal-ads060110.html
……………………………..
Sorry Martin … your excuse is quite hollow considering that you personally approved the production of these despicable attack ads .. but considering your desperation at the time, we now understand why you did it.
Will Dion driven to desperation also go deep into the Liberal vault and attempt something stupid like previous Liberals tried to do to no avail ..??!!
By Zorpheous on 02.18.08 2:55 pm
I don’t understand how Carbon trading works. Does it just move the hot air from place to place while people can feel better by off setting their polluted lifesytles while purchasing carbon credits? What % will CO2 be reduced by with a carbon trading scheme?
I’m appalled that the Conservative party, a party I used to be a member of years ago has drifted so far from actual conservatism….are we witnessing the importation of American style politics where, as Garth said, it’s all about attacking your opponent rather than standing on your own record?
This is an absolute insult to us a voting citizens and should be rejected immediately, we are better than that as a country and as a people.
remember people, do not respond to Harry S., all he is doing is provoking you. Give him time out (forever)
By Geminesse on 02.18.08 2:54 pm
By Zorpheous on 02.18.08 2:55 pm
It`s a carbon copy of the oil for food scam.
(intentional pun on carbon)
By got rope? on 02.18.08 3:21 pm
Actually it isn’t, but it is very easy to dismiss it as such.
For those tired of reading the childish comments by Harry S., here is what I do. Start at the bottom skipping any writer you don’t want to read as well as any replies to their bleatings. Been doing this for a couple of weeks now and lol I havn’t popped a Rolaids in all that time!!!!
In reference to the ’soldiers’ ad, it’s true that it didn’t air, but it was put on the party website where people would inevitably see it. In addition, an ad in French with a similar message (perhaps not worded quite like the English one) was aired. Attacking the military in such a way is much more effective in Quebec than it is in the rest of the country.
The Tories, as I said earlier, have lost all claims to moral or ethical superiority over the Liberals, but the Liberals have continuously shown that they are no better as they make ridiculous accusations like in that military ad or spout out more shrill anti-American rhetoric. If the Democrats win in November, the single biggest political factor that the Liberals have had going for them for the last few years will be gone.
Spending billions on negative attack-ads:
Under Mike Harris, that would have been touted as “Your Tax Dollars At Work”. (Baird, Clement, Flaherty in cabinet? heh!)
I have a strong sense that had Monsieur Dion only followed through on his initial taunt (“Bring on the election now!) to the CONS government over one year ago, he could easily have gotten at least a minority, if not a majority government mandate.
Such a bold follow-through on his daring challenge would have given the lie to the impression that Monsieur Dion “is not a leader.”
The money could have poured in once the election was called, as strong leadership would have been demonstrated, and Monsieur Dion could be our Prime Minister today.
As it is, unfortunately he has backed down from the brink (after making initial threats) several times now, making this “not a leader” impression stick. Now that that impression has sunk it, and been confirmed by having cried “wolf” at least once too often, it will be very difficult to convey Dion as a strong leader, because the people have been watching him for over a year now, and the impression of vacilation and hesitancy has been firmly establshed.
It is not an easy thing to change, once that image has become firmly established, and sticks with one, no matter how you try to shake it.
People tend to believe what they SEE, not what they HEAR. Words alone are cheap, unless they are followed up by actions.
Now that this image of a “weak leader” has set in, Monsieur Dion no doubt wants to change that, and he is determined that this time he WILL push ahead with pulling the trigger on the governing party, no matter what, even against the advice of some of his top lieutenants, and chief organizers in the Liberal Party who know the state of the party’s finances, and their ill-preparedness for battle.
A year ago, the money could have poured in, because a bold action could have made this “weak leader” image dissipate. Now that the “weak leader” image has been re-enforced time and time again, it is not going to be so easy to change, or to inspire support for party coffers.
When I learned of the present conflict within the Liberal Party, and Monsieur Dion’s determination to command his troops to “Charge!” recklessly and irregardless, I was reminded of Lord Alfred Tennyson’s poem, and had a sense that this could well be the story of “The Charge of the Lib Brigade.”
“The Light Brigade” consisted of 600 stalwart soldiers. Since Central Nova will not be fielding a Liberal candidate, there will be roughly “300″ Liberal troops running in the next election. By following their leader Monsieur Dion to “pull the trigger” on the government, and to “charge Parliament Hill” at this time, I had a sense that their fate could be as tragic and yet as heroic as the “six hundred mentioned in Lord Tennyson’s original poem.
THE CHARGE OF THE LIB BRIGADE
Half a league, half a league,
Half a league onward,
All in the valley of Death
Rode the three hundred.
“Forward, the Light Brigade!
“Charge for the guns!” Dion said:
Into the valley of Death
Rode the three hundred.
2.
“Forward, the Lib Brigade!”
Was there a man dismay’d?
Not tho’ the soldier knew
Dion had blunder’d:
Their’s not to make reply,
Their’s not to reason why,
Their’s but to do and die:
Into the valley of Death
Rode the three hundred.
3.
Cannon to right of them,(the CONS)
Cannon to left of them, (the NDP)
Cannon in front of them (the voters)
Volley’d and thunder’d;
Storm’d at with shot and shell,
Boldly they rode and well,
Into the jaws of Death,
Into the mouth of Hell
Rode the three hundred.
4.
Flash’d all their sabres bare,
Flash’d as they turn’d in air,
Sabring the gunners there,
Charging an army, while
All the world wonder’d:
Plunged in the battery-smoke
Right thro’ the line they broke;
Party and Candidate
Reel’d from the sabre stroke
Shatter’d and sunder’d.
Then they rode back, but not
Not the three hundred.
5.
Cannon to right of them,
Cannon to left of them,
Cannon behind them
Volley’d and thunder’d;
Storm’d at with shot and shell,
While horse and hero fell,
They that had fought so well
Came thro’ the jaws of Death
Back from the mouth of Hell,
All that was left of them,
Left of three hundred.
6.
When can their glory fade?
O the wild charge they made!
All the world wondered.
Honor the charge they made,
Honor the Lib Brigade,
Noble three hundred.
“The finance minister said just three months ago the economy was as strong as the Canadian shield, and yet thousands of jobs are being shed. How could that be?”
but, but, but, during Ontario’s last provincial election (fall 2007), the Ontario’s Liberal Premier, Dalton McGuinty stated that the economy was good and no need to be concerned. So he focused on faith based funding.
Surely, you would think that Dalton McGuinty would know what was going on in his province. Maybe, the blame should rest with Dalton McGuinty! Seems Dalton McGuinty is more concerned with “Family Day” and the Lord’s Prayer than his province’s economy!
Good post, Garth; Geminesse is on the mark too — ignore trolls, and they will slink on their bellies back to the slimy hell they have created for themselves.
Not for me — I won’t play their silly fundamentalist games. Much rather take a chance on myself, and either sink or swim. Either way, I make my own choices in my own life; I have to live with the consequences of those choices.
The link I posted re: Japan and China now dumping the US dollar in droves, which is one of the reasons that the US debt increases by $2-$3 billion each day (neither country, along with many others has much, if any, confidence in a decaying economy), Iran has now begun it’s own Bourse (it will be fully operational by month’s end), and it seems that other countries will eventually switch to the Euro.
To me, it is clear that sooner or later NAFTA, NAU, SPP and the Amero MAY be a daily part of our lives. There was a protest (about 80 people) re: the SPP over the weekend, and the secrecy the talks are being held in.
The decline and fall of America will be when dubya, or whomever is in power says the US is broke, can’t meet any more of their obligations and, well tough shit for anyone who holds greenbacks now, ‘coz they ain’t worth nothing anymore. It’s been done before, and it will be done again.
Three bambimbos. One president, with two two Majors. One country — CANAMEX — on one continent. One currency — the Amero. One government, headquartered in Washington, D.C., with two subdivisions in Mexico City and Ottawa.
This is not a pretty thought. When Dion gets a chance to be a REAL leader, one of the first things he can do will be to seek out new trading partners and new friends.
The reason I said “may be a daily part of our lives” is Dion — and others — can steer this country back on track again. Two years of harper and see the damage he has caused.
dubya and his kind are certainly no friends I ever want to be associated with, and it definiely includes CRAP. They are an untrustworthy pack of liars.
Tennyson wrote a second poem about the ‘Heavy Brigade’ that was present at the same battle; ‘the noble 300,’ they were, and they, wearing their bright red coats, handily defeated a large Russian cavalry force.
In spite of this, I think that the previous poem will be a greater reflector of the Liberals’ fate. Unless something extraordinary happens during the campaign, I think that the Tories will pick up a few seats, the Liberals will pick up a few, and the Bloc & NDP will drop. May might win Central Nova, but I wouldn’t bet on it – Maritime Tories are more on the party’s left, while Maritime Liberals tend to be more on their party’s right.
Tories will be upset that they didn’t get a majority, Liberals that they didn’t win, and the Bloc & NDP that they lost seats. The election won’t really accomplish much of anything, but fewer NDP & Bloc members is nothing to be sad about.
The Liberals will sweep Toronto again, and Layton may lose his seat if the NDP vote doesn’t go back up. Garth will probably keep Halton – unless it’s an election blowout, the rule of Canadian politics seems to be that any party that wins the West loses the Toronto area. Before Diefenbaker came along, the safest Tory seats were in Toronto & the West was a wasteland. Since then, it’s progressively shifted to the reverse.
I can’t help but notice and point out the irony of using military metaphors to predict the future of Stephane Dion and the Liberals.
I always chuckle when the Harper boys and girls try to fool Canadians about crime. Especially violent crime resulting in deaths as a result of the use of small fire arms.
Don’t those dunces know that the kind of crime described above takes place on Fridays, Saturdays and a little on Sundays. Where ?? Within one mile radiuses of wild nightclubs. Now if Harper had provided cities with the 200 additional policemen to patrol these danger areas our crime rate might be drastically reduced.
Of course there are other crimes that are committed in other areas away from night clubs.
I as a senior citizen, do not frequent nightclubs any day and on Friday nights and Saturday nights I am comfortably at home as all other senior citizens are.
In our extended family there is no evidence of violent behaviour towards fellow family members. I don’t know of any wife beatings in my family and neither are children sexually abused. These things happen rarely so most Canadian familied are like mine.
Maybe somebody should tell Harper that he is overdoing his hysterics about crime.
Actually it isn’t, but it is very easy to dismiss it as such.
By Zorpheous on 02.18.08 4:07 pm
Actually it is, it was even put together by the same crew as the oil for food scam and supported by the same supporters.
Besides it won`t work anyway so the question remains to Garth, how will it reduce CO2???
Dear Garth,
There goes Harper pulling the same old Harper crap by hanging Jim Prentice… his only credible opposition for the leadership of the Conservative Party… out to dry.
Flaherty’s disgraced, MacKay is only a pretty boy and was never credible to begin with, and now he’s going after Jim Prentice as the front man to take the heat for all of Harper’s outrageous lies.
Sheesh.
Has Harper ever had any credible opposition in a leadership contest??? Well he did once… when he faced Paul Maritn. He lost the first time and he barely scraped by the second time because voters were sick and tired of the old Liberals.
Now we’ve got Team Liberal with the strong consensus building Dion and Haper continues to manufacture negativity at the expense of Jim Prentice.
Careful Jim… Let him spew his own negativity… he’s the author of it.
But you gotta admire that Harper the way he masterfully manipulates every situation to HIS own personal advantage.
I really wish Emerson would just walk out on Harper, re-join Team Liberal, apologize to the people of Vancouver-Kingsway for the error of his ways and let the chips fall where they may.
It’s not like Emerson is ever going to get re-elected as a Conservative anywhere.
Look at the kind of people Harper attracts, and go from there boys.
Sincerely,
MB
I love the new photo op of Dion here! He seems like such an honest and sensible kind of guy.
What stands out in this ad is the fact that the liberals will save the our dear Canada some 52 million bucks. I love the prospect of him at the helm.
Thanks Dion, you are a great person and will be a splendid leader!
By David Cochrane on 02.18.08 3:25 pm
Could this have been a refreshingly honest post? It becomes difficult sometimes to discern amongst all the Partisanship.
Giving you the benefit of the doubt, you have my thanks. Please post more.
By Marc on 02.18.08 3:58 pm
Good question Marc. The answer is contained within your own words.
Yesterday the only remaining Harper minister with economic credibility, Jim Prentice, did it again.
Aye…Jim ‘the insurance sleeze’ Prentice.
By A.Political on 02.18.08 4:00 pm
I agree with you. Consider this please. Is the new age Harper party not following the long standing practices of the Liberal Party? Thinking back to honest Bob Stanfield, and good hearted but politically inept Joe Clark, did they not learn that the public prefers icing to cake? Sorry for my metaphorical ways, what I mean is lies take you farther in our current political spectrum than hard fact. Has been the way for a while now.
“I can’t help but notice and point out the irony of using military metaphors to predict the future of Stephane Dion and the Liberals.”
By David Cochrane on 02.18.08 5:06 pm
David, just check out the blog to which Garth has just recently given us a link from Jennifer Smith in “Runesmith’s Canadian Content” blog.
Look at the February 16, 2008, section on “The Smoke Filled Room.”
http://www.runesmith.blogspot.com/
“I received the dispatch a week ago from General Shaye, summoning the troops to a secret location somewhere in Oakville to receive our marching orders for the impending Battle to Re-Elect Garth Turner…
“So to those of you who are mired in doubt, who have surrendered to despair, I say to you: back away from your keyboard, get off your ass and JOIN THE FIGHT!” (end of quote)
The irony of using “military metaphors”? Go figure.
Dalton McGuinty stated that the economy was good and no need to be concerned
Catherine on 02.18.08 4:50 pm
The portion of the 50% of eligible voters that voted for McGuinty thought the 30,000 job created the month before the election was a good sign, but then McGuinty didn`t tell them they were in the public sector and taxes must be paid to pay for all those shiny new jobs.
The other 50% didn`t believe any of them. The next federal election could very well be a historic low for voter turnout.
I keep hearing about the duty to vote but when you`ve got a choice of not voting or voting for more of the same failed governance I really question as to who the patriots really are.
Kyoto Protocol would cost $10.9 billion over four years, because the government would have to buy greenhouse-gas credits from other countries to honour Canada’s commitments.
THIS IS A LIE compliments of the Harper CONs
Canada has the ability now to produce enough Carbon Offsets to meet our international obligations including Kyoto without buying ONE offshore Credit
Once we get a green government in place in Ottawa we will prove it.
STOP LYING HARRY S if you can?
So, I went to the Liberals are spreading negative ads in 2006; Harper said it was a sign of desperation and the liberals are spreading these lies all over the nation.
Now, two years later, I hardly think that Harper can use the same lines and look anyone in the eyes. He seems to be a truly gifted liar and has trained his cabinet members to use the ‘misspoke’ statement to cover up their lies. Pretty pathetic indeed.
“I can’t help but notice and point out the irony of using military metaphors to predict the future of Stephane Dion and the Liberals.” –By David Cochrane on 02.18.08 5:06 pm
“Whatever. Don’t matter. Because there’s only one finger on the trigger, and that belongs to Stephane Dion.
“He knows why he’s here. So, duck.”
–posted by Garth Turner on 02.14.08 @ 10:28 pm
So David Cochrane, go figure. The same post also refers to some “Lib war horses” so the expression “The Charge of the Lib Brigade” is consistent with that militant imagery.
If Mr. Harper wants to make our economic records an issue, I (Dion) challenge him to come right here, right now and debate me man-to-man over which political party has an economic record to be proud of. By Rob,
I saw how Dion performed at the Liberal leadership campaign debate against Iggy and it wasn’t pretty. I think a debate with Harper on anything is that last thing Dion would want to do.
We are occupied!!! Gonna hafta learn French and move to Quebec…better than living under the hobnailed boot of the z……!!!
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article19380.htm
Garth Why don’t the Liberals come up with the costs and how they are going to pay for it instead of calling ten Conservatives cost estimates of Liberal promises to date a lie? That isn’t to much to ask especially when it is our money they will be using.
By Ike on 02.18.08 4:42 pm
When I learned of the present conflict within the Liberal Party, and Monsieur Dion’s determination to command his troops to “Charge!” recklessly and irregardless, I was reminded of Lord Alfred Tennyson’s poem, and had a sense that this could well be the story of “The Charge of the Lib Brigade.”
………………………………….
http://tinyurl.com/2ugv39
Nuff said …..
Once we get a green government in place in Ottawa we will prove it. CAlberta.
Better yet why don’t the so called Green parties especially the Liberals come clean and tell us how they are going to meet the Kyoto targets and the costs associated with doing so. Now that would be the honest and ethical thing to do instead of trying to sell us a pig in a poke as they are doing now..
Canada has the ability now to produce enough Carbon Offsets to meet our international obligations including Kyoto without buying ONE offshore Credit
By Calberta on 02.18.08 5:38 pm
Now we`re getting somewhere. What part of Canada will buy the credits for Ontarios coal generation stations or Albertas tar sands? Quebecs hydro authority? Quebec could use the extra bucks.
Wait, lol, I think I get it, they will buy each others carbon credits and the co2 keeps going up.
That would make a good chorus line for a Liberal election song.
“People tend to believe what they SEE, not what they HEAR. Words alone are cheap, unless they are followed up by actions.”
By Ike on 02.18.08 4:42 pm
People tend to believe what they hear, as for the most part, in political campaigns , rhetoric reigns supreme. What they have SEEN, is the record of the party in power.
Dion could not have gone back to the well in a year. The well was poisoned. An objective observer would see that.
Then I read to the bottom and discovered it was Ike.
I knew when I read your recent posts you had an agenda. My mind hasn’t changed.
You may buffalo some folks old cock, but you better get up earlier if you want to buffalo this old “Soldier”.
I do appreciate your apparent effort though, and your word smith skills. A little amateurish, like mine but still a valiant effort.
Perhaps one day, we could meet on the Plains of Abraham and decide the fate of our Country.
Swords drawn of course.
first the CPC try to link Dion with all the controversy of the past Liberal leaders, and now they try to make it look like Dion had nothing to do whatsoever with the past Liberal government. by reefer.
is this the same way the Liberals are trying to link Harper with Mulroney’s current problems?
Just learned the CBC won’t accept ‘jew’ in their comments…’heeb’ is OK though!
http://tinyurl.com/2ugv39
“Nuff said …..” –By Harry S on 02.18.08 5:51 pm
Harry, that cartoon does fit in perfectly with the poem, “The Charge of the Lib Brigade.”
Only I would add that sometimes blind obedience to leadership which blunders is not heroism but foolishness.
Garth Why don’t the Liberals come up with the costs and how they are going to pay for it instead of calling ten Conservatives cost estimates of Liberal promises to date a lie? That isn’t to much to ask especially when it is our money they will be using.
By Van on 02.18.08 5:49 pm
Van – because the cons are liars. I watched Prentice & McCallum on CBC today. Prentice did not adequately respond. McCallum stated they have consistently said for years they will never go into a deficit position and they will only put forth their economic plan when an election writ is brought down. Why the hell should they, only to have the the cons steal parts of their platform. Hey the cons have spent more in 18 months than the Libs did for many, many years. And, now we have next to no surplus to help the Cdn economy, other than areas that support the cons. I’m really curious to see how bad our fiscal house is in. When can Sheila Frazer do the next audit. I think we’ll all be in for a big surprise. How much did Harper charge we Cdns for his makeup/image consultant and the millions spent on polls? OOps Harpie said he’d never govern by polls!
By Van on
Garth Why don’t the Liberals come up with the costs and how they are going to pay for it instead of calling ten Conservatives cost estimates of Liberal promises to date a lie?
Did you not hear McCallum?
Why give the conservatives all the facts so thy can twist them around a use what is useful to them ? Are you that naive ?
Recently, in my spare time I put together a few things for the consideration of the learned and intelligent peoples who read this blog.
I will post one of them now, as some seem to want to make light of the demands brought upon our Children.
Please take a few moments to follow along with me.
My House takes note that Prime Minister Harper recently stated the Parties that run this country understand the use of force.
My House takes note that Conservative Peter Van Loan recently stated you are either for the mission or not, you support the troops or you don’t.
My House takes note that much to the surprise of many Citizens, the Liberal Party team, headed by Mr. Dion, chose to abandon their previously stated position on Canada’s involvement in Afghanistan.
Therefore, it is the opinion of My House that consideration be given to the following;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhmDxtajk0E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qC-ujm58ZnY&feature=related
http://rjjago.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/woundedsoldier.png
http://www.aboutscotland.com/argylls/05ims/thinredline550.jpg
To the Team. Et tu Brute?
Watching Jim Prentice mouth Harper’s talking points over and over again I couldn’t help but notice how desperate the Harper Conservatives are right now.
They are so lost and adrift they are practically begging for Dion to give them a platform to steal.
Not going to happen. All things in due time.
I wonder just how badly Harper and Flaherty have mismanaged the economy? Just how bare are Canada’s cupboards after two years? Why such a hurry for an election, Harper? Is there something you don’t want Canadians to know, something you could hide for a while during an election campaign?
The truth will come out. Right now the Harper Conservatives REEK of fear. Just how bad is the fiscal reality for Canada? The Harper Party may play Canadians for stupid rubes, but something has happened that has the Harper Party very afraid.
Dion will steer his ship capably while the waters roil from the floundering of the Harper ship and the flotsam and jetsam Con Ministers desperately seeking safe harbour.
Sail On, Dion!
http://www.twincities.com/business/ci_8275334
Aye…so how much will our hillbillys reap, DICK… most land in our grain belt is now owned by amreisralies…look it up…I did!
Have fun…there are bipeds of a greater gods!!!
http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/25135
is this the same way the Liberals are trying to link Harper with Mulroney’s current problems?
By Van on 02.18.08 6:01 pm
They both left the country with huge deficits that the Libs had to clear up. And, the libs will probably have to fix the economic mess that flim flam created.
Aye…so how much will our hillbillys reap, DICK… most land in our grain belt is now owned by amreisralies…look it up…I did!
By wd on 02.18.08 6:24 pm
It’s the plan Mr. WD. Has been the plan, is the plan, will be the plan.
It’s no surprise to me. I worked the land. I feel the land. It is my soul.
Even though I had a deed, I never owned the land. The government and the corporations own the land.
We only pay the taxes.
By Larry Ezekiel on 02.18.08 6:08 pm
http://tinyurl.com/2ugv39
“Nuff said …..” –By Harry S on 02.18.08 5:51 pm
Harry, that cartoon does fit in perfectly with the poem, “The Charge of the Lib Brigade.”
Only I would add that sometimes blind obedience to leadership which blunders is not heroism but foolishness.
………………………………………………………………………….
Ex-PM Chretien apparently urges Dion to pull the plug on the Conservative February Budget and charge into an election.
Liberals Ignatieff and Rae apparently advise Dion not to precipitate a premature Spring election.
Dion is in a quandary because should he not charge into an election, and thus by proxy allow the Conservative Budget to pass, he will have lost all credibility as a leader. He will have to consider abdicating or leading Liberals to a certain defeat. Does Dion possess a sane state of mind or is he completely bonkers ?!
Perhaps Dion should do the honourable thing and commit political hara kiri, thus saving the Canadian taxpayer some $300 Million that an unwanted and futile election would cost.
Your thoughts … ??
Iran, Syria and Lebanon attacked in 30 days, III WorldWar, how it will Happen!
By Greg W., Oakville on 02.18.08 4:26 pm
Hello Greg W., Charles here. We have had a delightfully sunny week or so in the Okanagan, with temps. rising a little each day.
You forgot one thing — China, Russia and Iran now have signed deals to protect one another’s backs.
Iran and Syria, as well as other Middle East countries — except Israel — also have signed treaties.
China and Russia will protect their assets, as any country would.
dubya is sure planning on going out in a blaze of glory.
Unfortunately, we’re caught right in the middle of it.
stay the course,take the high road, keep a positive message, respond to the lies. Sell your message.
Actually it is, it was even put together by the same crew as the oil for food scam and supported by the same supporters.
Besides it won`t work anyway so the question remains to Garth, how will it reduce CO2???
By got rope? on 02.18.08 5:08 pm
might I suggest you actually go and read how the trading mechanism works, and how the trading markets are designed, and how the monies are controlled by the buyer.
As for how it will reduce co2, the answer is simple, we help developing nations leap frog our esrlier mistakes with dirty energy, and by dirty I mean polution as well as co2. We in tern develop the tech because we have the know how. The only thing we lack is the will to do so.
Dear Garth,
The best campaign I ever saw was Paul Martin’s first campaign… the one he won.
What he did was go negative defining Harper in the first 3 1/2 weeks of the campaign and then went positive with his vision Canada until election day campaigning HARD right up to the night before the vote.
Harper and Martin were neck and neck in the polls before the last weekend, but because Martin campaigned HARD right until the end he ended up winning a sizable minority.
Just my 2 cents.
Sincerely,
MB
is this the same way the Liberals are trying to link Harper with Mulroney’s current problems?
By Van on 02.18.08 6:01 pm
Would you defend Mr. Mulroney and the record of his era? Would you defend the apparent orchestrated overthrow of Joe Clark?
Mulroney’s record seems a very poor place from which to posture. Is it ok with you?
Dion’s best excuse for not calling an election over the budget …
Kyoto ate my platform !
Interesting link. Skip the first part and start on the second.
http://tinyurl.com/yoyntd
You know, the irony is dripping…
I for one would have to question “fiscal responsibility” and “fiscal management” slogans paraded by the CPC, given the sheer amount of money they spend on really crappy and pointless advertising and never-ending polls…
(Mis-)management at its finest, brought to you by your friendly neighborhood CPCers…
ROFLMAO~!
Austin
Further info. on al Queda.
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/fakealqaeda.html
“Prentice stood in the Tories’ giant campaign HQ in Ottawa and gave reporters a 67-page book which claimed the Liberals would spend more than $90 billion in new money…”
Were those 67 pages blacked-out?
I’m used to be provided with blacked-out pages as “explanation” by these crooks.
To the Team. Et tu Brute?
By Greg on 02.18.08 6:20 pm
………………………………….
What are you insinuating in your message .. because it sounds as if you are opposed to Canadian participation in the UN-NATO mission in Afghanistan..??!!
is this the same way the Liberals are trying to link Harper with Mulroney’s current problems?
By Van on 02.18.08 6:01 pm
If the shoe fits Van. Mulrooney has been a Harper consultant for a long time, until the Shreiber affair. Then Harper got his goons out to save himself (as today with Prentice) and that Con former minister that he was so close to (sorry forget her name) to distance himself. Boy, if I were a con minister or member, I’d watch my back if stevie came asking me to speak for another Minister/MP.
<blockquote
When I learned of the present conflict within the Liberal Party, and Monsieur Dion’s determination to command his troops to “Charge!” recklessly and irregardless, I was reminded of Lord Alfred Tennyson’s poem, and had a sense that this could well be the story of “The Charge of the Lib Brigade.”
etc.
By Ike on 02.18.08 4:42 pm
Ike, you’re not alone in equating poems to politics; in my case, it would be one set to music. This morning, while heading out to the ski trails to celebrate Family Day with my son (never thought a holiday in February — as opposed to say August — would be well-used but I was pleasantly proved wrong and am now a convert, thank you Premier McGuinty … but I digress) I sadly learned of the death of another Canadian master musician, Willy P. Bennett, of mandolin fame and a cornerstone to Fred Eaglesmith’s road band. Well, there’s a stanza in one of Eaglesmith’s songs that always reminds me of Peter Van Loan.
Why? Well, I read somewhere that Van Loan had an advanced university degree; I can’t remember where I saw that or what degree / level it was. The thought of him possibly having a PHD initially was just astonishing, given his usual antics. But then I recalled this stanza and it all began to fall into place:
By Van on 02.18.08 5:46 pm
I saw how Dion performed at the Liberal leadership campaign debate against Iggy and it wasn’t pretty. I think a debate with Harper on anything is that last thing Dion would want to do.
Hey van, I didn’t see that, so I can’t comment, though I would imagine his debating skills in English have improved, somewhat. And anyway, my theory, and the point I was trying to make, is, that this would be a good opp for M Dion to assert himself, something I would like to see more of from the Liberals, without appearing negative.
Negative attacks when unprovoked usually shed the attackers in a bad light, but attacking when attacked is perceived as self defense.
My theory, anyway.
-R
“Perhaps one day, we could meet on the Plains of Abraham and decide the fate of our Country.
“Swords drawn of course.” –By Greg on 02.18.08 5:56 pm
Are you suggesting that we make the “Plains of Abraham” the best of three series?
I say, let’s give our best efforts to negotiating a true and a lasting “peace” before both sides get destroyed.
Let’s not “charge” mindlessly into disaster like Dion is doing. There is a better way. It is called compromise, diplomacy and peaceful negotiations.
I reach out my hand to you. Let’s remove our hands from swords and guns, and shake each other’s hand instead.
Let’s work together for the common good of our common humanity. Let’s make peace and not war. Our interests as fellow human beings are intertwined and interconnected. Let’s fight FOR one another and not AGAINST one another.
http://tinyurl.com/2jawuu
http://tinyurl.com/2s24cb
Two reports, both of which clearly shows how the western msm is told what to say, and when to say it.
It appears that this pressure cooker of a planet is close to blowing its’ top.
“Dishonesty in politics is the #1 reason why Canadians don’t vote.”
Democracy Watch: http://www.dwatch.ca/camp/acthonesty.html
“Incredibly, during federal election campaigns, and during elections in every province and territory except Quebec and New Brunswick, it is illegal for anyone to lie about a candidate, but it is only illegal in B.C. for a candidate to lie about what they promise to do or what they have done.
The B.C. law is a good first step, but it requires voters to file a costly court application if they believe that a candidate has lied during an election, and there is no effective penalty even if the candidate did lie.”
If the Liberals can keep their campaign clean, and if Dion and team can evangelize his Three Pillars well, it should lock out the Conservatives.
However, remember the last election, the NDP received more seats, the Greens are gaining and never under estimate the youth vote.
The environment and sustainability (finite resources – oil/n~gas) issues are hitting critical mass, peacekeeping (re:Afghan a mistake), economy (globalization is exhausting our ability to self-sustain)
Report on Business: http://tinyurl.com/34bxkl “High Energy Prices not enough”
US financial meltdown (Canada isn’t out of the woods)
Vancouver Sun: http://tinyurl.com/yrpqvd “Canada’s banks face more trouble, IMF says”
Nation Post: http://tinyurl.com/yrxq32 “More bad news for CIBC”
Clearing blog on financial info run by two Canadians http://theautomaticearth.blogspot.com/
We have a lot of work ahead of us and nothing is going to get done with the status quo of government. Liberals are you up to the task?
Garth, you have my best wishes for your riding. In mine it’s going to be a tough one.
Van: Have you asked Harper to cost out his economic policy for the next year? (before the budget is read?)
I thought so.
He’d tell you to take a hike and wait for the announcement like everyone else.
Today I sent Prentice an email to say what a patsy he was and how disgusted I was with the con party. I also said that the Cdn public were not as stupid/ naieve as the Americans were during dubyas reign and they see through this con govt. I don’t think it will mean anything to him or his govt. as they, in their arrogance, regard the Cdn public to be stupid/taken in by their lies. Yes, lots might, but I give the majority of Cdns more credit. After all, they only got 30+ support last time and now we’ve had time to see them for what they truly are.
they will only put forth their economic plan when an election writ is brought down. Why the hell should they, only to have the the cons steal parts of their platform.
kpn on 02.18.08 6:11 pm
Why give the conservatives all the facts so thy can twist them around a use what is useful to them ? Are you that naive ?
By Bob R on 02.18.08 6:15 pm
This conversation has been going on for a year now with many answers ,all the same as the above.
You know by now where my position is. Neither the federal government, the provincial governments or any political parties have a plan, only a few band aid solutions where tourniquets are required.
If the Liberals lay out their plan and the Tories steal it that compliments the Libs and they can still run on it saying it`s their idea so they can do it better.
Conversely the longer they delay the greater the chance the Tories have already moved on it.
So lets all grow up and face facts. No one is laying out a plan because no one has one.
I’m also surprised anyone came.With all the lies that you lieberals like to tell,Why would anyone want to listen to you.Stephool DID say he would consider raising the GST,unlike uncle Jean who promised to scrap it.He has embarassed us internationally with our allies with his run away attitude(remember HofC fiasco).That showed leadership.And as minister of the environment,like most Lieberals,he promised us the moon but never delivered.Like Iggy and Dull Dryden said’why didn’t we do better?’Maybe Boob Rae can help out once he stabs Stephool in the back and takes over the party.Good luck,you’ll need it.
$62.5 billion? Mere bagatelle
http://caiti-online.blogspot.com/2008/02/625-billion-mere-bagatelle.html
Check out this kid. So good, yet so funny.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqXYwNDrU8k&eurl=http://widget-8b.slide.com/widgets/sf.swf
Liberals may support federal budget if it doesn’t hurt country: Dion
By Alexandre Robillard, THE CANADIAN PRESS – February 18, 2008
QUEBEC – Stephane Dion said Monday his Liberals might let the federal budget pass if they believe it is not too detrimental to the economy.
But Dion added that his party is ready to fight an election if the government falls on the budget.
While Dion said he doesn’t expect a “Liberal” budget from the Conservatives, he noted that plunging the country into an election would cost taxpayers $350 million.
Dion told a news conference that if the budget is acceptable or not too damaging, his party will let it pass.
http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2008/02/18/pf-4856958.html
……………………………………………………………….
Kudos to Dion for finally speaking like a responsible politician … without all that useless rhetoric his handlers have been promoting for him.
So can we expect Dion to agree with the upcoming February 26 Budget .. or will he fall on the sword by precipitating a $350 Million election that Canadians don’t really want .. ??!!
might I suggest you actually go and read how the trading mechanism works, and how the trading markets are designed, and how the monies are controlled by the buyer.
As for how it will reduce co2, the answer is simple, we help developing nations leap frog our esrlier mistakes with dirty energy, and by dirty I mean polution as well as co2. We in tern develop the tech because we have the know how.
By Zorpheous on 02.18.08 6:48 pm
I did or maybe that was the oil for food scam. Anyway the`re both the same, written by the same people, supported by the same people and promoted by the same people. Even if I could get by the authors history of corruption you point out the area I get lost.
Essentially we send billions to create green jobs in foreign countries so we can keep on polluting. This will not reduce `dirty` only slow down the `dirty` where we send the money.
Furthermore it will disadvantage our industries as we fall behind the green line while other countries pull ahead thanks to our tax dollars.
Sry Zorp but this is another oil for food scam.
What are you insinuating in your message .. because it sounds as if you are opposed to Canadian participation in the UN-NATO mission in Afghanistan..??!!
By Harry S on 02.18.08 7:09 pm
My lifelong goal, to fence with a virtual idiot.
PC = Reform = Alliance = CPC.
= = give or take a few voters.
Negative and attack ads demonstrate the fear. They are predominantly noticed by the unwashed beer drinking hockey crowd. They could not care less about politics anyway. They are also the people who want no election because they cannot spare that 1 hour to go to the polls.
Keep up the attack ads Harper, Canada will respect you for them and History will remember you.
Remember, we must factor in that dark horse, Canada’s RCMP, in any election.
Hmmm, 62.6 bi;;ion dollars is not alot of money in todays markets; so Dion is being realistic and reasonabale with his prediction of his promises. I guess that is quite accurate compared to Harper’s promises not to tax Income Tax Trust funds.
I’m confused? What’s up with this photo op that will assist the Conservative Party of Canada?
Are the liberal thinkers this stupid? Or are the Liberal thinking people of Canada going to say “well, Dion is a Leader” and we Conservatives don’t like it. Darn it, I’m confused?
It was the final week in Harper’s case, and the final day in Martin’s, that were defining moments. Quite symbolic really. Harper so smugly thought that he had it in the bag that he spent the last week campaigning solely in Alberta, neglecting the rest of the Canada. On the final day he casually took a train from Edmonton to Calgary, and when he arrived, ended with a Reform Party chestnut, proclaiming that “Old familiar cry, ‘The West Wants In’ “. Martin, on the other hand, was racing around from coast to coast like a madman, dipping his feet in the sea at each shore. (That hyperactivity would continue into his Prime Ministerialship, in near nervous-breakdown fashion, and ultimately proved to be his downfall). The symbolism was not lost on the voter: the regionalist versus the nationalist. And as they say, the rest is history.
Well, I have just read a few more comments on Garth’s threads. I strongly believe that this pathetic “new government” should have kept Joe Clark on and let him lead our Progressive Conservative Party of Canada. Instead, as I inderstand, Schreiber tipped the (his) money towards the Mulroney/Grant Divine fiasco.
Am I missing something here?
Are there any Joe Clark Fans or are they muzzled as well? Harper seems to want to represent Canada as an invisible image rather that an accountable image, what, if anything, am I missing?
By Ike on 02.18.08 7:13 pm
Hark, oh Angels of light and darkness. Tomorrow we shall stride forth to satisfy the quest of our destiny’s.
As the shadows encroach upon me, I am fearful of the darkness. In the morn, the light fills me with trepidation.
I once was lost, but now am found;
Was blind, but now I see.
Tomorrow citizen. I am tired now. My legs hurt, my lungs no longer do me justice. They ignore my heart.
In the Morrow.
The final word on the Ontario economy, would the last one out please turn out the lights.
I was hoping the west would separate, not move the east out here but as long as you`re coming here`s the rules. No abusing children for profit and no further attacks on the family.
Mon Feb 18, 7:57 PM
http://tinyurl.com/333yf2
The new governor of the Bank of Canada, Mark Carney noted that since December 2002, Canada’s manufacturing sector has lost 320,000 jobs, about 14 per cent.
“This means maximizing the ability of workers to relocate if they wish, maintaining appropriate social safety nets that do not discourage employment and focusing on lifelong learning and training,” Carney told the British Columbia Chamber of Commerce.
By Van on
“Garth Why don’t the Liberals come up with the costs and how they are going to pay for it instead of calling ten Conservatives cost estimates of Liberal promises to date a lie?” –Van
“Did you not hear McCallum?
“Why give the conservatives all the facts so thy can twist them around a use what is useful to them ? Are you that naive ?” –By Bob R on 02.18.08 6:15 pm
Bob R, would you by any chance be Bob Rae? And if so, is it true that you disagree with Dion’s decision to “charge” into an election campaign at this particular time?
As for hearing John McCallum in response to Jim Prentice, I understand that he has said, for example, that the Liberal war on poverty will NOT cost $5.5 billion a year.
Yet on April 4, 2007, Stephane Dion stated unequivocally: “The next GST tax cut that Mr. Harper wants to undertake would cost $5.5 billion. I will not make that cut. Instead of making that cut, I will invest in the child tax benefit and other social programs to lift Canadian children out of poverty.”
So either Monsieur will have to find $5.5 billion in new money after all within present levels of taxation, or else he will have to raise the GST again after the CONS lowered it.
Which is it?
By Greg on 02.18.08 6:20 pm
To the Team. Et tu Brute?
……………………………………………………..
If I understand you correctly, you demean and diminish our Canadian soldier’s service in the UN-NATO mission in Afghanistan.
Tradition and bravery is written in the struggle and the blood of fallen soldiers, and for anybody to suggest otherwise is an anathema to all brave and loyal soldiers.
You sir are beneath contempt …!
“Liberals may support federal budget if it doesn’t hurt country: Dion
“By Alexandre Robillard, THE CANADIAN PRESS – February 18, 2008
“QUEBEC – Stephane Dion said Monday his Liberals might let the federal budget pass if they believe it is not too detrimental to the economy.
“But Dion added that his party is ready to fight an election if the government falls on the budget.
“While Dion said he doesn’t expect a “Liberal” budget from the Conservatives, he noted that plunging the country into an election would cost taxpayers $350 million.
“Dion told a news conference that if the budget is acceptable or not too damaging, his party will let it pass.
http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2008/02/18/pf-4856958.html
What? Another flip flop? I thought that this time for sure Monsieur Dion was going to pull the plug, or as has been stated, “pull the trigger.”
It turns out I was wrong again, but this is what happens if you put too much credence in the latest indication of Monsieur Dion’s intentions.
Let’s get the suspense over with, and this time either say what you mean, or mean what you say. This playing of political games with making idle threats, or going to the brink, and then backing off, only re-enforces the image of a leader who is not sure what he is going to do.
“May be there will be an election, and may be there will not be an election!”
Still, nothing is certain, still hesitating, still vacillating, still wavering, still unsure, still of a double mind.
It is like the young boy who would run down the steets, and shout “Fire!”, and the fire trucks would come out to find that there was no fire.
Then, when a real fire did ignite, and he shouted “Fire!”, nobody believed him.
No wonder we have a problem with cynicism, skepticism, and mistrust in our nation.
Ike
Bob R, would you by any chance be Bob Rae?
What a wonderful compliment, but no. I have a lot of respect for Bob Rae who only offers Dion alternatives. In the end he’ll be fully on board. He will not walk out mad and neither will all the other Liberals who help Dion to look at all aspects.
None of them will be chastised by Dion for offering alternatives. They do not have to be afraid of some control freak.
“She tells all our friends that I’ve got my Ph.D.
But it stands for post hole digger”
? By Dube on 02.18.08 7:10 pm
I was always told that PhD stands for “Past Having Doubts.” That Mr. Prentice, a Conservative from the Progressive side, is Past Having Doubts about the Liberals, I have no doubt.
Isn’t dog fighting illegal in Canada and the USA? Well, how do the afghan men get away with Animal Torture and. I’m confused? Isn’t animal abuse a criminal offense in Canada and the US of A? Is Animal Abuse OK in Afgan? Why’s
On Question Period, Feb. 17/08, Industry Minister Jim Prentice went on record as saying the Dion’s spending promises will drive Canada into deficit. He even flashed a new book, purporting to document the costing.
Now why would they take the time and expense of getting together some kind of a book on this subject rather than to extol the benefits of their budgets, past and future?
They know they spent the cupboard bare to buy votes. Now they need a big cover-up so, knowing a good defence is a good offense, they decided to cobble together some figures and maybe some figures have included the same things over and over but that doesn’t matter, so long as they can make it look bad for the Liberals. Robert Fife, in relating this story, even said,”the truth be damned”.
This is all the Conservatives are left with after making so many political finance decisions instead of decisions to benefit Canada, i.e. instead of lowering the GST the funds could have bought a lot of research, development, implementation and transitioning in regard to climate change and gearing up our infrastructure. Did they put any more real new money into health care? …into homelessness or child poverty? …or food regulation?
They are on the offensive and are being about as offensive as they can get!
Lately, it seems like everything the conservative elected members is a lie! Am I wrong? Hmmm, just silly analytical skills and logical thinking. I’m mostly wrong! What’s up with these negative ads anyways? Have our Conservatives got it wrong this time or have they finally got it right? Go figure!
Personally, I am really enjoying watching Harper and his Goon Squad and congregation of parrots SQUIRM! Why ruin such a grand show by bringing them down immediately?
Let ‘em SQUIRM like the worms they are, and have proven themselves to be over, and over.
Garth Why don’t the Liberals come up with the costs and how they are going to pay for it instead of calling ten Conservatives cost estimates of Liberal promises to date a lie? That isn’t to much to ask especially when it is our money they will be using.
By Van on 02.18.08 5:49 pm
Van, tell me, would you give up all your secrets in order to help your opponents? Keep asking if you must but don’t hold your breath waiting for an answer. As for Harry, I agree with Lana & others. Just ignore him & that will drive him crazy. IGNORE! IGNORE! IGNORE! He dosen’t deserve any more attention.
Cheers
to sell us a pig in a poke as they are doing now..
By Van on 02.18.08 5:52 pm
Carbon sequestration science has been around since the 1960’s. It ia a proven method of reducing CO2.
A carbon tax is NOT effective because it only deals with the demand side of the equation the large final emitters.
A cap and trade system on the other hand incents an unregulated sector of the economy to reduce their emissions so that together both the demand side reduction and the supply side reduction equal our international obligations without hurting our domestic economy.
We capture the methane from the pigs and poke holes in all the CON fear mongering and lies about sending money offshore.
Hmmm, it seems like the conservative governent has an accountabitity problem! What’s up with that? Where is Baird, Flaghty, and Harpers’ everyday spokespeoeple these days?
I would like to know; maybe it’s a secret! Oh well, what can I say?
My lifelong goal, to fence with a virtual idiot.
By Greg on 02.18.08 9:11 pm
Per chance, is this another take on virtual reality (computer-generated stuff which actually doesn’t exist), or is this the real Harry we’ve come to laugh at, ignore his ramblings and to play games with, like a cat toying with a mouse?
Curiouser and curiouser, said Alice through the looking glass. Hmmmmm.
Think I’m in The Twilight Zone.
Evidently, I was wrong and stand corrected.
However, if the election results stand and Musharaff’s party is gone, then things become as clear as mud.
The US probably won’t be able to use Pakistan as a means to enter Iran illegally, although they will come up with some other excuse.
http://tinyurl.com/2457lk
There seems to be some misunderstanding about my military metaphors comment. All that I meant by it was that the Liberals, and in particular Stephane Dion and the party’s Quebec wing, have developed a tradition of pacifism and a dislike of most things military.
When it comes time to fight an election, however, there is no shortage of military/tough-guy metaphors coming out of their mouths (just look at Garth’s blogs) when otherwise they would condemn such language as ‘too American-sounding.’
A few more multi-billion dollar losses.
A friend once told me that if I ever wanted to make easy money, go to Hong Kong, stand in the middle of a street and hold my hands up, ” ‘coz the money comes flying in”.
Someone else — an undercover cop who specialized in drugs — said the best investment anyone can make would be to buy a return ticket to Thailand; bring back a few of illicit plants.
That was before 9-11. No more.
http://tinyurl.com/ysez8m
By reid on 02.18.08 7:35 pm
Lots of name calling… something about an old stretcher told back in 93′… geez, if this is the best the New Cons can muster, lol.
By Sandy Canchuk on 02.18.08 9:32 pm
You’ve pretty much got it, Sandy. Joe, Kim and Garth are red Tories. Mulroney was… this new bunch is all blue. The “pure” brand as they say (cough choke). Yes, the New Cons are far removed from the party of old, much more refined!
It’s best revealed in the “Conservative” gallery at the house on the hill with nothing but Harper pictures there. No Con mug shot ghosts of past PM’s, just 24 blowups of Harper. Apparently, he’s a cut above all the rest, the dawn of the new Conseravative era that squashes all other Con goverment efforts in the history books as not worthy of rememberance compared to the present “importance” of the “ground breaking” history Harper makes now.
http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/304659
News like this casts strong doubt on how decisive Dion really is.
He has to set his terms and if the Conservatives cannot meet them then vote against the budget. The attitude of waiting for the budget before he decides how to vote and vote he will in favor if the Liberals think “it is not too detrimental to the economy” sounds like a defeatist attitude and abject submission to the will of the Conservatives.
I think Dion is held hostage by the cowards and unemployable Liberals (in the private sector) who are too comfortable in their position right now and enjoying the status quo and dare not venture for any risky endeavor lest such may prove a big failure.
What a bunches of wimps.
They both left the country with huge deficits that the Libs had to clear up. And, the libs will probably have to fix the economic mess that flim flam created.
By kpn on 02.18.08 6:34 pm
kpn, and which Liberal program helped get rid of the deficit (43 Billion)? Was it the GST cash cow (30 Billion in revenue)? Ooops, it was the conservative plan.
Was it the NAFTA agreement (which created an 80 Billion trade surplus)? Ooops, it was conservatives who put it in place?
Was it the reduction of 25 Billion in the transfer payments? Probably helped – on the backs of the provinces!!!
Do tell us kpn, what exactly did the Liberal initiated that was truly their own?
And now Stephane Dion doesn’t want to reduce our national debt (only by 3 Billion annually). So basically, he wants to put the burden on our children and grand children. What a visionary. Not!
BTW, Mr. McCallum truly appeared desperate on Question Period. Everyone knows that the Liberals LIED about their promises to scrap the GST and rip up NAFTA.
My lifelong goal, to fence with a virtual idiot.
By Greg on 02.18.08 9:11 pm
Make it a ‘FROST’ GALVANIZED CHAIN-LINK, 1/2″ MESH, 12 ft. high, TOPPED BY RAZOR WIRE.
Have you heard the latest about Gary Lunn[G]e and his bevy of lies and continuing boondoggles? Ditto for Antonio Clement[-eh?], Jim Prentice and Richardson @ Justice?
Parties let loose the buzzwords
Both sides of the House are using question period to stake out their positions. Glen McGregor examines how the parties are using their televised time.
The Ottawa Citizen
Published: Tuesday, February 19, 2008
In the daily political theatre of question period, often all that differentiates the opposition queries from the government’s replies is the question mark at the end of a sentence
http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/story.html?id=477c6431-cde2-4c57-8e70-8c5bbd7c8244
Liberals question anti-Kyoto ads
Demand investigation into alleged Tory links with global-warming-skeptic campaigning in 2006
MIKE DE SOUZA, Canwest News Service
Published: 5 hours ago
The federal Liberals are calling for an investigation to determine who paid for a radio ad campaign in Ontario that attacked the federal government’s action to fight climate change in the 2006 election.
Liberal MP Mark Holland said yesterday he would push for parliamentary hearings into the matter – raised in weekend reports by Canwest News Service – about a complaint to Elections Canada against a group of global warming skeptics
http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/news/story.html?id=a0c50621-844c-4b30-a08d-43244d138e4f
By Ike on 02.18.08 9:44 pm
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008/02/18/liberal-conservative.html
(chuckles)
Why hasnt CTV put this on the news?
Americans detain CTV journalist in Afghanistan: advocacy group
Last Updated: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 | 1:32 AM ET
The Canadian Press
The Committee to Protect Journalists expressed concerns Monday about the U.S. detention of a CTV journalist who had been working in the Kandahar province of Afghanistan.
The New York-based group said Jawed Ahmad, 22, also known as Jojo Yazemi, has been detained for almost three months by the U.S. military at Bagram Air Base near Kabul, the Afghan capital.
http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2008/02/19/ctv-journalist.html
“Perhaps one day, we could meet on the Plains of Abraham and decide the fate of our Country.
“Swords drawn of course.” –By Greg on 02.18.08 5:56 pm
Are you suggesting that we make the “Plains of Abraham” the best of three series?
I say, let’s give our best efforts to negotiating a true and a lasting “peace” before both sides get destroyed.
Let’s not “charge” mindlessly into disaster like Dion is doing. There is a better way. It is called compromise, diplomacy and peaceful negotiations.
I reach out my hand to you. Let’s remove our hands from swords and guns, and shake each other’s hand instead.
Let’s work together for the common good of our common humanity. Let’s make peace and not war. Our interests as fellow human beings are intertwined and interconnected. Let’s fight FOR one another and not AGAINST one another.
By Ike on 02.18.08 7:13 pm
Now that you have had some time to ponder, I’m sure you realize my reference to the Plains of Abraham was simply an historical reference to an event which contributed to the shaping of this country. Something that neither you nor I are likely to do. That was the point I was making. You interpreted the words too literally. It is also representative of a Battle fought long ago that seems to continue to be fought today. Swords drawn was another use of language to indicate that we would hold opposing views.
Firstly, you have no idea as to whether Dion is charging into disaster. Polls and the electorate are fickle, and the present mood of Canadians indicates to me that an election victory is open to be won or lost as things are now. I think that is why the CPC is exuding such fear and practicing fear mongering. Their record to date is not extraordinary, so it’s hard to fight a campaign based on all that they have accomplished. Yes? No?
The Liberals would go to the polls with a leader who is not going to win them many votes on his own merit, it appears, but collectively they have done their job in digging up dirt and muddying the waters. American style. The goal being to level the scale on scandal and corruption. I’ll trade you one adscam and some misc. lies and broken promises for…. Everything from Air Bus to Baird. Throw in a little Emmerson and the Minister who was never elected and voila.
So, back to your message of peace and handshakes. Lets struggle together toward Justice for all, not just some. Let’s be realistic about our place in the world, and let’s not pander to extremism. Even if the Elephant has big shoes. We have done it before, and survived. We can do it again.
As for Mr. Dion; he was chosen leader of the pack. Whether one likes the choice or not, it remains reality. It is his job to lead. Dissenters should be heard, it is the way of Democracy. The rest of the story is where the wild card comes in to play. How many times in your lifetime have you seen a majority government ram some policy or law down the throat of the People even though the People did not want it?
I am not there in that room where Liberal caucus meets and I don’t know how many support or oppose Dion on the upcoming matters. If you aren’t in that room, you can only speculate too. If you are, and have inside information, just say so. That changes the water somewhat, doesn’t it?
At some point in this journey, is there not a line in the sand to be honored or crossed? For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. If the apple is left to it’s own devices, eventually it will simply rot and fall to the ground anyway.
By Charles Oxley on 02.19.08 12:26 am
The answer is yes. Take your pick.
Thanks for my morning laugh..
Tradition and bravery is written in the struggle and the blood of fallen soldiers, and for anybody to suggest otherwise is an anathema to all brave and loyal soldiers.
You sir are beneath contempt …!
By Harry S on 02.18.08 9:47 pm
If you had a road map where X marks the spot, could you find your way home?
Where do virtual idiots live anyway?
will have to find $5.5 billion in new money
By Ike on 02.18.08 9:44 pm
Hey, Ikey! Wakey Wakey! That $5.5 billion FAILED TO TRICKLE DOWN to consumers … See CBC Marketplace … It does SEEM everyone saw a 1% price rise stacked atop all their purchases.
Shades of Emperor Byron of Muldoon, Ka-Ching Ka-Ching Dynasty and the manufacturing sales tax [which Byron said was HIDDEN] heh heh heh … like when he took 3 payments of $75 – $100 K from Karlheinz. But of course, according to Mikey Wallace, liar extraordinaire from Burlington, Byron of Muldoon ‘only made a mistake.’ LIKE WHEN MIKEY, HIMSELF, LIED, ABOUT PROTECTING SENIORS’ NESTEGGS!
PS–We have it from RELIABLE sources, the current state of economic downturn is caused SOLELY by childless fathers.
From one of the better journalists in the country who has literally PINNED the CONservatives on their ETHICS COMMITTEE PERFORMANCE.
Climbing Mount Mulroney with Giorgio Pelossi
http://forums.macleans.ca/advansis/?mod=for&act=dip&tt=&pid=106300&tid=106300&eid=48&so=&ps=&sb=&tso=&tps=&tsb=
I think the Committee needs some Ritalin for CONservative David Tilson, aka GRUMPY and a LYING DETECTOR for Hiebert, who was MOST INSIGHTFUL, in his pursuit of ‘how does one open a bank account in those circumstances?’
By Catherine on 02.19.08 4:29 am
And you, Catherine, are leaving the country with an INTELLIGENCE deficit. I can’t believe you and Leasa are being paid [as in a retainer] for your CONtributions here.
What are all your PO’ BOYS and GRRRLLZ going to do when they’re hit with the CTC papers?
Okay, I know off topic (like everyone else apparently). I just have to say I have a new super hero, I love this kid! Never say ‘can’t’. Leasa
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NJvgT60-mk&NR=1
So the CPC is test marketing their latest venture into retail politics. I see little good reason to discourage them.
“But the NDP’s Mr. Martin said if the former prime minister refuses the invitation, New Democrats will not vote to compel Mr. Mulroney to talk.
“You have to do a cost-benefit analysis to see whether its worth getting to the bottom of this ever or if we should take our lumps, put it on the trash heap of history and try not to ever let it happen again.”
Yes, folks, this is Pat Martin, IN PERSON … That LIVING SCION of the previous statement … “We’ll get to the bottom of this, if it’s the last thing” … Remember him tag-teaming with Thomas Mulcair … No, it wasn’t wrestling … It wasn’t even GOOD THEATRE.
http://webinfo.parl.gc.ca/MembersOfParliament/Images/OfficialMPPhotos/39/MartinPat_NDP.jpg
You probably don’t recall it was a DIPPER MEMBER, Irene Mathyssen, London- Fanshawe, who CAUGHT James Moore viewing SCANTILY CLAD WOMEN on his laptop. What have these DIPPERS come to?
Cockburn meant more than the obvious when he called it “the TV war news”.
DER FUBAR, Stephen Harper, made the following promise to a frantically worshipful gathering in Oakville published Sunday January 15 2006
“Instead of making phoney promises of huge benefits that never happen, we will deliver genuine, practical benefits that people experience,” Harper said, adding, “I believe it’s better to light one candle than to promise a million light bulbs.”***
*** and PROTECTING SENIORS’ NESTEGGS!
Why ARE the CPC accepting the end of surpluses as a premise, anyways?
By Catherine on 02.19.08 4:29 am
What are all your PO’ BOYS and GRRRLLZ going to do when they’re hit with the CTC papers?
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.19.08 7:52 am
Geez, Catherine, those CTC’s are arriving like cluster bombs/bomblets and THEY’VE BEEN SWORN, Catherine!
Garth, I don’t understand why the Liberals don’t make more of pointing out that a Liberal government eliminated the budget deficit left by a Conservative government. This would help counteract the typical knee jerk conservative accusation about “free spending Liberals”
DER FUBAR SPEAKS … AGAIN!
ABOUT THE IMPORTANCE OF KEEPING PROMISES
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjD2KZbnFfg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X93q2a4t9AA
There is no greater fraud than a promise not kept—Stephen Harper
Conservatives Failed Promise on the Atlantic Accord
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EddC8uWChWk
MacKay says, “It’s about 100%”
Gerald Keddy—South Shore—St. Margaret’s
MacKay says—Vote your conscience—and say ‘goodbye.’
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeadsmaigdw
I’m having trouble finding the download link to this ground-breaking “costing report” on the Conservative web site.
a little help?
Ted,
It wouldn’t be very helpful if Garth were to say that as he was a part of the Tory administration that left behind the deficit.
In addition, the deficit first reached such proportions under the Trudeau Liberals in the 1970s. When he came to power in 1968, the deficit was 1% of GDP. By the early 1980s, it was about 4.5%. The recession that then hit drove it up to 8.5%; that’s when the Tories came in. The brought it down to 4.5%, but the recession of the early ’90s brought it back up to 5.5%. The Liberals that followed did eliminate the deficit in just a few years — and deserve credit for doing it — but they were also responsible for creating the deficit problem in the first place.
DER FUBAR IS SEEING AVENGING SENIOR ANGELS
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnNsxCnyLdk
Just wait ’til we see Mikey Wallace in HIS community travels … I’m going to turn him into my VERY OWN piñata … AND THAT’S NO BULL!
Your thoughts … ??
By Harry S on 02.18.08 6:46 pm
Now Harry is asking for your thoughts, don’t give them to him. Is it possible is already feeling the rejections?
Greg Weston of sun media hit the nail on the head today.It is better to wait for the four byelections to see who may be comimg to parliament,then to go to a general election early and risk defeat.
“The Stephen Harper school of leadership, evidently, is to destroy your enemy instead of improving yourself.”
This is a quote from you in the above story. It reveals that you must a student of that same school as this primarily all you have been doing since I began reading your blog.
How can I improve? — Garth
By Catherine on 02.19.08 4:29 am
kpn, and which Liberal program helped get rid of the deficit (43 Billion)? Was it the GST cash cow (30 Billion in revenue)? Ooops, it was the conservative plan. – Catherine
http://www.taxpayer.com/pdf/Federal_Program_Spending_and_Revenues_1961-2009.pdf
Boy, did you miss it. Mulroney’s $330 billion in deficits over 10 years forced us into a GST we should never have had needed to begin with.
Mulroney took over in June of 83′ and produced a budget he could call his own in 84′, inheriting a national debt of $193.4 billion. 10 years of Conservative budgets later (yeah, 2 elections in 10 years is that normal?) and our national debt is $524 billion. The numbers speak for themselves.
The rest of your post is to baseless to bother with. I really wish you would stop shitting us and wasting our time, Catherine. Truly.
What’s coming down in 15 days, Garth?
Why would anyone in their right mind want to share thoughts with Harry S?
Hard to share thoughts with the brain-less.
They wouldn’t know truth and facts if it was put in front of them – by them, I mean Harry S, Catherine, Leasa and all the gullible CPC trolls.
Unfortunately you have to wade through their brainwashed rhetoric to read the other responsers.
Just wait ’til we see Mikey Wallace in HIS community travels … I’m going to turn him into my VERY OWN piñata … AND THAT’S NO BULL!
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.19.08 8:58 am
Ummm, Garth, allowing comments like this is tacit approval of what they are saying.
Are you condoning violence against other Members of Parliament?
Only when it involves goat sacrifices. — Garth
QUEBEC – Stephane Dion said Monday his Liberals might let the federal budget pass if they believe it is not too detrimental to the economy.
Finally, no verbal commitment is being made, hopefully this will keep on confusing the Cons and they will waste all their capital on non-productive talk. Are the Libs for or against something, why should they tell all before a vote or an election? Confusion to your enemies.
Harry S, Catherine, Leasa
By slg on 02.19.08 9:36 am
You forgot Ikey, Mikey and Crikey. We have a history-making PHOTOGRAPH of Mikey and DER FUBAR, walking a quiet street in east Burlington, looking SUPREMELY CONFIDENT they COULD LIE WHILE THE OTHER WOULD BE PREPARED TO SWEAR TO IT. The BACKDROP is a natural for TWO CHUBBY CHUMS who have just exited the CHUBBY CHUM LUNCH ROOM.
Consider, for example, the case of MP Raymond Chan, who recently faced local accusations he hadn’t been on top of a Japanese community issue in his Vancouver-area riding.
After the former Liberal Cabinet minister called a news conference to explain himself, an official with Public Safety Minister Stockwell Day’s office slipped local Asian media a list of embarrassing questions on Mr. Chan’s behavior (with the correct answers helpfully included in brackets). Some of the less-than-diligent news-hounds obliged by firing a few of the government-scripted questions at Mr. Chan.
Of course, this is precisely the sort of antic the Conservatives angrily condemned when a CBC reporter was caught feeding a Liberal MP questions to ask former prime minister Brian Mulroney. But because the tactic was helpful to the government in no-rules pre-writ warfare, it was deemed just dandy with the Prime Minister’s Office.
Would this not be a more productive question for Question period instead of one that the cons try to throw back at the Libs?
I find it strange that participants on this blog will demand of one political party that they be completely open, transparent and honest with no secrets or “hidden agenda,” and on the other hand, when it comes to their own party, they say, “Keep your enemy guessing. Confuse him with pretensions of going to battle and then backing off. Keep them guessing. Don’t reveal your battle plan to your enemy.”
Where is the consistent committment to truth in this? Why the double standard? Why demand transparency in others when you are brazenly willing to justify not being transparent yourself?
Friends, we have met the enemy, and it is us.
“No verbal commitment is being made, hopefully this will keep on confusing the Cons and they will waste all their capital on non-productive talk. Are the Libs for or against something, why should they tell all before a vote or an election? Confusion to your enemies.”
–By Geminesse
Deceifulness intended to confuse, and to obfuscate, are now praised and openly recommended as legitimate political weapons to manipulate and to deceive.
This is a sad day for democracy when you see this sort of thing openly and overtly recommended as part of party policy and propaganda.
Surely this is wrong. The truth is always the best weapon in the long term if trust and respect is to be restored.
Now for some positive news. Canada’s annual inflation rate eased to 2.2 per cent in January from 2.4 per cent in December.
That is the lowest inflationary rate since August, Statistics Canada said Tuesday.
In its news release Tuesday, the agency credited the federal government’s one-point cut in the Goods and Services Tax and ongoing benefits from Canada’s relatively high dollar.
By disturbed on 02.19.08 9:37 am
If you’re looking forward to becoming an obstacle to ground-breaking progress, that won’t be a problem to me. The crosshairs are set and the string is tight.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyxpVn61iJg
Blah, blah, blah! Sheesh.
Okay, I am reverting back to early childhood basic philosophy.
Starting with the ‘Boy Who Cried Wolf!’
One, two, three….No one believed him anymore.
Likewise Harper and his so-called government, a minority government, a joke of a government.
Second, the old tried and proven American political trick of the Single Issue Election. Sorry, that only works on mindless sheeple, not intelligent and informed people.
All the ballyhoo about this so-called, actually yet to be called election is a waste of my time. It is like watching the promo for the WWE. everyone yelling how tough they are. How righteous they are…but no actual wrestling to be seen. Nope you have to PAY for that.
Well, here we go wasting another friggin’ $300 million because the two main parties would rather posture than participate.
I’ve HAD IT!
Nothing but BS lies and machismo CRAP!
Have fun, I am going to go make some money and get back to real life.
After this country is totally FUBAR’d I will be happy to offer my consulting services at the highest price. Until then…Ya’ll figure it out!
Oh, and as to Ontario’s auto industry. I have already done my part. I bought one of their overpriced cars, didn’t even get the Green rebate, and paid thousands in taxes on the purchase. Fortunately, I got a good one. Don’t even mention more taxes to this taxpayer. NOT MY PROBLEM!
Tell GM and Ford to cut their CEO’s, VP’s, and all the other top heavy manager’s salaries by 80%. to 90%. They’ll be amazed how much money they suddenly have. They are not getting any more of MINE! Same goes for the friggin’ gluttonous oil companies. Bring back NEP, and arrest these polluting bastards and redition them to Hell.
Wolf! WOLF! WOlf! GULP! Guess who is going to do the biting now?
Dion signals retreat
Behind-the-scenes reasons why Liberals want election delayed
By GREG WESTON – Toronto Sun – February 19, 2008
Now for the good news: Fresh off his triumphant about-face over Canada’s role in the Afghanistan war, Stephane Dion is now apparently retreating from an election.
The current minority Parliament is facing a series of critical votes starting next week, any one of which the three opposition parties could use to trigger an April trip to the ballot box.
Since the New Democrats and separatist Bloc Quebecois have all but declared their unanimous support for an election, the fate of Stephen Harper’s government is likely to rest in Dion’s hands.
It is no secret the Liberal leader has been champing at the bit since last fall, convinced that a race to the polls would give him the public exposure he needs to win over Canadian voters.
(Dion’s belief that the more Canadians see of him, the more they will like him, is thought to be widely shared by his immediate family and delusional friends.)
Not surprisingly, we are now hearing the phone lines into Dion’s office have been afire in recent weeks with Liberals from across the country trying to rein in their hapless leader, urging him to hold his horses at least until the fall.
Indeed, for all the talk in the media about growing election momentum within the Liberal party, it is remarkably difficult to find gung-ho Grits not under medication.
They don’t appear to be in his office.
Sources tell us the seasoned veterans among Dion’s staff are urging the leader to approach the coming votes with extreme caution, if not his old trusty white flag.
AVOID IT LIKE THE PLAGUE
……………………………….
More devastating facts from article at:
http://tinyurl.com/2fr5qg
Deceifulness intended to confuse, and to obfuscate, are now praised and openly recommended as legitimate political weapons to manipulate and to deceive.
This is a sad day for democracy when you see this sort of thing openly and overtly recommended as part of party policy and propaganda.
Surely this is wrong. The truth is always the best weapon in the long term if trust and respect is to be restored.
By Ike on 02.19.08 10:34 am
We don’t agree on very much but this is something on which we can agree.
By the way did you get your e-mail from the Conservatives to reserve your election campaign signs?
Friends, we have met the enemy, and it is us.
By Ike on 02.19.08 10:34 am
Strange … most STRANGE, how history repeats the lessons of the past. Joseph Goebbels said the same thing, long ago.
“Freunde, wir haben den Feind, und es ist uns.”
great. Maybe YOU’VE got a link to that report the CPC is on about, then. I’m having trouble finding it.
How can I improve? — Garth
You doing great Garth, stick to the undisclosed plan, avoid explaining anything, especially carbon trading and above all stay out of the HoC during a vote.
It seems to be working, parliament hasn`t screwed up as much lately as they usually do.
Greg said I should let my sense of humour come to the forefront, lol blame him.
Former Liberal MP dumps her party: Considers running with Layton’s NDP
Sunday, February 17, 2008
http://tinyurl.com/22wh7v
It will come as a surprise to English readers (as well Liberal MP Marcel Proulx it would appear) that the latest bombshell to hit political Ottawa is the speculation that Francoise Boivin may run for the NDP in the next federal election.
The former Liberal MP for Gatineau and chair of the women’s caucus has given up on her old party and is speaking very positively about running with the NDP following her discussions with Layton, Thomas Mulcair and even party stalwart Ed Broadbent.
The stunning news of Boivin’s decision is another sign of the changing face of federal politics in Quebec.
In the next election, Quebec will be key. Yet it is in Quebec that the misdeeds of the Sponsorship scandal have the most resonance and where the Liberal brand is the most discredited.
The NDP has been out performing the Liberals in Quebec since the 2006 Repentigny by-election and the September 2007 by-elections where the Liberals lost their Outremont stronghold to Mulcair and placed a shocking fourth overall.
For a party to defeat Harper in the next election, it will need to have credibility on the war, credibility on the environment, as well as the crucial name recognition of former MPs like Boivin in Quebec.
Boivin’s interest in the NDP is another sign of what could be a hopeful reemergence of a progressive federalist force in Quebec. The Harper Conservatives have reason to look worried.
Now, here is the way things should be. Great Quotes from Great Leaders
A lesson for all of us, and especially the MP’s who we have entrusted our future to. Most especially those who aspire to be our Prime Minister.
From History’s School of REAL Leadership!
Isn’t dog fighting illegal in Canada and the USA? By Sandy Canchuk on 02.18.08 10:12 pm
Illegal in Canada. Illegal in 48 states across the line. I believe it is Idaho and Wyoming that still allow this barbaric sport. Too bad Mike Vick didn’t do a minimum of research before setting up a kennel in Virginia, as he could still play football had he done it in a legal state.
Greg said I should let my sense of humour come to the forefront, lol blame him.
By got rope? on 02.19.08 11:26 am
I can vouch for Rope on that one. LMAO!
I repeat that if Monsieur Dion had followed through on his original call to “Let’s Bring On the Election!” over one year ago now, it would have been far better for him.
One cannot use the excuse that the “well has been poisoned” over the last year (as Greg has done), because it was Monsieur Dion himself who challenged us all to go for it! He should not have made the challenge, in all honesty, if the well was poisoned, and he did not realize it. That is not leadership.
We are now hearing that the phone lines into Monsieur Dion’s office have been afire in recent days with Liberals from across the country trying to rein in their hapless leader, urging him to hold his horses at least until the fall.
Sources now tell us the seasoned veterans among Dion’s staff are urging the leader to approach the coming votes with extreme caution, if not his old trusty white flag.
The naysayers include prominent Grits who have been critical of the party’s abstaining on important votes and propping up the Harper government, all just to avoid an election.
Now they are arguing the political risks from the Liberals’ sitting on their hands one more time for next week’s budget pale compared to the perils of an immediate campaign.
The question remains, “What if the CONS make the federal budget so odious and so obnoxious and so toxic that to even consider sitting on your hands when it comes up for a vote, or to abstain, becomes unthinkable?” What will it take to get Monsieur Dion to make a firm decision, and to stick with it? The more he abstans, the more the “not a leader” image sticks ever deeper.
The reluctant electioneers in the Lib Brigade point out the party is short of money, candidates, organizers, ground workers and planks for a platform.
At this writing, the Liberals can’t even find a campaign plane, and Dion’s practice sessions for the pivotal televised leaders’ debates are described by one party insider as “frightening.”
Other than that, as Dion says, the party is ready to go.
A majority of diehard Liberals has to imagine the party’s chances of winning the next election under Dion’s leadership are slim to nil, no matter when it is held.
When the Liberals who most want an election are those who most want to heave the leader and take over the party, it’s little wonder Dion is taking his finger off the trigger.
Yet he has taken his finger off the trigger aimed at this present government one too many times. That political game is now over!
Another ‘I fixed it….NOT!’ by Harper!
This is NOT getting it Done Steve!
Used tanks won’t roll for years
The second-hand tanks the Harper government is buying from the Netherlands will require extensive work before they can be put into the military’s inventory, with some contractors suggesting it could be years before all the vehicles are ready for action.
The first batch of used Leopard 2 tanks will arrive in Canada next month and the government will then begin the process of hiring a Canadian firm to overhaul the vehicles.
At least 20 of the 100 tanks will be refurbished and upgraded in Europe, cutting out Canadian companies from taking part in that contract.
When the Harper government announced the $1.3-billion tank program last year, it promised that domestic firms would reap large amounts of work from the project.
But Dan Ross, the head of the Defence Department’s procurement branch, has warned there are few Canadian firms that can handle the job of refurbishing the tanks. That, in turn, has raised questions about the level of economic benefits domestic firms will obtain from the deal, as well as how quickly the project will proceed.
Canadian defence industry officials have been increasingly frustrated about the pace of the tank program. In a November meeting with industry representatives, military officers confirmed that the Dutch Leopards have been in long-term storage and will require a comprehensive program of inspection and repairs.
But industry representatives told the Defence Department it could take until 2013 to bring the first 20 Leopards up to snuff. That prompted military officials to come up with a plan to give some of the refurbishment work to European firms.
After which time, please note, we will NOT need them, nor having spent $1.3 BILLION on used gear!
Plan Aheadddd? Leading us into the future…NOT!
Dion signals retreat
Behind-the-scenes reasons why Liberals want election delayed
GREG WESTON-Toronto Sun-February 19, 2008
Nothing more than a ‘note to Harper’ to inform him that Sun Media is prepared to accept large sums of money in the interest of CONTINUED UNBIASED REPORTING. Place your graphics and print media money with us, Steve!
He may well receive an invitation to Sussex and be allowed to share Stevie’s peanutbutter and jam sandwiches. There can be no healthier speculation than speculating about the value of your own speculations.
Bill Muskoka, I really enjoyed your “Great Quotes from Great Leaders” link. These were leaders from different political parties and countries as diverse as Sir Winston Churchill, Abraham Lincoln, Ronald Reagan, J. F. Kennedy, Mother Teresa, and Pope John Paul II.
The thing that occured to me while I was watching was that most, if not all of these great leaders were demonized and vilified by critics in their day, and yet now in hindsight, history has tended to look on them more kindly.
We all have our present perspectives, but who of us is to say how history will judge our present leaders in 20 years? Any one of us could be wrong, and may we be humble enough to admit it.
I know that my perspective is just that–a present perspective, for what it is worth. Oh that we would recognize that we are all fellow human beings, and that our common interests are intertwined and interconnected.
Nations that do not rise up above the polarities of different groups motivated by self-interest tend to start justify doing inhuman things to one another, and even intentionally deceiving another another, until the nation self-destructs and implodes from within.
It is a case of united we stand, divided we fall.
That is not idealism. It is just plain, outright and forthright realism.
Wisdom: ‘No man builds a tower without first counting the costs!’ Luke 14:28
We all have our present perspectives, but who of us is to say how history will judge our present leaders in 20 years? Any one of us could be wrong, and may we be humble enough to admit it.
By Ike on 02.19.08 12:25 pm
All depends on who wirtes the history, eh?
A Great Leader is one who is human, in touch which their fellow mankind, and errs, yet admits the error, and learns from it.
There is no such living person that has not erred in this life, nor shall there be. Those who believe they have achieved perfection merely delude themselves. All coins have two sides.
Personally, I trust one who has erred and admits it, but never one who will not!
“Personally, I trust one who has erred and admits it, but never one who will not!” –By Bill-Muskoka
Agreed!
Nations that do not rise up above the polarities of different groups motivated by self-interest tend to start justify doing inhuman things to one another, and even intentionally deceiving another another, until the nation self-destructs and implodes from within.
It is a case of united we stand, divided we fall.
That is not idealism. It is just plain, outright and forthright realism.
By Ike on 02.19.08 12:25 pm
Which perfectly describes Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, and now Serbia/Kosovo.
‘There is nothing new under the sun!’ Solomon’s Wisdom!
‘Fools proudly stand firm in the face of inescapable disaster, falsely!’
‘Denial is not just a river in Egypt!’
‘Pride goeth before a fall’
‘Those filled with false pride are fools. Therefore, they shall fall always!’
Today’s Connect The Dots lesson in reality!
Just read the Mclean’s Blog.
Bafflegarb! pure and simple these reporters where fed Bafflegarb!
If that is what our “Neo-Cons” think that we deserve, then they are in for a shock come the election.
Now-a-days it seems that everything I read out of Ottawa in the MSM is just chock full of lies and bafflegarb.
Do you CPC jerks really find the people of Canada that stupid?
Man, You are in for one hell of a surprise!
I for one will be off my couch and out campaigning I am so mad at your treatment of the truth.
And I warn you now that I will fight as dirty as you!
sop you keep on acting as you do.
It infuriates people like me into action.
He may well receive an invitation to Sussex and be allowed to share Stevie’s peanutbutter and jam sandwiches. There can be no healthier speculation than speculating about the value of your own speculations.
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.19.08 12:20 pm
Moral: Peanut butter tends to stick to the roof of one’s mouth, and with it their tongue!’ Shall we send Steve the stickier, thicker variety to save our country, and perhaps, out of sheer humanity, himself? He does seem to be in a ‘jam’!
Ike, on your 12:05 post you said;
I repeat that if Monsieur Dion had followed through on his original call to “Let’s Bring On the Election!” over one year ago now, it would have been far better for him.
****************************
Be fair now Ike. If it had been you, would you have instegated an electiones so soon especially with the coffers next to empty? Try to keep in mind that Mr. Dion became the leader of the Liberal Party a little more than 1 year ago so why would you think he should have brought the government down right away? Come on now, be honest. Place yourself in his shoes. Would you have & would that have been a smart move? The big question I have is why did Harper start his attack on Mr. Dion as soon as he was elected the Party leader?
I have a question that has been asked many times & never to my knowledge ever been answered. If according to the CPC & the trolls out there, why do they fear Mr. Dion so much to warrant for the 4th time in little more than 1 year, spending millions of dollars to discredit that man? Another question that has been asked & never answered, how much of the money in the CPC coffers actually came from his friends across the borders? My guess is quite a lot & those facts will come to light eventually.
Have a good day,
Cheers
It infuriates people like me into action.
By A.R.Wainwright on 02.19.08 1:29 pm
An old, but living idea we, as free people, and I stand firmly on:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.
Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.
Now, here is the way things should be. Great Quotes from Great Leaders
A lesson for all of us, and especially the MP’s who we have entrusted our future to. Most especially those who aspire to be our Prime Minister.
From History’s School of REAL Leadership!
By Bill-Muskoka on 02.19.08 11:29 am
Thanks Bill for posting this. Inspirational. I have forwarded it on.
Does Harper think himself to be the Messiah? Seems so, but he surely doesn’t follow the former’s teachings or style!
Harper’s 12
In the PM’s inner circle, there’s no room for sentiment or tolerance for failure. Maclean’s looks at who’s in, who’s out, and who has real power in Ottawa.
Read and learn the Players in power, or so they delude themselves to be! They forget ‘We the People’ inside their self-delusional Star Chamber of sealed doors, guarded assemblies, and covert plannings!
By Bill-Muskoka on 02.19.08 1:31 pm
Quebecor is going through a period of “rationalization,” despite assurances that the Quebecor’s downturn would not cause a chain-reaction in its newspaper business. That’s one of the reasons I think Sun is approaching the CPC, who have FAT campaign coffers, as a means to enlisting those funds to cover part of Sun Media’s fixed and variable costs … regardless of the potentially strident political message.
The little paper that shrank
htp://www.rrj.ca/online/644/
Quebecor’s call for a new formula to retain eyeballs is a familiar refrain. Change for Sun Media in the 21st century has meant substantial cutbacks more than once. In 2001, Quebecor — which purchased the group of tabloids in 1998 — eliminated 302 positions across the chain. Last June, there was another round of layoffs at Sun Media that meant another 120 jobs lost, including 30 at the Sun in Toronto. This move alone will save the company $4.6 million a year. Now there are worries of yet more layoffs across the board. “I was told it’s a fact,” says a former staffer. “The rumours are about when and who.” Many employees are already looking for work elsewhere.
1. Do you CPC jerks really find the people of Canada that stupid?
2. It infuriates people like me into action.
It’s easy to reply in the affirmative in both instances.
The one YES, important to US ALL, is #2.
Suit proves NAFTA needs fixing
The flawed provisions of NAFTA that allow a foreign investor rights to sue governments that make appropriate decisions to protect the environment. Bilcon, proponent of the White Point Quarry project that was rejected last year, is suing the government for more than $188 million for rejecting the development.
Is Harpers secrative SPP deal helping???
Personally, I trust one who has erred and admits it, but never one who will not! By Bill Muskoda
That means you don’t trust Harper, Dion, Layton or May because not one of them have admitted their errors. All they do is spin thier errors to try and make them truthful.
Plan Aheadddd? Leading us into the future … NOT!
By Bill-Muskoka on 02.19.08 12:11 pm
Neither O’Connor [of the really C.R.A.F.T. y] nor MacKay, who is ready to juggle 3 plates of tatters, gravy and turkey, in a single bound, GOT IT DONE!
Somewhere I have a graphic copy of the “signed note” MacKay gave to Orchard in the PC leadership. When I hear he’s visiting our area, I will reproduce it in quantity for his worshipping throngs.
How can I improve? — Garth
For one is to take the chip off your shoulder.
Would you like a hug? — Garth
By Ike on 02.19.08 12:05 pm
You misquote or again misunderstand my statement. The well was poisoned by adscam. I didn’t say it had become poisoned over the past year,
and you and yours make too much of the lets get back to power rhetoric.
The paranoia created by that remark, among your rank and file seems to be over the top.
You said;
“We are now hearing that the phone lines into Monsieur Dion’s office have been afire in recent days with Liberals from across the country trying to rein in their hapless leader, urging him to hold his horses at least until the fall.”
I’m wondering where are “we” hearing this from, and who is “we”? Along with the myriad of other insider goodies that you profess to have knowledge of, makes one wonder just what position in the CPC help desk you occupy? Or could it be that you represent the clandestine efforts of the timid? Ah, the intrigue!
Your writings are oddly similar to Leasa’s and Counsin “It’s”
Still I say, your tone smacks of fear.
I recall your asking me to engage you in discussion, yet you don’t respond to my post. Instead to cherry pick a point to misquote. Is that how you discuss issues?
I had to smile a wry smile at your righteous indignation over the concept that the Libs might be toying with your camp by going to the brink then withdrawing. That was actually rather amusing. Ethical politicking, oh yeah, uh huh. Big funny.
The thought of that as a strategy occurred me when the latest rumors hit the mill. In some cases its useful, in this case not especially.
C’mon Ike, fess up. Do you share a cubicle with Leasa and Harry or is it one of those work from home jobs we read about?
Van, tell me, would you give up all your secrets in order to help your opponents? Keep asking if you must but don’t hold your breath waiting for an answer. By Irene
Your answer is about one of the dumbest comments ever made on this blog. If that is indeed the Liberal postion then that tells me that they have no idea of how much it is going to cost us to implement the full Kyoto agreement even when we are 12aers behind the schedule. Sorry but this sure isn’t the way to gain my vote.
Hi kpn on, thanks for the fun link!
There is no such living person that has not erred in this life, nor shall there be. Those who believe they have achieved perfection merely delude themselves. All coins have two sides.
Personally, I trust one who has erred and admits it, but never one who will not!
By Bill-Muskoka on 02.19.08 12:51 pm
………………………………..
And this pompous proclamation from somebody who claims to be an American ex-Marine, but spells “honor” as “honour” and “savior” as “saviour” … and is unwilling to admit his own errant ways while hiding in obscure anonymity.
Personally, I trust one who has erred and admits it, but never one who will not …!!!
Irene, I realize that hindsight is 20/20. I am only suggesting that in hindsight, it might have been better to pull the plug one year ago as threatened.
As to if I would have done better, I admit that I could have made the same mistake. As humans, we all err. It is just that in hindsight, a costly error has been made, and now it is increasingly difficult to get all of the pieces back together again.
Greg, I assure you that I share no cubicle with either Harry or Leasa or anybody else. I am by no means on the same page with them on many issues. I am my own person, and try to comment from reliable sources.
The source of my information in my recent post was from Greg Westin.
http://tinyurl.com/2fr5qg
I realize that this blog is filled with different opinions from journalists, but Greg is one who usually does his homework. Time will tell.
Have a good one!
Personally, I have come to the position that Harper should try to stay in power as long as he can, because the media is in the process of turning against Dion …. not against the Liberal Party, against Dion.
Some time last week, his bubble burst. Every time the Liberals contrive a way of not voting against a bill they strongly oppose, the more they look like losers puffing smelly hot air.
Meanwhile, Goodale and McCallum are spouting on CBC non-stop, while Dion is kept under covers. A few months of the news being filtered through a parliamentary press that can’t stop making Dion jokes, and Dion’s credibility will be in tatters.
And Dion will get hammered in any next election. They’ll make him look like the mole in Whack-A-Mole … and you’ll want to thump him on the head with a nerf hammer every time you see his little rodent face on the tube. His lips will be moving, and you’ll be looking for a giant Monte Python foot to come down on him.
And Jack will run on the platform of … “You can still oppose the government without supporting idiots. Vote NDP ..!!!”
Here is the link, repaired. Sorry.
Harper’s 12
Harry S…ssszzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.19.08 2:03 pm
I hear the Sun is setting? Could we be that lucky?
Thanks Bill for posting this. Inspirational. I have forwarded it on.
By kpn on 02.19.08 1:58 pm
It was my fortune to receive and then share it. You are most welcome.
All they do is spin thier errors to try and make them truthful.
By Van on 02.19.08 2:21 pm </i.
Therefore, I do not trust YOU!
Answer this question for redemption, Van.
Then we can say this, eh?
By Harry S on 02.19.08 2:53 pm
One day, not long ago, you suggested you ‘could look after yourself.’ You won’t have to do that Harry A$$. When I’m done with you, there won’t be anything left to look after. That’s a PROMISE.
Sneak recording a Harper Caucus meeting.
I hear the Sun is setting? Could we be that lucky?
By Bill-Muskoka on 02.19.08 3:19 pm
They used to call here all the time. I had one caller in stitches because I told him I wouldn’t take that newspaper until they changed it to 4-ply, which would encourage me to recycle after use, but I never wanted to read it, even if it was free forever.
Maybe YOU can provide me with a link to this report we’re supposed to be talking about?
By Ike on 02.19.08 3:01 pm
I see why you didn’t provide a link the first time. Doesn’t the wide ranging claims without any references to sources bother you at all?
The article could have been entitled, “While standing at the water cooler”.
Someone posted a similar broadside from the National Post recently. No sources there either. Maybe these guys shared a cubicle in the men’s room.
I noticed the Sunshine Girl link at the side of the article. At least that was worth looking at.
Here are the rest of the questions from my earlier post that you didn’t address;
I think that is why the CPC is exuding such fear and practicing fear mongering. Their record to date is not extraordinary, so it’s hard to fight a campaign based on all that they have accomplished. Yes? No?
How many times in your lifetime have you seen a majority government ram some policy or law down the throat of the People even though the People did not want it?
At some point in this journey, is there not a line in the sand to be honored or crossed?
You can answer them at your leisure. Or not.
Have a good one too.
By Catherine on 02.19.08 4:29 am
And you, Catherine, are leaving the country with an INTELLIGENCE deficit. I can’t believe you and Leasa are being paid [as in a retainer] for your CONtributions here.
What are all your PO’ BOYS and GRRRLLZ going to do when they’re hit with the CTC papers?
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.19.08 7:52 am
PP, why don’t you prove that I am “are being paid [as in a retainer] for your CONtributions here.”!
You are such a deranged individual – are you sure you are even Canadian?
By Catherine on 02.19.08 4:29 am
kpn, and which Liberal program helped get rid of the deficit (43 Billion)? Was it the GST cash cow (30 Billion in revenue)? Ooops, it was the conservative plan. – Catherine
http://www.taxpayer.com/pdf/Federal_Program_Spending_and_Revenues_1961-2009.pdf
Boy, did you miss it. Mulroney’s $330 billion in deficits over 10 years forced us into a GST we should never have had needed to begin with.
Mulroney took over in June of 83? and produced a budget he could call his own in 84?, inheriting a national debt of $193.4 billion. 10 years of Conservative budgets later (yeah, 2 elections in 10 years is that normal?) and our national debt is $524 billion. The numbers speak for themselves.
The rest of your post is to baseless to bother with. I really wish you would stop shitting us and wasting our time, Catherine. Truly.
By brain on 02.19.08 9:13 am
Brian – you should change your signature – as you sure are not using your “brain”. There was NO 330 Billion deficit in 1993! You do realize what deficit means – right?
And brian, you should look at 2000-2001, where the LIberals had close to 20 Billion as a surplus and paid a whoppy 44 Billion in service charges! Whose pockets were lined with those service charges?!
You are such a deranged individual – are you sure you are even Canadian?
By Catherine on 02.19.08 4:14 pm
Pyotr,
Remember that in CC’s world everyone thinks the same…as per their orders.
See my Secret Caucus recording, you will understand even better than now. LOL
You are such a deranged individual – are you sure you are even Canadian?
By Catherine on 02.19.08 4:14 pm
Duh, Yup, Yup, Catherine! I be an EVEN Canadian …
Are you Marjorie Morningstar, of the Byron of Muldoon appointment offal?
How many under-the-table secret hotel appointments for kickback did you PERSONALLY SCHEDULE?
You really think stiffing the banks is a good idea?
btw, a little more vigilance on spelling brain’s nick would be nice.
By Catherine on 02.19.08 4:23 pm
That ‘table,’ so thoughtfully provided by the taxpayer group, has been doctored!
Before Trudeau, the DEBT was $13 Billion.
After Trudeau, it was $125 Billion.
After Byron of Muldoon, it was $585 BILLION. You do the math.
Remember, Byron of Muldoon was responsible for the policies which promoted unemployment, runaway inflation, high interest rates and the whole gamut of economic side effects.
Whose pockets were lined with those service charges?!
Interesting question, that. Lending institutions normally charge interest.
That might be an all-new concept to you, but most of the rest of us understand that.
Those institutions usually LEND at current market rates, which have been low and are dropping LOWER in the near term.
Are you going to take credit for the lower rates?
Let me give you a big rah, rah, rah for that … BRONX CHEER!
I don’t think you’re an EVEN Canadian.
Maybe YOU can provide me with a link to this report we’re supposed to be talking about?
By Brian Dondo on 02.19.08 3:45 pm
Until you see their estimates by line item, everything they say is SUSPECT.
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.19.08 3:30 pm
One day, not long ago, you suggested you ‘could look after yourself.’ You won’t have to do that Harry A$$. When I’m done with you, there won’t be anything left to look after. That’s a PROMISE.
………………………………..
Name the place and time .. and don’t bring your mother …!!!
Here is the link, repaired. Sorry.
Harper’s 12
By Bill-Muskoka on 02.19.08 3:06 pm
Again Bill thx for posting this link. As I don’t subscribe to Macleans I wasn’t able to read it when it was discussed a couple of weeks ago. Have started to read, and bookmarked it, but will wait till t’morrow when, hopefully, my mind is more functional.
From what I can gather they gave a bunch of hardcopies to the press gallery.
Now THERE’S a pack of sharp ones.
Name the place and time .. and don’t bring your mother … !!!
Nikolai Nikolaivitch on 02.19.08 5:23 pm
It’ll be at the appointed place and time when I first catch you acting up. I’ll give you a chance to become a ragmop, in front of ALL YOUR FRIENDS at a particular political meeting. I plan to attend at least a dozen meetings in ridings around Toronto. Which riding do you call HOME?
Under LIES HARPER’S PEOPLE TOLD Maclean’s
His enemies—he’s made a few since taking charge of the country’s budget—have worse names for him. Flaherty’s shocking decision to tax income trusts in October 2006, breaking a Conservative party campaign promise, turned many in the business community against him. One irate stockbroker in Louisiana allegedly threatened to cut Flaherty’s throat, prompting criminal charges. Security for the married father of 16-year-old triplet boys was later beefed up. Things also got heated on the East Coast over Ottawa’s new equalization rules, introduced in Flaherty’s 2007 budget. Newfoundland Premier Danny Williams, who claimed the government’s formula undermined the Atlantic accord, called for his resignation.
Word Count: 8,252 without any TRUTH
LIES TOLD TO MACLEAN’S–HARPER FRONT
His enemies—he’s made a few since taking charge of the country’s budget—have worse names for him. Flaherty’s shocking decision to tax income trusts in October 2006, breaking a Conservative party campaign promise, turned many in the business community against him.
One irate stockbroker in Louisiana allegedly threatened to cut Flaherty’s throat, prompting criminal charges. Security for the married father of 16-year-old triplet boys was later beefed up. Things also got heated on the East Coast over Ottawa’s new equalization rules, introduced in Flaherty’s 2007 budget.
Newfoundland Premier Danny Williams, who claimed the government’s formula undermined the Atlantic accord, called for his resignation.
It’ll be at the appointed place and time when I first catch you acting up. I’ll give you a chance to become a ragmop, in front of ALL YOUR FRIENDS at a particular political meeting. I plan to attend at least a dozen meetings in ridings around Toronto. Which riding do you call HOME?
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.19.08 5:37 pm
……………………………….
Come on PP-boy … just list the dozen or so political meetings that you will be attending in Toronto, and I will give you advance notice of my appearance .. and then we can meet outside, and we can settle on your boasting that:
“When I’m done with you, there won’t be anything left to look after.”
(Bring along ex-Marine-Minnow Billy-M if you fear for your welfare.)
“When I’m done with you, there won’t be anything left to look after.”
By Harry S on 02.19.08 6:13 pm
Still waiting to learn which riding you call HOME. Your attempt to goad is childish. I want to be able to mop the floor with your filthy carcass. I PROMISE … You don’t want to tell me because you’re afraid … That’s it … Harry A$$ is scairt skinney.
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.19.08 5:37 pm
Oooooooooooo! HS has issued a challenge, but he never had the balls to say if he had served his country in the military. Maybe he will be recognizable by his BIG MOUTH, and the ooze that froths from it.
Gee, hope the meat inspectors aren’t around, they may think He has BSE and shoot him!
I’ll be looking for his list of TH meetings he plans to attend as well.
I doubt we will see that either.
Remember the scene in the Steven Segal movie ‘On Deadly Ground’ where the Big Bad Bully with the BIG MOUTH and little brain gets his lesson in life? ‘What does it take to change the essence of a man?’
Van, tell me, would you give up all your secrets in order to help your opponents? Keep asking if you must but don’t hold your breath waiting for an answer. By Irene
Your answer is about one of the dumbest comments ever made on this blog. If that is indeed the Liberal postion then that tells me that they have no idea of how much it is going to cost us to implement the full Kyoto agreement even when we are 12aers behind the schedule. Sorry but this sure isn’t the way to gain my vote.
By Van on 02.19.08 2:32 pm
Your statment Van is about the dumbest answer on this blog yet. Did I say anything about it being the Liberal position? NO, it was my opinion & if you don’t like it, so be it. Get over it. Van where in hell do you think you have the right to insult one & not expect not to get it back? What makes you think you are right & everyone else is wrong? Well answer me this Van if you can. If you were Harper, would you be telling Dion on how you would pay for all the promises he has made? I stand by my earlier statement. If Flaherty can’t figure it out by himself, he’s holding the wrong job.
BTW, the answer I gave you is a sound one & was repeated by other posters on this topic & I didn’t see you attack them for it. Let me tell you Van, I am no pushover & will not run from any bullish displays by you or anyone for that matter. My opinion is as logical as yours & if you don’t like it, than don’t bother to respond as I’m done with you.
Cheers,
By Catherine on 02.19.08 4:23 pm
(chuckles) I think I’ve got competition for you from the stupid department, Irene. I said this:
“Boy, did you miss it. Mulroney’s $330 billion in deficits over 10 years forced us into a GST we should never have had needed to begin with.” – brain
The rebuttal:
“Brian – you should change your signature – as you sure are not using your “brain”. There was NO 330 Billion deficit in 1993! You do realize what deficit means – right?” – Catherine
It speaks for itself.
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.19.08 6:34 pm
And there you have it folks – the neo Liberal.
Boy, the Liberal Party of Canada has been hi-jacked by these types of “people”.
The PP-Boy Physio-political Challenge :
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.19.08 3:30 pm
One day, not long ago, you suggested you ‘could look after yourself.’ You won’t have to do that Harry A$$. When I’m done with you, there won’t be anything left to look after. That’s a PROMISE.
………………………………..
Name the place and time .. and don’t bring your mother …!!!
By Nikolai Nikolaivitch on 02.19.08 5:23 pm
……………………………………..
It’ll be at the appointed place and time when I first catch you acting up. I’ll give you a chance to become a ragmop, in front of ALL YOUR FRIENDS at a particular political meeting. I plan to attend at least a dozen meetings in ridings around Toronto. Which riding do you call HOME?
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.19.08 5:37 pm
……………………………………..
Come on PP-boy … just list the dozen or so political meetings that you will be attending in Toronto, and I will give you advance notice of my appearance .. and then we can meet outside, and we can settle on your boasting that:
“When I’m done with you, there won’t be anything left to look after.”
(Bring along ex-Marine-Minnow Billy-M if you fear for your welfare.)
By Harry S on 02.19.08 6:13 pm
……………………………………
“When I’m done with you, there won’t be anything left to look after.”
By Harry S on 02.19.08 6:13 pm
Still waiting to learn which riding you call HOME. Your attempt to goad is childish. I want to be able to mop the floor with your filthy carcass. I PROMISE … You don’t want to tell me because you’re afraid … That’s it … Harry A$$ is scairt skinney.
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.19.08 6:34 pm
……………………………………
Oooooooooooo! HS has issued a challenge, but he never had the balls to say if he had served his country in the military. Maybe he will be recognizable by his BIG MOUTH, and the ooze that froths from it.
Gee, hope the meat inspectors aren’t around, they may think He has BSE and shoot him!
I’ll be looking for his list of TH meetings he plans to attend as well.
I doubt we will see that either.
Remember the scene in the Steven Segal movie ‘On Deadly Ground’ where the Big Bad Bully with the BIG MOUTH and little brain gets his lesson in life? ‘What does it take to change the essence of a man?’
By Bill-Muskoka on 02.19.08 7:42 pm
………………………………………………………………………………
Why is it that I get the impression that both PP-boy and Billy-M are of the feminine gender …. because their boasting and threats sound so ….. girlish … !!!!!
By Harry S on 02.20.08 7:52 am
C’mon Harry A$$, just provide your HOME riding information.
Why doncha wear your CUTE FURRY BROWN OUTFIT WITH THE WHITE FLASHING for when Pyotr goes a-hunting.
Or, alternatively, you could provide us a copy of your most recent stomach x-ray which will confirm your NO GUTS condition.
OK Sweets? Meanwhile, we have lots of highly insightful information to pass along on the CPC Promise Breakers and their mental midgets.
Still waiting to learn which riding you call HOME.
By Harry S on 02.20.08 7:52 am
Harry A$$ is a COWARD!
Which riding do you call HOME?
By Harry S on 02.20.08 7:52 am
Still waiting for your HOME RIDING Harry A$$!
By Catherine on 02.20.08 4:56 am
Geez, Catherine, last time you said I was VIAL … Would that be a small jar, like an apothecary jar? I must observe that you and Leasa don’t provide much by way of literary merit or skill. Of course we’re all aware OUT HERE (as in, outside the mental hospital) that you folks need constant attention.
Admittedly, some of you have escaped into the mainstream. We’re waiting with our butterfly nets.
I’ll ask you and Leasa the same question I asked Harry A$$ … What is your HOME riding?
We just LOVE to drop by, unannounced, and leave pleasant surprises.
Just read an article about afellow from Pakistan who moved to Toronto a few years ago but went back to Pakistan last summer for a visit. He ended up staying to help his people and run in this weeks election. That takes courage.
THe article ends by the man saying he had found his his Heaven in Canada.
Despite having to having to put up with Baird, Harper, Van Loan and Lunn we should be thankful for all the MP’s who run for political parties. Maybe if all of the above writers went to live in a war torn country they would appreciate our few follies and be thankful for all our freedoms.
By Irene on 02.19.08 10:12 pm
First of all I didn’t say your comments was the Liberal position but rather said if it was indeed the Liberal position. Secondly, I didn’t attack you personally but rather I attacked your comment which I still feel was one of the dumbest ones ever written.
Personally I really don’t care what you write to me or about me because unlike you I am not thin skinned and do not take your or anyone else’s fro that matter seriously especially when comments like neo con, liars, dictator etc come into play.
Finally, if you don’t like what I write or how I write them, then don’t read them and just skip over my comments. So lighten up and don’t take everything that people say so seriously. You make it so easy for someone to push your buttons and set you off. Like politics it is a game to some.
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.20.08 10:18 am
Are you threatening me, PP?
If so, your school yard bullying is not working, however, Garth, may want to keep an eye on you.
By Sally on 02.20.08 11:01 am
Reads llike a ‘piece’ which encourages people to expect only mediocrity and incompetence, while maintaining that’s the ‘very best’ we can do. I don’t believe we should ever accept such a premise.
GARTH … THIS ASSHOLE PYOTR P IS NOT ONLY STALKING ON YOUR FORUM, HE HAS THREATENED Catherine.
THIS FORUM PERSONALITY IS A CERTIFIABLE NUTBAR WITH HIS SCREWBALL POSTING !!!!!!.
DO YOU INTEND TO ALLOW SUCH THREATS TO BE MADE ON YOUR FORUM ????????
————————————————————————————————————————————–
Still waiting to learn which riding you call HOME.
By Harry S on 02.20.08 7:52 am
……………………………………..
Harry A$$ is a COWARD!
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.20.08 10:05 am
……………………………………..
Which riding do you call HOME?
By Harry S on 02.20.08 7:52 am
………………………………………………….
Still waiting for your HOME RIDING Harry A$$!
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.20.08 10:08 am
…………………………………………………..
By Catherine on 02.20.08 4:56 am
I’ll ask you and Leasa the same question I asked Harry A$$ … What is your HOME riding?
We just LOVE to drop by, unannounced, and leave pleasant surprises.
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.20.08 10:18 am
………………………………………………….
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 02.20.08 10:18 am
Are you threatening me, PP?
If so, your school yard bullying is not working, however, Garth, may want to keep an eye on you.
By Catherine on 02.20.08 7:08 pm
……………………………………………………………………………
IF YOU ALLOW THIS JERK TO CONTINUE WITH HIS MANIC POSTING ON YOUR FORUM IT WILL DIMINISH FAIR DISCUSSION.
I don’t really get it; however, why do so many threads call ‘Harry S an A$$?
Why do you think he’ll ever be everything different if he already sounds like a conservative?
My guess is ‘if you hear it, then say it, and then mean it…It’s not a conservative.
Conservative/tories/Harper and his fiends lie through their teeth.
Harry S, as I see it, doesn’t understand the quality of honesty and integrity. He’ll never get it, I would suspect, so leave him alone and don’t bother with his threads.
Thanks Garth for this opportunity to express my views.