In the financial business, there are just two motivators. Greed makes people desperate to buy stocks or houses, at any price. Fear makes them desperate to sell, at any price.
Is politics different? Hardly – something Jason Kenney, Pierre Poilievre, John Baird and Stephen Harper know all too well. In this business, fear is the greatest weapon, and Conservatives are playing it for all it’s worth, with the “Dion’s Tax on Everything” campaign, launched Sunday.
On one level, it’s great communicating – a piece of cake if you happen to have, say, millions of dollars to spend, the office of the prime minister for creds and an unlimited budget for media buys, web site development and ad agencies. Thus, this campaign of fear is online, on the radio, in print and about to start playing on gas pumps.
On another level, it’s pathetic and disappointing. A worthy idea (taxing pollution, rewarding work) has been boiled down to its skivvies, then wildly distorted. In the Conservative response, gone is any mention of environmental goals, of stopping climate change, dealing effectively with crap-spewing industries or creating new economic opportunities and lowering personal income taxes.
Instead, a GST-style terrorfest of rising consumer prices and gas rape.
How will the Libs react? The damn-the-torpedoes response would be to push ahead simply because this is the right thing to do for our wasteful, oil-drunk society and collective future. The political reaction would be to modify and corrupt the plan to address worries of rising energy costs and pissed-off voter groups. Since Stephane Dion is one of the most principled people I have encountered in public life, and yet a national party leader who needs support, I don’t know the outcome.
But I do know this: The comments yesterday’s blog post generated, and the avalanche of emails I received offline, were telling. Either this is not the time for altruism, with $140-a-barrel oil, or proponents of the Green Shift have simply not articulated their vision.
So, I will carry this on with me today as I climb the Hill and meet with my colleagues. I have two conclusions to share: First, this issue, this action, this vision is too important to abandon, and too crucial to bring forth at the wrong moment.
Second, fear cannot be allowed to reign. Nobody ever profited taking advice from the cheap and the tawdry. This morning, they surround us.
195 comments ↓
How will the Libs react? The damn-the-torpedoes response would be to push ahead simply because this is the right thing to do for our wasteful, oil-drunk society and collective future. The political reaction would be to modify and corrupt the plan to address worries of rising energy costs and pissed-off voter groups. Since Stephane Dion is one of the most principled people I have encountered in public life, and yet a national party leader who needs support, I don’t know the outcome.
posted by Garth Turner on 06.09.08 @ 7:50 am
Garth,
I am afraid that you are exhibiting here a fatal “our way or the door way” arrogance. That is not the way to proceed. In a democracy the debate is central to finding a way that will mitigate the costs while achieving the solution.
If you race forward without considering the consequences and the various problems then you will fail. But if you listen, adjust, and empathize then you will succeed.
Granted, those who oppose the democratic process will try to interfere with and distort the public debate with silly tactics. Remember that they are trying to protect the “haves” in our society from the “masses” based on a 18th century concept of social order and entitlement.
Not to fear Garth, I participated in the online Can-west poll yesterday and over 70% of us said these ads will not affect us. It is obvious that people are tired of this nonsense. Read somewhere else that two anonymous Conservative backroom boys admit that the time has come for them to start being positive or risk being marginalized.
It is all in the timing and how you present your position.
The Libs are experts at playing up the “fear factor.” Dont you remember “soldiers in our cities,” and Stephen Harpers scary hidden agenda where he was going to criminalize abortion, jail gays and force women to stay home all their lives? Don’t dish it out if you can’t take it Garth.
You mean that’s not his agenda?? — Garth
Dear Mr. Turner,
Thanks for all your hard work for Canada. I just wanted to put in two cents regarding the talking points on the carbon shift.
I think it would be good strategy is to just focus on lowering personal income tax.
Force that to be the talking point…. since ‘Lower’ tax, begs the question “how”… and then that’s the opportunity to say that polluters will be surcharged for abuses.
ie
DECREASED INCOME TAXES THROUGH CARBON FUNDING.. or a “carbon-funded tax break” for all taxpayers to go green, etc. (I hope it’s a big enough tax break)
Best regards,
Barb
Ps
We went to the Calgary Liberal fundraiser on Friday and were impressed with both the video message from Mr. Dion, and the guest speaker Mr. Dominic Le Blanc – seems like a great guy.
The ads are silly. Don’t spend too much time talking about them, but you need to put something in the window.
Liberals will win an election if it is called, probably on a supply vote or as an amendment to a concurrence motion.
Presenting the Carbon Shift plan, or some amalgam of the provincial plans, during an election campaign is infinitely preferable to doing it in the summer when nobody’s attention will be focused on the issues.
But, let the budget and the apology sail through first, plus hearings on the scandalabras.
Garth:
My husband felt to insulted that he, as an adult, would be subject to these childish ads. He said Harper is treating people like their stupid – he doesn’t like be thought of as stupid.
He’s decided he will not purchase gas at any station that uses these ads – the person who will suffer, of course, is not Harper or the big oil companies, it will be the small gas station owner.
I suggest others do the same – enough is enough is enough.
Also, I’ve read where these idiots are emailing people – pretending they are emails from Stephane Dion – isn’t this lying, misrepresenation? Isn’t there some legal issues here? If not, there sure as hell should be.
But I do know this: The comments yesterday’s blog post generated, and the avalanche of emails I received offline, were telling. Either this is not the time for altruism, with $140-a-barrel oil, or proponents of the Green Shift have simply not articulated their vision.
posted by Garth Turner on 06.09.08 @ 7:50 am
Garth – it’s the latter. It hasn’t been articulated – and the details are lacking.
Don’t spin it – don’t sell it – don’t stoop the Conservatives level – tell us the plan. Allow us to debate it and make up our own minds. Treat us like intelligent adults (something the Conservatives are not doing).
HELLO?
GARTH?
These ads are a joke. No one will take them seriously especially at a gas station. Firstly they are a reminder that Harper is doing nothing about gas prices and secondly he’s funnelling advertising $$$$ back to BIG OIL. Guess who he really works for.
You know, I just thought of an idea to ease the Tory frustrations – collect some toys and donate them to the CPC caucus to play with. They can’t talk, they can’t think – they laugh, applaud and fart when told to – so I think they need some toys to play with to vent their frustrations. Polievre truly needs something to make him laugh, have fun and exercise his evil mind.
This is just too rich – Gwyn Morgan, oil man, Harper supporter has written an article about tax – like we’re going to think he is earnest and not thinking about those big oil profits….another insult to add to the pile of BS.
Garth, I’d like to hear your comments on how the carbon tax will be revenue neutral after a few years as carbon usage decreases, will the income tax increase again negating the effect or will the carbon tax just keep increasing pushing food and heat cost through the roof?
I’d also like to hear your comments on how the Earth biomass is going through a huge boom right now, thanks greatly to the nice weather (That’s read, increase in temperature) we’re having and the increased CO2 in the air aiding photosynthesis and nutrient processing.
link: http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/
Don’t spin it – don’t sell it – don’t stoop the Conservatives level – tell us the plan. Allow us to debate it and make up our own minds. Treat us like intelligent adults (something the Conservatives are not doing).
By Tim N on 06.09.08 8:22 am
Agreed whole-heartedly !!
Barb mentioned that you should just focus on the reductions to income tax. I think that would be the absolute wrong thing to do. First it will allow the CPC to frame this in their terms – as strictly a pocket-book issue. Secondly, there will be a large number of people (myself included) who will not see the immediate financial benefit. It cannot be the centre plank.
Instead, convince me that it is manageable, convince me that I will indeed have alternatives, convince me that it is worthwhile, convince me that it will work.
Do not stoop to the level of the CPC. We are capable of making the right decisions when presented with the right reasons.
Fear? HA!
Hey, Bugger off everyone. I just got notice that the Wolrd Bank has $800,000 they are giving me. Retirement awaits! LOL
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OH GOODEY! I’m RICH! (but not that STUPID!)
Another Do NOTHING day in Oddawahahaha! At least something is holding steady!
Well, Tory does have a point about soldiers in our streets – I remember that ad but the Libs, to their credit, did pull it quickly.
On the other hand, I would suggest that instead of playing this “when the plan comes out” game, the next time say nothing and then, when it is finalized, show the plan. But, let’s not talk about it until it’s ready and out.
I wish the Liberals would get a little more aggressive. Firstly in their fund raising. I live in Mtl and I get requests from the NDP and the cons weekly, nothing from the Liberals. Secondly, I would like to see the Libs take the Gov’t donw. There is sufficcient ammo now and Charest will go to the polls in the fall. Not a good idea to stall later than that. Lastly, I would like to see more discussion about Cns mistakes and lies directed to the population, not just at Question Period.
I never did comment on the ads. Not sure if I even should waste the bandwidth now, but …
The CPC has a strong solid base of supporters. They would vote for the CPC pretty much no matter what. This ad essential “preaches to the CPC choir”.
Problem is, that the CPC has wasted some much time oppposing the opposition that it has failed to articulate itself a vision for the future. So it loses support among swing voters. This ad really is devoid of substance and not worth taking seriously. What this ad does, however, is further play to the position that the CPC has little to say.
The swing voters are looking for an alternative. They are looking for a reason to move from the status quo. And, I should add, they are not star-struck with Dion or the Liberals and so will not vote for them just because – they will need a reason.
It is because of this that I say that the Liberals should not play games with the CPC. There is no point in ranting about the ad. The general populace is already ignoring it. Instead, raise the bar and present vision. Trust me … it will be noticed.
The ads are going to irritate people to no end. No election was called, but everyone knows Harper is in permanent campaign mode. His message is angry and who needs that when motorists are being charged big bucks for their gasoline? Very poor strategy, especially in Ontario, to remind people that Harper favours oil over manufacturing jobs. Taxpayers are already pissed off and these attack ads just add to their anger! It’s already irritating when motorists pull up to the pumps!
Sub heading: ‘Tories launch aggressive attack ads against Stephane Dion and the Liberals’
Some thing is going on here. Up untill this point the Decepti-cons and Optimus-Prime minister have dismissed the opposition and its leaders as not being worthy of being called such. Now they have their running dog press involved with a major campaign to discredit them? What happen some one show them some new numbers? Are the dogs running scared?
I thought the party in power ran the country while the oppositions job was to critique the sitting government and its policies. In these strange days the governing party has adopted the position of opposition and are now critiqueing and attacking the non governing party.
Maybe they are getting in some quality practice time before they assume this role officially.
Anyways, with the heat and humidity weekend past and the this direction from Stevedog and his hounds looks like the “dog” days of summer are upon us early.
Garth … are you wavering now ??
Will you be advocating:
a) Abstaining this week and launching Dion’s Green Shift Plan this summer, and hopefully accompanied with a full tv and radio ad campaign?
b) Holding off on any Green Shift Plan and just waiting until Parliament reconvenes in October-November?
c) Voting no confidence on the Budget thus precipitating a snap election this summer as most Liberal MPs prefer?
d) Or another strategy?
Your weblog article seems to suggest you are now opposed to presenting a carbon tax message, because fear is rampant amongst Canadians.
Those ads are insulting. I don’t think they will work very well. Oil prices are worrysome, yet I believe the public would welcome a long term option.
Stick to the Conservative government many weaknesses and the faltering economy.
Keep the heat on them!
Garth, you wrote:
“In this business(politics), fear is the greatest weapon, and Conservatives are playing it for all it’s worth…”
There is one thing that trumps fear, in politics, HOPE! Let the conservatives strangle themselves in fear while Dion and the liberals propose a message of Hope.
By Randy Too on 06.09.08 9:09 am: was spot on when he said:
“raise the bar, and present vision.”
I have to say though, I really don’t like the direction Harper has taken our democracy in……over simplistic populist fear mongering, law suits, degradation of Question Period, secrecy…..what is the goal of all of this? Survival?
Well, Tory does have a point about soldiers in our streets – I remember that ad but the Libs, to their credit, did pull it quickly.
On the other hand, I would suggest that instead of playing this “when the plan comes out” game, the next time say nothing and then, when it is finalized, show the plan. But, let’s not talk about it until it’s ready and out.
By forevergreen2000 on 06.09.08 8:58 am
Well, as you’ve conveniently forgotten – Harper was campaigning and promising soldiers/bases near every town – how would you take that?
come on, garth. reread your blog. you peddle fear with vigor. the question is, who’s lying?
(for what’s it’s worth, i’m not saying you’re lying, just that you’re playing the fear game too.)
From the looks of the comments so far, I’d say the Conservative War Room is at work early this morning.
This may be (current children’s hour attack ads) may be Harper’s “Kim Campbell moment”.
From what I hear from neighbours, a bunch of people at a barbeque – they are angry…..the whole thought of paying the oil companies to run their ads when gas prices are so high has absolutely angered them – big time.
Crying ‘unfair’ and hoping that drivers will transfer their anger back to the CPC is just wishful thinking.
These ads will most likely vanish once Dion announces the details of his Green Shift Plan, and he will have to personally explain why it’s a good thing for Canadians. These ads are intended to have Canadians question Dion’s Carbon Tax on everything, and they will plant the opposing pov quite effectively.
If Dion gets the chance to tour Canada this summer and explaining his Green Tax Shift Plan, he will have to support his mission with a massive tv and radio ad campaign. I don’t think that just having Dion attempt to communicate his message will be enough or even effective .. even if the friendly MSM supports Dion again.
After Dion finishes his Green Shift Plan tour of Canada, he will have to immediately defeat the government and precipitate an election. So now Canadians will be voting on having an election this year or early next year if they agree with Dion.
Obviously there is a great deal at stake for the Liberal party having Dion successfully communicate his Green Shift Plan.
Fear? Get real, Garth.
For pretty much a decade, the Liberals staked their entire political existence on creating fear over what Preston Manning/Stockwell Day/Stephen Harper would do to Canada if either of them ever got the chance. And you know as well as I do that it worked. The Conservative Party is *still* fighting off the residual effects of the Liberals’ unrelenting campaign of fear against them.
It sucks to have the tables turn, doesn’t it? But such is life in Ottawa. The Liberals have royally bombed the unveiling of this policy, and the Conservatives are pouncing on it, filling the void with their own negative consequences.
Is it fear-mongering? You bet. Does it work? Absolutely.
Your feigned indignation over “fear” advertising is embarassing, considering the party you joined practically perfected the art.
By jove! Harry has a point!
I was wondering why the Conservatives would waste soo much money on an ad that will have little real impact. … it is simply to force the Liberals to spend equally large sums to counter it.
Harry is correct. This ad will not generate anger – it will be largely ignored. And the ad is easily countered with simple answers – the details of the plan. But by putting it in the face of the public-at-large, it forces the Liberals to reach the same populace. Revealing the plan solely at Liberal meet-and-greet events will not be enough.
Devious.
Not just soldiers in our streets…how about the one where the Libs show a gun pointing at us on the t.v. screen?
I didn’t see it. Explain. — Garth
Politicans are still playing in their sandboxes. World populations are threatened now by energy, food and water shortages. Immediate survival is at stake.
In Egypt they line up for government subsidized bread at 3 in the morning. In Spain stores are expected to go empty in days as trucker’s strike spreads.
How are governments reacting? In the USA the military is by far the largest fuel consumer. In Canada we are spending 100 million a month on our effort in Afghanistan. Could that 100 million a month help Canadian farmers?
On a smaller scale, we still see car races and air shows which glorify the waste of energy. Once this obvious waste is stopped, we can begin to take our governments seriously. Until then, it’s just more talk, more raises for politicians, more tax and higher prices for the consumer who will be blamed for it all.
On one level, it’s great communicating – a piece of cake if you happen to have, say, millions of dollars to spend, the office of the prime minister for creds and an unlimited budget for media buys, web site development and ad agencies. Thus, this campaign of fear is online, on the radio, in print and about to start playing on gas pumps.
posted by Garth Turner on 06.09.08 @ 7:50 am
Quit lamenting that the tories have more money than the libs. I thought you were the guy responsible for raising money for your party. Are you saying you’ve failed?
And what’s your VISA number, Janice? — Garth
Hope someone has a plan for when the riots start?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMsqEph7a8I&feature=related
You want to talk about fear mongering, Garth. You really are a hypocrite.
Hey, it’s the ad that never aired. What a unique way to prove your point. — Garth
PTDBD
How about we keep the car races and airshows, and outlaw all the single occupant cars on their way to work in the downtown of all major cities. Seems like a more obvious waste to outlaw.
Kerry
see relevant article in Regina newspaper:
http://www.canada.com/reginaleaderpost/columnists/story.html?id=01c8317c-3852-4d5e-8ee1-ef5b6b942088&p=1
TD Bank economist Don Drummond suggests “a revenue-neutral carbon tax would encourage industry and consumers to make the capital investments and changes in consumption patterns needed to reduce our carbon emissions, which on a per capita basis are the highest in the country, exceeding even those of Alberta.”
Drummond also suggests reducing personal income taxes at lower income levels, noting that marginal effective tax rates at the $25,000 to $40,000 level are as high as 60 per cent. Raising the basic personal exemption would help achieve this laudable goal.
By Randy Too on 06.09.08 9:53 am
Bingo, Randy ….!!!!
Everybody is curious about Dion’s Green Shift Plan, but how is he gonna communicate it to Canadians???
- Speeches in the summertime?
- MSM supporting it for 2 weeks?
- Counter-attack ads in gas stations?
- Liberal MPs and candidates talking it up?
Just how does Dion intend to get his Green Shift Plan message to the people .. internet bloggers maybe?
Why do I have this feeling that Dion’s attempt to ’sell’ his Green Shift Plan will bomb big time ..??!!!
Dion ain’t exactly a great communicator …!!!
Poor Liberals. They want to increase taxes on virtually every commodity that people consume and they expect their opposition and Canadians to accept it blindly. Not likely to happen.
The ads are part of the political discourse and expose the Liberals for their arrogance, hypocrisy and their downright inability to connect with what ordinary Canadians believe and want.
Like the original Dion is not a leader ad these ads will work because they deal with bread and butter issues.
So the CPC mascot is a blob of oil. That’s telling. do I ever hope Canadians are wise to these neo-cons.
Still, it would be nice if the Liberals could get out in front of this issue.
Janice, Harry S., Catherine, et al:
“It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt.”
- Mark Twain
Garth, here is the ad HLH was referring to:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qqtCxLq5JU
Aside from the gun point, the ad also concludes that Harper will kill medicare and ban abortions.
No fear-mongering there …
Wasn’t that four years ago? Did it air? — Garth
Truth or Consequences? By Kady O’Malley
here’s what Conservative spokesperson Ryan Sparrow told CanWest News yesterday:
However, a spokesman for the Conservative Party, Ryan Sparrow, said a number of gas stations have committed to running the ads purchased by the Tories through an advertising company called fuelcast.com, although he couldn’t give a specific number
But when contacted by ITQ this morning, Fuelcast Network spokesperson Tony Herunter denied that his company was involved with the ad buy:
There appears to be some misunderstanding regarding the issue of the Conservative Party advertising their carbon tax ads on Fuelcast Network. Please be informed that this campaign will not air on Fuelcast Network. I trust that this clarifies this issue.
One consistency the CRAP has is ideas that are old (circa 1950), they talk about old issues, they live in the past, and have no plan for the present or future. When they do mangle together a so-called plan it is way off in the future, i.e., 2050, but never any real solutions to today’s problems. No, they just blame the Liberals (and the Libs do have a pretty hefty bag to lug around of ‘We didn’t get it done’) but the CRAP would rather destroy any progress that has been made (Kelowna Accord, Kyoto…which was only a START, etc.), and reverse anything the Libs are due credit for.
This is NOT a government, it is a bunch of power perverts interested only in more power. What a complete waste of my and everyone else’s time for the past two long years. Call the ELECTION.
If the Libs don’t trust the people then it is either one of three things…
1. They can’t grasp who are really the deciders in our nation and are incapable of communicating solid reasons the people should support them.
2. They are too scared of their own past to allow the people to speak.
3. They have no more solutions than the CRAPpers, just campaign promises, and their track record pretty much sucks just like all the others.
This has gone on long enough. Call the election, because at this point, this Canadian has had it with both major parties. The only one standing up for Canada is Jack Layton, and that may be exactly who forms the next government. At least he shows up, votes, and speaks out on issues the people really care about. It can’t be much worse than the childish BS we have been subjected to under the Harper Bozos.
Dalton McGuinty is more a leader than either Harper or Dion and has done more to move things forward than the Federal Bozos have. Maybe Ontario should just keep their money and kick Oddawahahaha out? Go to Calgary, Winterpeg, Hell for all I care at this point! Perhaps the ‘New’ Canada’ will consist of the Ontario, Quebec, Nunavit, NWT, Manitoba, and the Maritimes?
I am curious how this will play out in the coming days. Will people see this as an act of oil interests controlling the Harper’s Cons? Will it be seen as fears of the NEP program in 2008? Will it be seen as a desperate and costly attempt by the Conservatives to put some damage control on a popular move by Dion’s Liberals?
I also wonder that: if the plug was pulled on this government now by the you, would the hundreds of thousands and/or millions of dollars Harper’s Cons spend on these ads cripple a Conservative election campaign finances if they had to put even a portion of these costs under the $18.3M advertising allowance in a federal election, if it were called now; giving the Opposition Parties a financial advantage? Or would it simply give Harper a head start?
Garth,
You should actually thank CPC for framing the debate for you. Now you have concrete points to counter the CPC claims that the Dion plan will increase overall prices and hurt Canadians.
Do not blame CPC, it was the Libs that left a void by just releasing sound bites rather than concrete information on the plan. It si the job of the other part to counter-attack and spin everything that can be spin. This has been going on in politics since that days or Rome Senate.
n these strange days the governing party has adopted the position of opposition and are now critiqueing and attacking the non governing party.
Maybe they are getting in some quality practice time before they assume this role officially.
Anyways, with the heat and humidity weekend past and the this direction from Stevedog and his hounds looks like the “dog” days of summer are upon us early.
By paul fist in your face on 06.09.08 9:20 am
Could it be about having too much money but no cents?
Sorry, could not resist.
Don’t abandon the message. It is too important to give up. Try not to fall victim to the “we can’t fix anything if we’re not in office” pitfall. Run on principle, win on principle. From what I’ve seen of surveys Canadians want the carbon tax (and cap and trade). But the message of tax shifting has to be absolutely clear. And you have to emphasize that citizens have the ability to control how much money they can save by using less power & gas.
How very sad. US style attack ads aimed at nothing. They must be very desperate to prepare and okay this kind of crap. And its not even well done !!! Just like Finley and all the other morons. Best advice, IGNORE ALL OF IT !!!
This is a Quote, from a comment made on the G&M forums on this topic, Not sure if Garth allows this but I agree with this persons comments and thought he hits it right on the nail.
—————
Quote:
Allan Eizinas
I see that the Conservatives are attempting to use consumer outrage at the high prices to undermine the Dion leadership.
This may not be a very smart move by the Harperites.
Would the person filling his tank and steaming while paying $1.40 a liter not ask himself “Why would oil companies reaping $billions in profits allow these ads to be placed on their equipment? Why are the oil companies supporting the Conservatives?”
Do the Harperites really want to be perceived as being in the pockets of the oil companies?
Not just soldiers in our streets…how about the one where the Libs show a gun pointing at us on the t.v. screen?
I didn’t see it. Explain. — Garth
By HLH on 06.09.08 9:56 am
———————–
You see this is why you brain dead Conservative trollies are really a sad pathetic lot. Lies, lies and more lies. Keep it up though, the more you all open your mouths the more the Polls will reflect your drop in support.
Make no mistake this is not a revenue neutral tax proposal. The LPC is proposing taking $17B in carbon taxes to be offset by $10-13B in income tax cuts. Do the math, it’s a tax grab.
http://www.winnipegsun.com/Comment/Editorial/2008/05/13/5546051.html
The Liberal Party should present M Dion’s carbon capping plan for public debate, now, while the Harper Conservatives’ attack ads are airing. I believe that would send a strong message to Canadians. A two way conversation on the nation’s future between the Dion Liberals and Canadians while the Harper Conservatives have nothing substantive to add or counter with could have benefits to you.
How about a cross country session of public consultations on the plan, this summer? How about leveraging the power of the internet, bloggers and social media to get Canadians involved in your plan?
There’s a lot of power inherent in political conversations. Not only would public consultations make us feel like we’re involved in shaping a very important policy, the personal conversations with our families, neighbours, etc. that could ensue would be much more effective at delivering information than advertising, announcing, etc.
This consultation / debate should happen in summer, while it’s hot. Global warming would be much more top of mind, when it’s 50 with the humidex than when it’s cold or snowing…
Today, Canadians are just individual consumers of political goods rather than social producers of political outcomes. This has to change if we want to be able to face the challenges of the future, together.
-R
“Would those polluters – oil producers, hydro generating stations, smelters, mills, manufacturers – pass on this new tax burden to consumers in the form of higher prices?” asks Garth.
Well…he never does answer that question. He leaves it hanging in the air, perhaps because he answer is so obvious. The consumer will pay the bill. Inflation is inevitable.
He then dangles the promise of “pie in the sky” future income tax cuts. Ha!
A promise straight from the heart, that will end up going straight for your wallet. Dion won’t be PM as a result of this “grand idea”. In fact, it’s proof positive that he shouldn’t be PM. The guy shows a huge lack of common sense, proposing such an idea when prices are going parabolic.
Garth
So I took a road trip this weekend to Williams Lake; a small community almost smack dab in the middle of B.C. The first thing that struck me is everyone drives a diesel pick up truck. Trucks manufactured by those Oshawa autoworkers.
So you can imagine, in Williams Lake, their primary concern is the price of diesel. How we alter the mindset of a rural city surrounded by ranches and farms with a growing economy based on mining is daunting.
After taking a straw poll they believe that a carbon tax should not apply to them because of the distances travelled to make a living. They don’t have a transit system and so must rely on their vehicles to travel from outlying areas to town.
My question, how will the plan address rural Canada?
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20080609/carbon_plan_080609/20080609?hub=TopStories
Your blog is in the news again, Garth.
Here’s a scoop for you: The CBC interviewed me this morning. Duffy asked me to appear this afternoon. Robert Fife (whose article you reference), has not bothered to call. Guess he was too busy writing. — Garth
By and large, I’d say the Libs simply need better and more visible communication. The idea of replacing a non-optional tax (income tax) with revenue from a carbon tax (where you can reduce the amount you pay by reducing the amount you waste) is brilliant. And really, if the Libs were to push that bare-bones argument, it shouldn’t be that hard to sell.
Hmmmm…
I wonder what Royal Dutch Oil/Shell thinks about the CONS using their color signature on their ads… Might this give some idea who the anonymous donors for the $$$$$ are?
And, to that, I wonder how many other in the oil patch, Esso for example, will be thrilled to have a competitor’s colors shown so clearly on their red, white and blue pumps, or whatever… Individual station owners will appreciate the dollars from the ads though.
These might generate a chuckle, but surely the majority of Canadians are now beginning to wonder where all the bloody $$$$$$$$ is coming from and how can the CONS continue to afford this – while maintaining a “representative of the people” posture.
Immature talking to brainless… Not at all responsible or mature.
Fuelcast will not run the ads as their policy is that they do not get involved in politics or political advertisements .
Too bad as it would go a along way to convincing Canadians that Harpo is in bed with big oil .
Now I am waiting for the Liberals to articulate and sell this plan .
The plan should be given to major resource companies and experts in the field to provide the parameters for debate .
Once convinced they will save money Canadians will buy in en masse .
Canadians are wanting desperately to be part of the solution .
This piece meal rolling out must stop .
Give us the entire plan . All at once .
It is only logical .
Garth … upon a second reading of your article, I tried to parse it sentence by sentence, phrase by phrase .. and I came up with this precis:
Fear makes people desperate.
In politics, fear is the greatest weapon.
Conservative campaign: Dion’s Tax on Everything.
Fear campaign online, radio, print, gas pumps.
Distorting Dion’s worthy and noble ideas.
GST-style terror-fest of rising gas prices.
Liberal reaction to charge ahead regardless.
Politically change the Plan to accommodate voters.
Uncertain how Dion will react and the outcome.
People saying not the time for altruism.
Green Shift plan not a clear vision.
Green Shift plan vision and timing crucial.
Fear must be defeated.
………….
Is that about it? If so, we look forward to your next message after the Priority & Planning Committee today and tonights confidence vote on immigration bill C-50. Keep us informed … thanks …
Note to all MP’s and party leaders, not to mention Trolls:
*** The Top Signs Someone’s Not qualified to Be a Superhero
Won’t travel to towns that don’t have AA meetings.
Takes him TWO bounds to leap tall buildings.
Wonder Woman uses her Golden Lasso to get the truth. HE’S wiring an Army field telephone to your gonads.
He’s only spent four years in the Superhero Senate!
For some reason, Dahmer-Man keeps losing his boy sidekicks.
Soiling one’s drawers at the first sign of peril seems to work on only the most olfactory-sensitive evildoers, Scatman.
Heat vision + myopia = yet more state park deforestation.
Although swimming upstream is an admirable quality, there just isn’t much need for SuperSalmon.
Can only see through wet T-shirts.
The day’s never OFFICIALLY been saved by Excess Comma Reducing Man.
His call-to-arms catch phrase: “We MUST draft legislation!!”
Unless supervillains have built their sinister lairs inside beer cans or cleverly disguised themselves as 7-Eleven microwave burritos, he hasn’t vanquished a damned thing since junior high.
Morning wood not so much a mutant power as a side effect of the Cinemax After Dark Saturday lineup.
“So, Thunderbird and Mad Dog, we meet once again! Let’s see how you do THIS time, without Night Train’s help!”
The ability to “leap pre-schoolers in a single bound” is not much of a power. In fact, it’s actually rather creepy.
Just because people constantly ignore you doesn’t mean you’re invisible.
“Irony Man” will probably NEVER strike fear in the hearts of evildoers.
Misunderstandings seem to plague Wide-Stance Tapping Man.
Your ability to curdle milk with a mean glance won’t even get you a role in the X-Men movies.
The “M” on his chest is for Methuselah Man, and he’s not really very adept at using that walker as a weapon.
When he’s in trouble, the commissioner would probably prefer to send up a signal rather than drive around looking for a guy with a “Will Be Heroic for Food” sign.
People can smell the “Brown Streak” before they can even see him.
Knits his own cape.
His spiffy toolbelt and ability to solve a myriad of problems are impressive, but his “uncanny sensory perception” is due mostly to the cameras Superintendent-Man surreptitiously installed in your bathroom.
Can’t even get his Legion of Subordinates to refer to him as “ExcelMaster Gary.”
Her version of Kryptonite is being lactose-Intolerant and bruising easily.
Trust me, Lex Luthor doesn’t wait for Red Rover to summon him over.
Superman flies around Earth so fast that he reverses the planet’s rotation and rolls back time. Rotating your tassels in opposite directions merely brings Thanksgiving dinner to a bizarre halt, Bob.
At first, I wasn’t sure what kind of leader Stephane Dion would be. I knew pretty much nothing about him. Garth, the fact that you respect the guy gives him some points with me, but not enough to necessarily vote for him, even though I respect your opinion. However, since the CRAP attack ads, my respect for him has increased dramatically. For one, he has not responded in kind, which is a refreshing change of pace here in Ottawa. For another, if President Steve W. Harper is afraid of this guy enough to expend that much time and energy attacking him, there must be something worthwhile for him to be afraid of. Consequently, all of Harper’s attacks and negativity have done more to make me like the guy than everything good you’ve said about him. I imagine I am not the only one to feel that way. Maybe something along the lines of “If Dion is not a leader, why is Harper so afraid of him?” could be used in the next election campaign.
Garth, the sad fact is that the Liberals have a history of taking tax money (Quebec sponsorship) and financial changes (Liberal leaks to friends caused a market selloff of trust related instruments prior to implementing trust rulings – in contrast with the complete lack of market movement prior to the tory reversal – the rightness or wrongness is not relevant here – the reality of the leak is my point). So faced with what some supporters of carbon tax/cap and trade legislation refer to as “billions of dollars of additional tax revenue to apply to green initiatives” you will find those of us in the middle class hestitant about any new tax initiative whether construed as revenue-nuetral or not. It is too much money in flow creating a temptation that in the past has been irresistable to the Liberals. Granted you personally were not involved but it is the first thing I think about – rather than the altruistic reasoning for the tax. Kindest regards.
There is a larger issue that is being ignored here. You can give all the kudos you want to the Conservatives for their fund raising abilities, but elections should not be based on who has the most money. It appears to me that spending limits that only apply during the election are no longer appropriate. When a party with deep pockets can buy time for what are clearly election ads, even though the election has not been called, and there are no limits or accountability, then the party with the deepest pocket can potentially buy the election. Something clearly is not in the best interests of a democracy. Notice how this is only an issue now with the current incumbents! Garth, after the next election when the liberals are in power, I hope to see revisions to the elections act to prevent this type of travesty from becoming the norm.
In the mean time, their message was too soon. Let it lie for now, then, when they bring these ads out again, people will be emotionally distanced from them (heard it all before), allowing the plan to be evaluated based on the facts.
I believe, Garth that you and your Liberal buddies should be more concerned about your party’s lack of leadership than in what the Conservatives are or sre not doing. Mr Dion is having a tough enough job selling himself withoug trying to sell raising taxes of any kind. Do we believe it when it’s said that the carbon tax will be revenue neutral….I don’t think so….
[...] show divisions on timing of carbon tax plan.” The evidence of such a rift? A blog post by Garth Turner. One that concludes, “fear cannot be allowed to reign. Nobody ever profited [...]
Forget rising gas prices for a second. Garth, will the Dion tax shifting, climate change preventing green plan affect the price of beer?
The blog is not the world, Garth. Email and blog comments just the cheapest and newest means of generating Conservative astroturf. That said, yes it WOULD be nice to have something resembling a plan to defend.
Unfortunately Garth, a Carbon Tax is a Carbon Tax. What about home heating, increased air and transportation costs with the resultant increase of other costs from transportation of goods and services being downloaded onto the consumer. Mr. Dion, as altruistic and principaled as you say, put the cart before the horse, and literally blew it. This should teach him about “thinking out loud”. Get the plan, and then make the announcement.
When the Cons pick an oil slick as their mascot and present it to Canadians as a fun-loving, harmless, child-friendly buddy, they lose all credibility on the Environment front.
Garth–just keep hammering the inappropriate mascot—the Cons love oil producers so much they even have an oil slick as their spokesperson!!!
Perhaps they will come out with an oil slick bobble head for the kids—the gas stations can hand them out every time you fill up—or how ’bout a squeaky oil slick toy —or a talking oil slick doll-pull his string and he says all kinds of neat phrases like:
—oil is good is for
—big gas and oil barons love Harper
—John Baird is a “gas”
As we are experiencing a sea change of global proportion and the people are miles(kilometers)ahead of the government on global issues we must educate our leaders .
Here are some jobs for the new “Green” eomomy .
* Bicycle repair and bike delivery services
* Car and truck mechanic jobs, production jobs, and gas-station jobs related to bio-diesel
* Energy retrofits to increase energy efficiency and conservation
* Green building
* Green waste composting on a large scale
* Hauling and reuse of construction materials and debris (C&D)
* Hazardous materials clean-up
* Landscaping
* Manufacturing jobs related to large scale production of appropriate technologies (i.e. solar panels, bike cargo systems, green waste bins, etc.)
* Materials reuse
* Non-toxic household cleaning in residential and commercial buildings
* Parks and open space expansion and maintenance
* Printing with non-toxic inks and dyes
* Public transit jobs related to driving, maintenance, and repair
* Recycling and reuse
* Small businesses producing products from recycled materials
* Solar installation
* Tree cutting and pruning
* Peri-urban and urban agriculture
* Water retrofits to increase water efficiency and conservation
* Whole home performance, including attic insulation, weatherization, etc.
It is very clear that moving away from polluting work and towards environmentally restorative work will bring significant changes and immediate benefits to workers, communities, and society at large. We need to develop a clearer understanding of what kinds of policies and programs can ensure that green collar jobs are made available to workers with limited initial education and skills, and that these jobs are stable, living wage jobs that provide benefits to workers and their families. Do green collar jobs, in and of themselves, offer workers a supportive work experience that contributes to improvements in quality of life?
By C. B. Innes on 06.09.08 8:03 am
LOL. You should probably read your own posted clip one more time and take a few more moments to reflect on your views, CBI. Canada Action Party…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Action_Party
Yeah… futuristic, likely seers of the way, but not able to adjust to the present in the way they could or should. Politics, as you say, is about comprimise but comprimise with what? Right?
Leadership is always key, and they should use the Green Party model if the Canada Action Party wants government funding to create a war chest to get on the map. Otherwise, unless the party gets a high profile candidate elected, someone charismatic, its future is likely less candidates running and not more which will hurt them further. Its either run candidates nation wide or run regionally and the best fit I can think of would be British Columbia for their ideologies, perhaps even take a stance at provincial politics if they want to try to form a government. NDP leadership is weak there and Campbell never did cut it for the Libs with substance in mind and I have no love personally for the Liberal government of BC, but then, they are Liberal in name only. Harpers loves the Campbell government is a tell in itself.
Otherwise, unless I’m mistaken (yet again, chuckles), I’m glad to see you come out with your true choice of flavor in politics. Its always much better to be upfront with things as a rule…
Wow, I thought that Sun cover was just a mockup. A Wingnutter exaggeration of shamelessness or something. Amazing.
By William Dahl on 06.09.08 8:06 am
I fully agree. These ads are an insult to peoples intelligence and will backfire. This isn’t the U.S., but Canada. It won’t fly.
By Tim N on 06.09.08 8:22 am
I agree. Market forces will force consumers to consume less with high energy prices, no question and less CO2 IS the goal… but… corporations also have to be regulated concerning the environment and that means a tax C02 to get it done or laws with hard caps, one of the two. Now… if you were in business, what would you choose? What would you want? Hard caps or a tax… and what kind of bar would you want in terms of how hard those caps are? You would choose what costs the least, or at least, the least cost effective way to achieve that goal.
Taxation is the best way to get the desired result from what I can see, and big oil can afford it. In the end costs will be downloaded onto the consumer over time but the goal of reducing C02 will be achieved, administration costs will be much lower than a consumption tax and revenues can be returned in the form of lower income taxes… to the middle and lower classes for a change!
But I’m just assuming this stuff for now, I haven’t seen the plan yet and the reasons why are threefold. The plan must be completed and fully functional with details fully worked out. Dion has to prepare to put it forward to the media. And finally, market forces could seriously trump a carbon tax plan at this time. Consumers, after all, in general, don’t seriously question much past what they can afford and what they are paying for energy so they’ll want relief and considering whats happening to the recession in the U.S., consumers might not get that relief.
There’s really only one general solution, otherwise. Change our ways.
Randy rages:You see this is why you brain dead Conservative trollies are really a sad pathetic lot. Lies, lies and more lies.
Why does denial always seem to be accompanied by such bitterness? If you think the claim is wrong, ask for the evidence.
It makes you look a lot smarter than just calling people names.
By Judy
When the Cons pick an oil slick as their mascot and present it to Canadians as a fun-loving, harmless, child-friendly buddy, they lose all credibility on the Environment front.
Garth–just keep hammering the inappropriate mascot—the Cons love oil producers so much they even have an oil slick as their spokesperson!!!
I agree. Does this little bugger have a name yet? Slicky, Slickster, Oily Oils? I’m sure there is clever moniker that could stick to the devious little rascal.
Garth, have you considered having a name the mascot blog post? I bet that would be fun and that there would be some interesting suggestions.
By Harry S on 06.09.08 9:40 am
Boy oh boy, are you ever missing it, Harry. Again. And since you post 10 times a day and most of us can’t be bothered to try to persuade you, I thought I’d give it an all but hopeless try just to keep your posts down to a few or less.
Bay Street wants Dions carbon tax. Not Wall St.. Not Big Oil or even small U.S. oil. Bay St. wants it.
Why do you think that is?
Who do you think owns more than 85% of our energy resources in Canada? And guess what, smart guy. None of that 85% is taxed either provincially or federally. Just a pitance in what amounts to the bottom few nations that have the lowest energy royalty rates in the world of which the feds have no royalties.
I’ll ask it again, there, genius who believes such foolery as immigration is bad for the Canadian economy and such completely unfounded, likely highly bigoted tripe.
Why does Bay St. support Dions tax plan? Why does Thomas D’Aquino support such a carbon tax?
Its only one of two reasons. The cost will hit energy producers of which most of them are U.S. oil and gas companies of which Can corps will likely see a reduction in corporate income tax in return…
Or Canadian corporations that make up a pitance compared to foreign oil companies that have the rights to exploit our resources will have a lower tax if any taxation at all.
Have you thought of this?
I’ll ask it again Harry as it should be rhetorical by now. Bay St supports the carbon tax… why is that, you who’ve got it all figured out… why is that?
Personally, I’d like to see a consumption tax on gas and oil on a price per barrel and at the pumps on a 50/50% basis, with taxation ending at $160 dollars per barrel (but still remaining flexible to raise the bar if C02 levels don’t rise), with the tax revenue used to end the GST if feisable as the cost of administrating such a tax at 5 cents under Harpers dullard approach has made the whole program far less efficient due to costs in administration, or have revenues directed towards lower income taxes for the poor and middle class, as well as a modest corporate tax cut. But thats just me and I haven’t seen the hard numbers to look at the cost/savings of implimenting such a tax scheme, or factor in what happens if market forces push oil past the $160 mark. Just throwing it out there, but one thing is clear.
The goal of reducing C02 levels is a winner and there are only three ways of achieving it.
1) A tax on big C02 polluters. This will achieve lower C02 emmissions from producers and consumers alike as the cost of such a tax is passed down to consumers over time.
2) A consumption tax that forces consumers to consume more efficiently. (I would also create a crown corp that would take 10% of this revenue to generate big clean power with geothermal closed loop systems, as well as hydrogen production where fiesable.) Unfortunately, this does nothing to force big polluters, namely big oil to curb C02 levels produced by oil and gas production.
3) Pass legislation that forces MPG standards to be raised to at least 40 MPG’s for all cars produced and imported, 25 MPG’s for trucks, 5 MPG’s for diesel highway tractors, put weight and size limits on car manufacturers that will both increase MPG’s and ease infrastructure costs, and pave the way for Slower moving veichles that can achieve 100 MPG’s plus and speeds up to 90 km’s into full mass production at Ontario plants.
But thats just me. I’m certain someone like yourself would rather just make money at the environments expense and do nothing as Harper has done. Isn’t that what anyone else with selfish will would do? You know, do nothing, just continue to obscenely profit at everyone elses expense (including your own, but thats the thing with the selfish. They never really consider the environment and how it affect them)
Hmmmmmmm…Seems Saudi Arabia is far more concerned about the oil orices than our goobernment?
Saudi Arabia seeks meeting to tackle high oil prices
Minister says price hikes unwarranted, unnatural
Maybe their Islamic views of fairness have better meanings than North America’s, and the Western World’s ‘Greed is GOOD! viewpoints? No surprise there!
From the looks of the comments so far, I’d say the Conservative War Room is at work early this morning.
By Bob Larocque on 06.09.08 9:32 am
Hmmn.
I think the war room is more like a tree house.
Shakepeare said something along the line of things are seldom what they appear to be.
Otherwise, unless I’m mistaken (yet again, chuckles), I’m glad to see you come out with your true choice of flavor in politics. Its always much better to be upfront with things as a rule…
By brain on 06.09.08 12:46 pm
You are really talking nonsense as usual. Sometimes I think where my comments are concerned you leave your brain behind!
I have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to CAP. I have nothing to do with them. Their platform in the last election set out some hairbrain France-Quebec conspiracy theory that totally discredited them.
If you are so partisan that you are totally opposed to any public input into the direction that a Liberal government might take then be honest enough to admit it. Don’t try to mischaracterize others views for your own agenda. It is dishonest.
I have never pretended to be anything but a Progressive Conservative with ties to the Progressive Canadian Party (those PCs who do not agree with the ideology behind the merger and the direction of the new Conservative Party).
This four panel one shows how the pollution travels and involves non-polluting areas just the same.
I can hear Baird and Harper screaming ‘DAMN SCIENCE’ here in the Muskoka.
<a href=”http://weatheroffice.gc.ca/chronos/imageview/viewImage_e.html?urlpath=/data/prog/chronos&Type=ANIMA4PAN&start=0&end=48&format=jpg&TITLE=CHRONOS&pas=6&imagename=00_054_C1_north@america@chronos_I_4PAN_CHRONOS”CHRONOS Four Panel View
Make sure and play the animation to see what happens every day 24/7 here in North America.
Oops! Bad HTML. Here it is corrected
CHRONOS Four Panel View
Oh, and note the nice plume over the Oil Sands in Panel 2.
Garth,
Fear not. I know some people who were leaning Conservative who are just tired of feeling manipulated and having their intelligence insulted by the Con’s ads.
What it means, I don’t know.
Hope someone has a plan for when the riots start?
By Bill-Muskoka on 06.09.08 10:04 am
The Toronto Police force want another 3,500 Tasers. Does that count?
Consequences or Truth
Stephen Harper’s Conservatives have tried over and over to brand itself the chief defender of law and order in this country. But yesterday, when it launched its latest round of attack ads on the Liberals, the Conservative Party used illegal advertising space to get its message out, according to the co-ordinator of IllegalSigns.ca.
The Conservatives didn’t just use a single illegal video screen to play the fiercely partisan advertisement. IllegalSigns.ca co-ordinator Rami Tabello told Spacing that every single screen that the spot is playing on at Toronto gas stations is illegal. According to media reports, gas station video screens are the primary vehicle for reaching Torontonians.
ITQ spoke to Rami Tabello earlier today.
Last year, he teamed up with Toronto City Councillor Howard Moscoe to fight a proposal that would have legalized pump signs – a fight that he eventually won, only to have one chain of gas stations ignore the law completely, according to the civic activist. In an email to macleans.ca, he said that the signs “continue to be illegal”:
When Toronto’s signs by-law was written in 1994, the regulations concerning signs at gas stations were negotiated between city planners and the oil companies. Esso has now decided to ignore those very regulations that it previously agreed to. It is unfortunate that the Conservative’s law and order platform doesn’t extend to their own political advertising.
Stephen Harper’s Conservatives have tried over and over to brand itself the chief defender of law and order in this country. But yesterday, when it launched its latest round of attack ads on the Liberals, the Conservative Party used illegal advertising space to get its message out, according to the co-ordinator of IllegalSigns.ca.
The Conservatives didn’t just use a single illegal video screen to play the fiercely partisan advertisement. IllegalSigns.ca co-ordinator Rami Tabello told Spacing that every single screen that the spot is playing on at Toronto gas stations is illegal. According to media reports, gas station video screens are the primary
……….
Illegal – hmmm… a legal suit here?
You know what? I have lived through many different governments and my taxes have NEVER decreased. They may shift but the total NEVER decreases and ALWAYS increases. This carbon tax scares me – it MAY be accompanied by a FUTURE income tax decrease. No, I don’t think so.
I also don’t believe that a carbon tax will make any difference except with regard to the environment.
WW from The Okanagan Sunday; sentence applies to everyone of any path in all circumstances life presents, no matter the path:
“Work out your own salvation. Do not depend on others.” — Siddartha Gautama, a.k.a. Buddha
****************************************
REPEAT AGAIN AND STAY ON MESSAGE
Focus on the . . . deteriorating economy.
AToryNoMore, 11:02 pm
– and –
In Canada we are spending 100 million a month on our effort in Afghanistan. Could that 100 million a month help Canadian farmers?
Pecked to Death by Ducks, 9:56 am
Good day, gentle offsprings and fellow bloggers.
Combined with other posters here, you have hit the nail squarely on the head. Ignore the ads — they are clearly designed to inflame people’s emotions, thus turning their attention spans way from the reality of what is happening.
The Christ said that “the poor will always be with us”, and if it is possible to help them, along with women’s shelters, food banks, etc., then by all means help.
However, $100 mln. a month would be a major boost for farmers all across Canada, increasing crops here for our own use and benefit.
Another poster wrote that we used to import 10% of our food (which means that 90% was grown right here); now 40% comes from outside.
This means that 40% has to be shipped or flown here, which means less farmland is now available (less farmers), fuel has to be used in order to get said product here, and pretty much everyone knows what has happened with the cost of fuel.
If this cursed “combat mission”, or war in Af’stan didn’t happen, then fed. and prov. MPs would be able to come up with some solutions, so as to help Cdns. keep their heads above water.
As Buddy, Can You Spare A Dime? said, it’s easy enough to change ad agencies, but what good would that do if no one is prepared to do anything?
An election is coming, that much is clear. The point will be to give a party enough clout to do something a lot more positive for Canada, NOT the US or anyone else.
Charity begins at home. Work with what there is and improve on that. If there is some left over, then help others who need assistance.
Time to force an election. Dion looks like Nero playing his carbon tax fiddle while Canada burns. If an election calls then these silly adds will be counted as part of Harper’s campaign spending…that’ll force him to think twice about where he spends it.
Why is Dion letting Harper get back on the offensive? It’s time to take the Liars down.
Janice, Harry S., Catherine, et al:
“It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt.”
- Mark Twain
By slg on 06.09.08 10:21 am
slug, you may want to take this advise yourself. You often display some very angry tendancies. Pity on your family.
So Garth, I heard David McGuinty, your colleague on with Mike Harris. Seems that your colleague and your leader have absolutely no compassion for the every day people. On one hand you verbalize your concerns for the working stiff and on the other hand have no problem in being instrumental in rising the costs of everything through this hair brained scam called Carbon Tax.
Yup, Stephane Dion can sit down with his pate de foie with his 15 light chandeliers (with CFLs of course), while the everyday folks are struggling to put the very basic foods on their table for their families. Yes the food costs will rise because companies will put their rising (from Carbon Taxes) onto the consumers.
Yup – Stephane Dion only views things through an elitist ideology.
Maybe Stephane Dion should first sell his Carbon Tax to the GM workers.
Why are government workers on the taxpayers dime handing out flyers and ugly yellow tshirts?
http://jasoncherniak.blogspot.com/
So the CPC mascot is a blob of oil. That’s telling. do I ever hope Canadians are wise to these neo-cons.
By Markus D. on 06.09.08 10:21 am
Markus, I believe that blob of oil, that you so correctly described, could be Peter Puck in diguise.
Don’t worry Garth, the strategists still say it isn’t time to go! All that sitting, abstaining and walking out on votes thus allowing legislation to pass that the LIBERALS criticized won’t be forgotten, and now the Tories can spin the Carbon tax to help themselves….AND WHO DID YOU SAY THE STRATEGISTS WERE WORKING FOR? Perhaps it is time to get new ones, but it will be too late as you continue to lose support since all that bad legislation went unchallenged when it came to the vote!
The Toronto Police force want another 3,500 Tasers. Does that count?
By Greg on 06.09.08 2:40 pm
Only in Toronto! LOL
Garth, your previous post made a good case for the tax shift. But, the shift to industry would only increase the prices we pay for their goods. I’m sorry, but I do not expect any company to eat the tax loss and not pass it on to consumers.
No matter how you slice the cake, we taxpayers will still end up paying more and ending up with less.
Until I see my net pay and increase and my net expenditures decrease, tax shifting will not be acceptable to me.
And speaking of taxes, why have you backed off from your flat tax initiative?
By DJ on 06.09.08 3:41 pm
Good question because whoever these backroom gurus are they sure are turning me away as a supporter! They, like the Death Star Troll Patrol, need to get out more and listen.
Garth
My last ditch effort…
Sent: June 9, 2008 1:30 PM
To: ‘Dion.S@parl.gc.ca’
Subject: A Plea to Defeat the Conservative Government
Importance: High
M. Dion,
With the greatest respect, Canadians can no longer wait. Sir, if you allow Stephen Harper to regroup through the summer he will define you and the Liberal green shifting plan. You will give him time to change the cabinet and rethink his Ontario strategy.
Please M. Dion this is the best opportunity Liberals have to defeat this horrible government. I fear that if you wait the outcome will increase the divide in Canada.
Let the people decide – it is time to show Canadians Liberals care about this great country.
Best Regards,
Ancient Wisdom!:
Rumi said Logic and intellect, the babble of sharp wits, are extremely short staffs to take on a long journey.
A lesson for the HoC, which will, as most philosophical wisdom, be ignored!
By Catherine on 06.09.08 3:21 pm
As usual, you are spouting off on a subject you know nothing about! What will be the income tax benefit to offset the Carbon tax, we have no idea. But you are as quick to denounce it as those who know nothing about it are to support it. Why not just wait until we find out some details…oh right you are a B o B and that isn’t possible for you. I can wait but then again, I have no real stake in the CPC or the Liberal party. All I can say is the ad run by the CPC makes them look very foolish and mean spirited….but I guess if the shoe fits….
Canadians are too clever to fall for these pathetic ads. They will quickly realize that a carbon fueled income tax cut is a benfit to most Canadians, especially the poor. It will encourage reduction in ghg emissions while at the same time ensuring prosperity for all.
The Conservative do nothing approach to addressing climate change will result in an uncertain future for our children and grandchildren and will possibly even result in the collapse of civilization.
Canadians will demand a carbon fueled income tax cut over the pathetic Conservative policies.
C.B. Innes
Most people on this blog would, IMHO, agree with taking the time and diligence to have a full-on debate about how to proceed in mitigating costs while achieving the solution.
Unfortunately, as you realize, those who oppose are distorting any positive alternatives put forward and, most tragically, as we see even on this blog, there are too many who swallow the well-financed propaganda and lies put out there by those who really do have an attitude of superiority and entitlement.
How do you believe we can overcome this deceptive negativity? We need as much insight into this as is possible. It looks as though we may be getting some help from the media because I think even they are astounded at the low level of attack and perversion of the truth these neo-cons are displaying.
Barb. has a good point on stressing tax saving and this will help put the lie to “a permanent new tax” and “weasel-word terms”
I’d like to agree with Randy and want the same as he, but note how the simplistic “putting money back in your own pocket” scheme such as the GST cuts, resonated with voters (the same voters who believed Mike Harris et al) and just how quickly they grab onto the “tax cut” bait. It is depressing how shallowly people contemplate these exploitive tricks. We need to get their attention.
In his next post, Randy says swing voters are looking for an alternative and the Liberals really do have to present a vision and, IMHO, on at least a handful of most urgent issues.
David Collins says “don’t abandon the message”. Also true.
People also wonder what influenced Dion’s change in plans re: handling emissions. As an intelligent thinker, he must incorporate new information into his thinking as nothing remains static but this is being knocked by the ever-discussion-polluting neo-cons and adds another little poisoned olive into their toxic cocktail of deception and lies.
I like Rob Wiebe’s observation: “Today, Canadians are just individual consumers of political goods rather than social producers of political outcomes.” Let’s change this!
.
Why does denial always seem to be accompanied by such bitterness? If you think the claim is wrong, ask for the evidence.
It makes you look a lot smarter than just calling people names.
By Lawrence on 06.09.08 1:36 pm—————
You see Lawrence you are spreading more lies. None of those ads made it out to the main stream media during the election. They were canceled and never ran. It is the Conservatives and the likes of you that are running them now and posting them on YouTube claiming the Libs ran them. Lies, lies and more lies. Carry on Sheep.
AHA! The Gnatsies are sending out the Yellow Shirt Youth Corps already!
Tory ad freebies
Young Conservatives, clad in bright yellow T-shirts are all over the streets around Parliament, handing out yellow postcards with the hapless picture of Liberal leader Stéphane Dion and the blaring words: “Dion’s Tax on Everything… Will You Be Tricked into Paying More?”
Some observations:
1. It’s not the most environmentally friendly campaign — an hour into it and I saw the little cards littered all over the ground like cigarette butts.
2. It’s a tough crowd out there. I saw one young Conservative press the card into the palm of a former adviser to Dion. This Liberal fellow stared at the card and then barked: “How unbelievably crass!”
3. Part of the campaign included sending out mass emails yesterday from someone called “Stéphane.” I got one myself, as did my colleagues here. It says:
Hi Susan,
Stéphane wanted to tell you…
Having trouble setting priorities? Friends don’t know what they speak about? Billions of dollars of spending promises got you in a big debt hole? Well don’t worry. If you answered yes to any of these questions, there is an answer. A permanent new tax on everything!
I’m just wondering — can someone complain about tape doctoring one day and then put out emails in someone else’s name the next?
Susan Delacourt asks a very viable question I think!
Quote: “Nobody ever profited taking advice from the cheap and the tawdry. This morning, they surround us.”
Quote: “And they walk among us!”
I usually am turned off by most all advertising and selectively tune it out. It is no different in this case. But what is different is the source and the location. To me this is an assault on my freedom to go about my daily business without audio/visual pollution of my immediate surroundings. This is a new low in the tactics of political entities. In case they are not aware of it, there is not an election campaign under way, yet! Should this spending on campaigning be included into the next election campaign? I think so, and thus these ill bred idiots may already be over the dollar limits! Shame on them!!!
After this attack ad I’m putting my health policy studies aside and learning how to bomb Canada’s oil pipelines in a way that is non-lethal. I wouldn’t have dreamed such a course of action was ethical, pre-Bali.
If I could assure first responders wouldn’t be killed, and that it wouldn’t disproportionately target low-income Canadians and Americans (the sticking point that renders the concept a non-starter), I would send the blueprint to known environmental extremists.
Another alternative is to develop a derivatives strategy that would clog up world oil trade, but once again poor consumers would by unpalatable collateral damage.
This is class war between GWB and S.Harper, vs those who will be killed by climate change’s effects many decades from now. I’m standing up for the latter. S.Harper, the Conservative Party of Canada, and all the newspapers who endorsed Harper (all of them save the Toronto Star) are trying to brainwash the public that greed is better than the survival of humanity.
You mean that’s not his agenda?? — Garth
BY TORY@YORK 06.09.08 8:10 AM
Dear Tory at York,
You are attempting to Misinform people, just like your leader does. You know well that Mr. Harper’s many years shaping the Reform party, his groups such as the Calgary School, and his years as president of the NCC were all dedicated to criminalizing abortion, preventing equality for each individual, disallowing women the choice to stay home or go back to work and so on.
From ~ A Calgarian of 30 years who has seen Harper’s agenda
http://www.canada.com/calgaryherald/news/story.html?id=ed388033-bcc8-4039-aad3-5bfcc87c46f8
You can’t say those tories are looking after themselves!!!!
BY SLG ON 06.09.08 8:16 AM
SLG,
I will not buy gas at one of those stations. I may even write to the news networks who are throwing these ads on for free for the Conservatives. Any other ideas?
Thank you for the suggestion
Mike Duffy Live! was especially entertaining tonight.
Dean looks like he has lost a couple of family buckets.
Lol @ Garth, I thought you were being extra patient with the big D.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qqtCxLq5JU
“Aside from the gun point, the ad also concludes Harper will kill medicare and ban abortions.
No fear-mongering there …”
Wasn’t that four years ago? Did it air? — Garth
BY BROCK ON 06.09.08 10:23 AM
Dear Brock,
Yes, Harper would have gone to Iraq, hopes to ban abortion, weaken our gun laws, has spent those billions – so it was all true, and he scrapped the accord and Kyoto..
So why would YOU have had a problem with that ad if it had aired? Does the truth about Harper worry you so much that you don’t want to see it or have it discussed or brought out in the open? Harper’s long-standing and very well-known leadership with the NCC, is a group that was formed to end public healthcare
Terminally and viciously stupid Jason Kenney sure made an ass of himself in QP today .
What a fat toad he is .
I guess he forgot about the thirty five billion in Canadian savings his party made magically disappear last halloween.Trick or treat ? .A big fat lie of enormous proportions .
That is the biggest flip-flop in the history of the universe .
Maybe Dion did say no carbon tax,last year, until he realized one designed by the Liberals could actually work without damaging the population .
This fat asshole makes my skin crawl .
So proud of his virginity . Who in the hell would want it ? !
Mouthy bastard needs a stiff shot to the teeth .
Vicious and stupid not a winning combination .
Speaking of fear, if the Libs were not afraid of losing, we would have had an election last year. So the yellow colour featured by the Cons is appropriate. I know, discretion is the better part of valour.
Perhaps the LPC should worry less about the misuse made of information by the CPC, than about the information it has made – or failed to make – available. They have sold the sizzle, the Cons are saying it stinks, so the realistic option is to produce the steak, which better have an appealing texture and taste.
When will Dion present the plan? It had better be soon, and it better not have any wrinkles. How much abuse does the Liberal Party think it can survive, or is it out to challenge Kim Campbell’s record of two seats?
Vicious and stupid not a winning combination .
By Men With Hats on 06.09.08 4:56 pm
As Marcus, the Ranger in Babylon-5 stated to the Emperor and his alien co-hort ‘My, ignorant and arrogant at the same time. How efficient of you!’
So it does have one benefit, eh? LOL
So, when is the Election?
Tories have little room to grow, Liberals preferred choice in polarized vote: poll
The Canadian Press Harris-Decima survey compared attitudes toward the Tories and Liberals in a head-to-head, two-party format. The telephone poll of just over 1,000 Canadians found that 44 per cent of respondents would prefer a Liberal government after the next election, compared to 37 per cent who preferred the Conservatives.
By Bill-Muskoka on 06.09.08 4:24 pm
What a waste and just what I thought would happen with the cards being handed out when I read of it. I can’t believe that even if people didn’t want one of the fliers that they could not bother to throw it in a garbage can themselves though. I wonder how much longer voters will be able to put up with our federal politicians before throwing in the towel and saying do we really need so much government? Either the politicians can start to get to work and get paid for preforming their duties without all the childish games or they should resign. This is our country they are running, this is not kindergarten. Kindergarten is more civil and better behaved. It is a sad joke that is now reality.
forgotten – Harper was campaigning and promising soldiers/bases near every town
BY SLG ON 06.09.08 9:29 AM
And now.. Harper’s stunningly undemocratic move..” the deeper integration with the United States – hard to imagine that an agreement of such magnitude, allowing U.S.-Canadian troops on each other’s soil and threaten the sovereignty of each nation was not debated or voted on..”
“the Harper Conservative government and the Canadian military failed to announce the signing of CAP. This agreement was not signed by the governments of both countries, but by military commanding officers with no public debate or Parliamentary and Congressional oversight. There was no Canadian Forces press release, and the government refused to answer questions on the agreement in the House of Commons”
http://intelstrike.com/?p=266
Second, fear cannot be allowed to reign. Nobody ever profited taking advice from the cheap and the tawdry. This morning, they surround us By Garth.
The Conservatives have laernt from the Liberals and their fear tactics during the last two elections. Remember the soldiers in the street Liberal add which was pulled after at the last minute. Their hidden agenda one was another Liberal fear tactic. So Garth why is it Ok for the Liberals to use fear tactics in their adds and not the Conservatives? Personally I think you protest to much.
the thirty five billion in Canadian savings his party made magically disappear last halloween.Trick or treat ? .A big fat lie of enormous proportions . By men without brains.
Oh so now it is up to 35 billion. My how the amount grows with every telling of it. It started out at under 20 billion.
Fill your boots Barbara.
I think we have more than a carbon tax to worry about in the next election. What about the super highway and the secret North American Union? Since there is no doubt in my mind that Harper is for it, maybe Stephane and his Liberals should be saying what their thoughts are on it. It is about time we started asking our politicians for their views and their party views.
Lou Dobbs has done quite an investigation and it is frightening.
http://tinyurl.com/69yxaq
Please correct me if I am wrong. I don’t think Garth has addressed this issue on his blog although many have posted on it.
Randy Persists: You see Lawrence you are spreading more lies. None of those ads made it out to the main stream media during the election. They were canceled and never ran.
Randy, I linked you to a specific ad (the one with the gun pointed at the viewer) and I assure you that it ran in the media during the campaign. The only Liberal ad that was pulled in that campaign was the one about “Soldiers, in our Cities, In Canada”. Perhaps you better check your facts – and your manners – before you call me a liar again.
Latest scientific research on GM crops. Monsanto will end up being quite wealthy from this, except there won’t be anyone left to eat their ‘treated’ foods!
http://tinyurl.com/6xsfel
As usual, you are spouting off on a subject you know nothing about! What will be the income tax benefit to offset the Carbon tax, we have no idea. But you are as quick to denounce it as those who know nothing about it are to support it. Why not just wait until we find out some details…oh right you are a B o B and that isn’t possible for you. I can wait but then again, I have no real stake in the CPC or the Liberal party. All I can say is the ad run by the CPC makes them look very foolish and mean spirited….but I guess if the shoe fits….
By jwp on 06.09.08 4:10 pm
Oh that’s too bad that Stephane Dion didn’t have the forsight to have his Carbon Tax details in place before he opened his mouth about his Carbon Tax. I would suspect that he and his minions are busy scrambling to make the Carbon Tax more acceptable after hearing that he is not even close to what the average working stiff wants.
No sense in discussing this over the summer – when most people have their minds on vacations and spending some time with their children. Or was this Stephane Dion’s plan. Put out the details when no one is paying attention because the details are not acceptable!!!
Apparently Garth knows the details (he did mention that on Mike Duffy). So maybe before the House breaks and people are paying attention to politics (well some people), Stephane Dion should come clean on his Carbon Tax details. If of course he truly believes that this Carbon Tax is really good for our environment.
Harper was campaigning and promising soldiers/bases near every town – how would you take that?
By slg on 06.09.08 9:29 am
Don’t have a problem with a base near us. In fact I would look forward to it.
Sometimes people astound me. Some bitch because there is a base near them and then they bitch because it closes.
I remember when I was stationed at RCAF Station Penhold, Ab, the residents and city leaders of Red Deer didn’t appreciate the Station in fact some felt it should move because they felt we the RCAF members and their families didn’t contribute to the local economy very much. Well our Senioiur pay officer want to prove a point so he paid us all in $2.00 bills. This was in the days when their was actual pay parades. There was $2.00 bills flying around Red Deer for months after. Then when it closed a few years later in 1966/67, Red Deer screamed bloody murder. This closure was a result of a LB Pearson’s Liberal government decision.
The Conservatives have laernt from the Liberals and their fear tactics during the last two elections. Remember the soldiers in the street Liberal add which was pulled after at the last minute. Their hidden agenda one was another Liberal fear tactic. So Garth why is it Ok for the Liberals to use fear tactics in their adds and not the Conservatives? Personally I think you protest to much.
By Van on 06.09.08 5:55 pm
Sure glad you read before you post Van!
Finally , a tax on the air we breathe , and revenue neutral to boot ! When do we vote ….. I’m excited about Liberal fortunes running on this as their main policy plank .
By Marc on 06.09.08 5:28 pm
Ah Marc…you are so right….and to think that 60% of voters are so tied to the CPC and Liberals that they cannot think for themselves….it is indeed a sad reality!
After this attack ad I’m putting my health policy studies aside and learning how to bomb Canada’s oil pipelines in a way that is non-lethal. I wouldn’t have dreamed such a course of action was ethical, pre-Bali.
………..etc…….
By Phillip Huggan on 06.09.08 4:31 pm
You sound like the Liberals answer to terrorist Harry!
As Marcus, the Ranger in Babylon-5 stated to the Emperor and his alien co-hort ‘My, ignorant and arrogant at the same time. How efficient of you!’
So it does have one benefit, eh? LOL
By Bill-Muskoka on 06.09.08 5:13 pm
Agreed . And so funny .
Garth
Don’t give me that do goody good bullshit.
No one in the House is willing to take up the cause of Canadians struggling to make ends meet in a economic slowdown or address the environment.
Just an argument that it’s not time.
Garth, Canadians are running out of patience and time as we are in this not-so-slow burn that is passed on to the next generation.
So who’s worse Conservatives who tell lies because they don’t believe in climate change but understand it’s a “touchy” subject or a Liberal party who waits because people will eventually gravitate to a great plan and recognize climate change is our greatest challenge?
It’s all about money. greed, lies, delay, leadership, skyrocketing gas prices and no solutions – just business as usual. I keep hearing this lyric which says it all:
Money, get away.
Get a good job with good pay and you’re okay.
Money, it’s a gas.
Grab that cash with both hands and make a stash.
New car, caviar, four star daydream,
Think I’ll buy me a football team.
Give me a break
Money, get back.
I’m all right jack keep your hands off of my stack.
Money, its a hit.
Don’t give me that do goody good bullshit.
I’m in the high-fidelity first class traveling set
And I think I need a lear jet.
Money, its a crime.
Share it fairly but don’t take a slice of my pie.
Money, so they say
Is the root of all evil today.
But if you ask for a raise its no surprise that they’re
Giving none away.
Lyrics – Pink Floyd
I am done.
BY VAN 06.09.08 5:55 PM
Van, his stated – $36 billion is correct.
Try reading the news at CTV
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20061103/oilgas_incometrust_061106?s_name=&no_ads=
You pretty much sum up your party leader.. You lie about the issues, then you lie about your opponent, then you lie that your opponent is lying
Have you been diagnosed? Ask you doctor about Sociopathic personality disorder as consistent liars can fall under that category
Your outburst at 5:59 confirms another consistent trait
or proponents of the Green Shift have simply not articulated their vision. = Garth
Alleluia or is that Eureka!
Until Mr. Dion comes out and details his plan, the Cons have the field. Another analogy is buy on speculation, sell on fact. At minute, the Cons are speculating, and people are buying their interpretation of Mr. Dion’s plan, hook, line and sinker. Until he makes the facts of his plan known, they will continue to buy into the CPC’s message.
Mr. Dion has to make his plan known.
And this leads me to the next thought.
After 2 1/2 years of Harpers mismanagement, lies and incompetance, why is Mr. Dion not in a position to bring this government down?
He should have had his “red book” in order within 18 months. And i trust this is not becoming Mr. Dion’s MO, having excellent ideas but not being able to pull them together so that people can learn about them and understand them.
Assuming we don’t see the government fall tonight (which we really should), Mr. Dion will have the summer to get his house in order such that come the first confidence vote in the fall, Harper gets the chop.
If that does not happen, there are going to be a lot of people, not only po’d at Harper’s crap legislation, but increasingly PO’s at Mr. Dion for not preventing its passage through the HoC because he was not in a position to fight an election.
Dalton McGuinty is more a leader than either Harper or Dion and has done more to move things forward than the Federal Bozos have. Maybe Ontario should just keep their money and kick Oddawahahaha out? Go to Calgary, Winterpeg, Hell for all I care at this point! Perhaps the ‘New’ Canada’ will consist of the Ontario, Quebec, Nunavit, NWT, Manitoba, and the Maritimes?
By Bill-Muskoka on 06.09.08 10:36 am
Hey, you might be on to something here – afterall this is the “original” Canada and in fact, if it wasn’t for Liberals, Alberta wouldn’t exist in the first place.
Wasn’t that four years ago? Did it air? — Garth
By Brock on 06.09.08 10:23 am
Yeah, it did on the internet.
No air here. And did it appear on a Liberal site? — Garth
slug, you may want to take this advise yourself. You often display some very angry tendancies. Pity on your family.
By Catherine on 06.09.08 3:14 pm
Ah, tsk Catty – hit a nerve – too close for comfort? It did, or you wouldn’t react LOL – from “slug” – still with the 8 year old namecalling – some on the blog have now decided to call me that in a friendly way…nice.
Stick to the Conservative government many weaknesses and the faltering economy.
Keep the heat on them!
By AToryNoMore on 06.09.08 9:23 am
OTTAWA — New Tory attack ads against Stéphane Dion’s carbon tax may never be seen by Canadian drivers as they fill up their gas tanks.
The Tories unveiled the so-called “fuelcast” ads Sunday, which were supposed to start airing on video screens set up at gas pumps in and around Toronto.
But Fuelcast Network – the only company in the gas pump TV business in Canada – says it has a policy against broadcasting political ads.
However, Tory spokesman Ryan Sparrow says the party has a binding agreement with Fuelcast to show the ads and expects the contract to be honoured.
Attack ads
Enlarge Image
Attack ads (Conservative Party of Canada)
Videos
Stephane Dion
Tories’ new attack ads
CTV’s Graham Richardson on the Conservatives’ cartoon attack ad
Related Articles
Recent
* Tories target Dion with aggressive attack ads
The Globe and Mail
The ads feature what appears to be a talking oil splotch warning drivers that the Liberal Leader’s carbon tax will “drive up the cost of everything,” including gas and electricity.
Mr. Dion says the Tories are lying about his plan, which he has yet to unveil in detail.
Oh, Christ ! Here comes another lawsuit from the all idiot,all loser party .
We’ll sue . We have a signed agreement .
Van, you’re an idiot .Beat it ‘ya loser .
By Bill-Muskoka on 06.09.08 5:25 pm
So, when is the Election?
Tories have little room to grow, Liberals preferred choice in polarized vote: poll
The Canadian Press Harris-Decima survey compared attitudes toward the Tories and Liberals in a head-to-head, two-party format. The telephone poll of just over 1,000 Canadians found that 44 per cent of respondents would prefer a Liberal government after the next election, compared to 37 per cent who preferred the Conservatives.
………………………………………..
After Canadians get to hear Dion ’sell’ his Carbon-Income Tax Shift Green Plan, undoubtedly these popularity numbers will skyrocket out into the stratosphere. The vote will polarize around Dion and the Liberals because Canadians want to do their bit to reduce GHGs that are destroying our planet for the next generation.
Dion’s Green Shift Plan will polarize the NDP and BQ vote into the Liberals by September, and there will be a demand by Canadians to have an election asap.
Remember Dion’s apocryphal 2007 declaration after being elected Liberal leader:
“Liberals … we need to go back to power as soon as possible!”
Lou Dobbs investigation on the Super NAFTA Highway from Mexico to Canada and the North America Union and the coming Amero. Are you ready?
http://tinyurl.com/69yxaq
Dalton McGuinty is more a leader than either Harper or Dion and has done more to move things forward than the Federal Bozos have. Maybe Ontario should just keep their money and kick Oddawahahaha out? Go to Calgary, Winterpeg, Hell for all I care at this point! Perhaps the ‘New’ Canada’ will consist of the Ontario, Quebec, Nunavit, NWT, Manitoba, and the Maritimes?
By Bill-Muskoka on 06.09.08 10:36 am
Hey, you might be on to something here – afterall this is the “original” Canada and in fact, if it wasn’t for Liberals, Alberta wouldn’t exist in the first place.
By slg on 06.09.08 6:24 pm
Yup – you two are such strong Canadians, eh? You Liberals are pathetic!
Dear Garth love your blogs
Tony Clement should do the same
This is like a town hall meeting daily
It’s a better way to communicate with the people you work for.
Than the millions he is spending on mass mailings
And the people could see who he really is
Ha Bill we need a good political blog in Parry Sound Muskoka
Interisted
Thought real estate was a good investment? Think again.
http://tinyurl.com/5dt6on
*******************************************
Still the war without end continues.
This is harpo’s legacy for Cdns.? Could be time for him to enlist, get a taste of his own medicine.
http://tinyurl.com/64rlsu
It seems to me that we need to go byond politics and consider our planet. Oil is non-renewable. At some point we will run out. As we get closer to that point, prices will increase to the point where only a few VERY rich people will afford to buy it. Prices WILL increase. We need to spend our time looking for alternative methods to provide energy to our population.In the meantime, we also need to extend the life expectancy of the oil reserves.
Forget politics.. Look for solutions. WE may need our Scientits back at the NRC.
Would everyone please look to the future.. The future of our children and Grandchildren
No air here. And did it appear on a Liberal site? — Garth
I think people are confusing the 2004 campaign and the 2006 campaign. The ad in question (linked earlier) features a handgun pointed at the viewer… it aired in the 2004 campaign… and it was indeed broadcast on television.
Here is some discussion of it:
I don’t know if the confusion is genuine or contrived but I look forward to being called a “liar” again in either case.
” Carbi the talking poo stain ” is my humble suggestion for the WTF is it cartoon character.
No sense in discussing this over the summer – when most people have their minds on vacations and spending some time with their children. Or was this Stephane Dion’s plan. Put out the details when no one is paying attention because the details are not acceptable!!!
Apparently Garth knows the details (he did mention that on Mike Duffy). So maybe before the House breaks and people are paying attention to politics (well some people), Stephane Dion should come clean on his Carbon Tax details. If of course he truly believes that this Carbon Tax is really good for our environment.
By Catherine on 06.09.08 6:11 pm
Well they will have plenty of time with their children with gas at $1.35 a litre and no environmental plan in the works…and you can be sure if the details are unacceptable, it will be the end of the Liberal party. I think people will be listening very closely to what the plan is…and will act accordingly. I know you won’t B o B, but then your mind isn’t open to anything any party other than the CPC has to say. You have that right, and you do admit it freely so I wish you and your grandchildren bon voyage.
Liberals marked their opposition to Bill C-50 without bringing down the government and forcing a general election. “The leader and many of my colleagues oppose these changes,” said Liberal MP Ruby Dhalla “But we also have to ensure we listen to Canadians on a mass scale and whether or not they wanted an election and so exercise strategic patience”
http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=575441
Patience is a virtue.
Turner,
don’t be a rude prick on TV to a fellow MP. You have no right to tell him to “calm down”.
Why don’t you calm down you fucking moron. Don’t you know that Mike gets you on his show because you make the Libasses look bad.
Garth, I’m so utterly disappointed that the Liberals failed to show for the non-confidence budget/immigration bill.
Watched you on Duffy. Just wanted to say thank you for being so level headed and calm against such a foul loud mouth.
I agree with Kinsella that an election would have been good now, but I don’t agree about his views on the carbon tax shifting. If you can’t sell the proposal within a six week election campaign, you will never do it with more time and in the fall/winter. The window of opportunity is closing.
Thanks for the good reads on the blog and best of luck to you.
“I don’t know if the confusion is genuine or contrived but I look forward to being called a “liar” again in either case.”
-Lawrence On
I too am really looking forward to Garths and Randys rebuttal to your indisputable evidence. Although, I doubt that they will respond at all. Prove me wrong.
No air here. And did it appear on a Liberal site? — Garth
By Van on 06.09.08 6:26 pm
Who knows and who cares. Who is to know that the current sight is not actual a Liberal operative. The fact is that it was and still is being aired on the internet as I have said which is contrary to what you said. Btw, this add was run during the 2006 campaign so here it is just for you Garth and anybody else who may want to refresh their memories. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68toCAiPIjo
I don’t know if the confusion is genuine or contrived but I look forward to being called a “liar” again in either case.
By Lawrence on 06.09.08 7:27 pm
I am not calling you a liar by any means Lawrence. However the URL for add I was referring to happened during the 2006 campaign and is mn my last post. This add resulted in the widely used “Guns in the streets” comment during that campaign.
What I find very interesting and enlightening in both the adds is that it really indicates how the Liberals truly feel about the military and clearly demonstrates along with their actions during their time in office is that they appear to only disdain for the men and women in uniform. About the only time they show support is when it will show them in good light.
Guess the Libs agree with the latest bill, they did not even bother to opposed it. Next week they will whine and pine that it is bad, but at least we have grown to accept the procedure. Kind of like prostrate check
The new direction of the current government has to be seen for what it is- the desperate actions of a failing minority position. I just paid 1.35 a litre for gas, the loaf of bread I bought on the weekend cost 2.59 -double what it did a year ago. The rice meal I enjoy has gone from .99 to 1.88 since the fall. Sorry folks, there is no way given the direction of the cost of such basic consumer items that the Canadian voter will allow this government to continue or repeat. The Liberals know it.
Hence the carbon tax. Get ready for it. However it has more to do with Canadian politics than world climate change. This tax will deflate the west’s runaway petro economy. That is what it is designed to do. The national power base will remain in the east based on hard work and enterprize. The Canadian dollar will over time go to 80- 85 cents, which is where all international analysts say it should be. And all will be well.
PET sand bagged the separatists with skillful manipulation of immigration policy and Mr Dion and company will ditto that to Mr Harpers oil buddies with tax policy.
Clever fellow that Dion character.
It is rather ridiculous for Conservative supporters once again to try to justify their attack ads by saying the Liberals did it. You are really scraping the bottom of the barrel when you use that kind of justification especially after condemning the Liberals for negative and inaccurate attack ads.
I remember back in 1993 when our Progressive Conservative Party put out those horrible Chretien attack ads we made our distaste known to the party strategists. It is evident that the new Conservatives are a different type of conservative.
Turner,
don’t be a rude prick on TV to a fellow MP. You have no right to tell him to “calm down”.
Why don’t you calm down you fucking moron. Don’t you know that Mike gets you on his show because you make the Libasses look bad.
By Hey Stupid on 06.09.08 7:44 pm
Don’t be an effing moron,MORON !
Garth, I’m incredibly disappointed to see the Liberals not standing up against a bill (C-50) that the party claims to be against.
You are letting Harper have a dictatorship by proxy because the party is too afraid to put Dion on a ballot. All Harper has to do is continue to make every outlandish idea he has a confidence motion, and he can pass whatever he wants.
It is pathetic, cowardly and dishonest of the Liberal party to keep letting Harper change laws to benefit the minority of Canadians who support him, when with the Bloq and NDP you have a majority to oppose these changes. You have an obligation to the voters, I suggest you remind your party of that.
Slicks Landers, Accidental CEO of Harper’s Big Gas Co.
Wow, thanks Garth, I love your blog; it seems like you are always there listening and introducing us to the real works of the government.
I have learned so much since I discovered your webpage.
I dig the way the Cons are illuminating Dion. He’s becoming well known and it’s at the cons expense. Loved the Lettuce Head Dion. Gosh, they are a smart bunch of hateful, bitter people.
What is it about Dion that they feel it so important to mimmic and make fun of who he is and what he stands for.
I am a liberal minded person and I am no thief ever was, never will be.
Dion is starting to look pretty good; or at least we can actually say that the Liberals look pretty mature and a caring group of MP’s.
. . . Are you ready? . . . Bonnie L, 6:36 pm
Hello Bonnie.
CANAMEX / NAU / Amero / SPP / NAFTA.
NAFTA will be reworked, rewritten and everything else, in order to appease DC; CANAMEX can be changed to AMEXCAN.
The only reason why harpo so desperately wanted an election about six months to a year ago, was that if CRAP was able to get a majority, there wouldn’t be any discussion now — it would already be in place.
Now, times have changed and folk are noticing, more and more, what kind of leadership we have in Ottawa — zero. It all comes from the White House.
Could be this is one reason why Dion is holding off — let harpo and CRAP dig themselves further into a hole from which they can’t get out of, then strike like a cobra when the time is right — not too much longer, now.
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Stockwell Day writes a weekly column on castanet.net, so I thought I would share it with y’all (parens mine).
“The sky is falling!” That headline would understandably grab more attention than one that says “The sky is blue.” However, extreme or catastrophic announcements aside, I wonder at times if it is a journalistic requirement to maximize the negative and minimize the positive. Let’s do a consumer test right now to test my (jaded) theory on this.
Ready? Here goes. Were you aware through the media last week that there was a closing down of an auto manufacturing plant in Ontario? (Yes — approx. 2,600 good paying jobs gone.) If you were aware, please raise your hand right now, wherever you are reading this and hold it up until you feel silly. Okay, I can feel by that show of hands that quite a few of you caught that item on the news.
Now, by a similar show of hands, were you aware that last week there was an opening of an auto manufacturing plant in Ontario that will create at least 500(!) jobs? (No. Math says a shortfall of 2,100 jobs; where are they? Do the new jobs pay as much as the prior jobs?) Hmm, I’m looking all around and I can’t see nearly as many hands in the air. Okay, you can put them down now.
Now don’t you find that interesting? (Why didn’t the feds. publicize it? Could it be that they are non-union jobs, which don’t pay as much?) A plant closure gets such media saturation that everybody hears about it. But a plant opening gets so little reporting (depends on the size of the plant, where it is and will workers be well paid) that very few know about it. Now, I fully realize that a closure of that magnitude is big news (actually, devastating). When that many workers and families have their lives so totally upset that’s a human interest and economic story of compelling proportions (So, where will their next paycheques come from? The feds. know what they’re doing, right?). But, to have in the very same week and region a plant opening that will also affect thousands of lives, but in a positive way, that should also be worthy of broad, not scant coverage.
Quite rightly we enjoy freedom of the press in our vibrant democracy (msm is controlled, so I don’t pay much attention to them). We would never want that diminished. It just makes me wonder on a daily basis if there is a genuine sentiment or even an unwritten law in the major media outlets that bad news (which of course must be reported) must outweigh good news (You tell us — after all, you control the msm).
Here’s an interesting bit of news. This week in Parliament we moved ahead with something called Bill C-10. Among other things, this piece of tax law (Something smells fishy already) will deal with tax credits which can be awarded to film productions in Canada. This Bill will allow the Government to decline a request for subsidy if the film is pornographic, excessively violent or denigrating to ethnic or other groups. We are continuing a process initiated under the previous Liberal government and approved by all parties.
Most of the media reporting on Bill C-10 covers certain lobbyists in the film industry who accuse us of censorship. This is not the case at all. As a matter of fact pornographic films for instance or grossly violent films are produced independent of taxpayer dollars all the time. The government is simply saying that as the stewards of the hard earned dollars of taxpayers we must have the ability to say there are some things that should be left up to private citizens to pay for, rather than the Government (Isn’t this what The Third Reich did in the early ’30s? Burning books, censoring artist’s ideas, etc.?).
So fear not, there are no Government thought police (There are in the US now) sweeping the theatres to see what you’ve chosen to watch. But we will watch your tax dollars for you to make sure they’re being appropriately spent on the things that matter most in public policy.
****************************************
Orwell’s doublespeak again. Are these well trained seals or what?
Two years of identical poll results .
Failing policies written by retards .
A dollar that is way over valued .
Gasoline prices in the stratosphere.
Food prices that have doubled in less than a year .
Hyper inflation on the horizon .
Draconian laws that no one supports .
No meaningful investment in health
care .
Not one day care space created .
Wait lists ,for medical services,longer than ever .
Education costs flying out of control .
No ‘Green’ plan .
No effort to align Canada with those who wish to curb pollution .
Team there are a lot of reasons to vote for the Barnum & Bailey party-all clowns.
Thanks Mr. Turner for doing a great job in the face of del Maestro and his constant interruptions and reiterations of Harper Party talking point fabrications.
And good for all of you for telling Harper and his CrudeCrew to pound salt about sitting late with the Cons to get their dirty business done. If they’re ever in power again maybe they’ll learn what all successful students have: cramming the night before an exam results in failure!
I also noted that Van Loan berated the Opposition parties for being in a hurry for 3 month’s vacation, when Van Loan knows full well the government will be taking over 5 month’s vacation!
In the bombshell announcement last Tuesday, the government reneged on a campaign promise not to tax income trusts. The news shook the markets and led to stock losses of more than $36 billion over two days.
Under the new rules, the government intends to impose a distribution tax on payouts by income trusts. The tax will take effect next year on newly formed trusts but existing ones will have a four-year period of transition.
You were saying,asshole ?
This tax will deflate the west’s runaway petro economy. That is what it is designed to do
BY THE ARTIST FORMERLY KNOWN AS PRINCE 8:46PM
Artist,
Great post.
I think today will be seen, however, as a day the Liberals wish they had back. The government should have come down today. They were very strategic to release the ads this weekend….and it was solely for the purpose of making sure they made it through the vote today. And the Liberals went for it – hook, line and sinker.
I believe this day will be rregretted as harper et. al use the summer to regain all the ground they lost.
Big mistake IMHO.
Well, lookeee here! Wasn’t this one of the main causes of the housing bubble to go “Pop Goes The Weasel” in the first place?!
http://tinyurl.com/3queoj
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516 miles on a single tank of . . . hydrogen?
http://tinyurl.com/5klhzj
I heard about the gas station ads on tonight’s news and had exactly the same reaction as your husband: BOYCOTT. Any private enterprise that politicizes itself in this way by directly linking itself to the Conservative party will lose my business. Most often these days my memory is short, but not on this subject.
On the same news broadcast, I also heard how auto makers are scrambling to get out new alternate and fuel-efficient vehicles out within the next 2 years. It’s like the 70’s and the OPEC oil crisis all over again, when all of a sudden the big V-8s were being dropped lot hotcakes for 4 and 6 cyclinder vehicles, with Chevettes, Pintos and Gremlins making their debut. I was somewhat alarmed at people’s short memories of those events, when 2 decades later gas guzzling SUVs, king size pickups and Hummers were brought and bought. Personally I see these high fuel prices in an optimistic light, just the impetus for innovation like the compressed air vehicle that someone had mentioned here a month or so ago. Only need a couple of new nuclear reactors to generate the electricity to power up the compressors (of course to be hampered by the Conservatives’ plan to sell off AECL).
With that, the service station of the future would be the extension cord running from the outlet at the front of the house. What a problem: how will the Conservatives place their ads on that?
Air-Powered Car Coming to U.S. in 2009 to 2010 at Sub-$18,000, Could Hit 1000-Mile Range
http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/new_cars/4251491.html?series=19
CONs retreat form earlier slanderous claims
Notice how the CONs have retreated from their false claims of “ a tax on everything” to a “tax on just about everything”(Jason Kenney as of today)
Time for the Liberals to sue the CONs.
Meanwhile, both parties are taxing my patience.
Garth: First of all, you were great tonight on Duffy. Del Mastro was spewing his talking points (which we have heard repeated on every political show today) and you were clear-headed and sincere. I really did admire you. What a contrast in approach and objectivity!
Catherine:
If you don’t know enough about the plan, by all means, attack the planner.
I can’t help taking exception to those who, for purely partisan purposes, attack an earnest, honest, intelligent man who is really trying to accomplish lower GHG’s in as timely a manner as is afforded him.
If Dion doesn’t get his plan in, what will the Conservatives do to help people with the ever-increasing costs of energy? The cost will go up for everyone if the Conservatives have their way.
Dion wanted to have a discussion about a n urgent, serious problem. In good faith, he was giving you a chance to be included. You showed a lack of ability to think and took the easy way out. Why should you be taken seriously?
Ah, Ryan Sparrow, the same twenty-something fellow who brought you the Elections-Canada-RCMP-raid back stair dash between hotels to hide from the non-choice media. The genesis of this new ad campaign all makes sense now.
I love that little slippery, slick, oily drip! It is so representative of the little oily blobs that slip so many greasy smears into politics on the CPC benches! They could call him Slick Sam or Slippery Steve or Black Blot. Maybe Greasy Grunge or Little Slop of Horrors. One could go on but I won’t even though they’re asking for it!
Worth repeating:
Here’s two links to read and ponder:
“Is Prentice’s Copyright Bill Born in the U.S.A.?”
The FBI on allowing electronic sabotage and vandalism:
“…as this case demonstrates: even if you aren’t doing anything wrong, you still have something to worry about. I have no problem with the MPAA taking people to court for violating their copyrights as long as the MPAA and the individual or individuals accused are equal before the law. But this is not what such laws do. They give big businesses extraneous power to violate privacy, and commit acts of electronic sabotage and vandalism, such as with DRM solutions like AACS used on Blu-Ray discs – - yes, they can remotely sabotage your Blu-Ray player if it doesn’t meet their standards–preventing it from playing movies. Why are governments leaning over backwards to allow for this? If the Harper government proceeds with their plans to allow for this type of activity…”
http://www.mikebrockonline.com/blog/
Hmmm….
“With Industry Minister Jim Prentice preparing to unveil his controversial copyright bill, there has been considerable speculation about the role that the U.S. government has played in pressuring Canada to move on the copyright file. U.S. Ambassador to Canada David Wilkins has been very vocal, repeatedly, if misleadingly
– - “Indeed, according to documents recently obtained under the Access to Information Act, last spring Canadian Recording Industry Association President Graham Henderson met with Wilkins’ counterpart – Canada’s Ambassador to the United States Michael Wilson – to encourage him to pressure both governments to prioritize U.S. style copyright reforms.”
http://www.michaelgeist.ca/content/view/2667/159/
Conservatives favour cronyism. Not capitalism.
Stick to the Conservative government many weaknesses and the faltering economy.
Keep the heat on them!
By AToryNoMore on 06.09.08 9:23 am
By AToryNoMore on 06.09.08 6:31 pm
Garth: First of all, you were great tonight on Duffy. Del Mastro was spewing his talking points (which we have heard repeated on every political show today) and you were clear-headed and sincere. I really did admire you. What a contrast in approach and objectivity!
By Pat. G. on 06.09.08 10:03 pm
I just watched it on the CTV website and totally agree with Pat. G. Why would anyone vote for that immature buffoon DelMaestro. I cannot understand how he got in. He was ignorant and rude. A true neocon–a devious liar.
Mike Duffy’s program today can be watched here:
http://watch.ctv.ca/news/mike-duffy-live/monday-june-9-2008/#clip58643
I like the fact that so many people would like the Liberals to defeat the Con’s New gobeerment.
The ads they are airing makes for great comody acts. Jez, never had so much fun talking about their positive and inspirational artworks with my friends.
Most of us wouldn’t be able to think of such creative ways to make such an ‘Ass’ of ourselves; but eh, Cons love to belittle taxpayers and the Canadian voters through childlike displays of what they are made of.
Makes me wonder why Berniers’ biker babe held on to him for so long. He was probably trying to play tiddly winks with Dion while under the blankets/between the sheets, or whatever.
I’m really enjoying the Cons artwork and I sure hope the Liberals don’t spoil my fun.
Thanks for not bringing down this great bunch of comedians.
Anyways, we don’t need an election yet, the cons aren’t done yet.
We need to see what happens to all their lawsuits etc.
Air-Powered Car Coming to U.S. in 2009 to 2010 at Sub-$18,000, Could Hit 1000-Mile Range
http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/new_cars/4251491.html?series=19
By Dube on 06.09.08 9:50 pm
AHA! The Blowmobile arrives to save the day!
Hey, you might be on to something here – afterall this is the “original” Canada and in fact, if it wasn’t for Liberals, Alberta wouldn’t exist in the first place.
By slg on 06.09.08 6:24 pm
Yes, and it makes more sense than first glance presents. I note Chatty Cathy (Who pulled her string?) feels left out. Well, isn’t that a shame? Maybe she is in Alberta where secession has been the mantra for so long, but what if Canada left THEM? There is a beauty to that thought. Just imagine all those Texans coming in and taking over ‘You call that a hat you f’in moron Canuck? That ‘ain’t no hat…This is a HAT!’
Yeah, they’d find out too late who their real friends are. But do we really care any more? I don’t.
Hopefully, the people of Alberta (and I know many fine sensible ones from living there) will turn things around, but that is their ‘option’!
The pot is steaming and soon will BOIL! Yeah, that’s when the best flavours start to mingle. Then let it chill overnight, finish cooking it the next day, and you’ve got some good chow!
Finally , a tax on the air we breathe , and revenue neutral to boot ! When do we vote ….. I’m excited about Liberal fortunes running on this as their main policy plank .
By Bill D. Cat on 06.09.08 6:14 pm
Now, to understand taxation one must recall the heady days of good old Indiana Governor Otis Bowen, MD, suggested imposing a ‘Peter Tax’. It failed to pass because the legislature realized it couldn’t work. ‘The darn thing was out of work 90% of the time, 10% of the time it was in the hole, and besides it supported two dependents and they were both NUTS!’ Thisis what we pay goobernment to do…figure out the really ‘hard’ questions.
Good night. I will catch the other comments tomorrow, as it is too late to ‘move forward’. LOL
PS: Bill D Cat, PFzzzzzzzzzzzzt! And May Opus RULE! LMAO!
Yellow???? The ad maker must be LHFAO by the colour choice of the cowardly bunch of CRAPPERS pushing this pack of lies.
Skid Mark the latest con-bot marketing tool .
Ah, Ryan Sparrow, the same twenty-something fellow who brought you the Elections-Canada-RCMP-raid back stair dash between hotels to hide from the non-choice media. The genesis of this new ad campaign all makes sense now.
By Dube on 06.09.08 10:12 pm
Thanks Dube .
I would love an answer to the following question from Garth and/or any of the bloggers on here: If Canada institutes a carbon tax at the federal level, what so you believe success would look like? In other words, how would you know whether the plan worked?
I’m genuinely interested in your thoughtful responses here, so please hold the rhetoric and wisecracks.
Thanks.
By C. B. Innes on 06.09.08 2:06 pm
“You are really talking nonsense as usual. Sometimes I think where my comments are concerned you leave your brain behind!”
You might have a big point. Yeah, in the past, pickin on McGuinty and Danny just ’cause, and Suzuki (actually didn’t appreciate that one) and Ralph Goodale (Good ol’ Ralph? What’d he ever do) and Elizabeth May (kinda questioned that one too) did get my attention.
But… I am a man of errors. We all are! (but thats not always an excusable defense so…) Cough, hack, choke, so am I and for my errors in particular, I apologize.
You see, I suffer from this thing called patterned thinking and I had it in my logic for some reason that you were a Liberal! Problem of course is that you don’t talk like one and critique sometimes quite harshly which, when one thinks about it, is not good at least, in terms of my believing you are saying this and doing that but the long and short of it is that the mistake is mine and all this time, I thought from March on that you were pretending to be something you are not and that left me uncomfortable because… your views are highly respected and you do have influence not just with others, but also within myself.
And contrary to those who I’ve been unkind to like Catherine or Harry for example, I fully realize influence is ALL we will ever to hope to achieve on a site such as this but it is what it is and I’ll take it! (speaking often indirectly to them instead of directly so, I must admit, I often do this)
Maybe it was a post from March maybe that gave me the impression that you were a Liberal, I don’t know and its hard to look back, there’s been so much commentary and much of it good, I might add. But I gave up looking when I found this, CBI and knowing that I am not a perfect sort, will simply leave it at that.
By C. B. Innes on 03.04.08 4:27 pm
And just to set the record straight between you and I, I found this and suggest you refresh yourself before you get the wrong impression of where I stand ideologically and as a voter.
By brain on 03.04.08 9:47 pm
I would add that my views have refined somewhat since then. Back in March, the Libs didn’t have the numbers to go to the polls. I believe now that they do, but there are still organizational improvements needed particularly in Quebec to be ready for an election. I can’t see an election not being called before years end now after whats happened in these few short months, but the question is when and that comes down to damage control over being the best future government one can be.
I feel the Libs will form the next government, but they also need to live up to this nations expectations and that means the party as a whole needs to be organized and united and that time will come. Is it now? I don’t know. I’m not sure. But I believe that with a Liberal dominated senate and a summer break, that the Libs have time and they need that time.
Otherwise… I don’t try to mischaracterize the views of others for my own agenda at least, I don’t think I do. Sometimes… we just make honest mistakes. Think we know instead of really know… you know?
Anyways, just to be clear, I’ve donated to two political parties this year, The Libs and the Greens. I voted Green in the last election, I’m anyone but Harper and the Harper party and the best candidate in my riding will trump the party of my favor… unless for some reason, the best candidate is running for the Harper party. Then, the second best candidate will do. So until I really know for sure who’s running in my riding, I really don’t know who I’ll be voting for in the next election! (and that shouldn’t surprise you, I don’t think)
Otherwise, my past voting record, I’m just like you. An old PC’er (and that shouldn’t surprise you either, really) but… someone has to replace the U.S. sellout social misfit we’ve got now and it IS about power and empowering those who will wield it. And to that end, a brand is only as good as its leaders and followers alike, or in other words, the people that represent that brand.
And it doesn’t matter what organization it is, you can heal its wounds or afflictions from within or outside as long as the key people within the party, the true leaders, can be influenced by those with the policies most needed to govern this nation. Honestly, I do believe that Dion is that capable. Truly. If I didn’t believe this, I wouldn’t support him. I’ve noticed things about the man that cannot be faked. He does have principles and he is a natural born comprimizer… except to principles themselves. Its not flashy. Its not shiny. And its nerdy, true, and the English, though improving, isn’t perfect… but it is humble and it is the substance of which great leaders are born.
So yeah… I’ll support the Liberal brand. Considering the Harper alternative of governance and policy initiatives, why not?
And there’s one other thing, CBI, that makes me support the Liberal brand. (maybe not with a vote, but financially and influencially) His name is… the Honorable Garth Turner. This man has earned the title in my book, every step of the way and the flag he’s flyin’ these days is a red one.
And one last thing thats been nagging me, a confessional of sorts that I think you might want to look at yourself. (comes out of my trip down memory lane archives) It is one of conduct.
We get in a habit. A pattern of doing things, a way of coming across, a way of thinking… (the mind is so patterned in thinking) And we can serve our thoughts/feelings hot… or cold. But when individuals develop a reputation of sorts for being right or creating what is known in the blogosphere as “gems”, a higher level of social conduct is expected by such individuals. As confrontational and personal as politics can sometimes get, a certain professionalism is required.
Have you noticed this internal self examination, a house cleaning of self integrity in terms of social graces with the one who I believe (make that knows) deserves the word Honor before his name? (and if that isn’t digital democracy at work)
My point is that it doesn’t matter how right one is, the tone or delivery within the message itself is almost equally as important. The true cream of the crop picks up on this over time and makes that adjustment to tone down the need to win an argument, for there is a time for all emotions to be matched with the message, but everything has its place and time with serrendippity in mind. Always. For we are being judged and as it is with all judgments, the motive, the intention is key. And thats why the true cream of the crop picks up on this over time and makes that adjustment to tone down the need to win an argument replacing it with the need to impliment the best policies that govern this nation/province/municipality/organization, whichever it might be.
And that takes trust. Knowing the facts and sticking to the facts. Letting the facts speak for themselves and allowing people to make up their own minds with the facts fully presented and thats perhaps the most difficult thing of all to do… to trust… but if there’s anything I’ve learned in life, it really does all start from within and that trust comes from knowing these answers within oneself and never being afraid to seek for those answers one does not know or to admit ones limits ones not knowing the answers when they can not be found, and expand the boundaries to knowing from thinking… to be sure… to be absolutely certain. And that takes dicipline. Digging. For me personally? Being the badger from the west. (and getting to know my feminine side)
Otherwise… well, we might risk heavily becoming that which we most critique and, well, that just… doesn’t suit us! (ok, time and place, lol, but… y’know)
Anyways, apologies, CBI and catch you on the next one.
Ah, tsk Catty – hit a nerve – too close for comfort? It did, or you wouldn’t react LOL – from “slug” – still with the 8 year old namecalling – some on the blog have now decided to call me that in a friendly way…nice.
By slg on 06.09.08 6:30 pm
name calling? Ahh can’t I take direction from you Liberals? Or name calling or smearing is reserved for you Liberals?
I can’t help taking exception to those who, for purely partisan purposes, attack an earnest, honest, intelligent man who is really trying to accomplish lower GHG’s in as timely a manner as is afforded him.
If Dion doesn’t get his plan in, what will the Conservatives do to help people with the ever-increasing costs of energy? The cost will go up for everyone if the Conservatives have their way.
Dion wanted to have a discussion about a n urgent, serious problem. In good faith, he was giving you a chance to be included. You showed a lack of ability to think and took the easy way out. Why should you be taken seriously?
By Pat. G. on 06.09.08 10:11 pm
Tell me – how is Taxing the shit of our goods going to do anything for our environment? The only people that higher costs will impact our the lower income people and our jobs.
The 155,000$ earners will still sit down to eat their pate de foie in their huge homes and enjoy the luxuries of life. These people will still travel to exotic vacations.
This scam that lower income earners will get a income tax reduction is just crap. Unless the Liberals propose that people earning less than 40,000$ annually will not pay NO income tax (both federally and provincially-which they can’t do). This tax scam will hurt the bulk of us! But, the Demarais’s, the Raes, the Turners, the Dions, the Strongs will sit back and enjoy their income tax cuts.
If Dion wanted to really do this properly and hurt the polluters, then he would be taxing the crap of the mansion owners, the owners of 2 homes (including cottages), etc. But, he won’t. He will attack those that can least afford.
Oh btw, can Stephane Dion tell me, how much of an increase can we expect on our hydro bill. We have been good conserving for years and have lived frugally for years. My current monthly hydro bill is less than 70$ per months? And since Ontario has coal burning hydro plants, how much Carbon Tax will be applied?
Our natural gas (heat and water) runs less than 72$ per month, how much increase should we expect?
Our grocery bill is roughly 300$ per month, how much increase should we expect?
How many more jobs will be shipped to China and India – because it will too costly for manufacturers to operate in Ontario?
If Stephane Dion can answer these true life scenario questions, then I would say he has at least some credibility. I expect real numbers and none of the “we will make mega money” crap.
It is rather ridiculous for Conservative supporters once again to try to justify their attack ads by saying the Liberals did it.
By C. B. Innes on 06.09.08 9:10 pm
I’m not “justifying” anything. I’m pointing out – as are a few others – how ridiculous it is for Garth Turner or the Liberal Party to be whining about how “mean” their opponents are. Both Mr. Turner and his current associates have a well-established pattern of smearing, slandering, fear-mongering and general nastiness.
It’s not “justifying” that I am doing, it’s just reminding people who like to delude themselves about the facts. It’s something I enjoy even in the face of personal slanders (courtesy of Randy) and attempts to change the focus (courtesy of yourself). We were debating the exposure of specific Liberal ads in the past – nothing else.
RM, any Canadian plan that takes global warming seriously is already too late to be deemed a success. For instance, the world’s best wind turbines are manufactured in Europe. The big 3 have waited too long to invest in fuel efficiency and smaller cars. One electric vehicle manufacturer has already been driven out of Canada (for the most part these cars are still illegal on Canadian streets) and Zenn isn’t (was once) well positioned, requiring a CBC story just to highlight federal stonewalling of their attempt to gain access to Canadian roads, to being the world’s future #1 auto manufacturer. Alberta has about 1/3 the trust (I think $35 vs $100 billion) Norway has established from oil revenues to fund bloated infrastructures beyond a petroleum economy and and drying up of Calgary’s Bow and Oxbow glacial runoff rivers. (not to mention Southern Alberta will become too parched for agriculture).
I read somewhere that for a carbon tax to be effective (forget if they meant full social costs of carbon or to significantly modify consumer behaviour), it has to be something like $1025/tonne. Probably not politically viable. The biggest success would’ve been gaining a comparative advantage over our trading neighbour in growing environmental technology fields and employment.
I’d define success (would’ve been defined as a subsequent majority government if the Conservatives had the tax in their platform) as the tax being so well-received by Canadians that it emboldens the government to take further measures to address climate change, many of which recoup their costs in years or less. Another form of success would be in seeing Canada adapt our workforce to growing rather than dying sectors; wind turbines are by far, the most employment intensive power generation technology. Success would also mean not developing Alberta’s oil sands. Here Alberta resembles Africa’s acceptance of the dictator (also attempting to assassinate his opponent) R.Mugabe: in the 1980’s there really were British government influences that were indifferent or even harmful to the social and nutritional ills of Africa. Mugabe stood up for his people then. Now UK and others are genuine in their concerns over the well-being of Africans, and it is R.Mugabe who is behaving bad, but Africans won’t help themselves by ditching him. NEP exposed P.Trudeau’s indifference towards the west (just like B.Mulroney screwed Winnipeg, the child poverty capital of Canada over for Quebec brownie points). AB stood up for herself in the 1970’s, but now there is a real need to take the human extinction threat of global warming seriously, and AB is acting like Mugabe.
The real definition of success would see Canada adapt mature platforms (the Dutch pay $2.50/L gas, I’m disappointed S.Dion’s plan excludes gasoline from the tax) that reduce the likelihood of global famines and freshwater shortages in the decades ahead. Success would see Canada be able to rightfully tarriff goods from nations that don’t adapt sustainable environmental practises.
Catherine, I’m guessing S.Dion’s vision has some provisions to aid working class Canadians. Mansion owners use far more heat than apartment dwellers, the homeless, or the imprisoned.
In general, utility costs will rise in the short term, and fall below the pre-tax baseline after 5 years or so, whenever consumers or utilities make money-saving capital upgrades.
Food prices will certainly rise a bit as a result of the tax. It is a valid question whether fertilizer should be given a partial exemption, if anything so farmers can fully invest in capital in times of rising commodity prices. Er you’re concerned about low income issues and a Conservative?! The NDP have the best low income platforms, with the Liberals being endorsed by poverty groups. Why do you believe S.Dion is insincere about the income tax reduction portion of the plan? Why should people earning $40000 not pay tax? That is above the median; certainly not a $40/day Labor Ready wage. If I earned that much I could retire in one year off the after tax income.
A carbon tax is a very mild hit to *middle* class individuals earning $40000. It pales in comparison to eliminating Chretein’s daycare legacy, to name one single sub-$40000 income issue out of the dozens where the Liberals have a superior platform to the Conservatives (but inferior to the NDP for the most part). How does Harper’s commitment to build more prisons help low income Canadians? Flaherty telling the world not to invest in Ontario precisely when they are hit by auto layoffs? Ontario has the most diversified economy (a leader in health care, medical R+D, aerospace, agriculture, materials science, nanotechnology, etc) in the land; it is a model Alberta is successfully copying. Can you picture a Liberal Minister of Finance telling the world not to invest in Alberta immediately after the global demand for oil inevitiably goes fooooop? Of course not.
“Blunders without Borders…expose this PMs obsession. Power isn’t the main thing to this government; it’s everything. It strips all civility from the public debate, uncouples fact from spin and makes public policy a slave to communications strategy.” –Jim Travers, May 29/08. I thought it was relevant to re-post after yesterday’s orchestrated crap. If I have to listen to that ad at the pump…too bad stupidity wasn’t painful, right Bill? Good luck Mr. Giorno. (Hope I got your name right.) Great resume for GWB, Bill. Justice will be satisfied when convicted War Criminal is added. Men, I thought yours last night at 9:26pm was dead on. So many here say what I believe to be true. Don’t know whether to laugh, cry or…
By linda on 06.10.08 12:16 pm
My policy is this…If I see that ad I leave and go to another filling station. Simple as that. I will, however, make a point to tell them WHY!
Yeah, Bush still has more to add to his resume. Now he thinks he is in charge of Iran. Here is pretty much Bush’s mentality, as well as those who follow the moronic little POS.
President Bush decides to leave the White House and go out to sit in a local bar.
A guy walks in and asks the barman, ‘Isn’t that Bush sitting at the end of the bar?’
The bartender says, ‘Yep, that’s him.’
So the guy walks over and says, ‘Wow, this is a real honor! What are you doing in here?’
Bush says, ‘ I’m planning WW III .’
The guy says, ‘Really? What’s going to happen?’
Bush says, ‘Well, I’m going to kill 140 million Muslims and one blonde with big tits.
The guy exclaimed, ‘A blonde with big tits? Why kill a blonde with big tits?’
Bush turns to the bartender and says,
‘See, I told you, no one gives a shit about the 140 million Muslims’.
A talking slime-ball. Brilliant. However it would have been cheaper to have Stephen Harper say the line, as this would still maintain the slimyness.
Almost 700000 people voted here.
I agree with 89% of these voters.
The silence of leaders around the planet is deafening.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10562904