In case you missed it, I’m in trouble again. On Friday afternoon I began receiving lots of emails in French from folks in Quebec telling me what I could do with myself, and what they’d like to do to my sister. That co-mingled with messages from Albertans reminding me that they have the oil and we have the problem. I did some battle on the radio, on Charles Adler’s rant, with people in the oilpatch who think this climate change talk is crap. And, just to cap things off, Stephane Dion called and chewed me out.
The issue is a single sentence in my last post in which I drew comparisons between those who wish to separate from Canada, whether they live in Quebec or Alberta. I called such separatists, who put regional and self-interest ahead of the national cause, “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.” Everyone I have heard from tells me this was a mistake. Quebecers tell me they consider such words racist. People like me, they say, encourage separation. Albertans say it’s exactly the sentiment of easterners who want to hobble the West. Others say it takes debate down to the level of Stephen Harper. Dion says it needs to be respectful.
So, why should I even try to justify my words? My attempt to show the Liberal leader has the stones to face down those who think of themselves first, and the country second – no matter where they hail from – succeeded only in making his task more difficult. That was not my intention. Nor do I have anything but respect for my fellow citizens in Quebec and Alberta.
But there’s no way I, as a federal member of the Canadian House of Commons, am going to lay down before people who openly advocate ripping the country apart. Moan all you want about money, or lament those who don’t share your culture or language. But don’t expect me to roll.
Reaction:
Oh! The Faux Outrage!
Le PLC, un parti raciste et haineux?
421 comments ↓
Get over yourself Garth, no one wants to see the country get ripped apart. But this silly carbon tax scheme is going to accomplish just that if it ever comes to fruition.
Well you did call them all losers too. I guess it hurt their feelings.
I’m always fascinated how people manage to make a huge deal out of statements intended to illustrate the truth when it goes contrary to their current perception of truth.
Carry on Garth…if nothing else, you get people talking.
Garth:
You just rolled!
You intolerant racist
anti Western , anti Quebec corrupt Liberal Pussy.
Steve
Je veux pas que tu t’écrases. Tu as le droit de ne pas vouloir que le peuple du Québec ait son pays, comme tous les autres peuples de la Terre, mais tu n’as pas le droit d’insulter les Québécois qui pensent qu’ils méritent ce pays.
Dis-moi, Garth, es-tu un suprémaciste canadien? Considères-tu que le droit des Canadiens-anglais de continuer d’avoir le Québec dans leur pays vaut davantage que le droit du peuple québécois d’obtenir son pays?
Le Québec est une nation, même Harper le reconnaît. Et toutes les nations doivent avoir leur pays.
Vive le Québec libre!
Mon commentaire précédent a été effacé. On n’accepte que le speak white ici? Si ce n’est pas en anglais, ce n’est pas bon? Vous êtes un raciste, M. Turner!
But there’s no way I, as a federal member of the Canadian House of Commons, am going to lay down before people who openly advocate ripping the country apart.
And just what the hell do you think you ARE advocating . In one post you managed to piss off half the damn country .
“Nor do I have anything but respect for my fellow citizens in Quebec and Alberta.”
Ya right. You only meant to insult Albertans (where there are no seats to lose). Any Albertan who thinks your policies are junk, or doesn’t want to get robbed AGAIN, just gets conveniently labelled as wanting to break up the country and therefore can be insulted at will. Glad to see the Libs have written off the voters of Alberta.
I cannot believe that I am the first on to leave a message. We live in a world where people live to be pointing fingers at others with accusations. Even though I can see that the choice of words may not be helpful as they are making their way into the national press. But really, I guess I’ll be racist too, but I just get tired of Quebecers and Albertans who seem to live only to be offended, or live only to wrap themselves in resesntment.
I’m from Manitoba, Alberta never spoke on behalf of us, nor did we see them the voice for the west. I’m a self described francophile, and have often opted to fly over to the other side of the Altantic to skip the politics. On the other hand, I’ve spent time in Chicoutimi and love the people there.
Those touting their identities in constant states of resentment (oh the poor westerners) and offendedness (I won’t even leave a suggestion of what that could be) are in the vast minority.
Having said all of that, I can see where you are coming from.
«Ma gang de malades… vous êtes donc où?
Lise, Payette. Former Parti Québécois cabinet minister, in today’s Le Devoir, in reference to all Quebecers.
http://www.ledevoir.com/2008/07/04/196314.html
My translation,
Where are you, gang of sickos?
I get the feeling you would never call all Quebecers a gang of sickos. That is something only a former Parti Québécois minister is allowed to do.
But I do agree with Monsieur Dion. You should keep the debate on a respectful level – it will separate you from the separatists!
Keep it coming, Garth. This is a free country.
Garth
After so much time in politics you must know that you can say whatever you want about Albertans. But to cast doubt on the motives of Quebecers, separatist or not, is strictly verboten.
Thank God that Stephane quickly reprimanded you before others get similar ideas.
Garth, In all seriousness my friend it was just a matter of time before you jumped over the line. I think that was mild compared to some of the other crap you have spouted on here, but in all fairness, your the same as you have always been and if the LPC didn’t know what they were getting, then they are dumber then I thought.
Time to back it in you mouthpiece . Someone should demand your resignation.
Awesome stuff Garth!
You are the virtual Sampson of the internet.
Chad
Nice comment Steve at 7:33 pm.
This is the kind of idiotic, immature nonsense that prevents reasonable dialogue. Those of us that have read, spoken or listened to Garth know exactly what he meant by his words. Just because someone speaks with passion on a topic with a differing viewpoint doesn’t mean that sreaming that person down will actually accomplish anything constructive. Agree or disagree but at least sound like an intelligent adult…as for getting chewed out Garth – too bad, but I suppose that Mr. Dion needs to keep a lid on emotions and what may sound like comments that could be easily turned around against you and/or the Green Shift. But for what it is worth, I happen to agree with your comments – in their entirety.
Way to go Garth stir them up if nothing else it will get us all involved.
Way to go Garth stir them up if nothing else it will get us all involved.
Bob in Alberta.
I guess you feel like you are saving the country Garth?
From all these bad separatists?
The have different views and that is how you fight?
Very poor name calling.
Les Quebecois dont need lessons from you
And Harper wants the 2 solitudes to get along…
With red neck like you…..good luck.
Jacques Boucher
Montreal
Hey Garth, first time commenter here. I’ve always thought you were rather pompous and mouthy, and I’ve not really changed my mind. But I have to say, those exact qualities are 100% perfect for fielding questions from the likes of Charles Adler and Dave Rutherford (and I’d love to hear you take on that arse John Gormley) on something as controversial as the Green Shift. You may not be as “respectful” as Stephane Dion admonished you, but you get the job done, better than he does. I’m not enamoured with the plan, though I think it’s a decent first step, but Dion doesn’t speak the same language as most of the “jock talk radio guys”, as you put it, and it’s not ’cause he’s from Quebec. Keep up the good work.
Everyone I have heard from tells me this was a mistake. Quebecers tell me they consider such words racist.
Well, isn’t truth a BITCH in their little world? Quebecers who despise anything non francophone, have language laws, and harass visitors who do not speak French. Tell them UP YOURS!
What a bunch of hypocrits. As to the Albertan atmospheric polluters. I hope they choke to death on their own fumes.
To the rest of Canadians let’s work together because some will never be able to.
You called it right on Garth. That is my opinion. If they don’t like it TOUGH SHIT!
“So, why should I even try to justify my words?”
Nah. You’re Toronto Trash, incapable of anything other than ugliness, and rotten to the core.
You just keep doing your thing and telling the Canadian electorate to “bite me”, as you are so fond of doing here at your blog, and we’ll see you on election day. At the rate you are going, I don’t think you will get your deposit back.
Hey Garth… just go F yourself! There’s is such a big difference between Albertain Rednecks and Quebec revendications. Not the same thing at all. You don’t see the difference because you are such an idiot!
A French message will not follow, for you block heads!
GARTH; Way to go,just can’t resist getting those big feet in your BIG MOUTH.No doubt Mr. Dion is more than a little peeved.Better start looking for another party,your time with the Liberals is running out.
As an ANglophone who grew up in rural Quebec in the 70s and 80s, and as a Francophone who lived and worked in the oilpatch for a number of years, I have to say your descriptions were pretty dead on.
Don’t let the bastards (even Layton, that dangerously clueless pandering fool) grind you down!
Va chier très cher. C’est avec des gorlots comme toi que ça va se passer. Merci, Lâche-pas.
Paul
For all those who refer to the PM as mean-spirited and a bully, I hope you use those words now for Garth.
I have to admit that it is a guilty pleasure to hear Ontarians complaining about “being polluted by the West boo-hoo-hooo !”
I remember too well 1980’s acid rains over Quebec and Maritme’s forests – not to mention pollution (alomost death!) of the St-Lauren River – courtesy of Ontario’s and USA’s once flourishing steel industry.
And when we dared to complain, we were called jealous and selfish, not able to look at the big picture of the Canandian economy, loosers unable to sustain a strong economy by themselves, thus, blaming their rich neighbours for their problems ….
Quebec yesterday, Ontarians today.
**Yawn**
Seriously: As much as it would be unfair and an insult to intelligence to blame Ontarians alone for acid rains – GM cars were driven by Quebekers, too ! – I find it pretty hypocrite to blame the producers of the oil, as if as cusumers we had nothing to do with the problem!
Since I left Quebec (I now live in Toronto), I really discovered how this country is not united. That is so unproductive. Is this country united or not, oui ou mer** ?
PS: today’s comments on Quebekers ? As far as I am concerned, nothing pleases me more. I am begging on my (macho) knees for more, Garth.
See, all independence needs is a little spark. Last one came from Clyde Wells, in 1990. Next one – from you ? Are you an separatist in the closet ?!
Why do you think Pauline Marois laughed when asked to comment your post ?
Lâche-pas, mon Garth, this country (guess which one) needs more of you!
Go on man.
We need more people like you to do it.
Last time it was close
Next time bring your friends, idiot.
Thank’s for your help!!!!
comments you made:
But there’s no way I, as a federal member of the Canadian House of Commons, am going to lay down before people who openly advocate ripping the country apart.
Poor mr turner, with the view you have and the comments you make you are doing exactly what you are accusing other of doing. And you call yourself a member of the parlement. You definitely are a poor thing to see.
Christian
Just imagine the reaction if a Bloc MP was to have the same type of comments… Miss Wong would rip her eyeballs out in another anti-francophone rant and columnists all around Canada would call out for extreme punishment. But it’s only the french seperatist right Garth? They are not allowed a voice! That’s why we cheated in 95, it didn’t matter right? They wanted to rip the country apart. Everybody knows know that since Champlain was the first GG for Canada 400 years ago (yeah for historical revisionism for the good cause… just like the post-communists regime… like the north-coreans…), Quebec was part of Canada in the beginning anyway what the hell do they have to wine about right ??? We should have finished the job in 1970 when we had sent our newly formed Canadian forces… ahhhhhh now those were the good ol days! Instead of just putting 500 in prison arbitrarely, why the heck didn’t we just round out ALL THE DAMN SEPERATISTS and put them on a boat to New-Caledonia… ONE-WAY! Or just a boot camp(reeducation of canadian identity, just like we did with the indeans) in Labrador…
Yeah those damn seperatists that want to rip my country apart… kill the dreams of our fathers of confederation, the nice Alexander Galt, and a french province completely subjugated to clergy, those were also good days… not like today were they are allowed to openly advocate for sovergnety…
*****
Good job Garth! Vos paroles ne font que nous rapprocher de notre but, l’indépendance du Québec. Pas contre le Canada, mais bien pour le bien des nôtres. Car l’intolérance que vous manifestez n’est qu’argumentaire à nos yeux.
Isn’t odd that most bilingual people in this country are french ?
What? Garth has to apologize to people who thought it was appropiate for Dion to be drawn as a RAT in newspaper cartoon? And how about that editorialist from Edmonton today, who wrote (about Dion) ‘And if the dorky Quebec politician…’. What’s that saying about glass houses again?
Ah Garth… yet again showing just how smart and how politically astute you are. You and the Lieberals are a perfect fit.
Remercions Garth Turner. Grâce à lui, nous nous rapprochons des conditions gagnantes vers la création du PAYS DU QUÉBEC!!
I wouldn’t subscribe to a blog if I thought the person writing it was a knob. What’s with all the criticism?
Those who advocate separating from Canada are self-interested, flakes.
We’ve listened to this sort of nonsense for years. I like visiting Quebec (and my French is atrocious) but I would judge that the separatist contingent are a noisy fringe.
As far as Alberta is concerned, well, still a noisy (redneck) fringe. Suppose, just suppose, governments decide it is too politically and environmentally dangerous to use Alberta oil. What is Alberta going to sell the rest of us then, dust?
You don’t need me to tell you not to sweat it Garth.
Quebec roots, Quebec born brothers and sister, born in Ontario and raised 25 years there, now 30 years in Alberta.. and loyal Canadian here.
Separatists from any province are traitors to Canada and they are also “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.” The rest of Quebec are wonderful people.
Well Garth … you certainly have painted yourself into being a divisive Ontario redneck now. Yup .. you are a redneck .. plain and simple .. from Ontario .. and I’m not making this up..!!!
Now your Quebec Liberal colleagues will have to cope with your Ontario redneck attitude and answer to all Quebecers about their position on Liberals from Ontario because how many more Liberal rednecks are there lurking in Ontario..??!!!
You have royally shit between the bedsheets politically … and now we shall see the repercussions in Quebec and Alberta with you in the middle.
If you are true to your independent beliefs, you should stand your ground because you first and foremost represent the citizens of Halton .. and Dion should have understood that when he took you on as a Liberal MP.
Perhaps the real damage you have caused is relegating Ontario to a “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.” province … sucking the money out of the West and pissing on the Quebec nation.
You have nothing to apologize for Garth. Your as honest a politician as they come. Your 100% right to dislike those who wish to break up this great country. Be them from Quebec or Alberta.
You keep being you, we all need a good dose of Garth every day or so
Epic Fail. Jump off a bridge sir.
L’étroitesse d’esprit est dangereuse, en particulier chez les gens de pouvoir qui ne comprennent rien. Un ancien conservateur devenu libéral, c’est une girouette qui ne fait que tourner sur lui-même et s’enfoncer comme une mèche de vilebrequin, dans sa propre bêtise.
Merci de me lire en français.
Many thanks Garth, you got the words to make things happen!
Grâce à vous, être imbécile est aussi une vertu !
Opinion is like a disease, it’s not because you catch one that you want to spread it!
Poor poor canadians…
fm
“self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.”
I’m not even a separatist and this offended me. Anyone who thinks the separatist movement in Québec is selfish needs a history lesson. It’s about culture and language. It’s about creating a Québecois nation in North America. Separatists know very well that if sovereignty happens, Québecois might carry a heavy economic burden for a while – but their descendants will have a country. It’s far from selfish – to them, it’s a self-sacrifice.
I’m from Québec and I identify more strongly with Québec culture than the culture in the ROC. I’m proud of our language, our cinema, our litterature, our music… I understand the desire to express that pride. For separatists, expressing this means fighting for a country. For me, it means sharing our culture with others – showing my Ontarian friend a Québec TV Show, bringing my aunt-in-law from B.C. to a concert of Les Cowboys Fringants…
So while I don’t express my Québec pride the same way separatists do, deep down, that pride remains the same. So disrespectful comments like yours sadden me greatly and make me doubt that Québec and the ROC can ever get along.
re: JACQUES BOUCHER 07.04.08 8:04PM
This is rich: “And Harper wants the 2 solitudes to get along lol! Harper was president of the group that wants to get rid of bilingualism Jacques, so you’d better get reading on what Harper’s been up to, he’s still doing their dirty work.
“It is very revealing of the man’s politics that he took the position of president of the National Citizens’ Coalition –the most ferociously right-wing lobby group in the country. Founded originally to fight public medicare, the NCC was Reform’s soul-mate. Harper praised the organization because it “criticizes, attacks and gives alternatives to such things as official multiculturalism, enforced national bilingualism…open door immigration…”
But it was an article in the National Post a few days after the 2000 election that exposed the real Stephen Harper. In the article, Harper revealed his admiration for free-enterprise Alberta and his contempt for the rest of Canada
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0MKY/is_9_29/ai_n14735871
You shouldnt apologize Garth, the truth needs no apologies. It’s time people start calling the separatists what they really are. Your description was pretty accurate, but I would probably add “traitorous” to the list as well.
Hey Gaff,that is why i am separatis,because of such square head like you.Don`t give up stupid ass hole.
Did someone seriously say that it is racist to think that seperatists are losers? What about the people from Quebec who aren’t seperatists? Or are races defined by political affiliation now?
J’ai une question pour toi, si les québécois sont si stupide, pourquoi vous tenez tant à nous garder avec vous si vous nous haissez ? La réponse est simple : vos intérêts économique : dans tous les ministères le Québec reçcoit beaucoup moins que sa part selon le pourcentage de population … sauf un … le ministère du patrimoine. C’est nous qui reçoit le plus de drapeau du canada…
Now I will traduct in english because I suppose you don’t understand french since you don’t care about Quebec.
I have a question for you, if quebecois are so stupide why do you care about keeping us in Canada since you hate us ? The answer is easy : money : In all the ministery Quebec receive less than 23 % ( population of the Canada in Quebec ) except … for the flags of Canada … we receive more and more flag of Canada than everybody else !
Good job Garth! i appreciate your courage to stand up and say what you honestly believe in.
Quebec Separatists only think for themselves, they want Canada to fund everything, they are always putting down Canadians and last but not least they stole english made business with their greedy language laws.
QUEBEC PLEASE SEPARATE
So Barb… what was the results of the 1995 referendum in Quebec within the french-speaking community again? close to 78 %… ahhh that’s a lot of people to be putting aside. Who are those other quebecers (rest of Quebec… !) you talk about ? We have a Bloc MP in our riding and he is a fine man. Gets elected with woping majorities and works for ALL is constituents, wether they be fench, english, independentists or federalists… why is it that we have to be inclusive all the time but reading the comments here from a lot of folks, the “seperatists” (what a nice one from Chretien in the 1980 referendum… in Québec we shouls start to talk about federalists as “assimilationists” or “fédérastes”)are the plague of humanity! Well it will hurt to know that at least 5 of Charest current ministerial team, the Liberals from Québec, openly say they voted YES in 1995 and would be hard pressed not to do it again. Are they part of the other Quebecers ?
Don’t get me wrong, Harper’s policies are doing great for the independentist option, it shows the great gap between our beliefs and the right wing of Canada on many subjects. You should have been in the audience when the GG spoke first yesterday at the 400 of Quebec city… all were not cheers…
Garth, think about it. Don’t you know why Mr. Dion is so upset? You said: “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.” Uh, Garth, Mr. Dion started his political career as an active separatist. Get it? Good.
Anyway, you are right, but politics offers no reward for ‘right’ especially if ‘wrong’ gets you the votes.
Leasa
Keep it up Garth – fan those sepratist flames – Canada does not need the bloc – we got you – you asshole!
Salut espece de con c`est pour ca qu`il faut se séparer de vous maudit fédéralisme a marde pis va dont de faire foutre maudit criss fuck you
I can see the headlines already Country splits in 4 because of Garth Turners blog. And Dion thought he would bring the country together with higher taxes! The shift is hitting the fan!
Mr. Turner…I’m waiting for an explanation.
If you would not hide behind a false name and false email, I would gladly tell you. Give me a valid address and I will respond offline. — Garth
Vive le Québec libre.
Deux cultures, deux langues, deux nations, deux pays.
And if you don’t understand what I just wrote, that’s another reason for separation.
You have nothing to apologize for Garth. Your as honest a politician as they come. Your 100% right to dislike those who wish to break up this great country. Be them from Quebec or Alberta.
You keep being you, we all need a good dose of Garth every day or so
By SJ on 07.04.08 8:49 pm
Separatists from any province are traitors to Canada and they are also “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.” The rest of Quebec are wonderful people.
By Barb the proof-reader on 07.04.08 8:44 pm
My sentiments exactly.
Simon, Je comprends votre poste, je ne consens pas juste, mais je consens que cette déclaration de garths avait tort
who openly advocate ripping the country apart
Garth Turner on 07.04.08 @ 7:12 pm
My guess is you`re never going to hear the end of that thought until the very end.
Do you really consider a large portion of the population that are concerned enough about certain issues to use our voices evil people?
Ripping is really harsh considering Ontario separated decades ago. The NEP and side effects put Ontario in a space by itself with not only the economic power but voting power as well. Replacing the manufactures tax with the GST increased and distanced the industrial center from the rest of the country even more. Perhaps throwing an extra 30% of lost consumer spending power by reducing our currencies value wasn`t necessary so I`ll just put that one in the greed pigeon hole.
If that`s not `ripping the country apart` I don`t know what else it would be.
Just a hint, insulting our intelligence won`t lead to open and meaniful debates that you hoped this blog would follow.
no justice, no investment
“If you would not hide behind a false name and false email, I would gladly tell you. Give me a valid address and I will respond offline. — Garth”
I sure I don’t need to divulge personal information to you for you to explain why you edited a comment of mine on our blog.
You are my guest. Free to abide by the rules of this forum. Free to leave. — Garth
“Great country”? Canada? It’s nothing more than a railway from ocean to an other, a railway that connect two different nation, who hate each other.
Vincent (who hate speak in english…vive le francais crisse!)
Québec city
SJ, Barb the proof reader and Lana, All three of you make me nauseous, oh ya,, let support the LPC the party of the big tent, the party of inclusiveness, Take your smug superior attitude and shove them.
Tous les trois de vous me fait nauséabond, oh ya,, laisser le soutien le LPC le parti de la grande tente, le parti de totalité, Prendre votre attitude supérieure suffisante et les pousse.
Garth,
You forgot to include thin-skinned in your description.
I have to say I side with those few who understand that Garth was talking about those who want to see the destruction of Canada. He was not talking about all Quebecois or all Albertans.
As a proud Canadian, I will stand up for Garth and say, right on! Anyone who wants to break this country apart deserves to be dumped on, and from a Canadian point of view they are losers.
Some politicians wouldn’t say ’shit’ if their mouth was full. That’s not Garth. I find it refreshing.
It’s probably a CLM though, for someone in politics….
DELETED. (Twice)
You are my guest. Free to abide by the rules of this forum. Free to leave. — Garth
That has nothing to do with you editing a comment.
Am I talking to a brick wall here?
Give an email and I will explain. Without that, yeah, bricks. — Garth
Si vous sautez en bas de pont, chez M. Turner, je ne m’arrêterai même pas pour vous regarder crever.
Garth,
I am sure public executions are banned but what about public floggings and the old cat-o-nine tails……….?LOL
Hi brain on 07.04.08 8:22 pm,
Thanks for the links you posted on the other comment section.
For anyone that may have mist them;
(Pease at a minimum read the first link, it’s only 3 pages.
Especialy read it if you already think you know it all.
You know who you are
Then tell all your friends and family, so we can all get going while there is a bit of time left to take real action!)
The cold truth about climate change
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2008/02/27/global_warming_deniers/
Here’s a few that are the latest buzz explaining with simplistic empirical evidence that climate change is very real, is happening very rapidly and we should all be very worried.
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/GlobalWarming/WireStory?id=3984505&page=1
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/GlobalWarming/WireStory?id=3984505&page=2
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/GlobalWarming/WireStory?id=3984505&page=3
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/GlobalWarming/WireStory?id=3984505&page=4
http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/climatechange/
BY JANICE 07.04.08 10:48 AM
Janice, I’m SO glad you warped the facts about NEP again, when you deleted some “facts” as you say. ?Funny, this is the item that Harper as a young man fell for too.. the one that changed him. He probably even believes the hyped up story about NEP. You don’t even talk about the real story. So we’ll get it on the table.
I’ll include a the of lines you conveniently left out:
“Alberta Premier Lougheed stopped development on several oil sands projects. Given that oil sands production was not yet technologically or economically feasible, the gesture was largely symbolic. He went on national television to announce that oil shipments to the rest of Canada would be cut”
[Largely symbolic, yet Alberta politicians feint. Get them some water.]
Janice, you also left out the most important part of your quote:
“The economic effect of the program is debated.”
Janice, you deliberately left that out, and it should have been right in the middle. Caught again.
“Canada, along with all of the economies of Europe — and the economy of the United States, fell into a worldwide recession. It would turn out to be the worst economic downturn since the Great Depression.””
Hmm. Janice, I know you thought it was great to include that part about Norway, too, so we’ll take a look at Norway later. Glad you brought that up.
[Janice included Norway in the same old NEP spin, but Norway is actually a good example of just how poorly Alberta politicians have taken care of Alberta’s interests vs what Norway did]
Should I post the info again about Norway, or does that weaken your spin?
Just how much time do you spend on your feinting couch?
Quebec roots, Quebec born brothers and sister, born in Ontario and raised 25 years there, now 30 years in Alberta.. and loyal Canadian here.
Separatists from any province are traitors to Canada and they are also “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.” The rest of Quebec are wonderful people.
By Barb the proof-reader on 07.04.08 8:44 pm
I really love your posts. A lot of your links I already read. It’s nice to meet someone on the same train of thought.
These words “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.” To me describes Big Oil to a tea
Harper, Van Loan, Pierre, Josie, et al rise in the House every day and bemoan the powerlessness of the Bloc–they castigate the Bloc for trying to break up the country–they say the separatists are weak and lost.
Where is the outrage against the Con M.P.’s, including the P.M. who continually berate separatists?
“For all those who refer to the PM as mean-spirited and a bully, I hope you use those words now for Garth”
BY BARB ON 07.04.08 8:17 PM
Garth tells the truth and he is admired for that. At least in the Liberal party he is free to be who he is, and he serves his country very well. Politicians who tell the truth are the people we need the most.
On the other hand, Harper lies, Harper lies all the time, and Harper thinks lying is okay.
im glad that you hate me so much, please kick me out of this country, this will a gift for you and me lol
but their descendants will have a country. It’s far from selfish
BY MYRIAM ON 07.04.08 9:00 PM
Selfish it is, to destroy a country.
I knew you crossed the line as soon as I saw your post this am. As a matter of fact I called you on it and got dismissed. So glad to see your “apology”, which amounts to a further backhand. None of us who were posting on your site earlier today were separatists, yet you and your Liberal attack dogs treated our comments as though they were. We are as Canadian as you will ever be. A formal apology to all Canadians is called for sir. Not this lame self-righteous post.
This I find funny. What a joke. All the false indignation.
It is obvious, that you, Garth, have succeeded in making yourself an easy target for bigots, separatists, anti-Canadians, and ASSHOLES.
My previous post stated you perhaps misinterpret the differences between Quebec and Alberta separatists. I stand by that post. However, they BOTH are overly catered to in the interests of “Political Correctness”.
M. Dion was right in saying “be careful”, as we do not need to make their job easy. That being said, it should not be forgotten that M. Dion is also in just as much trouble with the Quebec separatists – by forcing them to use clear, concise, and accurate descriptions in referendum language. No more “sovereignty association”, implying that if Quebec separates, it could still take all the good things from Canada, but have their own way.
Your posts, while often unnecessarily provocative, are a huge breath of fresh air. Too many of our political representatives hide behind a false front to gain votes. At least we know where you stand.
Every one oversteps the boundaries at some time – it they are trying. Those always playing safe seldom accomplish much.
Separatists are not a good thing. Those who crap on this blog, from BOTH Alberta and Quebec, should move to Zimbabwe.
BY DE LORIMIER ON 07.04.08 9:27 PM
Countries, as many great men have said, are fragile. Together and united we can do great things. We all have, really, only one problem of division, and that is from outsiders. That is why I always detest anyone who falls for separation talk. We’re a much stronger country as one. Foreign interests are always stirring the pot to divide us, and when we locally have words and differences, no one rejoices more than unseen investors who can’t wait for us to part. Divide and conquer works in peace time, not just in war.
There are international interests that gnaw away at our country. If Alberta and Quebec politicians can get some people whipped up over the idea of separating, like that’s a good idea, then the separatists are fools. They are being conned, in the name of culture. [or greed, in the case of Alberta]
Foreign interests love when we quibble. They love to see and assist Alberta or Quebec to talk about separating. That makes us weak, and wide open to what amounts to a loss of our country. Your grand kids will be dumbstruck at the stupidity of this day and age, when they no longer have a real Canada. They will only hear about it, and our resources will have been long looted from us, to foreign investors pocketbooks.
Everyone, keep an eye on the bigger picture.
Selfish it is, to destroy a country.
By Barb the proof-reader on 07.04.08 10:27 pm
Then it also must be selfish to keep us in it against our will… remember 1982 (rapatriement unilatéral de la constitution contre l’avis du Québec)
and why do we call this country a “confederation” anyways ? it’s nothing but fraud. 1 point of taxation, 1 curency, 1 army. That’s it! if not, independence is the only way.
Marc Lalonde, Mr. Trudeau’s energy minister and the brains behind the NEP, later acknowledged the motive was what Albertans had suspected all along: to transfer wealth from Alberta to Central Canada.
“The major factor behind the NEP wasn’t Canadianization or getting more from the industry or even self-sufficiency. The determinant factor was the fiscal imbalance between the provinces and the federal government,” he says in David Kilgour’s 1988 book, Uneasy Patriots. “Our proposal was to increase Ottawa’s share appreciably, so that the share of the producing provinces would decline significantly and the industry’s share would decline somewhat.”
The above was the Liberal party policy in the 70’s and is the Liberal Party policy today.
And where is that written? The caucus has not seen it. — Garth
I’m as true blue as you’ll find in this country.Harper’s got green (reform green) “blood” mixed with yellow of the NDP and pink-ed by the Liberals.
The Bloc is black and blue but the Liberals wouldn’t have it any other way.
Happy Independance Day America.
Aux séparatistes qui écrivent sur ce blogue: vous êtes, comme tous les Québécois, une gang de malades. C’est pas moi qui le pense, c’est Lise Payette qui vous interpelle ainsi dans son texte au Devoir d’aujourd’hui. Mais elle est reconnue comme étant séparatiste, la dame Payette, vous prenez donc ça comme un compliment.
Le texte de Payette au Devoir est un parfait exemple de litérature raciste, écrit par une personne qui se confère le droit de juger et de rabaisser le caractère de tout un peuple.
Contrairement à madame Payette, Garth ne s’en prend qu’à des adversaires politiques. Dans une société démocratique, c’est son droit.
Ce sont à cause de gens comme vous que je ne veux pas être Canadian mais bien Québécois. C’est facile d’insulter des gens caché derrière un micro à la radio ou dans un blog M. Tuner. Nous voyons votre grand courage, bravo. J’espère que votre famille à honte d’avoir un lâche parmi eux.
Pourquoi ne pas venir faire un p’tit tour au Québec M. Turner pour nous dire tout ça ici?
Je me souviendrais de vous M. Turner….
ROFLMAO!
Garth, you just got more Quebecers politically active here than all the money and graft PMJC and Harper wasted ever dreamed of doing. EXCELLENT!
Welcome mas amis. Bon nuit.
Now, who wants a drink?
Isn’t odd that most bilingual people in this country are french ?
By De Lorimier on 07.04.08 8:32 pm
Not at all! It is a question of survival – and a key point in the separatist argument.
To prosper in an English world of business, you must speak the language. That “international language of business” was once French, and Spanish, and Greek, and Latin etc. Some say we are headed for Mandarin, and for a while it looked like Japanese. English remains due to the relative simplicity to learn and apply, as it is built from “Romance Languages” with some Germanic mixed in.
BTW, an interesting side-effect from Bill 101 forcing everything in Quebec to be French centered, was a huge boost in Francophone people seeking ESL (English Second Language) training. The wise Francophones realised that if the Anglos were forced into learning French, they would lose out if they were not also bilingual.
You must be careful what you wish for, eh?
Oh, and also, M. Parizeau, M. Bouchard, and their children were educated either in the USA or England. What does that tell you about staunch separatists and the French language…..
Garth:
According to the Canadian Press, you were ” re-elected as a Liberal in 2006.”
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20080704.wgturner04/BNStory/National
Keep up ! You’re giving more and more reasons to Québec to leave Canada. Keep up, Sir !
M. Turner,
Your biggest problem is that you have no understanding what democracy is all about. I’m not even sure you understand the meaning of the world democracy.
Having seperatist in a democracy is a unique privilege that seems too complicated for you tu understand. It is the biggest test that can challenge a democratic country. Sorry to inform you that you failed the test. You are welcome to move to a country run by a dictator. You would love it. I spent a few years working in such countries and you seems to have the perfect fit.
Canada made mistake. Canada is not perfect. But I believe Canada can learn from it’s wrong doing. But you don’t want to roll. Then the right question to ask you is: do you deserve to represent Canadians in Ottawa? I cannot answer this question. Darwin’s deduction will take care of you.
FYI: For a fact, as a member of the parliament, you have no clue of the impact on ordinary citizen of what you say or write. I recommend a severe reality check.
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0MKY/is_9_29/ai_n14735871
By Barb the proof-reader on 07.04.08 9:00 pm
Thanks for the link Barb. I have added it to the little booklet I am making of all that has been printed showing Harper in the way I see him. I will be giving it to my friends and family. It seems no one has the time to really follow or find all that media prints. It is important for people to know who he really is. Stephane Dion is the leader for the times for a fairer, greener, richer Canada.
and why do we call this country a “confederation” anyways ? it’s nothing but fraud. 1 point of taxation, 1 curency, 1 army. That’s it! if not, independence is the only way.
By De Lorimier on 07.04.08 10:41 pm
TABERNAC De Lormier
Quelle menteur!
The platforms I have heard from the Pequistes and Blocists want to keep:
- the Canadian Army for protection
- the Canadian currency for Trade
- The benefits of Canadian diplomacy for foreign affairs
ETC., ETC.
What crap you spout!
“sovereignty association” – please explain.
Do you really want to turn the Surete du Quebec into your “army”?
Do you understand the costs and damage your “separate state” would encounter if you tried to create your own currency? What; do you want to switch to the US dollar? The Rupee? The Franc? The Yen? The Euro?
I believe in the French culture. There is so much richness to share.
The rest of the world is forming large unified organisations, yet you want to “go it alone”. They recognise the strength a common legislative body provides.
Get your head out of the clouds. One of the BIG reasons your “culture” has survived, is because of Canada. The greatest influence that kept the French culture submissive in Quebec was the Catholic Church – NOT “les Anglais”. Without Canada, you would be as French as the Louisiana Cajuns (Acadians moved from Canada) – in other words, almost totally assimilated by the US culture.
Maudite revisionist historians…
Lorraine Montagne,
J’admire le côté constructif de votre commentaire sur les 7 millions de malades québécois.
Bravo! Un bel exemple de généralisation des plus bêtes et stupides.
Est-ce que cela vous valorise de mépriser tous les individus que vous avez le plaisir de cotoyer?
PS: Je ne comprend pas pourquoi vous incluez les poupons avec votre ”tous” dans la gang de malades. Je vous recommande aussi de déménager dans une dictature.
PPS: Isn’t that amazing the fact that Quebecers take space on this website to criticize each other, in french? Ahhh la démocratie!
My sympathies Garth, while someone like me, or even one of the Progressive Bloggers, could get away with venting out of sheer frustration with the colossal stupidity of some members of our society, you are held to a different standard. IMHO, it behooves someone in your position to choose their words carefully lest they serve only to inflame an already delicate national issue. I’m not sure what purpose is served by bringing your argument down to the level of those you were criticizing.
The volume and sentiment of comments from Quebec would seem to suggest that all you have managed to achieve is polarization.
However, that said, I’m reminded of Mayor Ralph Klein’s slogan (1982?), “Let the eastern bastards freeze in the dark”, a sentiment which he apparently continued to hold when he became Premier of Alberta. So blunt words didn’t seem to have much of a negative impact on his career.
Peace
Well, after reading the comments I’d say ‘Garth, you have WINNER!’
You have activated the silent Mars Candy factory, aka, Nutbars to the MAX!
Now, let’s all have it out. Are you IN or OUT of Canada? Comeon, take a stand or SHUT UP!
I say all Canadians say AYE and the rest can go to France, the U.S.A. or Hell. Note: Hell and the other two choices will probably not be a great deal different thanks to the morons who continue to contaminate the planet, but why even bother bringing in maps, charts, and science. You all know everything already because your Talking Heads told you.
I hear the other two choices are planning on having a Bake Sale right after the Meltdown. Keep those fires burning. YEPPERS and Goodnight.
Oh, hey France, how’s the vinyards doing? Moving North are they?
Hey, Alberta, how’s your homeless and tent population? Air quality? How about those rivers? Go fill your bottles fast. You, too, can become part of the Mutant Generation. Just ask the Mexicans along the Rio Grande how their children born with no brains are doing? Then bow down to the almighty American mulitnational corporations who promise you prosperity?
A question to all you, and especially Garth, who link seperatists in Canada (Quebecois or Alberta) are losers:
Do you think Tibetans wanting independance from China are selfish losers also?
By Loraine Lamontagne on 07.04.08 10:48 pm
Avez-vous lu l’article en entier madame ? vos propos sont diffamatoires et ne respectent en rien l’esprit et la diégèse de ce texte. Avant de vômir vos inepties de mange-SOUVERAINISTES (ça fait tu si mal de le dire madame l’”assimilassionnisse!”)svp référez-vous correctement au texte. Car les préoccupations que soulèvent M. Payette (aussi souverainiste soit-elle) sont UNIVERSELLES. Le cynisme qu’elle dénonce affecte tout autant les institutions canadiennes que québécoises… et que dire de cette tendance au ludique, cette dictature du paraître au détriment de l’esprit critique. Ce désengagement citoyen, madame, nous affecte tous, sans égards aux tendances politiques.
Mais ça, si ça vient de la plume de Mme Payette, ça ne veut plus rien dire n’est-ce pas ? Et le révisionnisme historique de M. Harper (pratique courante dans les régimes post-soviétiques qui réécrivaient l’histoire selon leurs intérêts politiques), ce chantre de l’unité canadienne, vous en faites quoi ?
In Garths defense.
He didn`t just now fire up western separation. It`s been brewing for a long time. There are issues such as the ones I described in my 9:46 pm post. We don`t approve of the level of good governance and I can`t see why the people of Ontario should approve either. Just look at the mess our elected federal government has done in making Ontario the economy engine of Canada. How could you possibly approve of the mess you`re in.
Separation is being fueled by, of all things, the none of the above crowd. Separation is the only logical alternative so we all thank the partisan basher here, in Ottawa and in the media for contributing to the swelling numbers of NAP, (None of the Above Party), you`re doing a swell job.
Separatists are not a good thing. Those who crap on this blog, from BOTH Alberta and Quebec, should move to Zimbabwe.
By maybe Rhino? on 07.04.08 10:37 pm
Doesn’t Zimbabwe have enough selfish assholes already? Perhaps you should suggest another country? Hmmmmmmmm!
I’m not a Liberal, I live in the west, and while I believe the environment is very important – I don’t believe for a second in the Green Shift/Carbon Tax plan that Mr Dion proposes.
Having said all that, I am a big fan of Canada, so good for you for saying what you think, and good for you for having the blog. It may not serve you well in that party (or with the Conservatives either, as both parties expect you to act like a trained seal). I may not agree with you, but at least you give your honest opinion. I’d likely vote for you if I lived in your riding (not that it really matters).
Have a good weekend, Garth.
Merci du fond du coeur. Vos propos font avancer la cause souverainiste.
And to make sure everyone understand:
From the bottom fo my heart, thank you. Your observations will be a great help for sovernists.
What I find laughable and detestable is the so-called Qubecois who liken their plight and struggle to Palestinians .
I see all the asshole heroes are out in full force .
Who gives a shit what you morons think .
For the most part you are nothing but social parasites .
Take your whine and cheese and beat it .
Oui c’est ça, les souverainistes sont tellement machos qu’ils ont une femme comme chef du Parti Québécois. Et nous sommes tellement racistes que le premier député africain au fédéral, Maka Kotto, maintenant député du PQ, était un élu souverainiste…
Je me demande c’est qui le raciste…
Garth, I guess you don’t realize that the seperatist talk was ignited by the Carbon Tax. It’s easy really, no Carbon Tax threat no seperation threat.
I listened to Adler, your hearts not in it is it? I mean “if the promise is actually kept”.
Gord.
Va chier !
Selfish it is, to destroy a country.
By Barb the proof-reader on 07.04.08 10:27 pm
Then it also must be selfish to keep us in it against our will… remember 1982 (rapatriement unilatéral de la constitution contre l’avis du Québec)
and why do we call this country a “confederation” anyways ? it’s nothing but fraud. 1 point of taxation, 1 curency, 1 army. That’s it! if not, independence is the only way.
By De Lorimier on 07.04.08 10:41 pm
Remember the ‘Plains of Abraham’?
You got your sorry asses kicked but good.
Be thankful the British didn’t send you packing back to France .
For a defeated race you sure do whine a lot .
ahahahaha, what a great canadian! I’m so so so sooooo pround to be in the same country as you. I’ll pray the Queen of Colonial Canada for you, I wish you’ll be more canadian that way.
But, why don you just forget this step, everybody will save time : kick us out of your beautiful and very united country.
PET did not allow us to sign your constitution, so one day or another, one way or another, we will be independant.
(It’s sad for you, because you’ll have to find other people to hate.)
Dion + Carbon Tax = New NEP!!!
Wow!
Je ne peux croire les mots que je lis…How sad they are. Vous ne comprenez rien monsieur. You are reinforcing the stereotypes. Plus je vous lis, moins je me sens canadien. You are helping the separatists cause…
An honest discussion in this country hasn’t been possible since Poopy Lip Glossed Harpo/Company. I’ll tell you this though, Canadians like me who usually couldn’t give a fig about the special Quebecers, couldn’t for life nor money nor soul nor anything in the world, conceive of our country without them. Because the plain and simple truth is our Quebec is our Canada! And Our Canada is our Quebec! Don’t ever try and take away our Quebec! I am just a miserable Ontarian and I love my Quebec and my country. Actually ASK Canadians how they feel and they will tell you all the same thing. We are all ONE.
But just in case anyone thinks I’m partisan here is what I have to say to that: The argument that the two parties should represent opposed ideals and policies, one, perhaps, of the Right and the other of the Left, is a foolish idea acceptable only to the doctrinaire and academic thinkers. Instead, the two parties should be almost identical, so that the people can “throw the rascals out” at any election without leading to any profound or extreme shifts in policy.”
Ha-ha, isn’t that the truth.
Que de temps perdu politiquement à débattre de nos identités respectives!
Que d’incompréhension!
Il est vraiment temps que le Québec fasse sécession du Canada et devienne un pays indépendant, afin de tourner la page sur cette Confédération canadienne, qui, fondée de bonne foi par 4 colonies jusque-là indépendantes, s’est avéré au final un douloureux échec aux yeux de bien des Québécois.
Il est temps que nos deux ‘pays’, pleinement aptes à s’auto-gérer, se parlent d’égal à égal… Et avec respect.
Ce serait d’ailleurs l’occasion idéale de doter le Québec d’une constitution, cette fois non imposée unilatéralement par une majorité qui lui est étrangère, à l’image de la société moderne qu’il incarne. À cet égard, on pourrait : inclure des garanties constitutionnelles relatives au respect de l’environnement (chose susceptible d’intéresser Dion), réitérer l’unité et l’unicité culturelles inhérentes au Québec (protéger définitivement sa nature française) et développer une symbolique qui nous appartienne, i.e. qui ne découle pas par exemple de l’idée de suprématie de Dieu (charte canadienne, préambule) ou encore de la monarchie ou de l’impérialisme britannique (AANB1867, préambule surtout), etc.
Former un peuple souverain, c’est ce qui nous rendra respectables aux yeux de bien de Canadians qui, pensant qu’on leur est subjugués, nous négligent et nous caricaturent. Et en réponse à cela, il est normal que certains d’entre nous leur renvoient la pareille, mais ça n’enlève rien au fait qu’une large majorité de Québécois sont québécois bien avant d’être canadiens. Ô, on peut bien les traiter de “traîtres” vis-à-vis du Canada, mais… Ils s’en foutent, au même titre qu’ils s’en foutraient si un Américain leur disait qu’ils sont des traîtres à “l’Amérique”. Les Québécois ne sont PAR NATURE et HISTORIQUEMENT pas canadians! Les Québécois, qui s’appelaient jadis les “Canadiens” avant qu’on ne biaise ce terme, ne forment pas qu’une nation “au sein d’un Canada uni”. Ils ont formé une nation bien avant la Conquête britannique et la Confédération, de même qu’ils formeraient une nation “à L’EXTÉRIEUR” de votre Canada uni!!! Ce n’est pas qu’on n’a pas essayé d’être canadiens ou qu’on n’aime pas les Canadiens anglais : c’est juste qu’on se fait rabaisser, caricaturer, minoriser, abroger nos lois, censurer à l’interne et à l’international, menacer, etc., à tout bout de champ depuis la Confédération!!! Vous ne pouvez quand même pas nous en vouloir d’hésiter à appartenir pleinement au Canada, à votre Canada, avec votre symbolique et vos intérêts économiques…
C’est simple à comprendre, pourtant.
Maxime Laporte
Garth … are you trying to build a firewall around Ontario .. or at least the GTA .. because it sure sounds like it …??!!!
“self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.”
I am a Western Separatist, and damn proud of it!!!
Garth, your excuses are so lame. Even my kids are more creative when they get caught being a$#holes!
Hey Garth.
The good thing about morons is that they don’t have the intellectual capacity to understand that they are morons.
So telling you you are a dumb moron would be pointless since you will of course disagree for the reason I presented above.
So keep up the good work Garth; open your mouth and let the self-righteous horse shit roll out.
Garth
This Foot in Mouth decease you have Garth, how do you remove the tread marks off your tongue?
Can you explain why the Liberals always want to stir up the separatists. There hasn’t been any separatist talk in Alberta for years (beside the odd loon) and you and Dion open your mouths and their popping out the woodwork. Do you practice this or does it come naturally.
Anyways Garth now that hopefully we are finished calling each one names how about some detail on your plan.
How are you going to tax Coal for example? In 2006 Alberta produced 37 million tonnes of coal and collected $11 million in royalties. By my calculations if you taxed all of the Alberta production Ottawa would receive $2.6 billion in carbon tax just for Alberta coal.
This would also increase coal fired electricity by, the very least, 100% in four years. Is this correct?
Hey Garth you really fired up the lunatic fringe this time.
I’m sure most of them will feel really stupid once they sober up but the rest talk like loonie nut-jobs that only get out on the week-end.
Anyway don’t worry about the whackos’ because we have a planet to save and a country to salvage after 2 years of the go nowhere do nothing Harper Clown Party agenda! Keep the faith Garth – the silent majority of Canadians support you.
Le texte paru dans Le Devoir, signé par madame Payette et qui s’intitule “Ma gang de malades… vous êtes donc où?”, fait référence à la chanson “LA DÉSISE” du chanteur DANIEL BOUCHER, sortie en 1999 sur l’album “DIX MILLE MATINS”. Il s’agit d’une pièce très connue au Québec et madame Payette n’en a extirpé anecdotiquement que son titre. Il faut connaître la chanson pour comprendre ce choix. Mais, comme nos deux cultures respectives ne sont visiblement pas homogènes et que la nôtre, plus particulièrement, ne semble vraiment pas vous intéresser, normal qu’il y ait tant d’incompréhension! Si vous connaissiez un peu plus cette culture qui est la nôtre, peut-être nous comprendriez-vous un peu mieux, et éviteriez-vous de nous traiter de traîtres ou de racistes à qui mieux mieux! Mais je crains qu’il nous faille un pays pour attirer le moindrement votre attention, susciter un respect et un intérêt, – qui ne soit pas qu’hypocrite, comme en établissant un fantaisiste “bilinguisme” à la grandeur du Canada ou en “reconnaissant” le Québec comme nation -, en ce que nous ne sommes pas que des créatures, des caricatures, ni vos bouc-émissaires!!!
J’étais fédéraliste avant : je pensais que vivre dans un pays désintégré, mais qui fournit des garanties juridiques individuelles fortes, des “droits et libertés”, était suffisant… Mais, je me suis rendu compte que “l’idée d’unité et de solidarité”, normalement à la base de “l’idée de pays”, était bien supérieure à cela. Et je dirais que même les gens qui se disent détachés de leur propre pays, n’accepteraient que difficilement une situation où une majorité, patiemment, assimile sa minorité qui, autrement, en étant en pleine possession de ses moyens, pourrait très bien lui survivre.
Bonne soirée,
Maxime Laporte
When the FLQ was trying to recruit at our high school, I saw first hand the insufferable conceit of the separatists and there discussions on the English dogs as they called them. Then I went out west and saw the smug Albertans with there ” Let the eastern bastards freeze in the dark” mentality. They had more money than brains. So you hit it bang on Garth. If it quacks like a duck…then it is a duck…
2. Le texte paru dans Le Devoir, signé par madame Payette et qui s’intitule “Ma gang de malades… vous êtes donc où?”, fait référence à la chanson “LA DÉSISE” du chanteur DANIEL BOUCHER, sortie en 1999 sur l’album “DIX MILLE MATINS”. Il s’agit d’une pièce très connue au Québec et madame Payette n’en a extirpé anecdotiquement que son titre. Il faut connaître la chanson pour comprendre ce choix. Mais, comme nos deux cultures respectives ne sont visiblement pas homogènes et que la nôtre, plus particulièrement, ne semble vraiment pas vous intéresser, normal qu’il y ait tant d’incompréhension! Si vous connaissiez un peu plus cette culture qui est la nôtre, peut-être nous comprendriez-vous un peu mieux, et éviteriez-vous de nous traiter de traîtres ou de racistes à qui mieux mieux! Mais je crains qu’il nous faille un pays pour attirer le moindrement votre attention, susciter un respect et un intérêt, – qui ne soit pas qu’hypocrite, comme en établissant un fantaisiste “bilinguisme” à la grandeur du Canada ou en “reconnaissant” le Québec comme nation -, en ce que nous ne sommes pas que des créatures, des caricatures, ni vos bouc-émissaires!!!
J’étais fédéraliste avant : je pensais que vivre dans un pays désintégré, mais qui fournit des garanties juridiques individuelles fortes, des “droits et libertés”, était suffisant… Mais, je me suis rendu compte que “l’idée d’unité et de solidarité”, normalement à la base de “l’idée de pays”, était bien supérieure à cela. Et je dirais que même les gens qui se disent détachés de leur propre pays, n’accepteraient que difficilement une situation où une majorité, patiemment, assimile sa minorité qui, autrement, en étant en pleine possession de ses moyens, pourrait très bien lui survivre.
Bonne soirée,
Maxime Laporte
Offensive? Gees, how thin skinned people are. fact is, there are people wanting to destroy this country, years ago they would have been hung as traitors, now they are offended by some passionate discourse.
Admittedly, i do think Dion has appoint to debate at a level above Harper.
But people, lay off the carbon tax until you can comment on harper’s plan, the one with no tax decreases and a cap and trade with a higher price on carbon, a cap and trade that will see eastern companies sell emissions credits in huge amounts to western oil companies….and you thought the NEP transferred wealth from east to west.
Keep up the passion garth.
Que de temps perdu politiquement à débattre de nos identités respectives!
Que d’incompréhension!
Il est vraiment temps que le Québec fasse sécession du Canada et devienne un pays indépendant, afin de tourner la page sur cette Confédération canadienne, qui, fondée de bonne foi par 4 colonies jusque-là indépendantes, s’est avéré au final un douloureux échec aux yeux de bien des Québécois.
Il est temps que nos deux ‘pays’, pleinement aptes à s’auto-gérer, se parlent d’égal à égal… Et avec respect.
Ce serait d’ailleurs l’occasion idéale de doter le Québec d’une constitution, cette fois non imposée unilatéralement par une majorité qui lui est étrangère, à l’image de la société moderne qu’il incarne. À cet égard, on pourrait : inclure des garanties constitutionnelles relatives au respect de l’environnement (chose susceptible d’intéresser Dion), réitérer l’unité et l’unicité culturelles inhérentes au Québec (protéger définitivement sa nature française) et développer une symbolique qui nous appartienne, i.e. qui ne découle pas par exemple de l’idée de suprématie de Dieu (charte canadienne, préambule) ou encore de la monarchie ou de l’impérialisme britannique (AANB1867, préambule surtout), etc.
Former un peuple souverain, c’est ce qui nous rendra respectables aux yeux de bien de Canadians qui, pensant qu’on leur est subjugués, nous négligent et nous caricaturent. Et en réponse à cela, il est normal que certains d’entre nous leur renvoient la pareille, mais ça n’enlève rien au fait qu’une large majorité de Québécois sont québécois bien avant d’être canadiens. Ô, on peut bien les traiter de “traîtres” vis-à-vis du Canada, mais… Ils s’en foutent, au même titre qu’ils s’en foutraient si un Américain leur disait qu’ils sont des traîtres à “l’Amérique”. Les Québécois ne sont PAR NATURE et HISTORIQUEMENT pas canadians! Les Québécois, qui s’appelaient jadis les “Canadiens” avant qu’on ne biaise ce terme, ne forment pas qu’une nation “au sein d’un Canada uni”. Ils ont formé une nation bien avant la Conquête britannique et la Confédération, de même qu’ils formeraient une nation “à L’EXTÉRIEUR” de votre Canada uni!!! Ce n’est pas qu’on n’a pas essayé d’être canadiens ou qu’on n’aime pas les Canadiens anglais : c’est juste qu’on se fait rabaisser, caricaturer, minoriser, abroger nos lois, censurer à l’interne et à l’international, menacer, etc., à tout bout de champ depuis la Confédération!!! Vous ne pouvez quand même pas nous en vouloir d’hésiter à appartenir pleinement au Canada, à votre Canada, avec votre symbolique et vos intérêts économiques…
C’est simple à comprendre, pourtant.
Maxime Laporte
2. Le texte paru dans Le Devoir, signé par madame Payette et qui s’intitule “Ma gang de malades… vous êtes donc où?”, fait référence à la chanson “LA DÉSISE” du chanteur DANIEL BOUCHER, sortie en 1999 sur l’album “DIX MILLE MATINS”. Il s’agit d’une pièce très connue au Québec et madame Payette n’en a extirpé anecdotiquement que son titre. Il faut connaître la chanson pour comprendre ce choix. Mais, comme nos deux cultures respectives ne sont visiblement pas homogènes et que la nôtre, plus particulièrement, ne semble vraiment pas vous intéresser, normal qu’il y ait tant d’incompréhension! Si vous connaissiez un peu plus cette culture qui est la nôtre, peut-être nous comprendriez-vous un peu mieux, et éviteriez-vous de nous traiter de traîtres ou de racistes à qui mieux mieux! Mais je crains qu’il nous faille un pays pour attirer le moindrement votre attention, susciter un respect et un intérêt, – qui ne soit pas qu’hypocrite, comme en établissant un fantaisiste “bilinguisme” à la grandeur du Canada ou en “reconnaissant” le Québec comme nation -, en ce que nous ne sommes pas que des créatures, des caricatures, ni vos bouc-émissaires!!!
J’étais fédéraliste avant : je pensais que vivre dans un pays désintégré, mais qui fournit des garanties juridiques individuelles fortes, des “droits et libertés”, était suffisant… Mais, je me suis rendu compte que “l’idée d’unité et de solidarité”, normalement à la base de “l’idée de pays”, était bien supérieure à cela. Et je dirais que même les gens qui se disent détachés de leur propre pays, n’accepteraient que difficilement une situation où une majorité, patiemment, assimile sa minorité qui, autrement, en étant en pleine possession de ses moyens, pourrait très bien lui survivre.
Bonne soirée,
Maxime Laporte
2. Le texte paru dans Le Devoir, signé par madame Payette et qui s’intitule “Ma gang de malades… vous êtes donc où?”, fait référence à la chanson “LA DÉSISE” du chanteur DANIEL BOUCHER, sortie en 1999 sur l’album “DIX MILLE MATINS”. Il s’agit d’une pièce très connue au Québec et madame Payette n’en a extirpé anecdotiquement que son titre. Il faut connaître la chanson pour comprendre ce choix. Mais, comme nos deux cultures respectives ne sont visiblement pas homogènes et que la nôtre, plus particulièrement, ne semble vraiment pas vous intéresser, normal qu’il y ait tant d’incompréhension! Si vous connaissiez un peu plus cette culture qui est la nôtre, peut-être nous comprendriez-vous un peu mieux, et éviteriez-vous de nous traiter de traîtres ou de racistes à qui mieux mieux! Mais je crains qu’il nous faille un pays pour attirer le moindrement votre attention, susciter un respect et un intérêt, – qui ne soit pas qu’hypocrite, comme en établissant un fantaisiste “bilinguisme” à la grandeur du Canada ou en “reconnaissant” le Québec comme nation -, en ce que nous ne sommes pas que des créatures, des caricatures, ni vos bouc-émissaires!!!
J’étais fédéraliste avant : je pensais que vivre dans un pays désintégré, mais qui fournit des garanties juridiques individuelles fortes, des “droits et libertés”, était suffisant… Mais, je me suis rendu compte que “l’idée d’unité et de solidarité”, normalement à la base de “l’idée de pays”, était bien supérieure à cela. Et je dirais que même les gens qui se disent détachés de leur propre pays, n’accepteraient que difficilement une situation où une majorité, patiemment, assimile sa minorité qui, autrement, en étant en pleine possession de ses moyens, pourrait très bien lui survivre.
Bonne soirée,
Maxime Laporte
Yeah right, that’s how you roll and that’s how your political career will end up. Good thing for every provinces, from the Atlantic, to Quebec (I’m part of the greedy loosers I guess) all the way to the Western parts of Canada. Paradoxically, you, sir, are a MP that do exactly what some “balkanizers” do, helping to break the whole thing apart.
Good Job.
“. . . I’m in trouble again. . . . Dion called and chewed me out.”
You’re in trouble and got chewed out? It’s worth it, because after the final election results are in shortly, that’s when CRAP will find themselves beyond help.
No time to be politically correct and speak warmly of others — this is war, about as ruthless and nasty as the US. Besides, nothing like stirring the broth — get rid of the sediment!
“. . . even try to justify my words?”
Don’t bother. If certain folk are too ’sensitive’ to read others’ opinions, let them go watch Sesame Street.
In the real world, this is where shit happens, so live with it.
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Real estate is doing well in some parts of the world. A friend e-mailed pix of the huge mansions built on the sea shore in Dubai, towers and new buildings all going up.
One of the towers is tall enough that workers at the top see the curvature of the earth — spectacular.
Unfortunately, I can’t post them here, but trust me, this — plus two links — is why gas here is about $1.45 / L, there about 25 cents.
http://tinyurl.com/56qwsy
http://tinyurl.com/6ehcrg
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Ghost towns in the good ol’ US of A . . .
http://tinyurl.com/58ef7h
http://tinyurl.com/6ebtoe
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The World’s Smallest Political Quiz
maybe Rhino?, 10:30 am
Thanks for the link, Rhino — apparently I am a Libertarian, which means I want a lot less govt. in my life.
I understand Putin has cut the number of govt. agencies in Russia from 108 to 12 — talk about streamlining!
At least I’m NOT a talking-head, bobblehead troll doll!
Final post for the night. Here ya go Garth. A more positive view of what’s happening! http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=633043
Just a couple of thoughts, Garth.
First, if you need a vacation for a week, just shut this web site down for a week or ten days so that the rabble have to go through withdrawal! Haw haw haw
Second, we need McGuinty, et al to do like Quebec has just done, APPROVE the Electric cars for city street only use in Ontario. They recharge for $3.63 Cdn overnight on our nuclear powered grid! This will be the Greenest Shift that can be made and it leaves Alberta/Saskatchewan oil and gas unneeded!
Next, we need to electrify the railroads from Windsor to Quebec City, again using atomic power and or hydro produced electricity. This is also a totally Green Shift. No taxes need to be shifted just invest in our current infrastructure.
Third, the wind turbine farm project of the Eastern end of Lake Ontario could also boost the green scene.
Finally, we need to search for a new Prime Minister who will respect all Canadians, not just those who think they are entitled and superior by accident of birth or religious fervor! We the People are tired of this Pit Bull mentality!
2. Le texte paru dans Le Devoir, signé par madame Payette et qui s’intitule “Ma gang de malades… vous êtes donc où?”, fait référence à la chanson “LA DÉSISE” du chanteur DANIEL BOUCHER, sortie en 1999 sur l’album “DIX MILLE MATINS”. Il s’agit d’une pièce très connue au Québec et madame Payette n’en a extirpé anecdotiquement que son titre. Il faut connaître la chanson pour comprendre ce choix. Mais, comme nos deux cultures respectives ne sont visiblement pas homogènes et que la nôtre, plus particulièrement, ne semble vraiment pas vous intéresser, normal qu’il y ait tant d’incompréhension! Si vous connaissiez un peu plus cette culture qui est la nôtre, peut-être nous comprendriez-vous un peu mieux, et éviteriez-vous de nous traiter de traîtres ou de racistes à qui mieux mieux! Mais je crains qu’il nous faille un pays pour attirer le moindrement votre attention, susciter un respect et un intérêt, – qui ne soit pas qu’hypocrite, comme en établissant un fantaisiste “bilinguisme” à la grandeur du Canada ou en “reconnaissant” le Québec comme nation -, en ce que nous ne sommes pas que des créatures, des caricatures, ni vos bouc-émissaires!!!
J’étais fédéraliste avant : je pensais que vivre dans un pays désintégré, mais qui fournit des garanties juridiques individuelles fortes, des “droits et libertés”, était suffisant… Mais, je me suis rendu compte que “l’idée d’unité et de solidarité”, normalement à la base de “l’idée de pays”, était bien supérieure à cela. Et je dirais que même les gens qui se disent détachés de leur propre pays, n’accepteraient que difficilement une situation où une majorité, patiemment, assimile sa minorité qui, autrement, en étant en pleine possession de ses moyens, pourrait très bien lui survivre.
Bonne soirée,
Maxime Laporte
Maybe Rhino:
Moving to Zimbabwe ? What a fine idea !Problem is, a great democrat thought of that before you. Ecept that the summer camps for dissident was in Siberia. Stalinism, anyone ? Hello, goulag !
The Canadian Constitution is a LAW.
A foundamental one, yes; but just a feaking “texte de loi”.
It is not sacred, it has not always existed, it was the result of discussions and negotiations, had been amended (in 1982) and guess what ? It might be tweeked again in the future.
Just calm down everyone.
So Canada will remain frozen in time, stuck with the same political structure forever and ever ?
What are you afraid of ?!?
Independence is one political option, that is all. It is not something vicariously “wrong”, it is not evil, just a political option.
You are against it ?
Fine. Then debate ! Argue ! Convince us ! If independence is such a bad idea, how come 49.9 % of us haven’t seen the light since 1995 ?
But of course, if you are convinced that as a coincidence, 49.9% of Qubekers are just plain stupid, that give you a great reason not to engage into a sensible discussion, right ?
So let,s call them names – traitors is a fine one. Hoo, scrary.
Then, no one will notice that perhaps, you are lacking argument, or interest in politics and beside – there are so many good American series on TV, who got time for dialogue ?
For your information, many of my very best friends ans many of my family members – my brother, my dear dear grand-father! – were federalists, and we have always been able to have an INTELLIGENT, CIVILIZED and CONSTRUCTIVE conversation about that issue.
This country will break, I am telling you, because its real bound – deep and true democratics values – will not survive to all that bad-faith, political ignorance (shut the damn American TV off once in a while, and read about your country that you pretend to love so well.)
There is no democracy without dialogue. None.
Democracy is not so much about voting, it is about dsicussing and trying to find common grounds, biulding bridges, easing differences – and – why not ? – cultivate and take advantages of these differences!
Anyhow. Je prêche dans le désert. I am dreaming.
Forget about it folks, go back to your favorite US magazine, and leave notre belle patrie alone.
Rather surprising…
Seperation in Quebec is pretty much past now, low as 35% right now. The idea that Quebec ever will be a country is pretty much dead in the mind of most.
Real stupid to bring that up now Turner, real stupid.
It’s looking more and more that the new climate change tax strategy/opportunity is backfiring. I think this one may have awakened the average dozy Canadian.
Ontario is about to learn what it’s like to such hind tit in the economy and they just can’t stand it. Your crap on Adler today was evidence of that.
Canada has not been a real country since Pierre Trudeau got through with it.
Quebec should be a separate nation if they want to and so should the West. That might be the best thing that ever happened to Canada. Why not just go with it?
FYI … Most of the planet is either ignoring or is unaware of your precious global warming pile of crap. It is impossible for a handful of Western democracies to do anything about climate unless they install a thermostat directly linked to the Sun.
Climate change is natural. Taxing the air we breath is not.
I hear Stephane Dion talk about destroying jobs in the oil patch in order to create more job in universities? That is the stupidest most idiotic thing I have ever heard. Universities are the domain of totally unrealistic assholes like Stephane Dion and we have quite enough of them running around ruining our society and our culture now.
Sorry to bitch and squawk, but the Liberals give us so much to bitch about.
All this talk of racism…
I did not realize that les Quebecois, ou les Francais, ou les Allemagnes, ou les Irlandais, ou les Espagnoles, were of different races. What about the Haitians? The Congolese? Whatever the human beings from the Cote d’Ivoire are called?
Laine Pur? Talk about racism, and elitism in the same bed. Was there not a backlash against such in France a few hundred years ago? Liberté, égalité, fraternité.
There are none of us that do not have some Mongol, or Moor, somewhere in our DNA, and genetically, we are none more distantly related than 54th cousin or so.
These arguments of separation are childish. The real threat to us all is he absorption of all of Canada into another entity. United we stand, divided we fall. That old saw has merit still.
I can’t help but wonder why you liberals do not propose a tax on manufacturers of the vehicles, etc. that creat the CO2 emissions. (GM, Ford, Bombardia, etc.) Could be the typical two faced liberals are cowards as always.
For crying out loud! Get over yourselves, people! It’s all good for some to come on Garth’s blog and threaten separation from Canada, but soon as someone calls you on it who do you run to? The bloody government.
You’re either Canadian, in it for the long haul, or you’re not.
Keep on keeping on, Garth.
You calls ‘em as you see ‘em. Can’t ask for much more than that.
Sad that more MP’s can’t say that.
Honesty hurts sometimes.
Vous semblez avoir une haute opinion devous-mêmes monsieur Turner, vous me semblez hostile envers les souverainistes québécois, avares, machos, égoïstes et, vos plates excuses font de vous un pauvre loser.
Anyway, you are right, but politics offers no reward for ‘right’ especially if ‘wrong’ gets you the votes.
Leasa
By Leasa on 07.04.08 9:28 pm
Ain’t that the truth. First time out of your mouth, Leasa. Do you like the taste?
Yvan, you too are welcome to move to a country run by a dictator.
How about you call it Yvania and it will be all yours.
Head on out, find some new land, stake a claim, put up your flag, defend and populate it.
Easy peasy. Get going. Via con dios.
Oh Garth, (You Mulroney-ite ex-PC you).
You don’t get it.
Canada being the 2nd largest country in the world under Federalism will have regional differences, it’s a fact of life.
Wether it’s the Atlantic provinces, Quebec, the Prairies, Alberta or BC, every province has their regional interest that are greatly vast.
But you are from Ontario, the central hub of centralization where you think you are the center of attention.
You are and will always be a Mulroney crony and we true Liberals will always remind the like of you who you are.
Hé Garth, va te faire enculer par ton chef bien aimé dans la machine à fric libérale corrompue. Ton parti de merde a baisé le Canada au complet pendant des décennies.
SJ, Barb the proof reader and Lana, All three of you make me nauseous, oh ya,, let support the LPC the party of the big tent, the party of inclusiveness, Take your smug superior attitude and shove them.
Tous les trois de vous me fait nauséabond, oh ya,, laisser le soutien le LPC le parti de la grande tente, le parti de totalité, Prendre votre attitude supérieure suffisante et les pousse.
By KH on 07.04.08 9:49 pm
LOL what a riot. Using the words “inclusiveness” to denigrate one party, while supporting the very OPPOSING definition of it (separatists). I think you need to wake up kiddo.
I’ve lived in Quebec, I’ve lived in Alberta, I know what the people are like in both provinces. DIVERSE.
The people who want to rip apart a country over a hundred years of unity over stupidity do not deserve the ability to call others ‘racist’ (which is absolutely ludicrous.)
I loved Montreal, don’t speak a lick of french, but if I had a lot of money kicking around, Montreal would probably be called my home. Can’t say the same for Alberta mind you. There are few, far and between who have an open mind, but for the most part I found the political, “moral” mind of most Albertans to be closed tight. Very one track.
It was not a good place for me, that’s for sure.
I stand by Garth on this one.
On that note, traffic must have quadrupled on here from Quebec lol. Never seen so much french uproar on here before.
Merci beaucoup. Un séparatiste Québécois reconnaissant
Merci encore une fois. Vive le Québec libre. Ça peut être difficile à lire, le français est une langue tellement difficile à apprendre que les canadiens ont de la difficulté voir incapable, trop complexe, il y a des mots, des verbes, des adjectifs, des adverbes, des accents ce n’est pas donné à tout le monde d’être capable de maîtriser autant de choses à la fois ça prend un minimum d’intelligence pour y arriver je vous souhaite bonne chance et vous remercie encore une fois Vive le Québec Libre
I called such separatists, who put regional and self-interest ahead of the national cause, “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.”
I would say your statement is accurate. That’s probably why Quebecers and Albertans are upset. As for Harry S, Leasa, Catherine, Sheila and the other trolls, I could care less about what they think … They’re DUE for a HARSH comeuppance.
Why not oblige us commonfolk with a sampling of the most favourably profane submission verbatim? I’m sure it would reinforce our dedication to OUR CAUSE.
I apologise for the proof reading errors in my previous post. Here is the better copy:
Mr Turner’s bad manners and name calling are far from unique, they are typical of the malaise and mediocrity of much of our government and mob element that such ‘politicians’ cater to. What concerns me is the use of the word ‘balkananization.’ It threatens military action without the trouble of a law suit coming back in one’s face. Sigh… It’s not news, it’s just more of the same.
You were a conservative under Harper and you call others racist and macho? you are a liberal under Dion and you call others losers? You are a rich guy spewing venom on anyone who disagrees with you and you call others “me-first and greedy”? You have a blog to your name where you pontificate on matters about which you obviously don’t have a clue and you call others “self agrandizing”?
You really have your head up the place where the sun never shines…when you live in a glass house don’t throw stones. It really p….. me off to think that you are getting a salary out of my taxes…..
By Belz_ on 07.04.08 7:35 pm
Vive le Québec libre!
By Belz on 07.04.08 7:37 pm
By Belz on 07.04.08 7:38 pm
You should recall this man of stature, who is actually much shorter than Charles de Gaulle, standing next, while Charles paraded before the free French in Paris. De Gaulle was adamant he would lead his armoured brigade into Paris, despite the fact the opportunity resulted from Allied efforts and sacrifices in operation Overlord. De Gaulle, ever the egocentric personality, was never good at acknowledging the efforts, sacrifices and contributions of others.
So, I say, dat’s dat for me! The Vichy went on to ‘cook up’ vichyssoise.
Cela dit tout, pour moi.
Now let’s everybody go elsewhere and FEEL PRECIOUS. … and leave Albertans to gloat over their 130 square kilometre cesspool, which appears to be the envy of the WORLD for healthy swimming.
Perhaps the real damage you have caused is relegating Ontario to a “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.” province … sucking the money out of the West and pissing on the Quebec nation.
By Harry S on 07.04.08 8:45 pm
This is rich coming from a person who has constantly made bigoted remarks about the French – you really have nerve.
To all you Quebekers responding to this – I don’t know if you read Garth’s blog on a regular basis or not – the responses are full of bigoted remarks from CPC supporters. It’s sad that you don’t realize just how bigoted Conservatives are. Harper plays the politics of the “nation” and you fell for it – he wants a majority. If you look at his past remarks (Harper) you will see that you are being used and that is truly sad.
Sorry folks – I love Quebec and because I’ve been working on my family genealogy I’ve learned some history about people from centuries ago and how they felt. There is a history that shouldn’t be ignored and you can understand the French pride, if you take the opportunity to research and know our Canadian history. Unfortunately, most people make their opinions on word of mouth nonsense.
I’m actually surprised that Quebekers fell for Harper’s manipulation, but then they are angry at the Liberals – BUT that is past, done, over.
We owe a lot to Quebec – especially the doctrines of the Liberal party. The Quebekers gave us that and yet they want to turn their backs on something the helped us with in the first place – a more liberal view of life. I thank them for that.
So, continue to fool yourselves – that’s your choice.
Garth made the boo boo and only he should be held responsible, not the rest of Canadians and he made his point clear.
Happy 400th – a very rich history indeed. You should be proud.
To all you conservative bigots – you are now jumping on the band wagon for political points – that is truly sick.
I recommend a severe reality check.
By Yvan on 07.04.08 11:04 pm
Please forward your check in the amount of one million Euros.
I like Jacques Villeneuve AND Scott Goodyear. They’re EXCELLENT racists. But, if you’re planning a racing event in Montreal, you can’t use tobacco in your ads. Defense de Fumer … All VERY VERY PRECIOUS … juste pour rire!
Dans une société démocratique, c’est son droit.
By Loraine Lamontagne on 07.04.08 10:48 pm
Darn tootin’ … It’s Garth’s right to speak out on any issue. I KNOW that’s his reason for being in Parliament.
But, you could have said, “We love you guys, but I’m too busy to love you all right now … and I think you might be having a headache at this moment.”
That’s a whole lot better than Jack Spar-I-So blaming the ‘money and ethnics’ and speaking of revenge. I’ll always remember M. Spar-i-So, standing next to his stalled ATV, with everyone else rushing past him.
Les mots sont certainement durs pour les mettre sur un blog, mais ils reflètent assez bien la réalité.
Beaucoup de francais (de France) pensent la même chose que vous M. Garth, et vous n’avez pas à retirer ces propos, car ils sont pertinents.
Les souverainistes sont racistes et n’aiment personne d’autre qu’eux même.
Il n’y a qu’à voir comme le monde (et surtout les français) se fout du 400e de Québec. (Québec est un vrai repère de souverainnistes racistes).
Ils n’aiment pas les anglais, les français, les juifs, bref ce sont des gens bien spéciaux, et en plus hypocrites.
Bon courage,M. Garth, et ne lachez pas.
Greenpeace is hailing the tailing ponds of Alberta as a major tourist attraction. [130 km2 ... NOT SMALL] Albertans must be very proud.
Is that REAL? Or a gambit? Eddie Stelmach is spending $25 Million to convince potential tourists that the tailing ponds are the place to be right now. He seesm to be cut from the same cloth as Stevie [I'm not a Leader] Harper. What was it Gibbins said? Something like, “Western separatism has its head up its rear again.”
I was just going to pass a comment about you opening a can of worms and leave it at that, but then I sat on my throne for a few minutes and my mind got racing. I do my best thinking while on the throne.
I see you are hearing from the handful of idjumits who have allowed others more intelligent to form their thoughts and manipulate them via emotion/language etc.
I started to think about my life, travels and experiences and the whining/bitching/moaning minnies who think they have things bad.
If they had ever worked a scoop tram in Lynn Lake Manitoba, they might have had things bad.
If they had ever worked the mines in Subbury, they might have had things bad.
If you have to ask “why should I justify my words”, then you should have never gotten into politics in the first place.
It’s interesting to see one man with little or no understanding of a situation take prejudice over 7 million people he doesn’t know yet that he’s trying to win over, and force his entire political party out of the election by saying such eloquent words.
You’re out of line, sir. And it’s to be expected that Quebecers say the same things about you. Didn’t you ever hear of “do unto others”?
In English
The words are certainly hard to put like this on a blog, but they reflect well enough the reality.
A lot of French people (from France) think of the same thing, and you do not have to remove these comments, because they are relevant.
Separatists are racist and love nobody else than themselves.
There is only to see as the world (and especially French people from France) does’nt care of the 400th of Quebec city. (Quebec city is a the house of racist separatists).
They do not like English, French, the Jews, they are very special people, and in more hypocritical.
Don’t give up.
Pourquoi “monsieur” pensez-vous qu’il y a des souverainistes au Québec???
C’est parce qu’il y a des cons comme vous.
“A call to all Canadians….”
Yeah right…
Ton texte haineux ne fait qu’agrandir le fossé qui nous sépare.
C’est drole, mais on dirait que la provocation vient toujours des fédéralistes….
Je crois que Garth Turner devrait démissionner et quitter la vie politique pour un moment. Pour le plus grand bien de tous.
Now, who wants a drink? By Bill-Muskoka on 07.04.08 11:01 pm
Hey, Bill, speaking of a drink, I’ve been meaning to ask you if you ever tried adding a lime and a slice of cucumber to your vodka and tonic? I prefer gin and tonic like this, but haven’t tried it with Vodka. It is a very refreshing, summer drink.
+++++++++++++
On another topic–one I feel is of more importance than Garth’s choice of phrasing or words–is the topic of the state of our Long Term Care Facilities–particularly in Ontario. I just finished reading an article in the local paper about how there is now going to be an investigation. Yet, the article states that Price Waterhouse did one in 2001, which put Ontario at the bottom when it comes to caring for our elderly.
Both my Mom and Dad died in LTC facilities in the past two years–my Dad only 6 months ago. Due to a shortage of funding, and not because staff don’t care, my parents’ care was less than adequate. The article brought tears to my eyes. I guess this is a provincial issue and not a federal one, I’m not sure, but I am going to get in touch with my MP about this. It is too late for my parents, but I still keep in touch with some of the other elderly people at that home. Funnily enough, the one my parents were in is the Fairview Mennonite Home in Cambridge, which is probably one of the best in Ontario, and still it is inadequate. It makes me wonder about the ones that got a much worse “score”..it also sickens me.
Thanks to Dion, Canada has the Clarity Act which provides for a clear question regarding separation and a process to implement the will of the people, should something like separation be the result of a free, clear and open vote.
Compared to many countries in the world this is a very mature and considered approach.
Garth’s post has struck a nerve since it hits at the core of the notion of what ‘loyalty’ means. Should we be more loyal to a region or a province, or to the country?
The United States would not allow such discussion to even take place, as succession from the union is not allowed under their constitution.
I think it is important to remember that in many countries advocating separation is grounds for being charged with treason and can be punishable by death. (that is not the case in Canada, and I am NOT suggesting that with my posting).
Here is an article about one such case in Turkey:
Ocalan charged with treason
Kurds around the world continue to demonstrate
A Turkish judge has charged the imprisoned Kurdish rebel leader, Abdullah Ocalan, with treason and attempting to divide the country.
State prosecutors said they would seek the death penalty at the end of the trial.
Mr Ocalan’s first formal court appearance, before a single judge and no jury, was closed to the press.
None of the 15 human rights lawyers who applied to defend the Kurdish leader were permitted to see him.
The hearing took place at a high-security prison on an island in the Sea of Marmara, south of Istanbul, where Mr Ocalan has been held since he was captured in Kenya last week and brought back to Turkey.
Mr Ocalan has already been tried in his absence on similar charges.
BBC Ankara Correspondent Chris Morris says Mr Ocalan’s formal arrest marks the beginning of a new case against him.
The trial will be held by Ankara state security court, sitting in session on the prison island. The rebel leader will appear before three judges – one military and two civilian – with no jury.
No foreign observers
Turkey earlier rebuffed a European Union call to allow foreign observers to attend the trial.
“The EU’s idea of sending observers to the trial means to approve and encourage interference in the independent judiciary,” the Turkish foreign ministry said in a statement.
“This attitude which is against the principle of a state of law is not acceptable.”
One of the lawyers who applied to represent Mr Ocalan, Osman Baydemir, has said he is concerned about the Turkish leader’s health and the way he is being interrogated.
Meanwhile, in south-eastern Turkey, the security forces said they had killed 14 members of Mr Ocalan’s PKK rebel movement.
As human beings, whenever we get emotionally aroused we are incapable of making sound, rational decisions. It would be a shame to lose this great country through emotional displacement of any kind.
Merci M. Turner,
Prochaine Élection je vais me rappeller ou voter. La mémoire fini par nous faire défaut et nous fait oublier comment le canada déteste les québécois. Merci de nous le rappeller
I am what canadians would call a ‘French seperatist’. It is sad to still read those comments in 2008. Firdt of all: our seperatist leader is a woman. I don’t think she’s macho. Second, can’t you guys understand that we Quebecers want to seperate not because we complain or because we don’t like canadians. It’s because we’re different. Like the Irish, the Scotish, Czech and Slovaquian. From my point of view, we Quebecers have way more reasons to seperate from Cadana than the Irish had to seperate from the United Kingdom. Still, nobody in Canada who has common sense would critized the fact that Irland is independant.
You called us (Quebecers) ” all losers “… It hurts when a man from politics says that and after that, says that he wants to get the country together…
Separatists, not Quebeckers. But why bother being accurate? — Garth
Mr. Garth TurnerMP, FYI
(Note: you may already have heard this kind of stuff.
This post ended up being long, but this one has no links.
If you don’t post this due to the length, I’ll understand.
I might try posting 2x if unsure it got through at first try,
If you see it posted twice please delete 2nd one. Thanks)
To be human and make mistakes, as see throw some others human eyes.
Perhaps some of these persons simple have a different personal agenda?
Maybe they have been mislead, given partial or twisted/spun/out of context information? From others with a very different agenda, other that the best long-term interest of everyone. Including their own family’s best long-term interests.
It might be due to their lack of up to date good knowledge or understanding of the facts?
It could just be from selfish shortsighted greed, preventing them from even being concern for even there own kids future?
Isn’t life fun, trying to communicate with others.
It isn’t always easy, as you must know.
Communication is a complex thing, to do successfully!
-It involves at lease two people and both must work at it to have it succeed as first intended.
-Each must formulate thoughts. Find words that can transmit their thoughts to the other person can understand what is trying to be communicated to them.
-The receiving person(s) must receive the message by concentrate on getting the whole message, and understand the word/language/symbols it is being transmitted in. Then to understand it they must think about the information sent and try to formulate in their minds what was meant by it. Using the information they already have to work with.
-Then the receiver has to do the same thing to respond, and hopefully the first thought was understood as intended.
This communicate thing has lots of steps, and lots of chances to have the message/meaning that is trying to be transmitted to get screwed up, buy either transmitter or receiver person.
-Throw in an emotional filled topic, and some how even more opportunities arise to not successfully have the true/intended thought received or understood as hoped.
(not be misunderstood as intended.)
-Often any errors in communicating can be corrected easily by simple repeating, perhaps in a different why, what the first message transmitted was.
-If it’s found that a misunderstanding or error in transmitting the thought happened,
One can unusually corrected it right there and then, by the people involved. It’s often helpful to be in sight of each other, or specking over a phone. This is due to body and facile language and vocal tone that can also be part of the communication process.
-Additional clues both facial and vocal can help to insure the perception/understanding of the receiver of the things being communication, is being understood correctly. This often helps to insurer the communication process ends with the two people at lease understanding what the other intended in the first place, almost instantaneously. (Not that they agree with each other necessarily.)
-Communication is not always done perfectly, at least not always the first time, every time. Sometimes one need to work at it so every one can truly start to understand each other.
-‘Most often’, but not always, personal put downs and verbal attaches are not the most useful way to get ones thoughts communicated effectively to others, or so they can be easily understood by others.
Even though you may be feel strong emotions to at the time.
This type of communication, could be a learned, or mimicked style? It could be from someone who may have different personal agendas than your own or a group. Their agenda might be to just not work together for our common best interests. They may have there own selfish agendas in mind.
Sometimes a person is just going about things, in an unconstructive manner, despite there best intention. Sometime a person may be just wrong about things. This could be due to lack of knowledge, and/or are not good planers for the best long-term outcome of everyone. Sometimes a person maybe unable to even comprehend new information and make the needed adjustments to there plan to achieve a good outcome for everyone’s best long-term interest.
(Trying to be as nice about this, as I feel I can,.
Doesn’t this sort of remind you of PMSH and his gang? Or Bush?
But on the other hand, they may just be lying sociopaths will there own narrow short-sited agenda.
They’re truly don’t care one bit about you and your families future well being.)
The use of written language can have some added chances of miscommunication in that,
There is a greater time factor involved in trying to get your thoughts received as intended and the time to get a response back to see if the thought was interrupted as intended..
-And then there’s the choice of world used, the grammar, spelling, composition of the world, and comprehension, all add to the possibility of more errors happening.
-Throw in an emotional, hot button topic and humans beings can get into all kinds of trouble with trying to communicate in a useful meaningful/productive way.
Wars can start because of misunderstood communication. So we have been told?
Advertisers know about the chance of communication errors, causing a loss of market share. When possible, for very large clients test samples of advertisement are run past a small number of representatives of the targeted groups to make sure the information is understood and the desired response is achieved.
Then there are the other issues of differing opinions, values, ethics and agendas. All could be moving targets.
-Good leadership usually involves the ability to be able to communicate thoughts and ideas, even complex or multiple part ideas/plans successfully to others.
The complicated ideas sometimes can take time to fully communicate to others.
Written documents can help, if you can somehow get everyone to read them.
-Misinformation, by some others, with there own personal agendas, sometimes gets in the way of good communication of complex multiple part ideas. to the general public.
In some instances these competing agendas actually do more harm than good for a groups long-term best interests.
-Good leadership also is willing to listen to others before deciding on the best plan to get you to wear the group best long-term interests will be met.
-Good leadership is able to critically-think about and prioritize and many competing thoughts and issues to formulate a plan of action that is best for the group as a whole.
-Good leadership is also willing to reevaluate past decisions and priorities based on new information to try and achieve the best possible outcome for the group that is willing to fallow the (hopefully good) leader.
-Good followers are usually also good leadership potential, which can help the leader get the group towards the chosen goals, hopefully for the betterment of the group as a whole. -Good followers assuming the leader is competent and actually working to help ‘everyone’ in the group to achieves the best and desired long-term outcome that is good for all in the group. When some new information becomes available that could effect the survival of a group it is important this information is given to the leadership. If they take no action to prevent a disaster they need to be removed from their leadership roll immediately. Sometimes it does take a bit of time to get enough people to understand, be convinced that there own best interest and there families is best served by getting some new leadership, to help them in the time left to take action, so all can live to see another day.
In past times, the groups vary survival depended on good leadership!
(There is now plenty of compelling good reliable evidence, that today we are again at that point were the need to have good leadership is required to help us all take the required actions that can help us all to prevent the most brutal effects of Global Climate Heating, and get use all ready for peak-oil, you and your families very survival is at stack!
I hope and feel that the majority of Canadian people just want to try and get along with each other. And to work on trying to make this Country a better place, a place for all of our families to grow up in. I’m including ‘all’ the people in ‘all’ the Provinces of this Great land Canada.
I’ve been paying attention to you and your blog.
And to what PMSH and his gang are up to.
And I’ve given much more attention since the PMSH non-clean air ‘plan’ came out.
And PMSH ejected you for speaking up for ‘everyone’s’ best long and short-term interests.
I do not like at all, what I’ve been seen from the PMSH gang!!!
PMSH has a small self-serving agenda as fare as I can tell.
It’s not at all helping everyone in Canada toward getting to our own best long-term interests. Quit the opposite in fact.
I’m not at all sure that PMSH is even in fact working for the people of Canada?
Seem like PMSH is more interested in working of this buddy Bush and the big corporate
Interest, instead of the best interest of the human beings of the Country of Canada!
The planers and decision makers of, PMSH &gang, can’t be very well informed as fare as I see. Or there just short sighted, a selfish, lying, uninformed bunch of sheep without a real clue about the responsibility they now have, to get their job done, for the long term good of us all. Not just the short-term interests of there corporate friends in Washington like PMSH buddy Bush!
I for one, have a strong feeling that you Mr. Garth TurnerMP, are basically an honest and forthright person ‘in general’, (besides the stereo type bad image that some politicians have gotten themselves.)
You seem too have a much Love of your Country and are trying to keep it/make it a better place for us all to live in, including throws that strive to break up this good evolving thing, Canada. With its wonderful mix of basically good people trying to get along and help make this Country the best it can be for there families and everyone else here. It’s not a perfect place, but its hopefully getting closer.
I assume you ran to be an MP to ‘try’ and help make Canada a better place for us all to live in, as you are able
As one of the humanly flawed persons that living and work here in Halton, I can understand your statement, and feelings/passion about wanting to keep Canada together, for everyone.
Thanks for this blog forum.
Thanks for telling it as you see it.
Thanks for; ‘That was not my intention. Nor do I have anything but respect for my fellow citizens in Quebec and Alberta.’
Thanks for trying your best, as you are able, and being human, like us all!
Be careful to not fall into the trap that PMSH shortsighted neo-conns would love for you to keep doing.
You know there plan, stir your pot, push your buttons, until you spout sometime for them to try and spin and throw bad at you, regardless of what could happen to all the good people of Canada in the future. And we know the spin will come from them regardless.
I ask, who is ‘insane’? Who are the ones ‘screwing us all’? Sound a lot like PMSH, he would now!
Even the Corporate run mass media runs with the kind of stuff that get communicated less than perfectly.
And often they add their own spin just to juice it up a bit more.
I wonder if some of them are still living inside Plato’s cave?
The people that are only after power, for power sake, have learned that we imperfect human beings can be easily manipulated, and especially if there is lots of feeling and emotional attachment to whatever topic is involved, like ones own country, or cause.
The separatist and foreign powers know this and take every opportunity to try and get more people on there side. They have a different goal/agenda that conflict with most Canadians best interests.
I hope and feel, the majority of people have goals that will actually help make Canada the best place we all can live in together.
Lets all try and work together to improve what we can so we all can enjoy our brief time here on this earth and in this great land, Canada, and not screw it up to baddy, as PMSH is trying to do.
It’s to bad some will spin word to try to divide, to work there on ’small’ personal agendas.
(If PMSH was acting in the best interest of the all the people of Canada that would be great. But PMSH is NOT!!!)
Not to worry, not that you are, I as a person from Halton, that votes! Mr. Dion and yourself and are still at the top of my list to get my vote next time, hopefully in the fall, as soon as possible!
I still want to see all the Leaders Party Platforms/plans for us all, ‘when’ this PMSH & gang Government falls. And I want to see the Leaders debates, with all the ‘main’ party Leaders in Canada, before I vote, ABC for sure!
I’ve been paying attention!
So fare Mr. Dion seen to be the best choice of the bunch for PM, to help us all try and keep this a great place to live in, for everyone. We are facing a couple of BIG, BIG life altering challenges that need immediate attention or else…
You know the ones I keep going on about; Global-Climate-Heating! & Peak-Oil!
Hopefully all your, unedited/un-spun/in-context, comments will be understood by most Canadians that take the time to read them themselves. And not much more will come of them.
Yes the spinners will keep trying to twist word to serve their own small personal agendas.
Hopefully, tomorrow the PRESS will find the next thing to jump onto. Hopefully get to the really important stuff/information that we the people all need to really now about.
Why’ll there still time for us all to act in everyone’s best long-term interests,
Including the MEDIA peoples and their FAMILY.
And there’s so much stuff that PMSH doesn’t what the people told about!
People working in the mass MEDIA are a bright bunch and have FAMILIES. YOU care about what the future will bring for YOUR FAMILY. And if they will be able to survive the really tar able troubles coming all our way soon!
You know this line, ‘We can do it, and you can help!’ (or something like it?)
YOU MEDIA people can help to get the good information out to the people/masses.
So we can really get t he job done, for YOU and YOUR FAMILY!.
So we can all really take the action that are needed, in time, to stop the coming Global disaster from happening
Maybe YOU the MEDIA people can actually help by simple filtering out the B.S/misinformation about Global Heating & Peak-Oil, that is only adding to the publics confusion and the inaction to demand action to help us all get the job done. In time to stop the BRUTAL troubles that we all are quickly approaching!
It’s in YOUR OWN and YOUR FAMILIES best interests!
If you the MEDIA that have been paying attention, YOU know it is coming soon!
So what are YOU as MEDIA going to do to help???
At lease this blog has gotten some more free exposure. Hopefully more people in our great country will visit it more, and get involved as they are able to help make/keep this a better/great place for us all to live in!
Including PMSH own kids!
No one said life is easy, and when you have more than one person involved it always involves some politics in this imperfect world with us imperfect humans.
Except for a few perfect people, but they are just deluding themselves and are not necessarily sane or entirely a wear of this reality were all
Some simple are not informed. Or ‘believe in myths, avoiding the discomfort of thought’.
It sound like a nice way to avoid some stress and seeing that action is required now for your own selfish interests. We all need to work together to keep our only planet from becoming to overheated and changed that we cannot even survive.
But what do I know. I’m just one of the imperfect people. Hoping to help make the world a better place to live in for everyone now and in the future, as I am able, with the information and resources at my disposal.
What are you going to do to find out, and help yourself!
We are all in this together, like it or not.
If ever we needed to work together for the common long-term good, it is now!
What are you waiting for to start to take action for your own and your family’s best interest!
Just my two cents.
Garth, keep on telling it the way it is – as if there were any doubt!
For those iterested in the political operations of the CPC, the Citizen has a two-page feature about “Harper’s backroom general”, Garth’s evil twin, Dough Finley, at http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/observer/story.html?id=d9c2d075-fe60-4a23-8559-d6527724ae95
If that kind of politics appeals to you, go for it.
KH,
would you happen to be one of those members of the CF who have declared the Harper Government a protected species to ensure the continuation of the cargo cult?
Pro Patria
Turner tu es un imbécile que ,bien sur le ROC t`admire.C`é pas fort.Pôvre con ,voilà exactement la raison pourquoi j`ai voté OUI aux deux référendums ,et pourquoi je voterai OUI au prochain référendum sans même savoir la question, CAR TU ME DONNE LA RÉPONSE.
Pôvre imbécile de trou cul,j`ai honte de faire parti du même pays que TOI et ta gang dun ROC.Tu es genre TALIBAN du canada.
UK Housing Bust Spells Trouble for Pound
http://www.moneyandmarkets.com/Issues.aspx?NewsletterEntryId=1931
PANDORA’S BOX OPENING!
MAJOR NEW CRACKS APPEARING IN US ECONOMY!
http://images.moneyandmarkets.com/1001/86450.html
I understand that you want to protect the image your country you have in your mind but, it must not be done by lies or disrespectful words. Our seperatist movement (and it members) has been one of the most peaceful and respectful of democracy in the world. Therefor, Canadians ans especialy its politicians sould be respectful towards them.
I guess your supposed background in strategic communications and crisis management will come in handy dealing with this spectacular cock-up you’ve created. I knew you should never have been invited into the party.
I would demand your resignation as Dion’s communications advisor, but it seems you’ve already been fired.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/climatechange/
By Greg W., Oakville on 07.04.08 10:09 pm
Great links, Greg. I particularly like the one above. Let’s hope the “deniers” on this blog have the intelligence to at least check out your links and keep an open mind. They know who they are
But I won’t hold my breath (although sometimes I have to when I go outside in the morning and smell the air pollution. “I hate the smell of air pollution in the morning!” (with apologies to Francis Ford Cappola)
Stupid square head
Oh my, seems the French Prime Minister has Foot in Mouth disease even more than Garth is alleged to have. LMAO!
A French farce mars Quebec fête
He insists he didn’t come to Canada to “create a new diplomatic incident.” But that’s just what French Prime Minister François Fillon managed to do, with his obnoxious performance at Quebec City’s 400th anniversary celebrations this week.
Repeatedly, Fillon referred to Quebec as “un pays,” which can be understood as “a country,” in his public remarks. That was a slight to the vast majority of Canadians, including the majority of Quebecers who voted against separation in two referenda.
And in his formal speech at Thursday’s ceremonies marking Quebec’s foundation, Fillon felt moved to pay homage to Gen. Charles de Gaulle’s outrageous pro-separatist spectacle during Expo 67, where the then French president cried, Vive le Québec libre. De Gaulle was promptly given the bum’s rush out of the country. And Canada-France relations plunged into a deep freeze for close to a decade.
Yet in Fillon’s mind, de Gaulle was “a great voice, an historic voice” who summoned “the French fact” out of hibernation, at least in the minds of his fellow countrymen. Canadians, of course, had already been shaken awake by separatist bombs.
It is tempting to dismiss Fillon as a clown. Certainly, his performance was farcical, unworthy of a foreign dignitary. But it was also deliberately provocative.
Now, note the difference (if you are intelligent enough?) Liberal MP under fire for ‘separatist losers’ blog post
Liberal MP Garth Turner has come under fire for blasting Quebec sovereigntists on his blog as “balkanizing separatist losers.”
Mr. Turner, who represents the Toronto-area riding of Halton, wrote a blog on Thursday praising Liberal Leader Stéphane Dion’s plan to defend his environmental policies against Tory attacks.
“You might not agree with everything the man says, but you have to admire this about him,” Mr. Turner wrote. “He stood up once to the self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing separatist losers in Quebec.
“I guess he can do it again in Alberta.”
Which is accurate, truthful,and needed to be said.
Garth spoke regarding what Dion had had to contend with from the Separatists, but the French Prime Minister insulted both Quebecers and the rest of Canada.
Got it? Good. Glad to have helped you.
Now, onto other matters such as fools living Life in the Fast Lane up here in the Muskoka.
Three dead in Muskoka tragedy
a guardrail that had been peeled back 22 metres, twisted and bent like a paperclip. Behind her was a pine tree split in half, and in the water below, an Audi.
Was speed possibly a factor? Oh yeah!!! That road is not a racetrack, but Hey, how can you tell some Citiot Prep Schools knowitalls that? Oops, no need to now.
And for a little summer activist activity how about we all BOYCOTT the Beer Store?
The real reason your beer costs more than it should
Imagine a store where most of the products are kept in the back.
You order from the cashier. The products can’t be sold below a legislated minimum price. And the overwhelming majority are made by one of three large companies, which also own the store.
In Ontario, that is how $2.5 billion worth of beer is sold each year.
There’s my Saturday morning comment. Have a nice day!
It is pretty unbecoming, Garth, to simplistically characterize any region or people. Not too different from Harper’s “culture of defeat” remarks about the maritimes.
Since when are separatists “a region or people”? — Garth
mange delamerde red neck
Vous voyez pourquoi je ne peux pas voter liberal aux prochaines élections!!! Merci Monsieur pour votre franc parler…. pas pour rien que vous étiez conservateur!!!!Vous agissez comme vos ancetres, commes les loyalistes qui ont peuplé l’ONTARIO. Reveillez vous tres cher Monsieur! C’est avec des jugements de valeur comme vous les faites que les séparatistes quebecois prennent de la force. Mais avec une Ontario qui tombe en ruine avec vos fabriquants de voitures et de pieces qui ferment… peut-etre que le canada se brisera par lui-même, non pas a cause du Quebec, mais a cause del’Ouest! Maintenant learn french if you want to know wath i said!!!
Québec est une société progressiste. Ils peuvent avoir plus de bouteilles de bière sur le mur, parce que la bière est moins coûteux.
Triste mais sage! Er, I mean Sadder Budweiser!
http://www.thestar.com/Business/article/454722
Part II: Cornering the beer market (July 5)
Video: Bad Brew series
Part I: The real reason your beer costs more than it should (July 5) Imagine a store where most of the products are kept in the back.Quebec’s corner-store beer sales translate into better deals than those in Ontario.
Quelle est l’adresse du Québec Département de l’immigration?
Hope one day, Quebec will separate, then no more problem with those frenchies. I guess you, M. Turner you’re a soldier of a kind of God…Baptist or something precher like that!
Are you paid (deputy) to do this crap?
Garth, I can’t believe you actually got Jen Marie Le Dumont to criticize you. That guy went off like a wet firecracker, even after sparking the bonfire of racism that the Bouchard-Taylor commission turned out to be. Les Québécois de souche, or les purs laines, are among the most racist and intolerant people out there. Still crying for a country as if they are horribly oppressed. They want a divorce but they still want to share the same bed.
Sir,
Not only your post fuels separatism, but all the people who support you also strengthen separatism. If you shut up and let separatists dream about their cause and talk about it they will do nothing because basicly we are a bunch of dreamers. That is what smart federal politicians understood, and obviously you are not one of them. Thanks for helping the cause.
Instead of insulting separatists from Quebec and other parts of the country, you should work to try to understand what are the failures of the current canadian system, and offer solution to improve it. Cursing against separatists will only put oil on fire. Ask why we have a stronger national sentiment toward Quebec instead of Canada. Do you feel more a citizen of the British Empire or Canada? For us it’s more or less the same…
I think you are just a racist and an ignorant moron..and the peoples,that elected you are pretty much the same..
VIVE LE QUEBEC LIBRE
“Harper, Van Loan, Pierre, Josie, et al rise in the House every day and bemoan the powerlessness of the Bloc–they castigate the Bloc for trying to break up the country–they say the separatists are weak and lost.”
Judy,
The Cons argument is that the Bloc cannot achieve that which they can, autonomy for Quebec with an increase of powers to the Quebec City governmen (and for that matter all provincial governments) through limiting those of the Government of Canada :
“. . . Stephen Harper today presented Reform’s New Confederation proposals, a package of 20 measures to modernize and .decentralize Canada.
Reforms proposals would retain key federal powers to maintain a common economic space, eliminate internal trade barriers, create and coordinate important areas of economic regulations and represent Canada effectively in international trader negotiations, defence and foreign affairs.
Canadians told us they want Canada to be a balanced and equal federation in which Ottawa plays a cooperative rather than domineering role” added Harper. This is what we propose. There will be no special status, formally or informally, for Quebec or any other province.
Reforms New Confederation proposals include:
Natural Resources
Guarantee exclusive provincial control,
Manpower Training
Guarantee exclusive provincial control.
Social Services
Change the role of the federal government to foster cooperative Interprovincial agreements
rather than imposing unilateral standards by withholding transfer payments.
Language
Replace the Official Languages Act with a new law, the Regional Bilingualism Act, that would
recognize the demographic and linguistic realities of Canada and the practices of provincia1
authorities.
Culture
Make provincial governments the primary providers and guardians of cultural services and
primary regulators of cultural industries.
Municipal Affairs
Strengthen the role of municipal governments in the delivery of essential services.
Housing
Guaranteed exclusive provincial control.
Tourism
Guarantee exclusive provincial control.
Sports and Recreation
Guaranteed exclusive provincial control,
Spending Power
Forbid new Federal spending programs in provincial jurisdictions.
Transfers to the Provinces
Replace federal cash block grants with tax point grants.
Charter Challenges
End the Court Challenges program and tax-funded court challenges of provincial legislation.
Disallowance, Reserve and Declaratory Powers
Remain dormant under a Reform government.
REFORM OF INSTITUTIONS
House of Cornmons .
Permit greater freedom for individual MPs; wider use of referenda, citizens initiatives
and recall.
Senate of Canada
All future appointments to the Senate would be made by means of elections on the model of the
1989 Alberta Senate selection process,
Supreme Court and Judiciary
Future appointments to the Supreme Court of Canada would be made by the provincial
legislatures; all appointments reviewed by elected Senate.
Bank of Canada
Future board appointments made by provincial Legislatures. Ottawa would continue to select.
the Governor of the Bank.
Lieutenant Governors
Appointed by provincial legislatures.
Tax, Debt and Expenditure Limitation
Unilaterally amend the Constitution to forbid deficit spending or rapid spending increases,
except when authorized by a national referendum.
Constitutional Referendums
Introduce a motion in the House of Commons that all future constitutional amendments must
be approved by majorities in all regions of Canada through a referendum.
For further information please contact: Larry Welsh (613) 492-2815
Line Maheux (613) 943-0030 “
By Herb on 07.05.08 8:09 am, Morning Herb, I would have to say far from it, they annoy me as much as any of the other parties, but that just leaves me to choice come election time the best of the worst. LOL. What does piss me off is the hyporcrits in this room who cannot acknowledge that Garth screwed up and call him on it.
COMMENT IN ENGLISH AS MOST OF YOU GUYS ALREADY FORGOT THE TINY FRENCH LESSONS YOU HAD IN SCHOOL, APART FROM VOULEZ-VOUS COUCHER AVEC MOI?
Well, you have to understand that we are not in Huxley’s Brave New World! Many of us would not accept the concept of being governed by a queen. Our ancestors in France made a revolution beleiving rightly we should get rid of such stupid ruling forever. Needless to say, monarchy is the ultimate form of state welfare addiction for a true republican as myself. Moreover, we also got rid of the catholic church 40 years ago for good reasons.
So, what now? Well, how would you be pleased in a wedding where the contract was imposed to you by force. May I remind you we have NOT ratified the constitution as it is. Adding to the insult is the fact we have to endure a a camera addicted General Governor on a daily basis on TV networks, largely paid by our taxes, whom REALLY thinks she was elected or some kind of God gift.
Egocentrics? Isn’t it the case for the part of the country which IMPOSED its constitution and rules by décret.
Finaly, many of us know the referendum was stolen to us by a later proven flow of illicit electoral spendings by the federal government.
If you think Al Gore felt cheated by Bush while ripped of Florida, you can easily imagine that for many of us this was a Coup d’état.
So, perhaps you could wake-up tomorrow morning and have this thought : mmmm, I forgot WE imposed the Constitution on THEM.
Vive le Québec! Vive la République! À bas la royauté!
I knew one day this blog would be your undoing and now it is just a matter of time before you are cast aside by the Professor. I think the conservatives have to be really commended for their good judgement when they booted your sorry ass out the party. I believe you have brought politicians to a new low although in your case you are probably loving the attention you are getting in both official languages. all
Like I said on my blog, it’s not a question of agreeing or not with seperatists. It’s a question of respect. Disagree? Fine. That doesn’t make seperatists what you say and it doesn’t allow you to say such things.
Also, like I said in my own post, it’s amazing how this blog gives you a brand new set of balls. It’s easy to throw insults when you’re hidden behind a screen isn’t it?
And how are yours? — Garth
Folks! Time is running short. The next time we commonly look up from our navel, we may not see the world the same way it was when we started this spitting contest. You’re darn right Canada has a problem and it’s us, all of us. What happens when you’re in bed on a cold winter night and the person next to you pulls all the covers to themselves? You either start pulling too or you freeze, right? In my opinion, the world is our bed and if we don’t pull together, we will all be freezing in just a few years. Tell me if speaking French or English in Canada will matter when you have to wear a gas mask because you can’t breathe the air outside. Tell me if being in one or the other political party will feed your family when crops fail year after year. Remind how to protect myself and those around me from those who see me as an infidel whose life is worth less than a sack of beans. In the future, a very near future, all this bickering will be the shovel that dug our graves. People, wake up! Time is running short and we have to pull together if we want to see a few more sunrises in Newfoundland and a few more sunsets in British Colombia. An opinion is like bad breath: we all have it from time to time but it doesn’t mean you have to share it with others all the time. There are, in MY opinion, three major problems facing us: global economy, global environment and global safety. If we can’t drop out of the pissing contest right now and work together on the above problems, you better learn some survival skills and teach them to your kids. The human race is at a fork in the road of history. Look back, look ahead, look around.
Here is a late breaking piece about the problems associated with biofuels. Time for governments to get off this approach and embrace geothermal, wind and solar to address our power needs.
Grim findings in World Bank’s biofuel report
A secret World Bank report reveals what many analysts had already assumed — that the increased use of biofuels has had a direct, powerful impact on the cost of living.
CTV.ca News Staff
The internal report was obtained by the U.K.’s Guardian newspaper and the results were published on Friday.
The study — the most detailed of its kind so far — shows a much more dramatic rise in food prices than had been previously estimated. The report finds that food prices have risen 75 per cent, according to the paper.
The study is a direct contradiction to claims by the U.S. that biofuels — those made from plant products — have only caused prices to rise by three per cent or less.
With many Western nations turning to biofuels to reduce their dependence on petroleum products, as well as cut down on greenhouse gas emissions, the report will come as a stunning rebuke.
The report, written by respected World Bank economist Don Mitchell, has not been published.
It argues that the U.S. position that rising food prices stem from economic growth in countries like China and India, simply isn’t true.
And successive droughts in Australia haven’t had a major impact either.
Instead, the report finds that the U.S. and EU’s demand for biofuels has taken a significant bite out if the food supply, causing prices to rise.
In the U.K. since April, all gasoline and diesel has had to have a 2.5 per cent biofuel content.
The EU is considering making that a 10 per cent requirement by 2020.
“Without the increase in biofuels, global wheat and maize stocks would not have declined appreciably and price increases due to other factors would have been moderate,” the report states.
The report finds these changes between 2002 and February 2008:
Food basket prices rose 140 per cent.
Rises in costs of energy and fertilizer caused a 15 per cent rise in food costs.
Bio fuels caused a 75 per cent jump in food prices.
According to World Bank estimates, 100 million people worldwide have slipped below the poverty line as the result of skyrocketing food prices.
The paper suggests the damning report has been kept in-house in order to avoid embarrassing U.S. President George Bush at a time when the leaders of the Group of Eight industrialized nations prepare to meet in Japan next week.
Much of their talks will focus on high fuel and food prices.
As a Quebec sovereignist, I’d like to respond to your peculiar choice of adjectives.
self-aggrandizing: the separation of Quebec will do nothing to aggrandize me personally. I will still be a mere speck among millions.
hostile: I have no hostility towards Canada. I generally like the people, enjoy some of the literature, the music, and look forward to my trip to Toronto later this month. But it feels as foreign as a trip to the USA.
me-first: Maybe this one is true. As part of a francophone minority of 25%, it certainly makes more sense to be “me-first” than “them-first.” Not too keen on volunteering to be cannon fodder in Kandahar, a situation that could have been avoided in an independent Quebec.
greedy: Most separatists are aware Quebec gets more from the federal government than it gives. How are we greedy when we’d be losing out on all the taxes from the dirty oil money from the West?
macho: Macho? Have you ever been to Quebec? Machismo is hardly a fitting attribute. The people here are self-effacing, practically emasculated, and separatism is most often a defensive shrinking away from a central government trying to shove its maple leaf flag down our collective thraot.
selfish: Selfishness is what has prevented separation. Many people here like receiving all the dirty oil money from the West. We don’t want more for ourselves, we just want to have a state that is coherent with our nation.
balkanizing: that’s just a synonym for “separatist” with negative connotations. The “balkanization” of former Soviet states under heavy-handed Moscow rule has led to long-term prosperity for most of these states.
Mon très cher Garth
Je préfère être un « perdant » ou un « prétentieux, hostile et égocentrique, macho, égoïste et balkanisant » qu’être un minable politicien criminel Libéral et un complice de torture, comme le sont tous les libéraux et tous les conservateurs Canadiens.
Si tu veux coimprendre de quoi jhe parle, mon estie de crosseur de politicien, bouge toi le cul christ de sale et va voir : http://jeangodbout.com et tu constateras que tu n’es qu’un minable complice de fraudes et de torture. Va te faire enculer minable tyran corrompu et oppresseur sans respect de la vie et de l’être humain.
Garth, Please repect all Canadians and shut up. We do not need your racist, bigoted slurs in the media. I hope your constituents do the right thing and send you packing.
How is opposing separatists, “racist” and “bigoted”? — Garth
COMMENT IN ENGLISH AS MOST OF YOU GUYS ALREADY FORGOT THE TINY FRENCH LESSONS YOU HAD IN SCHOOL, APART FROM VOULEZ-VOUS COUCHER AVEC MOI
By Austerlitz on 07.05.08 9:32 am
That’s the most hurtful comment I’ve ever been subjected to. I was told, when I lived in Quebec, while I was in the military, “You are like a son and a brother to us.”
Man, you talk about being PISSED OFF … I was 19 years old at the time … and they were ALL very beautiful women, which became the basis for my chimney sweep business.
Do we get free French fries with our poutine? De Gaulle would have insisted.
If your answer is still “non,” get yourself a huge barrel of grey POOP-ON!
Vous n’êtes qu’un batârd…tout comme votre parti corrompu!!!!!
By Brian Wilson on 07.05.08 9:33
Like all your comments you’re probably claiming entitlement to recognition while NOT a contributor.
There is a reason the Clarity Act was sponsored by Senator Thelma Chalifoux Canada’s first aboriginal women in the Senate of Canada and it was because in the last referendum more than 90% of Quebec aboriginals voted to stay in Canada and since more than 90% of Quebec land is controlled and owned by the autonomous aboriginal people except for a small part of the St. Lawrence seaway Voila! -no ones going anywhere and thanks to the Clarity Act they have to ask a clear question as well.
All you coffee house separatists’ better give your head a shake if you think insults on this blog will lead to the break up of our country because in your Quebec nation it is the aboriginal people who control the agenda not you.
“Our ancestors in France made a revolution beleiving rightly we should get rid of such stupid ruling forever.”
Such nonsense!
The French Revolution occurred a generation after Canada was lost to France.
Be accurate in your diatribes, sil vous plait.
À bas la royauté!
By Austerlitz on 07.05.08 9:32 am
le roi Louis le quinzième, le seizième et Napoleon de Napanee et tous les autres?
AS an ass hole,we can`t have any better than turner.
God safe turner,that is marvellous for Québec separatis.
To my own point of view (please, be kind regarding my english skill), anybody who claims being lucid should have understood much more than “the desire of Québécois to break apart our Canada”… Such a weakness does not deserve congrats…
To my own point of view so, instead of breaking a strong country apart to become a lonely county surrounded by a broken country, it seems necessary to break apart our current constitution which is responsible of our canadian pain. Our actual Federation based on that simplifiued workflow show it well :
Fed. Gov. each province
/\ \ /
/ \ compared \ /
/ \ to \ /
/ \ \/
each province Fed. Union
So if every single province, instead of having to behave the way a couple of powerfull men desires it and decides it for the whole country, if instead, every province had the sole power of an established State, and then begins to share compatible interests (one by one) with each other province, on a model like the European Union one, there wouldn’t have such nightmares between canadians.
Moreover, once the basics of the shared ideas are well established, like duties, postal services, a provincial police force union, country-wide driver’s license and such, as you keep the Canadian-wide power regading international tasks, you can then begin to enjoy the real chance to set up your province the way the people living in wants it to be!
Way too often, people get frustrated when someone expresses himself on a sbject just because the one expressing can’t find the right terms to explain his discompfort which results in the one listening to him not understanding a plot of what is this all about, or worst, it will make him angry about it when it shouldn’t, real not!
For me, the Canada is an heaven to live in, but with some differents cultures sharing though the same humanism, the same peacefull mind and the same mutual respect of his citizens. When people on each side will accept to open their mind and try to understand what is meant when others talk instead of blaming them to do so, maybe we’ll begin to accept and appreciate each others…
this blog sicks, can’t use more than one white space in a row, can’t post 2 messages in row, can’t do nothing getting clearly understood… is this has been nuilt like Mr Garth?
And when you’re confessing your sins tomorrow, don’t forget to ask for the same penance as Emperor Brian of Muldoon.
“Go forward with a penitent heart, my son, to receive 3 envelopes stuffed with cash from a man with a strong German accent.”
Why that’s [almost/but not quite] like governance by the controlling Maurice Duplessis, who, as I understand it, is still revered by most Quebecers.
KLH,
good. I would agree that Garth screwed up – if what he said were neither true nor valid. It being “inconvenient” or “incorrect” in view of our national political landscape is something else.
Too bad Finley’s troops will have a field day with this.
Meet The Most Powerful Man In Canada
For those of you who have read the Thursday, July 4, Globe and Mail, Page B2, an article written by Konrad Yakabuski introduces us to Paul Desmarais Sr. who heads up a POWERful CORPoration based in Quebec. He is also a partner in controlling a large European Business Empire including a Media Group.
He has a direct pipeline into the President of France, who has just assumed the leadership of the European Union for the next six months. President Sarkozy apparently has some big goals that he wishes to pursue in this EU role.
In the summer of 2005 or 2006, Sarkozy was invited to visit the Desmarais estate in Quebec where they live in a French-style castle.
Supposedly, it is the Desmarais Family that controls the Canadian Political System on behalf of the Bilderberg Group. Therefore, based on the limited information that I have access to, I hereby nominate Paul Desmarais Sr. as the most powerful man in Canada.
BTW, this is the man who may be responsible for turning the normally mild-mannered Stephen Harper into an anal-retentive control freak.
The fact that a public article like this would be allowed to be published at this time makes me wonder if something Big is about to happen.
The fact that a person born in humble circumstances can attain such a powerful position shows the value of having a very friendly banker. However, there is a price to pay for having a very friendly banker. Somewhere along the way you will be asked by someone in The Powers That Be to do a favour for someone. If you do that favour your funding continues. If you refuse to do that favour then your funding will dry up. This continues until you finally reach a high position in the hierarchy of Corporate Elites and/or Plutocrats that comprise the Synarchist Movement.
Some other high powered persons who fit this pattern are as follows: George Soros, Sam Walton, Warren Buffet, Bill Gates, Peter Munk, Frank Stronach, and Ron Southern. (Soros and Munk are supposedly front men for the Rothschild Family)
The International Banking Cartel led by the Rothschild Family controls the global monetary system which uses a fractional fiat currency system that is not backed by any assets of value. The Rothschilds are also involved in the Gold Cartel as is Barrack Gold. This Cartel uses a variety of methods in an attempt to suppress the price of Gold Bullion.
The Powers That Be know how to reward their new friends and how to punish those who break the rules.
As an example of punishment, I offer the name of Conrad Black. Black was a regular at Bilderberg meetings and was supposedly involved in inviting new Canadian participants to Bilderberg Group meetings. However, I read on a Canadian blog site a few years ago that Conrad Black wrote an autobiography in which he apparently included some details on how the Bilderberg Group operated. That was a no no!!
Soon after that his legal problems began. Now Conrad Black has lost his power, his wealth, his stature, and his freedom. According to a recent news item, he may also lose his Order of Canada.
This is another piece of the Big Picture.
Cheers.
You are one more reason to quiet Canada for us…We are so diferents on many things ! Chaque sondage d’opinion de société montre les différences immenses entre nos 2 nations…que ce soit sur l’avortement, la guerre, le mariage gay, le femmes etc. We will be more friends after the separation..but until this day…
Garth, I think you should continue to speak your mind. Once when I commented on this blog that you allow plenty of rude, ignorant and totally ridiculous people to state their piece, you said “this site like Canada is a free speech zone.” So feel free my friend to state your piece. With parliament down for the summer we need some controversy.
Maybe I missed a sesitivity class but last time I checked Quebecer and Albertan were not races.
Racist,what crap! The last time I checked, living in Quebec did not make one a distinct race.The description was ignorant and juvenile,but definetly not racist. Also,it is not Garth’s comments that would lead to rise in seperatist feelings,but the ‘green tax’ that the nutty professor and the problem child are trying to push on the country.
wow, this whole leaving the conservatives in order to speak your mind is really working out for you, isn’t it?!
“Moan all you want about money, or lament those who don’t share your culture or language. But don’t expect me to roll.”
your smug self-righteousness is horribly transparent, garth.
do you know that many conservative officials refer to you as “the gift that keeps on giving”?
this is why.
You may be right. I might be greedy, I might be selfish, I might be thinking of my own interests before those of this country of yours… Since Quebec never signed up Canada’s Constitution, how can people from our province can consider themselves a part of your country? As Mr. Ignasief suggested, maybe a constitutional debate is needed. Maybe the time has come that all the 10 provinces sit together(not leaving Quebec delegates on the other side of the bridge while you go get Manitoba’s permiere at Winnipeg) Maybe Canada will get a chance to turn the page for good. Only good will from federalism supporters can bring a end to the soverinism even in the most nationalists places of Canada. Up to you, Mr. Turner, to bring the question and set the matters for good… it never gives anything to shovel right in front of you. You’ll still have to shovel it sooner or later
Dear Garth,
You are an idiot.
Thanks and have a nice day!
One thing that I find really nice about the French comments is I can skip right past them and not blink an eye. LOL
Some may even be complimentary to Garth, but who knows?
I read that French Prime Minister Francois Fillon made reference to the ‘country’ of Quebec this week while visiting Quebec City. Allow me to clarify the situation.
Here is an addition to my article on how Canada could be merged into the NAU using the piece-meal method.
In regards to Canada merging with the United States, there has always been a question mark about the status of Quebec. Now that the EU is already negotiating with the North American government officials on rules and regulations, there is another option to consider. Quebec could join France and become part of the EU. Quebec would then be in a position to function as the liaison and transfer point between the EU and the NAU. This would make Quebec much more powerful than now. A member of the Desmarais Family could also sit on the NAU ruling council. They currently have a family member involved in the SPP negotiations.
It takes time and effort to Become Aware.
Cheers.
For me, the Canada is an heaven to live in, but with some differents cultures sharing though the same humanism, the same peacefull mind and the same mutual respect of his citizens. When people on each side will accept to open their mind and try to understand what is meant when others talk instead of blaming them to do so, maybe we’ll begin to accept and appreciate each others…
By Benoit Blais on 07.05.08 10:20 am
Je pense exactement la même chose à propos de Québec et les Québécois. Mon seul souhait est que je pouvais parler en français, ainsi que vous parlez anglais, sans l’aide de Google traduction. Merci beaucoup!
Hi Lana on 07.05.08 8:23 am,
Glad you liked the posts.
Just to be clear, It wasn’t a link posted by me, but a link re-posting that brain on did yesterday.
I thought a re-posting would allow more people a change to find out some of the facts for them selves!
What does piss me off is the hyporcrits in this room who cannot acknowledge that Garth screwed up and call him on it.
By KH on 07.05.08 9:32 am
Just because you don’t agree with someone’s opinion, does not make that person a hypocrite…or a hyporcrits for that matter. People are entitled to their opinion. Critical thinkers know what Garth’s words meant.
I would say your statement is accurate. That’s probably why Quebecers and Albertans are upset. As for Harry S, Leasa, Catherine, Sheila and the other trolls, I could care less about what they think … They’re DUE for a HARSH comeuppance.
Why not oblige us commonfolk with a sampling of the most favourably profane submission verbatim? I’m sure it would reinforce our dedication to OUR CAUSE.
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 07.05.08 5:20 am
And there you have it folks. In Stephane Dion and the Liberals world, every single one of their opponents would be rounded up and get their just rewards.
This version of the Liberals under Stephane Dion are truly scary.
Front Page of the Calgary Herald today….. “Grit’s blog SLURS Alberta”.
nice.
By wallyj on 07.05.08 10:36 am
By barry on 07.05.08 10:38 am
By J. McBrearty on 07.05.08 10:38 am
Well why the hell aren’t you folks smiling GLEEFULLY? What The Hon. Garth has said will obviously satisfy your needs in both the short and long term. If, on the other hand, you hope to ride forward on that basis, without a well-defined policy plan for THIS COUNTRY OF CANADA, you had better be double-jointed because you CAN KISS IT GOODBYE!
We’ve seen Harper riding across the country touting his supposed fine diddly achievements, talking blue-sky apple pie nonsense. People don’t fall for his H-S Road Apples because they know he’s a phoney … And, they’ve known that from his pre-history.
In a recent article I made the following statement:
“Unfortunately, under the current situation, the system is stacked in favour of the Globalist Elites. Loyal Canadians who believe in a sovereign nation state would have to wage a bloody revolution in order to rid Canada of these Elites. There are very few Canadians who would be willing to do this.”
This appeared to cause trepidation for some people. Back in November 2006, I posted a number of articles that discussed an alternative option that involved setting up an Independent Candidate Movement. Unfortunately, there were no activists reading this forum, so nothing happened.
I am enclosing below one of those articles.
*****
An Introduction to Canadian Politics in 2006
In view of all the positive comments about the Independent Candidate Movement, I have decided to submit some serious discussion about the need to take back control of our political system in Canada from the Elites who have control now. This will not be an easy task to do since the Elites control most, if not all, of the levers of power that we would have to use to get organized and to communicate with each other.
Most of you believe that we live in a free and democratic nation. In reality, most of the governments in the world are controlled directly or indirectly by a large group that I am calling the Synarchist Movement. Some of you call them The Powers That Be.The members of the Synarchist Movement are mostly Corporate Elites and members of the Plutocracy who are not already members of an Illuminati Family.
[Note: Synarchism and Synarchists are synonymous with fascism and fascists. Neo-conservatives and Straussians are synonymous with neo-fascists. Compare the political history of Europe (1921-1945) and the operations of the George W. Bush Government.]
These Synarchists have started up many working groups to implement the various parts of their overall agenda that will eventually lead to a One World Government. Most of these groups operate with some degree of secrecy and are usually effective at what they do. The only group that they show off to the public is the United Nations, and we all know how ineffective the UN really is.
They use the United Nations to give them a veneer of respectability while they pursue the real issue of depopulation. They require a One World Government so that they can better implement their plans to reduce the population down to a range of 500 million to 2 billion loyal worker slaves. Our current population trend is creating too much stress on the environment and natural resources of Planet Earth.
[Note: this is what the Global Warming furor (HOAX) and the Kyoto Protocol (SCAM) is all about - depopulation. Read "Brave New World" by Aldous Huxley and "1984" by George Orwell. These works of "fiction" are now turning into reality. While the stress on Earth is probably true and requires drastic measures, I do not agree with the inhumane methods that they are using to achieve this depopulation. For example, how many of you drink diet soft drinks (Aspartame)???]
The groups that involve us the most are the Bilderberg Group (1954), the Trilateral Commission (1973), the Royal Institute of International Affairs (1920), and the Council on Foreign Relations (1921). In Canada, we have the Canadian Institute of International Affairs (1928), which we never hear about, and Power Corporation of Canada (1925), which we occasionally hear about.
These are the primary groups that control the Political Leaders in Canada, United States, Great Britain, and most European nations. In this post, I am not going to give the names of the Canadians involved. It is more believable if you find these names for yourself by searching the Internet for all of the groups that I have named.
However, I think it is safe to say that PMs Trudeau, Mulroney, Chretien, and Martin were all connected to Power Corp, as is future Liberal Leader, Bob Rae. The newspaper La Presse (Power Corp) came out in support of Stephen Harper. You should be able to connect most of the other dots after you complete your research.
The major item on their agenda that will affect us in the near future is the formation of the North American Union. This means that Canada will surrender its sovereignty and eventually most Canadian residents will lose many of their current rights. The Americans will assume control of our Natural Resources and cheap Mexican Labour will pour into Canada. The Corporate Elites will appoint a Synarchist council to rule over us. The first Chairman of this council might be a Rockefeller or maybe even Bill Clinton.
[Note: we can also expect some type of financial collapse in the near future since they want to implement a Cashless Society whereby everyone is implanted with a microchip in order to buy or sell.]
Under the current circumstances, a Federal Election in the Spring will probably return a minority Liberal Government. An election in the Fall will probably return a majority Liberal Government. Right now, Harper the Puppet is running to lose.
As I see it, there are only two options that we can use to take back control of our Sovereign nation from the Elites.
1: Elect enough Independent MPs (who are not connected to the Elites) in the next Federal Election so that they can form the next Canadian Government.
2: A simultaneous Revolution of the People to physically remove the Elites from power and to terminate as many Elites and their supporters as is necessary in order for ordinary Canadians to rule themselves again.
[Note: the Elites outside of Canada will make an attempt to intervene in the implementation of these two options.]
I have put together a submission entitled: Grassroots Politics 101, the 2007 KISS version. This discusses some ideas on how to get a campaign to elect Independent candidates going.
[COMMENT: I am reviewing this KISS version to see if it is worth posting again.]
*****
Cheers.
Not just people in the oilpatch thing this whole ‘man-made climate change’ thing is crap. The only people who actually believe it are the ones who have not even spent one hour actually researching it. Or the ideologues. Or the scam artists.
By Catherine on 07.05.08 11:01 am
The greatest reward I could ever receive is to have you REPEAT what I’ve said, while implying YOUR MEANING to it.
Nothing has changed … and I’ll prove it to all who attend the all-candidates’ meetings in as many ridings as I can.
Beyond that, be careful on your 3-speed unicycle.
Do you think Tibetans wanting independance from China are selfish losers also?
By Reid on 07.04.08 11:19 pm
….is this a stupid statement or what…there’s an issue of human rights involved in this situation – duh!
A culture of defeat, build a firewall around Alberta, small man of confederation. Gee seems other people are allowed to say whatever they want and are never called to task.
Garth, the fact that so many people from Quebec and Alberta felt compelled to comment on your blog indicates how well read it is. As the only blog from a sitting MP it is a very important window into the halls of power for many people interested in national politics. Sure you get into trouble once in a while for things you say but, “if you want to make omelettes, you have to break eggs.” Keep it up, we need you Garth and obviously so do the people who comment regularly from all points on the political spectrum. You provide a national forum for all the rants and well considered reflections that appear every day.
By tom on 07.05.08 11:09 am
Are you the guy I saw headed over to the Dairy Queen with StockYard Day to order a BIG AL MELT?
By Patrick Bergeron on 07.05.08 9:44 am
Excellent comments. Thank you. I see the number one threat to our future as GLOBALISM! We have seen our jobs, economies, and security be given to foreign powers, which are not even governments, but multinational conglomerates, all so neatly hiden behind legalities of ownership.
The Age of Greed and Materialism is passing. We should help it to its grave with all due haste.
we need to be a nation because our southern neighbor is still seeking to be the One World Empire.
Can we survive separated? NO! No more than any single province, territory, or First Nation could. We are interdependent on each other. No one has been fully self-sufficient for a century. We are all individuals depending on others.
All the Spearatist movements are founded on quicksand and unrealistic thinking, driven by those who are most vocal, and least able to see the Big Picture.
Hopefully, regardless of the separatists, this wonderful nation will remain Strong and Free?
Thank you for helping the separatist cause. Otherwise, let me tell you what the separatists think of English Canadian like you: war loving, push over, American suckers, British loyalists, no culture, red neck… it is about this!
“So, why should I even try to justify my words? My attempt to show the Liberal leader has the stones to face down those who think of themselves first, and the country second – no matter where they hail from – succeeded only in making his task more difficult.”
That’s not true Garth, earlier you said:
“And, just to cap things off, Stephane Dion called and chewed me out.”
Hey Garth,
I just had to respond to this. You wrote, “Since when are separatists ‘a region or people’”? —
Sorry, you Liberals cannot refute such forms of argument because of your inclusion of “sexual orientation” in the charter of rights. This was largely a Liberal cause. Now you have to re-open the charter and include “political persuasion”. This is how such moves can come back to bite you. Great to have seen this self-destruct over the weekend. Better than a football game. The entertainment value of your blog is way up there.
Y a-t-il des séparatistes ici assez honnêtes pour avouer qu’il est prétentieux de croire et d’écrire que les Canadiens anglais n’ont pas de culture?
Y a-t-il des séparatistes ici assez honnêtes pour avouer qu’il est hostile d’écrire que tous les libéraux sont corrompus et que les fédéralistes sont des traîtres?
Y-a-t-il des séparatistes ici qui sont assez honnêtes pour écrire qu’ils lisent régulièrement de tels propos anti-canadiens dans les journaux du Québec?
Allez – ou bien êtes-vous aussi des lâches?
Big f&^*in deal…
Garth, if that’s the worst thing you do, all these people need their heads checked. I wish all these newcomers to the board would fight like this for REALLY important issues…
Get over yourselves!
Court’s ruling may give Iraq war resisters 2nd chance
http://www.torontosun.com/News/Canada/2008/07/05/6072131-sun.html
Finally, some hope for American military personnel who REFUSE TO LIVE OUT the Bush lies!
http://my.pclink.com/~rlovgren/photo1aa.jpg
Paraphrasing Colin Powell;
“Those trailers you see positioned there at that remote location are actually intended as part of Saddam’s plan for chemical warfare.”
Yep, Yep, Yep!
http://my.pclink.com/~rlovgren/photo1aa.jpg
Which would mean, by extension, that the SnakPak papal DUNCIO Kenney is a true war hero.
It amazes me how decent, ordinary people are villified because they come from one region or work in a particular industry.
I am from Alberta and although I don’t work in the oil patch, I benefit from their success. The Receiver General of Canada benefits and therefore so does everyone.
I remember very dark days after the NEP – similar to the dark days the auto industry is facing today. I have real concern for those people, their families and their future.
Garth and others – please don’t lose your humanity in your pursuit of attention and headlines.
Vive le Québec! Vive la République! À bas la royauté!
By Austerlitz on 07.05.08 9:32 am
Thank you for your English post. You’re absolutely correct. Since we had very token French language classes in the 60’s sadly, my French is non-existent. Things are very different now; my niece has been in French emersion school since grade school here in BC.
As to Garth’s original post – I strongly disagree with the harsh and unfortunate language he used.
However, my sentiment is and will always be that I want Quebec to stay within Canada. I am sure we respectfully disagree on that point you so passionately believe in.
The point of Garth’s post was to discuss M. Dion visit to Calgary to discuss the Green Shift.
Would you care to comment further Austerlitz on the Green Shift Plan?
Jean-Francois,
By far the best post in this string. You are absolutely right. I am thankful that by and large Quebec separatists have been peaceful and respectful of democracy. That is why they have a right to exist in our midst. Turner missed this point completely.
I am Canadian. Born and raised in Saskatchewan. I’m appalled any CANADIAN would speak of breaking apart our country. We would be eaten up by our American neighbours for sure. Yes we have differences that IS what makes us so different. Let us worl our problems out and stop bickering!
Garth,
A lot of spew above. I wouldnt worry about it; on a positive note, its good to know that there is still some passion left in this country.
My advice is Garth, shake it off, ride your bike….life will continue.
Daryn
Happy to see that both Quebecois and Albertans agree that most of the the smug tw*ts in Canada still live in the GTA with Garth. The rest of his former constituents are out here happily making money and paying taxes to support his big mouth. Happy 400th Birthday Quebec City! Calgary’s sister Ville! Maybe we can should remind ourselves that real diviseness is caused by self centred cretins like buddy Garth in the centre of the universe.
Tsk, tsk, tsk. Mr. Turner, your boss is advocating action that puts the economic well-being of, not just Canadians, but 1 billion people folks in the world at risk in favor of a welfare scheme aimed at propping up the backward leadership of the other 5.6-billion. He advocates joining a scheme that hobbles us, yet does not cover such nations as China, India, Russia, and Mexico, who get to “pollute” to their hearts’ content while we pay them to do it. To top it all off, the most “harmful” greenhouse gas out there is water vapor! Our arctic ice cap is melting? So is the one of Mars due to solar activity. Now, if you want to address the issue of smog in our cities (the kind we never seem to get in Edmonton), I’m with you, Garth. If you want to be a loser in backing this mad man-make climate change hoax, you are on your own.
Piece of trash!
By tom on 07.05.08 11:09 am
The decision makers in your ‘oil patch” not only believe in a “carbon tax” they are quietly campaigning for one. Maybe the coffee group you sit with don’t want it but that is because you don’t understand business and that your JOB depends on some plan that puts a price on carbon. Ask Harper what his plan is?
Status quo won’t save you or your coffee shop buddied.
Get informed or get lost!
Finally found a reason to become separatist: your stupid look, Garthe Turnère, after Québec becoming independant.
this post is the reason i never post anything here nothing postive is happening here here in ontario we import our energy from foreign countrys how about some ideas on how to get us off the oil and we might save the envionment while were at it
“But there’s no way I, as a federal member of the Canadian House of Commons, am going to lay down before people who openly advocate ripping the country apart. Moan all you want about money, or lament those who don’t share your culture or language. But don’t expect me to roll” LOLOL. Quote from the Rhinestone Cowboy
Garth, I’ve been a participant at your blog for quite some time, but this time I have to congratulate Dion for admonishing you your mispoken renarks.
No-one, including Dion, is expecting you to roll over. You have an extensive vocabulary…why don’t you try using it to frame how you could have said what you did without using such a broad brush to paint everyone in Alberta and Quebec as being separatists …
Your time stinks! Dion is currently engaged in attempting a national policy which in Canada is uncommon because we in this country we enjoy the most decenteralized government in the world. He’s in Alberta where selling that policy is not an easy task and your comments are making his job harder.
As you very well know, the separatist movement in Quebec is becoming less influential. And it’s never been a strong force in Alberta.
Apologize and move on. Reword what you said to being more acceptable. I know you can do it–sit down at your computer and you’ll come up with a way that you retain your dignity and so Albertans and Quebecers.
I champion freedom of speech, but you as an MP very well know there some things you have to word in ways that are acceptable to a wide range of people.
Suck in up Garth and do the right thing!
Canuck
Hey fucker
You don’t have to “justify your words”, which are racist and unjustifiable. You have to ask for repentance and shut up next time.
The fact that Mr. Turner uses such derogratory terminology to describe his fellow countrymen makes me wonder how different he is from what he is accusing ALL Quebecers and Albertans from being.
Mange de la marde hostie de chien sale
I’d rather be a loser from Alberta, than a winner from Ontario… you keep on winning there Garth… and while the wheels fall off your economy, us loser Albertans will just have to make do in our lesser status as Canadians in the eyes of Central Canadian Politicians.
Yup… if this is what being a loser is about, I’m all in.
I can understand a reaction to Garth’s over the top generalization. Many of us in the Maritimes felt the same way about Harper calling us “defeatists.” At least Garth is not our Prime Minister and will likely never be in such a position of power.
Unfortunately, those who have gone “over the top” in their reaction illustrate that there are individuals to whom the comments can apply. I took Garth’s original comments as directed at this particular breed of malcontents (e.g. those who have gone beyond political disagreement to advocate violence and engage in attempts at character assassination).
@ Loraine Lamontagne,
Oui, oui, oui et oui. Et Stéphane Dion est un clown; vous le savez trop bien que la majorité des Québécois (souverainistes ou pas) ne voteront pas pour lui aux prochaines élections, même si Stephen Harper décidait d’aller en guerre avec un autre pays.
Much of their talks will focus on high fuel and food prices.
By TS on 07.05.08 9:46 am
Great post. I am glad someone wants to talk substance over Garth’s inappropriate language describing separatists.
Interesting, as Harper’s entire solution to the environment is ethanol using food crops: Wheat, barley, corn and canola. Actually, what we should be doing is intensive research on butanol not ethanol. Part of the byproduct of butanol is hydrogen.
The other advantage of butanol is it is not corresive so you can pipe it like gasoline. Ethanol, on the other hand, has to be trucked to the distribution centre for “blending”.
Garth tu es un attardé conservateur qui ne voit pas plus loin que l’aspect économqiue d’un problème (comme bien des fédéralistes d’ailleurs). Une démocratie, ca laisse le droit à tout le monde de s’exprimer et ca tombe bien, y’a au moins 40% de Québécois et 30% d’Albertains qui s’expriment pour leur liberté. Va falloir vivre avec ou ben crisser ton camp ailleurs si T,es pas content…en Chine tu serais bien vu.
I find Albertans who call Esterners bastards, Torontonians Morontonians, Dion Stephanie, Maritimers welfare bums, who spell Chrétien Cretin, Liberals fiberals, (need more?) to be self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.
Why don’t you start by learning the difference between LAY DOWN and LIE DOWN, you ignorant Federast? Did you go to school just to eat your lunch?
By Greg W., Oakville on 07.05.08 8:02 am
Have you forgotten? The media works according to the Eagle’s song ‘Dirty Laundry’!!!!
My advice is Garth, shake it off, ride your bike….life will continue.
Daryn
By Daryn on 07.05.08 11:54 am
Garth thinks CO2 is pollution, why would you recommend he ride his bike and create more?
Gord.
Thank you, Garth.
You’re a great politician, a great Canadian, and an asset to the Liberal Party of Canada.
By Bill-Muskoka on 07.05.08 10:48 am
Lol, this is reminding me of George Carlins book When Will Jesus Bring the Porkchops. He said he chose the title, as it would piss off the Christians, Jews, Muslims, and vegatarians. Walmart also banned the book as he would not change the cover of himself sitting where Jesus sat at the last supper. He said it was one of the proudest days of his life to be banned from Walmart. Garth has seemed to piss off Quebecers, and Albertans with his one sentence as well.
I cannot understand why he is being called a racist. Quebec is a culture of people, but are made up of a multitude of races, just like the rest of Canada. It lessons the meaning of what is racism when the word is used incorrectly. It is happening more and more. David Duke is a racist, Garth Truner is not a racist in any way, and his words were directed towards Quebec seperatists and western seperatists. If one is not a seperatist there should be no insult taken by them. Any one who was insulted by Garths words, should state why they are seperatists, and how we could try to change that attitude.
CC: Stephane Dion
Dear M. Turner,
I am a french-speaking canadian from Quebec (francophone, quebecois), and I would like to give you my support. I decided to send you this message, hoping that the feedback you receive from french Quebec is not all negative. Please excuse my poor english by the way.
I think in this country, in Québec, in Alberta, elsewhere, and in Ottawa, there are people that are giving more value to an image of ourself than to the truth of what we really are. I believe this is due to the fact that collectively we have more compleasance than will to improve our society. This characteristic is really “canadian”, and it’s everywhere. It seems that we like to hear that we are so good and so near to perfection as a place… the best place in the world, where everybody wants to live, etc. It’s like that in Ottawa, it’s like that in Quebec. But what we should hear is what we have to change to make this place such a good place. This is where we need men and women like you, because we really need to hear the truth. People that remind us that there is hard work ahead. Personally, as an engineer, I like things that make sense, and I like to know what should be improved. Looking at our flaws is not all negative, it can also be as constructive. This is how I understand your statement.
Canada is a harder project because it is in each one of us, it is something that we are willing to give existence together. We need a balance between our regional interests and that great project called Canada. If we ever lose that balance, Canada will break apart. Sure all its pieces will continue to exist, but the concept that there is something greater than our regional interests will disappear.
So, coming back to your recent statements that are so strongly criticized, maybe some of it was a little exagerated, but it does not change the fact that you were right. Mister Turner, you have all my support.
Cordialement.
Mario
Montréal, Québec
“And how are yours? — Garth”
Mine are just fine thank you.
But I don’t insult people on my blog you know.
I will continue to oppose separatists. Get over it. — Garth
Again a stupid statement from a stupid English speaker.
Vous êtes tellement moron. Quand allez vous, les canadiens anglais, réaliser que nous nous, les Québecois, nous faisons coloniser depuis des décennies. Tout ce que nous voulons c’est d’accéder à notre indépendance et que vous n’avez rien à dire à ce propos compte tenu du fait que cela ne vous regarde tout simplement pas.
…And for those who can’t read French go take some lessons.
Soon after that his legal problems began. Now Conrad Black has lost his power, his wealth, his stature, and his freedom. According to a recent news item, he may also lose his Order of Canada.
This is another piece of the Big Picture.
Cheers.
By John Zalischuk on 07.05.08 10:29 am
John, do you understand how you have barely touched the tip of this iceberg? We all know Mr. Chretien’s strong business ties with the Damaris family and we remember well when Chretien said to Mr. Black..”you cannot be a Canadian citizen and become a Lord of England.” It was an archaic law from the 1800’s yet, Chretien found a way to boot Mr. Black from this country. Yet….it’s absolutely fine for a French Citizen (against France’s laws) to become Prime Minister? Can someone explain this double standard?
Mr. Black is in jail today, not because he did anything that most other exceedingly wealthy rich people do, but because with is publications he really pissed Chretien off.
Leasa
I’m not saying you don’t have to oppose to separatists. Do it respectufully is all I’m asking for. Like I said, if you’re against it, fine be that way I could care less. But insulting people is useless.
Hello Mr. Turner,
I was just reading in the francophone press about Mr. Dion asking you to retract your blog comments about sovereigntists being “prétentieux, hostiles, avares, machos, égoïstes, des perdants qui prônent la balkanisation du pays”. While I commend Mr. Dion for seeking more civility in our political debates – I think this has been sorely lacking in recent years – I would also like to send you some words of support. You tell it like it is, and this is also something that has been sorely lacking in our public discourse. Call a spade a spade and I could not agree more with your assessment of separatists.
I also find it a incredibly melodramatic of some of my fellow Quebeckers for calling you a “racist” for your comments – as if separatists were a race of people! Tell them AFAIK separatism is not a movement based on ethnicity, and if it somehow ever was, they would have more serious problems than merely being self-aggrandizing hostile balkanizers.
http://www.ledevoir.com/2008/07/05/196598.html
http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20080705/CPARTS/80705034/6488/CPACTUALITES
Andy B.
Montreal, Canada
I agree on that though, it was not a racist comment…
Bon. — Garth
Also, like I said in my own post, it’s amazing how this blog gives you a brand new set of balls. It’s easy to throw insults when you’re hidden behind a screen isn’t it?
And how are yours? — Garth
By Daniel on 07.05.08 9:44 am
I know where I can reach Mr. Turner personally, where I can see him and reach out and touch him. Would you please be kind enough to give me your full name and address so I can do the same with you?
When you have done so, I will have some respect for what you had to say but I would suggest it is you who is the coward and hiding behind “the screen”!Prove me wrong Daniel!
WEEKEND SATIRE
In view of all the acrimony that I detected in this forum this week, I thought that it was time for some humour. I am reposting the following piece of Satire which also contains a lot of REAL information.
*****************************************
Harper on Global Warming
(originally posted in January 2007)
Over the past few weeks, a lot of emotional energy has been wasted discussing the Global Warming issue and how Mankind is going to fix the problem that we caused. I have been considering how best I could try and educate everyone on the REAL reasons about Climate Change. I think that I have found a way to do this with the following scenario.
Weekend Satire
*********************
DISCLAIMER
In order to comply with provisions of the Canadian Anti-Terrorism Act and the United States Patriot Act this message is being posted for entertainment purposes only as required by law.
*****************************
[Setting: Prime Minister Steve Harper holds a press conference in the facilities of the Parliamentary Press Gallery in Ottawa.]
*****************************
Greetings to all of my Canadian subjects. Firstly, I would like to thank the Parliamentary Press Gallery for allowing me to use their facilities for this important press conference. It is really a nice place that you have here!
Secondly, this press conference is NOT about calling a Federal Election. Instead I am going to begin a discussion about the future of Planet Earth, and in particular the future of Canadian society.
This is a momentous day for me. Anytime that a private person publicly admits that they are wrong is a momentous day, but when a politician does that, that is REALLY a momentous day.
I, Steve Harper, Prime Minister of Canada hereby admit that I have been wrong about a lot of things.
I apologize to the members of the Parliamentary Press Gallery for my anal-retentive behaviour over the past year. Hopefully, over the next few months we will be able to develop a cordial and informative relationship that will be of benefit to everyone.
I apologize to the members of my caucus for my anal-retentive behaviour in trying to micro-manage everything that they did.
I apologize to the many conservatives who voted for me in the last election in the hope that I would begin making constructive changes to the way that the Canadian Government functions. I failed you.
I apologize to the many non-conservatives who voted for the Conservative Party in the hope that we would be different from the corrupt Liberals. In some cases, we were as bad or worse than the Liberal Party in some of the things that we did. I also failed you.
In the coming weeks and months, I hope that I will be able to regain your trust and I promise that I will not fail you again.
Over the past week, I have held many meetings with a variety of members from the Group of REAL Scientists. They have been providing me with a lot of scientific information about a variety of subjects. Most of these subjects, I did not take when I was in university. After some meetings, I felt like I had just had a session in the wood shed with my father and his strap. After some sessions, I felt like I did after a university cram session, when I tried to cram a lot of information into my brain for an important exam.
Well I have now had some time to reflect on this wide range of information, along with a couple of nights to sleep on it. I have made some important decisions about Global Warming and the Climate Change issue. There is a lot of detail and background information that surrounds these decisions, but for the time being, the following statements will have to stand on their own. The details will have to wait until later.
1: While the activities of our industrial society may have made a tiny contribution to Global Warming, I must state that Global Warming is not a man-made problem. Therefore, it can not be stopped by Mankind, nor can it be stopped by the Supreme Creator of the Universe. Anyone who says that we can stop Global Warming and/or Climate Change is lying to you. Therefore, the Government of Canada will be withdrawing its support of the Kyoto Protocol and from any other group whose purpose is to fight Global Warming. Anyone who is fighting against Global Warming is fighting against a phantom ghost.
2: Climate Change is a component of a Cycle. Cycles come and go, Cycles vary in length. 13,000 years ago a number of cycles ended and a large part of the population at that time was wiped out by a variety of calamities. In the coming years, we are facing another confluence of cycle endings. Some of these cycle endings are even more important than the ones 13,000 years ago.
3: One of these important cycle endings is the 26,000 year Precession of the Equinoxes. On December 21, 2012 our Sun will supposedly line up with the Center of our Galaxy in addition to crossing the galactic equator once again. The REAL scientists do not know what this will mean in practical terms. Using esoteric sources of information, they can only speculate.
4: Our Solar System travels in Space. We are currently in an area of Space that has a much higher level of energy than we are accustomed to. According to esoteric sources, we are going to meet up with a high energy Cosmic Wave that is going to cause a major transformation of our Solar System. This Wave has a cycle period of 309,000 years. For those of you who believe in the concept of Rapture or Ascension, then this Cosmic Wave may be what you have been waiting for.
5: On the more scientific issues, the REAL scientists report that while the magnetic fields on other planets in our Solar System have been increasing in strength, the strength of Earth’s magnetic field has been decreasing to a very low level. This suggests that we may have a magnetic pole reversal in the near future. Unfortunately, our scientists do not know what really happens in one of these magnetic pole reversals. These scientists also report that ALL of the planets in our Solar System have warmed up, possibly due to this much higher level of energy which is also having an effect on our Sun.
6: Supposedly travelling on the crest of the Cosmic Wave is a Cluster of Comets. This cluster is a regular visitor that comes around every 3600-plus years. Historically, this cluster of comets has caused problems for Earth a number of times. The most recent event was around 1628 BC. There is a theory that our Planet Venus was once a comet in this cluster and at that time.
7: In addition to this cluster of comets, there will be a number of random comets that will be spiralling into our Sun. This means that these comets could be coming in from different directions and may not be seen until it is too late to do much about it.
8: One of the reasons for these random comets is that we apparently have a dark companion to our Sun. This is a failed sun that is called a brown dwarf or dark star. According to a recent theory, the orbit of this twin sun is around 5000 years or less. There is a possibility that we may be able to see this twin sun in the near future, as it may be close enough that it becomes luminous, but not close enough that it will affect us on Earth. Whenever this twin sun or any other object travels through the Oort Cloud, it changes the direction of a number of objects from the Oort Cloud. Many of these objects begin spiralling into the center of our Solar System.
9: In addition to these incoming events from Space, we will be having a variety of Earth Changes such as volcanic eruptions, earthquakes, weird weather conditions, fires, and global flooding. Due to all of the debris in our atmosphere, there will be no growing seasons for a few years, at least.
10: For those of you who pay attention to what is happening in the sky, you may have seen aircraft that have been painting long white lines across clear blue skies. Most people who see these lines think they are just long contrails. In fact, these are called Chemtrails. This is a secret operation that bypasses elected politicians. I will endeavour to find out what the real purposes for these Chemtrails is. Anecdotally, there are reports that these Chemtrails make many people sick.
I have one more public apology to make. I apologize to the Honourable Garth Turner, Member of Parliament for Halton, for my petty decision to boot him out of the Conservative Party Caucus. If he will accept my sincere apology, I would like to appoint him to be the Minister of Communication. He will be given the task of overseeing the Canadian Blogosphere and for restructuring the CBC. Since these statements may cause me some repercussions from the Corporate Elites who put me in office, I may need a friendly media partner, such as the CBC, in my corner. We will be inviting Canadians to send in their constructive suggestions, and Garth’s Department of Communication will also do the initial filtering of these suggestions to weed out the spam.
In ending this prepared statement, I should also confess to some additional mistakes.
Those people who know my history will know that I was an early supporter of NAFTA, as proposed by Brian Mulroney. I am also a supporter of the North American Union. I must now confess; this has been for the benefit of the Corporate Elites and the Canadian Plutocracy.
Therefore, I now pledge that the Canadian Government will be terminating its legal participation in the NAFTA agreement, and we will also be withdrawing our support for the formation of the North American Union. If we are in the final years leading up to the End Times, then Canadians should be free to make whatever decisions that we think are necessary, without being hindered by unnecessary legalities.
Thank you for your continued support.
Hail to the Supreme Creator and the Laws of the Universe.
************
DISCLAIMER
In order to comply with provisions of the Canadian Anti-Terrorism Act and the United States Patriot Act this message is being posted for entertainment purposes only as required by law.
Weekend Satire
…And for those who can’t read French go take some lessons.
By Alx on 07.05.08 1:16 pm
I would rather walk in front of a bus then learn the spoken language of the province I was born in. Learning Tagalog is by far more benificial to myself working in Vancouver with the many Filipinos I work with. Speaking French in B.C. will not advance myself in any fashion. Speaking an Asian language, or any language from the Indian subcontintent will be more helpful. Unless I need to work in the Federal government, work for Nato, I have absolutly no use for French other then knowing how to order a beer or a burger in France or Belgium.
Well I never said that either! I think the people who are calling you racist are really overreacting. Separatists are not a race. They believe in a political ideology which is not the same thing. I recognize that SOME Quebecers are a little sensitive on these topics.
I just can’t condone the words you used. That was my problem with it.
Pour Sylvain Racine: Les Québécois ne voteront pas pour Stéphane Dion parce qu’il est Québécois. Tous les indépendandistes vous le diront : les pires premiers ministres de l’histoire du Canada ont été des Québécois. L’élite indépendantiste a convaincu les Québécois qu’un des leurs est incapable de bien gouverner un pays, que ce pays soit le Canada ou le Québec. Je pense que le terme perdant (loser) convient parfaitement aux indépendantistes québécois : ils exploitent la culture du perdant, de l’assimilé, du petit peuple, de la gang de malades du texte de Lise Payette dans le Devoir d’hier. Le peuple québécois ne sera jamais à la hauteur des aspirations de son élite indépendantiste. Alors, aussi bien rester dans le Canada, n’est-ce pas ?
Garth. Congratulations on actually being more bombastic than Ralph Klein. That’s saying something too.
I’m not a PC supporter on the federal level. Never have been. But Garth, you make Harper seem like a much more palatable option.
You, LOL, are the Conservatives best friend. And you don’t even realize it.
Mr. Black is in jail today, not because he did anything that most other exceedingly wealthy rich people do, but because with is publications he really pissed Chretien off.
Leasa
By Leasa on 07.05.08 1:18 pm
So the United States Court in Chicago is acting on the wishes and instructions of private citizen Jean Chretien, the former PM….well Leasa, sounds very plausible…BTW…the moon will be blue tonight, take a good look! LMAO….this was a very well thought out argument Leasa.
Mr. Black is in jail today, not because he did anything that most other exceedingly wealthy rich people do, but because with is publications he really pissed Chretien off.
Leasa
By Leasa on 07.05.08 1:18 pm
Oh sure, Leasa … We all appreciate your wise comment on the variables of
Conrad Black’s sense of morality. Maybe you can negotiate a “non-compete” arrangement with Connie whereby you can send him $50,000 and he can honour you with his silence. If you weren’t so stupid, you would be worthy of the word DUMB … as in a fencepost.
Send Connie a letter praising his morality. I’m sure he will deign to favour you with a missive which will go entirely over your head from an intellectual standpoint. After all, with a 15% remission, he would expect to “be out” by September 2013. Maybe you can arrange to meet him at checkout time. Meanwhile, his Order of Canada is about to be pulled … Like Eagleson.
Mr. Black is in jail today, not because he did anything that most other exceedingly wealthy rich people do, but because with is publications he really pissed Chretien off.
Leasa
By Leasa on 07.05.08 1:18 pm
This statement makes absolutely no sense. Do you really think that Chretien has that much influence with the United States court system? After all, it was an American government that charged and convinced him.
By MAYBE RHINO? 07.04.08 11:15 PM
Maybe Rhino,
That was very heartfelt and true.
[...] a Liberal, is all about political correctness and innuendo. It is not news. Read what Turner actually writes to explain what he meant. Is the media telling us what we can or cannot write? If so, what does free speech [...]
BTW, congrats Garth on getting on the front page of the Calgary Herald. If that’s not enough for you, today is the first full day of Stampede…which is the single most cohesive celebration this easterner has ever seen. LOL, way to go
Irvine
Calgary, Alberta
“proudly a separatist loser”
Are you the guy I saw headed over to the Dairy Queen with StockYard Day to order a BIG AL MELT?
By PYOTR PETROBITCH on 07.05.08 11:24 am
I guess this is what you call intellectual contribution to the discussion HUH? asshole
“self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.”
is a description that applies perfectly well to Southern Ontario, which you happen to represent, who comes up with 40% of Canada’s industrial base on such a small tiny part of the territory.
And this balkanization by Southern Ontario holds as well for military bases.
And Nuclear Energy subsidies.
And other examples would show up if I did the research.
In such circumstances, because there are many opinions involved, it’s better to use restraint in debates, if one doesn’t want to retract again and again.
mario
Some of the above posters lack varying degrees of both self analysis and over view knowledge of the subjects being discussed.
First: Western separatism has roots long before oil was discovered and used as a transportation fuel. Remember Louis Riel and also the financial raping of Western grain farming settlers by Eastern Grain buyers? Quebec separatism also predates Confederation because the English Army allowed French settlers to remain on the lands after the victory on the Plains of Abraham. Had General Wolfe not died in the battle, this history might have been different.
Second, many of you are a long ways back on the learning curve as evidenced by not knowing or accepting the molecular biologists discoveries about DNA. They have proven that there is ONE not four races of Homo Sap’s! The differences that you see are a result of large family groups exposure to differing food sources and environments over periods of time. It can be proven that if a species is exposed to a change in environment or nurishment that affects 1 in 1000 there will be mutations arise that will persist in that species if the change is a beneficial adaptation. Geneticists tell us that only one gene mutated once 50K years ago in Africa that produced white skin color. (par exampla: Polar Bear’s white fur allows more sunlight producing vitamin D to strike their skin. That is a a survival advantage in higher latitudes obviously)
Third: When I personally was in the trans-bordering freighting business, I witnessed not only Quebecers but Federal Civil Servants discriminating against me when I arrived from the USA with Ontario plates on my semi! Quebec is a distinct and different culture to anyone who has the slightest powers of observation. I was even asked where I had learned my limited French as my accent was not from Ontario. They in turn do not understand that much of Central Alberta and Saskatchewan was homesteaded by many Ukrainians amongst others, Edmonton was 52% at one point! This too is lost on Ontarians and East Coasters. What is lost on all of you is that too often politicians are laying you off against one another for tactical advantage.
Finally, until you dummies wake up and realize that problems are solved by proper scientific analysis using ALL of the facts and that emotional decisions interfere with correct resolutions, you do not have a hope in hell of resolving the true issues.
Their is scientific evidence that this Global Climate change started back when Watt created the steam engine! As populations grew and mined coal plus pumped oil, there has been a subtle but ever increasing shift in climate. It is also not the first time in geologic history for a major climate shift to have occurred! If you take the time to read and REMEMBER what facts are available then just maybe you will have some understanding of what is the TRUTH and while you are at it look for the WHOLE TRUTH not just partial snipets!
You’re just a fucking racict. Vive le Québec libre!
We’ll be free of that kind of moron!
I have yet to comment on Garth’s comment. While I agree with the intentions of what he said, he could have expressed his opinions in a more diplomatic way. That being said, I can sincerely understand his frustration not only with the garbage comments repeated ad nauseum, but with posters who verbally attack he & his party with extreme profanity. Perhaps its about time that Garth changes his first page of his blog from ‘Garth Turner welcomes feedback, messages of support, or comments of criticism from all Canadians.’ to something similar that the G&M used: “We will not publish questions/comments that include personal attacks on participants in these discussions, that make false or unsubstantiated allegations, that purport to quote people or reports where the purported quote or fact cannot be easily verified, or questions/comments that include vulgar language or libellous statements.” I know of no other MP that writes at least one, if not 2 blogs daily, and allows comments such as I have seen posted on his blog. Kudos to him & to Dion for allowing him to do so.
I moved to Quebec at age 3 and left at age 26 as most of my friends/acquaintances left a year or so after the P.Q. got elected. I loved Mtl. & the Prov. of Quebec & many French Quebecers, but I knew that being an Anglaphone my future did not lie there. I grew up learning French in elementary school, but as my friends were English speaking, I did not get to practice my French (Parisian, which was taught in school). While in Belgium, my French improved greatly, I took French classed at noon, had a tutor come to my apt. 2/wk., the only language I could speak with my boyfriend was French (he was Portugese) & had many French speaking friends. Upon returning to Ottawa I took 3 week French immersion courses during the day where we spend part of the time learning French as spoken in Quebec. I was also taking French in the evenings at Carleton. When I returned to Mtl. I took French literature at Sir. George Williams. When I met my French hubby(from France)in Mtl. while on vac 22 yrs ago he could only speak a few words in English. His accent was easy for me to understand. BTW, he told me that many Quebecers, when he first immigrated, did not like people from France.
I know this is getting lengthy, but my Dad worked in Drummondville for a British co. who made camouflage nets during the war. He was the manager, had many French people under him. He wanted to promote one, but instead the co. sent one of their own people from the UK. Dad was really PO’d as the Quebecer was far more knowledgeable than the Brit they sent. I can understand, on one hand, why Quebecois(e)of my age were ticked off. But, as someone above said, the Church played a big part in holding back French Quebecers. They were encouraged to go into law, medicine or become a Priest or Nun, rather than business.
My mostly anglophone sister, her bilingual hubby and daughter, my B&SIL & their children & a several friends still live in Quebec & we visit them each year. I’m so pleased to speak to them and speak to the salesclerks in French.
Yes, my Canada includes Quebec.
Haida Gwai are more of a nation within Canada than Quebec will ever be .
Carry on bollocks with that kind of bigottery. We’ll get faster our independance. You really do a good job!
@ Lorraine “Galadriel je n’ai pas de vie et mal baisée (pas baisée)” Lamontagne:
Alors, qu’attendez vous pour crissez le camp du Québec?
Garth, why are you deleting my posts?
Garth,
The difference between your childish, provocative and hostile rhetoric versus adult language is what gets you in “trouble” in the first place. The fact that you go on pretending that you respect Quebecers just doesn’t stick when your previous choice of words says exactly the opposite and even worst to those in Quebec who have nationalist views. Nationalists or not, those folks are Quebecers as well you know and you’ve certainly made it clear what you feel about them. The thing is that whether they have a different view than yours about Canadian politics is their right as much as yours. Throwing rubbish language at them gets you nowhere near a constructive, mature debate. You want to prove to them that their political views are wrong? Then grow up for heaven’s sake and address the issues with as much respect for your opponents as you would expect you should receive from them. If only one nationalist Quebecer had thrown half of your racist rubbish towards federalists, how would you have felt? Surely quite disrespected isn’t it? So there it is Garth. Respect the integrity of your opponents as much as you would like yours to be respected, whatever their views might be. Otherwise you’ll continue to go on as that other uncontrollable hot head who only serves to raise people against each other instead of trying to debate about the true issues like a grown up person. Is it all that hard to understand for you? No? Then prove it once and for all and drop your stupid racist bullshit.
I’m sure Harper et al are intent on embarking on a navel-gazing exercise to determine Quebec’s real destiny.
Now is the most opportune time, in view of the serious economic downturn facing the country. If Quebec decides to pursue the matter from an activist standpoint, the signs will bloom again, “à louer, en vente,” and this time TROC will not stand idly by in readiness to bow, scrape and curtsy to a Quebec population which feels it has been treated unfairly.
…CERTAINLY NOT AFTER HARPER SHARED SO MUCH CASH UNDER EQUALIZATION, WHICH WAS PROMPTLY TAKEN UP AS AN INCOME TAX CUT BY CHAREST.
Meanwhile, Ontario still has not received its deserved per capita funding for health care … Not until 2014 … As Ontario’s economy worsens, so too will the amount of funding for equalization be reduced. When Ontario becomes a HAVE-NOT PROVINCE, there will be $20 BILLION less for distribution among other governments in Canada.
In the meantime, Flaherty and Poilievre have bad-mouthed Ontario as being unworthy of capital investment. Forty-One Ontario C.R.A.P./S.H.I.T. MP’s have maintained absolute silence on Peter Van Loan’s wish to deny Ontario its entitlement to fair representation by population. Stevie [I am not a Leader] Harper has polarized large regions within the country. When will these C.P.C. policy wonks rush forward to take credit for the mess they’ve created?
By jwp on 07.05.08 1:45 pm
Hi JWP…It would be too time consuming to go into complete details as to why I believe that Conrad was railroaded. I’m not saying the guy is an angle by any means…
Can you answer me one question? Why can one NOT become an English Lord and keep their Canadian citizenship and yet, you can become Prime Minister and be a French citizen?
Garth congratulations for stating what needs to be said about many Quebecers. But when are you going to stop pretending to be a Liberal? Get over your hate for Harper. Canadians have had enough of the personal campaigns the likes of you and Danny W play out, and not for unity but or however you routinely couch in defense but for personal agenda. If you need to be in the Enquirer then get out of Canadian politics.
Patrick Bergeron 9:44am
You are right, isn’t it interesting how the MSM can say day after day that Canada will run out of cheap easy to get at natural gas in 28 years yet not one political party or government has even started discussing how people in all the homes using natural gas for heating will do so after then! It is also equally interesting that with the world heading over a cliff together the countries best able to weather the coming years are all left of center with strong central governments and set of national goals to deal with problems together. In other words they already understand how to share the blanket as well as having a system to keep the fire burning so that the blanket actually keeps them warm. Unfortunately many Canadians are far too selfish to share and it will take a few cold winter nights with no blanket at -40 degrees to wake them up. Hopefully there will still be time to fix the problem then.
In Quebec, the three-week average result suggests 37 per cent support for the Bloc, 25 per cent for the Liberals, 17 for the Tories, 11 for the NDP and nine per cent for the Green Party.
The Liberals lead in Ontario at 38 per cent, with the Conservatives at 32, the NDP at 16 and the Greens at 13.
Support for the Tories has also dipped in Ontario outside the greater Toronto area, especially in the eastern 613 area code, Anderson says.
“I think it’s been tougher for the Conservatives to continue to occupy the advantage they created in 2006.”
The Liberal brand has begun to recover as the sponsorship scandal dissipates and leader Stephane Dion proposes a bold and high-risk carbon-tax strategy.
My Canada includes both Quebec and Alberta, including those who have different points of view within those provinces.
The ability to accommodate people of different points of view without resorting to ad hominem attacks against an identifiable group is what has made Canada great.
My concern has been to see the attitude expressed that those who do not share their view can take a hike or move somewhere else. As any mature person would know, this is what fans the flames of separatism.
By Marc on 07.05.08 1:36 pm
And you hypocrite pretend to live in a bilingual country. Uncultured moron.
…By Marc on 07.05.08 1:36 pm
And you hypocrite pretend to live in a bilingual country. Uncultured moron.
Baird is calling for Liberal Leader Stephane Dion to rein in outspoken member Garth Turner for the comments made on a blog.
Baird says Turner should apologize for writing about what the Liberal MP called, the “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing separatist losers in Quebec.”
Turner wrote that Dion once stood up to the Quebec separatists, so he should be able to do it again in Alberta, in defending his environmental policies.
Dion said Friday that he had spoken to Turner, who had retracted his statements.
In an interview, Turner said he would not remove the remarks from his blog but would clarify them.
This is rich . From a member who is a total laughing stock in all of Canada .
Another insult to Canadian intelligence.
Shut up Baird !
Hey fucker
You don’t have to “justify your words”, which are racist and unjustifiable. You have to ask for repentance and shut up next time.
By Charles Garnier on 07.05.08 12:18 pm
Charles, I think you are the one who should be asking for repentance & you really should learn to clean up your mouth or shut up. Using that kind of language is disgusting & vulgar.
What do I think of separation in Canada? How about it being an act of treason. If this were 100 years or so ago, one would probably be hung by the neck until dead.
Btw,I really believe that its not the provinces in general who should be talking of separating but merely the people who think we should. Let them be the ones to start packing their bags and leaving period. That’s if any other country will want them. I have my doubts.
I love my Canada! Quebec & Alberta included. United we stand. The true North Strong & Free. Be proud of the whole Canada. Not just parts of it.
Regards,
Chill out, folks! We’re losing track of a far more important issue: finding Harper’s personality.
Who is THE looser now? On a un beau gros visage de perdant ici, du beau perdant tout frais, un vrai beau candidat au diner de con… soit il ne pense pas avant de parler il dit donc vraiment n’importe quoi, soit il se penche devant son chef comme si la petite face de rat avait la moidre autorité sur qui ou quoi que ce soit… Un vrai spectacle de clown.
Wow, Now John Baird has come out of hiding to criticize Garth for his writing. Congrats Garth on getting more exposure for your blog. Where all these new commentors coming from anyway, has the Bloc finally budgetted for a death star as well?
If you agree that Ontario and other provinces should get money from Alberta’s oil revenue, then you agree with Ontario and other provinces making money off pollution and wrecking the environment. Alberta can keep it’s dirty money.
Stick to your guns Garth, these traitorous bastards need to be exposed as what they are. Its too bad, in the good old days people who betrayed their country were either strung up or shot.
Somehow, this is all about Garth. Maybe someday Garth will be able to run for leadership of a party. After he gets thrown out of the Disunity Liberal Party of Canada he can run for his own party. Preston did it and did not too bad and we all know Garth is a much smarter man than Preston.
You just got your 15 minutes of fame (Said in english so you can understand)
I know where I can reach Mr. Turner personally, where I can see him and reach out and touch him. Would you please be kind enough to give me your full name and address so I can do the same with you?
When you have done so, I will have some respect for what you had to say but I would suggest it is you who is the coward and hiding behind “the screen”!Prove me wrong Daniel!
By jwp on 07.05.08 1:31 pm
1-I didn’t insult anyone
2-Why would I want you to respect anything I say. I don’t know you.
These comments were aimed at Mr. Turner. I’m not trying to have anyone agree or disagree with me.
Hey… That’s exactly what we needed in Quebec… an other frustred politician that wakes up sovereignists…
I will say like your chef said…
Celui qui le dit c’est lui qu’il est…
pauvre gang d’ignorants…
Hi calvin on 07.05.08 12:12 pm,
I’ve post more in-depth detail on past post. Here’s a quick list of ideas.
CANDU Power, Hydrogen, plug-in cars, and some more renewables
for a start.
Improved energy efficiency standard for all building, including the windows! Install geo-thermal heat-A/C in all new buildings and better-insulated standard for them all.
Stop building/urban sprawling over our productive farm-able lands so the future people and we can still grow much of the food we all eat locally. Use CFC or even better LED lighting. Think about the plug-in bicycles for nice days, and plug-in fuel-cell buses. How about some plug-in hydrogen fuel-cell train engines, and farm tractor, garbage trucks, lawn mowers.
Require the installation of motion censers on all new light switches
Use low flow toilets, and simple tank divider to reduce water volumes on the existing ones.
‘Easily’, to use, programmable thermostats that have auto lower night setting for the winter.
With a manual over ride button and timer, for the night owls, maybe.
Install control censers that can tell if you’re at home, in bed, or just out, and them turn off stuff that is not in use that you forgot was still on.
Require all appliances sold in Canada to have off switches manual and remotely that actually turn the stuff off! Have clocks that are only lit up when the time needed.
I know it’s just a clock, but all the clocks and all the stuff add up to a lot of power/energy usage. Remember were not just talking about a few peoples stuff but million and billions of us on this planet. The Corporations/company don’t worry much about it because too change stuff would required the effort and some up front cost too change/make better stuff with a reduced life time energy requirement. We need our Government to look out for our long-term interests and simple set a high standard for the stuff that can be sold here at all! If they don’t make the changes then they loose access to our markets.
The economy is not totally ‘free’ now! Companies are always looking for free handout, but complain when they are ‘all’ given/required to meets a higher standard to be able access our markets. That includes oversea wages and working condition, pollution controls and worker exposures.
It cuts in to there maximizing of profits! The so-called free trade is not ‘fair trade’; it’s being manipulated by the corporate world so it maximizes their bottom line! Yes, they’re all try and show a corporate good image through the mass media. But it’s there reason to exits to maximizing of there bottom line, that is #! In there minds always. Some people in companies try to do there stuff better. Some even improve their bottom line by improving energy efficiencies. But there are still some people in corporations that do what they can to take unfair advantage of people and whole countries.
Most people thoughtful people that run companies just want a level field to compete on
With standards that they all need to meet, to have access to our markets. Our Government should be insuring that the standards being set so we the human beings, best long-term interests are the #1 reason to set high standards that must be maintained. Even though the corporate lobbyist, do what they can, to lower the working, wage levels, health and safety standards. Sometimes they try to hand over brown paper bags or just large donation to get the person they would like in to office and then come calling for favors.
It’s not a good thing at all. It ends up subverting /corrupting our system of checks and balances. What did PMSH promises/sign when he flew to Dallas the day after he got elected? Who is it the Flarity(sp) gave his friend tens of thousands to do a bit of research write one speech for him? The process to insure we the taxpayers get the bets value for out money was totally subverted by this so-call PMHS finance minister.
What great open and transpired government we got, not!
We need to be vary carefully who we are voting for because the corporate world is always working on getting the people elected that will help them to maximize profits over everything else. I think PMSH and Bush are the most obvious example of how his can become a bad thing for all the working people.
(I’m not against earning a reasonable amount from your creative thought and hard work.
But how much is enough? What are the unseen unaccounted for cost of simple lowering the bar to maximize a company’s short-term bottom line? What are the true environmental and human costs? (But I digress for the energy efficiency ideas.)
An auto/remotely reduced A/C for when no one is home.
(I believe some home owner have this in parts of Ontario and they get a reduction on the cost of electricity, and can reduce cost more my changing the time they consume more electricity, to say wash and use an electric clothes dryer.)
Improved energy efficiency standard for all appliances and with smart start timers or you can’t sell them here!
It’s much easier and cost less to build in energy efficiencies when putting a building up, than doing it later on. If it ever gets done at all?
Insure we have qualified builders/trades people, and ethical building inspectors for all the ‘new’ homes/buildings, as well as retrofits.
That why it won’t be so easy for Mike Homes to find fix up jobs to do.
It’s to bad we didn’t smarted up and start back in the 70’s. Just think about how much we would be ahead right know! But we’re here now and need to get going and work together to get it done. And it will mean much better, required and enforceable, improved energy efficiency standards for all of Canada. Not just going with PMSH’s ‘SPP’ harmonize lower standard!!!
Require that all electric motors and stuff with them, to be the most efficient types, And be the only kinds for new sales in Canada. Yes they cost a bit more up front but will pay for them selves quickly. And some industrial motors might not be such and easy switch?
Just my two cents.
By Patrick on 07.05.08 9:50 am
I am an Anglophone Quebecois federalist, who has lived in Les Cantons, compte Duplessis, and now reside in Montreal. I have also lived in BC and Ontario.
I fully support your comments. I disagree with your goals, but do agree with the characteristics you proclaim, as a “reasonable” idealogical separatist.
It must be difficult to see the number of totally stupid, racist, ego-centric comments from many obvious Francophone separatists, who, by their actions here, are calling YOU a liar. You do have my sympathy, as most folks I have discussed nationhood with, are similar to you.
Quebec, from my experience, is the place I will always return to. I have had opportunity to move elsewhere, and decided to take a financial hit by remaining Quebecois. The solidarity of the Quebecois, is demonstrated by our concern for each other. WE, are the most socialist region, with the best public health care, environment programs, child care, etc., and for the most part, are willing to PAY FOR IT though higher taxes – which is what we are now being asked to do for Canada’s environment through the Green Shift. (sorry for that, but it needed said)
This is why I return, am willing to pay higher tax, am willing to have MY LANGUAGE placed in a minority. To me, the importance is looking after each other. Possibly, “brothers with a differing point of view”.
I have seen very little of this from the trolls of the CPC, and unfortunately, this seems common with many of the other alleged “republicans” – Albertan or Quebeckers.
For this, I am always trapped between the Two Solitudes. Why can’t we just “get along”….????
You are a disgrace to gene pool of all politicians. You are too full of yourself to know how stupid you are. Check the following link on Global Warming.http://brneurosci.org/co2.html
You might also read Michael Chritons “State of Fear” which predicted AGW histeria.
WW from The Okanagan Saturday — can be applied to Garth’s current post, as it has garnered a lot of debate, which is good — it’s managed to get people off their backsides for once:
“Nothing is a waste of time if you use the experience wisely.” — Auguste Rodin
Ain’t that the truth!
****************************************
AP report says “Musharraf (Pakistan) knew about nukes”. Musharraf supervised shipments of uranium to North Korea, yet he is one of dubya’s puppets, so the WH was (probably still is) using other countries to constantly stir the shit and make a nuisance of themselves.
With their economy now blowing up in their faces, there may be other things to focus on.
****************************************
“. . . truth needs no apologies. . . .”
Tory@York, 9:08 pm
However much it pisses people off, truth
needs no apologies AND no laws to support it.
Truth stands alone, by itself.
****************************************
“. . . I’m reminded of Mayor Ralph Klein’s slogan (1982?), “Let the eastern bastards freeze in the dark”, . . .
orlebar, 11:17 pm
Infrastructure for one.
Second, unless something is done to slow down, or halt the ever-rising price of natural gas, oil and electricity, a lot of folk ARE going to end up freezing in the dark during the coming winters, so Ralph’s words may well be prophetical.
The US power grids are deteriorating, and have already shown they are unable to cope with increased demand for A/C (leads to brown-outs, then total black-outs); what about the demand for heating in winter?
Someone, somewhere is making a real good, fast buck off of our backs.
There was a report on WRH a couple of days ago that said there had been “suicides which could be directly related to the economic downturn . . .”
Aloha Airlines shut down ermanently a few weeks ago, and the number of corporate bankruptcies exceeded personal bankruptcies for the first time in a long, long time last month.
With the US greenback’s 41% decline since dubya’s first G8 summit in 2001, all of these things happening at roughly the same time, does not look promising for the West.
****************************************
“. . . the rest can go to France, the U.S.A. or Hell.”
Bill, 11:18 pm
Hell is the best of the three — other than Lucifer, there are no crooks or lying politicians to deal with!
Well TS, you got it wrong.
“The United States would not allow such discussion to even take place, as succession from the union is not allowed under their constitution.”
Wrong. And I think you mean secession. Several states only signed because it was clearly understood that leaving the union was an option if they didn’t like it. Just because it’s not written in the Constitution specifically, doesn’t mean they can’t do it. Basically, if it wasn’t spelled out specifically on how to deal with something, then the State retained that right inherently as each signatory State existed before the Union. Same with people’s rights.
And where is that written? The caucus has not seen it. — Garth
Here it is for you Garth. I am surprised you haven’t seen it before.
http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=633027
Garth, you have a big problem and that is sometimes and this was one of them that your mouth is in gear before your brain is.
Mr. Black is in jail today, not because he did anything that most other exceedingly wealthy rich people do, but because with is publications he really pissed Chretien off.
Leasa
By Leasa on 07.05.08 1:18 pm
My God, I think she’s jumped the shark. How bizarre to think Chretien had anything to do with Conrad Black ending up in jail. He ended up in jail because of an over-zealous American justice system which equates the word justice with retribution. A system that your idol Harper is trying to imitate and shove down our throats even though it’s been proven again and again to be a failure for the most part.
As far as Black’s canadian citizenship goes, he was given a choice by Chretien. He prefered to relinquish his
Canadian citizenship so he could go to England and prance around in silly costumes and attend fancy soirees
Suck in up Garth and do the right thing!
By Canuck on 07.05.08 12:17 pm
It takes a far bigger man to apologize than one who doesn’t. The question is is Garth up to it? Time will tell.
BTW, Gath I hate separatism just as much as you but I am not an asshole about it. You, my friend crossed the line this time.
……..So, why should I even try to justify my words? My attempt to show the Liberal leader has the STONES to face down those who think of themselves first, and the country second – no matter where they hail from – succeeded only in making his task more difficult. That was not my intention. Nor do I have anything but respect for my fellow citizens in Quebec and Alberta………
POSTED BY GARTH TURNER ON 07.04.08 @ 7:12 PM
……..As to Garth’s original post – I strongly disagree with the harsh and unfortunate language he used.
However, my sentiment is and will always be that I want Quebec to stay within Canada. I am sure we respectfully disagree on that point you so passionately believe in…….
BY BONNIE N BC ON 07.05.08 11:44 AM
Like Barb, I felt your words were in appropriate and shocked me that you would talk like that with your command of the English language. Why do you and some of the men on this blog have to always be talking about “stones”? Why not say the Dion has the heart of lion, a heart of courage. Dion, the lion heart. The way he has withstood the Harperites attack shows that he is truly a man unlike Harper, Bernier, Finlay, Flaherty,Van Loony,et al. who still have to grown up. He has the courage to go right out to Alberta to really begin to debate the Green Shift knowing he is generally not wanted. He is the Leader of Canada for these times. He will lead Canada to a greener, fairer and richer Canada which Harper and his gang has shown that they cannot do.
Hi Garth,
First time poster here. I have to say that the words you used to describe separatists, “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.” are bang-on! It may be a little over the top, but it’s about time that some people stopped just listening politely when separatists spout their hostile views. I’ve got nothing against Quebecois and I have Albertan friends, but really, I think separatist types should get a taste of their own medicine sometimes.
Garth is correct this time!
All those who suggest separatist moves whether in Quebec, Alberta or Newfoundland, are self centered, near sighted and disloyal to Canada.
[Now this is not name calling, but simply descriptive. There are many comments here that are name-calling and devoid of any logic.]
Logically we are all stronger pulling together as *Canada*. Our majority is mature enough to iron out how to share the wealth.
Visitors and tourists contribute to our rich way of life. We will lose that *gold mine* if we squabble over oil, trees and water and bust up the big picture.
The USA may not be perfect yet you know there is no urge for any group or state to break away.
I admire that loyalty to country in the USA. It*s real. I lived there for a time.
Groups in Canada who talk separation remind me of petulant North Korea who uses nuclear projects threats to get special foreign trade considerations.
I don*t always agree with Garth though. = TG
After reading this blog, and all it’s posts (yes even the french ones) one thing is crystal clear to me. The art of communication no longer exists in the general public. No one listens, no one debates, no one allows for someone to be passionate about what they believe in, and no one seems to respect others points of view. All I’ve read is hyperbole, insults, partisan nonsense and insult after insult. It is truly sad.
In my opinion, seperatists aren’t the problem – it’s the unwillingness to work together, compromise and move forward for the good of everyone across this great country that’s the problem.
More people need to travel to the 3rd world, and see how people really live. Then maybe we would work together to have something better.
Perhaps “Canada” as we know it is dead. Perhaps we need a new model. There is one thing I do know, we are better off working together than seperately. I just wish more people thought that way.
I think I’m more upset by the bad grammar used in your final paragraph.
Hi Garth.
Today I attended the opening of a new mosque in Calgary. The PM was there as well as Stephane Dion and many other politicians. I intended to go and talk to M. Dion and tell him to give you some slack. There is no evidence he will listen to me; he has left my emails unanswered. I did not get to talk to M. Dion; the dignitaries went off to a special dining room. I had a great lunch in a tent with many hundreds of people. I got to talk to several people
and give them the same DVD I gave you, the PM and other MPs.
After he spoke M.Dion got a standing ovation.
I did not meet Mr. Harper either, he left for other engagements.
I suggest you give yourself a break, have a beer and rejoice, you may not be perfect; you are a contribution to the debate.
Good work Garth. The things we Westerners remember the most was a) PET giving us the finger and b) the rigs moving out when the NEP started (and nobody east of the Manitoba border gave a shit because their economy was thumping along just fine). Hmm. Surprised why you can’t elect anyone in the West? It ain’t rocket science you clown. King Ralph, if you’ll notice, actually went out of his way to promote federalism, as did Lougheed before him. But the attitude of you clown politicians in The East (nb. not Central) does more to promote disunity than anything else. Looking forward to Dion being shut out here again next election. Oh, and by the way, if you’re going to retract your statements, then actually retract them and don’t dance around…. clown.
@ Loraine Lamontagne,
Oui, oui, oui et oui. Et Stéphane Dion est un clown; vous le savez trop bien que la majorité des Québécois (souverainistes ou pas) ne voteront pas pour lui aux prochaines élections, même si Stephen Harper décidait d’aller en guerre avec un autre pays.
By Sylvain Racine on 07.05.08 12:33 pm
Well then Sylvain – you are the bigger fool.
I am a Quebecer, English Quebecer mind you, but I WHOLE HEARTEDLY AGREE with what you called them, Garth. I know separatists, and they are EXACTLY as you describe them. Selfish. Macho. Arrogant. Name it, like you did, that is what they are. They are also a rather unintelligent bunch to say the least – how anyone could think that Quebec could survive on its own is a total and utter idiot – do the bloody economics math and see! The taxes here are ludicrous as it is, if the idiots got their way we would be paying 90% of our wages in taxes to the new ‘country’ of Quebec lol. Do NOT apologize, if the truth hurts, screw ‘em.
Wow!
Je ne peux croire les mots que je lis…How sad they are. Vous ne comprenez rien monsieur. You are reinforcing the stereotypes. Plus je vous lis, moins je me sens canadien. You are helping the separatists cause…
By jP Gagnon on 07.05.08 12:14 am
JP – How long have you been reading Garth’s blog? Since yesterday.? I’ve never seen you post before. I’m actually beginning to wonder if most of these comments aren’t coming from the CRAP youth group – the ones wearing those T-shirts in front of the Langevin Block the other week.
“Dion + Carbon Tax = New NEP!!!
By Kyle on 07.05.08 12:13 am”
Kyle, do yourself a favour and get educated. The Green Shift has got nothing to do with a ‘made in Canada” price for oil. There are absolutely no similarities whatsoever between these two policy initiatives.
READ The Green Shift and you will discover a meaningful start to contolling carbon emissions in Canada. A meaningful start to eliminating poverty in Canada. A meaningful start to redefining a new tax structure in the country.
You posting is mindless and thoughtless. Surely you have more intellect than that posting shows.
“Mr. Black is in jail today, not because he did anything that most other exceedingly wealthy rich people do, but because with is publications he really pissed Chretien off.
Leasa
By Leasa on 07.05.08 1:18 pm”
Leasa, you may not have noticed but Black was convicted in US courts for US based offenses. Your posting defies logic (as usual).
“Ripping is really harsh considering Ontario separated decades ago. By buddy, spare a dime? on 07.04.08 9:46 pm”
This is one of the most assinine statementts posted. Ontario is still a part of Canada. There has never been a vote for separation, and Ontario is a fully functioning member of the confederation.
Stupid post. Simply stupid.
Folks, Garth knew exactly what type of reactions he would provoke when he wrote “He stood up once to the self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing separatist losers in Quebec. I guess he can do it again in Alberta.”
I do not consider Garth a stupid man. I consider Garth a calculating manipulating politician who knows how to be a puppeteer of his “supporters” and our mainstream media.
Was there any value in his rant of Quebecers or Albertans? Of course not. But he knew that he could draw attention from his followers and the media. I guess even negative attention is better than none in Garth’s world.
I think it is time to take a break from the blog until emotions come back into check.
I have rarely seen so many absolutely stupid posts on Garth’s blog as have been written on this topic.
All that this proves is that human beings are incapable of sound logic when their emotions are out of control.
People, people, people…. we have so many more important things to debate and discuss than a few words written by Garth when he was in an obviously emotional state.
I’ll give you all a hint… none of us (including me) is any better than Garth when we are emotional. We all say and do things when we are in an emotional state that could have been said or done differently, and more logically.
At the end of the day…who cares? So Garth is human. Duh! Now there’s a revelation.
Let’s return to some meaningful dialogue about The Green Shift and alternative SOLUTIONS to the carbon emission crisis. Criticizing the plan without offering alternative solutions is simply being intellectually lazy.
Let’s have some meaningful dialogue about the attack on our democratic institutions by the Harper government.
Let’s have some meaningful dialogue about Canada’s social programs and the plight of aboriginals and the poor.
Let’s have some meaningful dialogue about the state of our economy and the risks we face due to a lack of Federal economic leadership and vision.
Let’s have some meaningful dialogue about the world financial crisis and what that could mean to each of your retirement prospects.
Let’s have some meaningful dialogue about the state of our national health care program and how the Roy Romanow’s report has been largely ignored by both Federal and provincial governments.
Let’s have a meaningful dialogue about what Canada can to do better recognize the foreign credentials of immigrants so they can make more contributions to our economy and health care system.
Pissing in the wind at each other accomplishes nothing.
I see you all in a few days or perhaps a week… I’ve had enough of the pissing in the wind.
For All the People of Halton, FYI, If you mist it.
Why are the people we elected to look out for our common best long-term
Interests locally?
Just giving way our hard earned taxpayers dollars to developer by subsidizing the cost of new areas infrastructure!!!
Stop subsidizing the home builders with our hard earned tax payers money!
Stop this money giveaway! The builders will build in Halton anyway!
Why are we just lining their pockets!
I smell A RAT!!!
People from Halton should be asking a lot of question of the Councilor and Mayor that Vote to give our hard earned tax dollars to the developers! And have the taxpayers subsidizing these homebuilders! There was an article in the Oakville beaver? A few weeks back.
Seem the Oakville Mayor, Mr. Carr, and a few other Oakville councilors voted against giving our money away! BUT more voted to just give your hard earned money away.
They don’t care; it’s not there money! I smell a RAT! Are there any brown paper bags in site?
But NOT the Milton guys and others!!! They voted to hand your taxpayer money over to the developers, to just line their pockets. They make at lease 30% profit already.
Find out who vote to give away your hard earned tax money!
Run against them, and help to get them voted out!!! (NOT voted back IN!)
I smell a RAT, and they could be holding brown paper bags!?
(Are the OPP or RCMP able to quietly have a look around for any suspicious brown paper tails? Just a thought I had.)
We are all getting screwed again buy this guys!!! : (
***Also the Incineration issue, in Milton ,and for others***
And some of the Milton guys, councilors, think you can burn garbage to make it just go away.
(You remember that energy form waste thing. Not a good Idea at all.
I can find the’ links’ to a presentation on why burning garbage; incineration is a very BAD Idea, by a leading US toxicologist. If anyone would like the ‘links’ let me now. If I miss your request today try again until I see it. And post the ‘links’ for the incineration presentation..)
All you get from burning garbage is very Toxic bottom and fly ash that requires a special toxic waste landfill. But their guys think it’s ok to just put it into our municipal dump. The out of site out of mind thought process. The dump liner is only guaranteed for about 10-20 years if I remember right? Then the toxins could start to leech out into the ground water, is anyone on well water? Then the ground water and toxic chemicals will migrate down stream to the lake! Where is your drinking what coming from now, and in 20 years? They aren’t even testing for most of the toxic stuff in the water now, since there are using filters that can’t remove most of the crap in the lake water. Yes, they remove the big stuff and kill the bacterial so no one get sick and dies right away.
Those ideates disregard the fact that burning garbage will product Dioxin the go up the smoke stack! The real nano size particles can’t be filtered, and get out into the air we all breath, then into the rain water and soil, were food is grown in.
They don’t even test for the nano-sized particles that great made and out from burning garbage. They only test once a year ,and only after calling first, to say there coming to test. The test can only measure particles down to 10 micros, that 1000’s or is it 100’s of time bigger that a nano meter. So that supposed safe standard for emotions is written to allow/except X number of Micro-sized particles. They don’t ever look at the amount of the really small stuff that goes up the smoke stacks!
Dioxins are a very toxic product of burning plastic, garbage.
Dioxins get more concentrate up the food chain.
We mammals’ build up/bioaccumulation this toxic stuff in our bodies all through our lives.
***But guess what, women have one way to get ride of there Dioxin load in there bodies! It gets excreted out with breast milk!
-Do we in Halton really want these ideates to get voted back in Halton for their lack of concern over exposing everyone and especially babies to more uncontrolled release of toxic waste, Dioxins, by burning garbage.
What about recycling to reduce the amount of stuff filling up Halton’s landfill?
-****And there just giving away are hard earn tax dollar to developers that don’t need it at all, it just lines there pocket, at the ‘we the tax payers’ expense!
Go ahead and bend over again!
Help get the word out about this morons that just give our money away, and don’t get a flying F***!
-And they think it’s just ok to burn garbage, instead of recycling. The garbage burning is just a bad way to make some energy (your can save about 5x more energy by just recycling instead)
Burning garbage/plastic will increase every ones toxic dioxin loading and especially our newborn babies!
In case you mist it, tell the Halton regional Councilors to ‘STOP ADDING FLUORIDE TO ARE WATER NOW!!!’
To keep adding it, They Will Be,’ Grossly-Negligent’!
There are lots the good scientific papers/data know available!
(It ‘basically’ says if you keep adding this stuff to Humans drinking water it is simple an ‘insane’ think to keep doing!.
It has been a ‘Deception’ that it is save, and stops lots of cavities
The good science that is available now shows that they are all kinds of BAD stuff it does to our human bodies!
-Like if you’re an infant under 6-mounth old and you drink water with fluoride,
it will permanently lower your I.Q. permanently! (Did they want to made people not to smart???)
-Breast-feeding is BEST because the breast filters/with not let fluoride pass into the breast milk that the baby drinks. Fluoride is not need in any of are biological functions!
-Fluoride is linked to some arthritis.
-More broken hips.
-Thyroid suppression
-Greater uptake of aluminum into the brain.
-Some skin allergies.
And much more BAD stuff!
Would you drink sunscreen to protect your skin? Then why do you think drink fluoride will protect your teeth?
Topical application to the teeth with fluoride may help stop a very small number of cavities.
Good oral hygiene, brushing and flossing regularly, and a good diet is the best why to stop getting cavities.
One glass of fluoridated drinking water has about the same amount of fluoride as a pea size bit of tooth past.
And what does it say on your tooth past container? It says DO NOT SWALLOW!
The graph that was used to show fluoride could help stop tooth decay was ‘cooked’, because only specific date point were use to get a nice straight line. If all date points that were available were used there was absolutely on correlation.
The fact is the Fluoride that is added to Oakville is toxic waste from the phosphate industry. It even has arsenic and lead in it. The stuff they add to our drinking water!
Brita water filters do not remove fluoride. Boiling water makes it more concentrated. How often do you completely empty your teakettle?
To find all the good science fact about the effect of fluoride on the human body go to;
http://www.fluoridealert.org/
Tell your neighbors!
Tell your local Governments to stop this insanity!
And as an instant added bonus, they can save the money that know use to buy this toxic fluoride waste.
More Ontario provincial-ism Garth. Envy of the current success of the West and Newfoundland is not a way to set policies. And small mindedness is no way to think for the nation. I am shamed to have you as an MP!
Thank you for being honest. Those who take offense to your words are either just looking for something to complain about or seperatist losers. I agree with you on this matter. Maybe losers is a bit harsh and everyone wants you to be PC (Politically Correct) but I think anyone that puts themselves before their country and it’s future welfare is a loser.
The issue is a single sentence in my last post in which I drew comparisons between those who wish to separate from Canada, whether they live in Quebec or Alberta. I called such separatists, who put regional and self-interest ahead of the national cause, “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing.” – Garth
Is it true? Thats the question we should really be asking. Is it true that western/eastern separatists are self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing?
There are those who claim that separatists have legitimate beefs. Y’know, that they aren’t being treated fairly by Ottawa and its 308 MP’s that tweak the (what is in their opinion I guess, hopelessly flawed) system. Is it true? Is Quebec with 25% of the Canadian population and 38% of Canadian federal tax revenues being treated unfairly? Is their language and culture somehow in jepardy? Are they treated poorly by the rest of Canada, by the rest of the English Quebecers and Immigrants who make up a minority in Quebec? Is Quebec disadvantaged? Is Bilingualism a failure to them? (Obviously must be in Quebec, the Quebequois only want one language, the French language so much so that bilingualism doesn’t really exist in Quebec outside of Montreal). Is Multiculturalism a failure to Quebec? (It was to Pariseau who blamed the last loss in the separatist vote on immigrants, natives and English speaking Quebecers)
Is it really true that French speaking Canadians are under threat, socially, with their culture, with their language, with human rights? Is it true that they have been fiscally been treated poorly by Ottawa? Is it true that they have been underrepresented in Ottawa?
The facts remain, people, with Quebec. They’ve been treated fairly. More than fairly, I might add. From equalization payments to language, to culture, to representation, in some cases, more than fairly to the expense of the rest of Canada. And outside of Western separatists, do we complain, do patriotic Canadians complain? No, patriotic Candians want unity and we’ve literally bent over backwards to try to make it happen.
And some haven’t. Lets get back to Harper, because his words of the Liberal Green shift screwing the West and his comparing it to the NEP is really what all this is about. Garths words are reactionary to a PM who has time and time again, throughout his life including now, promoted east vs west or west vs east division and this, by the way, is hardly the way a true leader of any nation should act!!!
And as for the western separatists… are westerners oil producers, each and every one? Do oil producers speak on behalf of all westerners? Are the residences of the provinces of Alta/Sask who, with 13% of the Canadian population and produce 40% of Canada’s GHG’s, unfairly treated by taxation that forces GHG oil producers/polluters to clean up their act?
Really?
And outside of those who truly are self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing, people who care about the health and well being of the rest of Canada, who are peaceful, think of others, sharing, humble, selfless and uniting, are not blinded by self centered interests. They see the truth. They know it.
“Everyone I have heard from tells me this was a mistake.” – Garth
I think it was in a way. I’ll explain it at the end.
“Quebecers tell me they consider such words racist.” – Garth
I don’t think its a racist statement. To me, the truth is the truth is the truth. I can see why a large minority of Quebecers in general would think that way. Separation from Canada is such a hyped issue there from the media to the water dispenser and peoples positions on it have been so hotly debated, so hotly contested (and not to hurt anyones feelings, but the Quebequois have them… feelings, I mean) and the propaganda… the outright lies! Language, culture under threat from Canada, thats a nice stretcher. Quebec has a better chance at competing against other nations, particularly U.S. multinationals against market share, thats an ugly fallacy if not a bald faced lie (unless they like electing Harper, that is. Maybe Rhino sez it best.
Theres an ugly truth there as well that separatists both east and west would rather weaken Canada first to give themselves cause to separate and if that isn’t what Garth described separatists to be, I don’t know what is). Even the term is wrong. Is the french language a “race” now? Is culture a “race”? C’mon, folks. Its all a bit of a stretch (especially if a few of Garth’s words like “Quebecers tell me they consider such words racist” ever deserved to be raked over with a fine tooth comb.)
As I do recall, there are approximately 365 pieces Garth writes to the masses every single year (thats between books and MP functions on a day to day basis by the way). Uh… what about the “big picture” of the words of Garth? Its all too much for us, we have to isolate and dissect one line as though it speaks for the whole? Uh huh…
“People like me, they say, encourage separation.” – Garth
Or discourage separatists.
“Albertans say it’s exactly the sentiment of easterners who want to hobble the West.” – Garth
Highly believable. “The east is against us so we have to do a pre-emptive strike!” Ranks right up there with Ebert Ohmud’s words (Israili appointed PM) of “Iran could have nukes within 10 years, we must nuke them now!” Nice friend Harpers got there…
“Others say it takes debate down to the level of Stephen Harper.” – Garth
It does. Unfortunately, it seems to be the only way some of us can hear you. (you know, some… particularly the self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing assholes we’ve got in this nation)
Dion says it needs to be respectful.
And thats why it was a mistake, Garth. He’s right. It does need to be respectful. For me, it looks like a matter of conditioning. Dion has lived in Quebec most of his whole life (not France, as some of the Conbots suggest, he’s got dual citizenship? Whoopie, big thrill, where does the man lay his head) and having been a Quebequois/Quebecer most of his whole life, he knows the issues from the inside and when two groups or organizations are polarizing in ideology, sometimes the best way to separate the distinction is to look at behavior itself, and this includes “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing”.
Because you nailed it Garth. Separatists truly have these traits but true patriots of this nation have, in general, the opposite.
And sometimes… (you know, sometimes) we really do have to get in the gutter, fight in the trenches and duke it out. If its not the case, then please, someone tell me why Canadians are excercizing military “offenses”. It sure isn’t “defensive” behavior we are seeing there, much as propagandists say we are at risk to “terror”, it behooves me as to when the last time was that Islamic fundamentalists attacked this nation’s soil and no, 911, I’m not buying it. The long and short is that we shouldn’t be “offensive” when we don’t have to be. But therein lies the catch.
These words you are reading are the words from Garth’s blog. Every day, day in, day out, its the trenches of blogger war in the bloggosphere with those who are without a doubt, “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing” and who is participating in it most directly in terms of writing pieces, censoring for hatespeak, and a good number of posts, day in, day out? And as we are products of our own environment, who can say that this blog isn’t rubbing off on Garth and those who participate? The good, the bad and some of the ugly.. because it does. (not saying that what we take in is what we dish out, doesn’t work that way, but it does rub off on us) And we as readers should be respectful of those environments from which we hail, be it a western separatist/canadian environment, or a nationally divisive PMO, or an eastern separatist/Canadian environment or an environment such as this one that debates all issues, some poorly, others… effectively.
“But there’s no way I, as a federal member of the Canadian House of Commons, am going to lay down before people who openly advocate ripping the country apart. Moan all you want about money, or lament those who don’t share your culture or language. But don’t expect me to roll.” – Garth
I hear you, loud and clear you and couldn’t agree more. This nation is simply worth fighting for, worth preserving from its adversary’s from outside and most especially from within. Some will defend our fine nation loudly. Others coursely. Others with the respectful demeanour of Stephane Dion. Others still will give their lives. Others still, will give their simple examples, model exemplar as Canadians we can all be proud of. And there will be those from outside and within that will want to tear apart this nation, divide, polarize, weaken and conquer with hidden agenda’s the way Harper does (and his eastern separatist supporters/counterparts) and they will try everything from lies and fallacies, to assaults on democracy itself… but when the smoke clears and the dust settles, they are a minority in this nation both nationally and regionally, lest we forget but their defeat does have to come with the practice of respect by true Canadian patriots.
Calling an asshole an asshole to their face will get one nowhere. Its a vent, but solves nothing. But show them why they are what they are without the offenses, without the label. Explain why to the masses disfunctionality is disfunctional and their power is chopped at their knees.
There are many overwelming truths that can be used to put out separatist flames… the description without the label and hammering it home as a theme is often more than enough but in the end, its the practice of principles that speak louder than words.
And a few last words, Garth and to all Liberals, MP’s and future MP’s who want to make a positive difference for all Canadians. (since when was I ever short of those?)
Scrap the reactionaries. True leaders lead by example. The time has come for opposition parties to stop opposing and start leading, practicing the faith in the reality that before years end, a new government will replace the hapless old one.
Its time to get out the mandate. (just as Dion is doing). The Green shift is a perfect example of it as well as the effects of it. Whether its decided to come in trickles or floods, play the strong suits first at the very least as we need time to debate, educate, organize and frame the message. The “Green Shift” legal snag with the name itself should indicate the Libs need the time to get that message out so… don’t wait. Campaign as if an election were called last week. Get out the platform. Dictate the future course of policy and debate because the Republican Harper tactical “control the message” (including that of the opposition’s) won’t go away.
From here on in, define the future course of policy in this nation. No more reactionaries, set the agenda.
- Framework policy
- debate
- refine policy (committee’s/inquiries)
- Introduce laws
- Pass laws
We need the framework polices that the Libs have now if we are to really debate with principles and the true funcitonality of democracy this great nation deserves. Get as much input from science, professors, intellectuals, writers, researchers, hands on infield workers, everyone. Show how democracy works because we dealing with self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing individuals/groups who’s goal is to usurp democracy itself. Garth/MP’s, its their biggest weakness so “stand separate” from their own principles.
I know you do with your heart, its there daily. Its time to get back to the policies (and that includes behavior, you know, some
) that leaves the cavernous divides between the two leading parties for voters to with clear conscience, make the right choices come election day.
Scrap the reactionaries, set the course, tone and mandate, set the policies without the detail (except for the national food policy, the detail is there, Carolyn Bennet is a trump card in the waiting) and victory is yours/ours.
And one last thing. Support strongly, Elizabeth May’s right to speak at the leadership debates. She needs to come in Garth, for all the right reasons. The Greens have flirted with double digits nationally this past year in the polls, its democatic in principle, its time, and if Dion publically supports her bid to speak at the debates, its another wound that Harper can’t heal. Simply put, with climate change, 2 vs 2 is better than 1 vs 2, and Stephane “the comprimiser” Dion will stand the most to gain.
Dear Garth,
Insulting people doesn’t help your cause or that of the Liberals, for that matter.
Sovereignists, in either Quebec or Alberta, are aware of their culture, their differences and… their worth.
The fact that these people dream of their own country is simply an opportunity for any federal party, perhaps yours, to convince them that Canada can acknowledge these dreams and perhaps do something about it.
In other words, don’t just accuse other people of having worthwhile dreams, prove them wrong with hard facts that -your dream- is so good that they too should be part of it.
Your insults towards both the Sovereignist Quebeckers and Albertans might actually be a sign that you’re out of arguments and that… they’re right!
And don’t count on that moronic carbon tax of yours to help win you new members… seriously, that tax (and the very idea of such a tax) is the dumbest thing I’ve heard in a long time.
FYI, Found the links,if you’d like to know. 3 parts.
(The Garbage/Plastics Burning Dioxin issue.)
Energy from Waste: Part 1 -The Myths Debunked. 10 1/2 min.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XB5iOtxlpCs
Energy From Waste:Part 2- Some regional alternatives. 6 min.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNLQ359ex-U
Energy From Waste: Part 3. 10 1/2 min.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYbkVIjR59M&mode=related&search=
Sorry Garth finger problems, will try once again.
Well said Garth, the truth always hurts, those who bash the East or Quebec and do not stand tall for all of Canada coast to coast to coast should give their head a shake. Here in the East we have sent 100’s thousands of the years West to build the region to what it is to-day many universities have East Coasters in prime education positions, doctors, lawyers, dentists, nurses and just about every trade know. And yet when times were tough with oil shortages what did we here from many ungrateful Cowboys’ “Let them Freeze in the East” oh how they forget the food baskets, money and cloths that were sent by many who did not have much West during the great dust storms! Quebec has a wonderful and proud heritage and needs no foul words from those ill spoken people who are not sure who they dislike more Indians or the French. So your point is well taken by us older people who have heard the sad song before. Our children to-day are much better and see people from a better view and respect all nationalities. For what it is worth should any province need a helping hand I am sure we here on the East Coast will continue to provide assistance despite the bad words of such ill informed people. Remember we all live in same house and should ill winds blow sooner rather than later from dirty air snd yes Climate Change it effects all creatures big and small and yes even self centred individuals in the same manner. So be careful what you say or write, for we all look the same in a Johnie shirt standing in the line up waiting for medical help as fire, floods and other disasters know no boundaries.
By Bonnie N BC on 07.05.08 12:34 pm
There might be an answer with ethanol but its not with what we are currently producing ethanol from.
Brasil has no small population and 40% of the fuel consumed by transport is from sugar cane produced Ethanol. Sugar canes, as most probably don’t know, produce 7 times the hydrocarbons that corn does per acre. Their veichles are “flex” carborated to adjust to varied mixes of Ethanol/gas fuels.
There is a major push to reverse the Ethonol initiatives by the U.S., but the reality of it is that Ethanol’s success is going to be decided by whether or not ethanol producers decide to go with growing sugar canes over corn and if producers can’t make the switch from corn to sugar, then the North American society is far more dumbed down than I originally thought.
Hello Garth,
After a couple of days thinking about what you said re ” Separatists” and knowing how I felt about this for many a year, I totally agree with you. Any Canadian citizen who wants to turn their back or divide our Magnificant Country Canada I would without a doubt say that they are TRAITORS. Bravo, Garth, Bravo
Gary R
Pls note I was born in Quebec, lived there for 28 years, lived in Ontario (Etobicoke) 32 years and balance in BC
Thanks for basically giving the Conservative Party of Canada more votes in Quebec! Do you not realize this is where the votes are at? This was a horrible PR move for the Liberal Party. Almost seems like you were paid off by Harper to make such silly, intollerant comments. Perhaps you are the macho, selfish one!!
Garth, I totally support you! Absolutely support you! Your words meant exactly to those who was “offended” upon. I mean those separatists are bunch power thirsty people whom only wants their 15 minutes of fame on the international stage.
There are certain Canadians whom carrying a Canadian passport while protecting the rights and interests of some other intities, such as their native country or native province.
My comment is regarding Loraine Lamontagne’s comment on 07.04.08 7:44 pm.
The quote you got from Lise Payette’s article in the Devoir is from a popular Québec’s song, by Daniel Boucher, in the early 2000, so it has nothing to with M.Turner ill-chosen rant. No offence, M.Turner, but anyone who can label all those sharing a political opinion like this is nothing but a bigot. Life is mostly grey, not only black and white. I read someone defending you saying that once again, people focused on the words rather than the meaning, for my part it’s even worse. You insult and generally show contempt toward Sovereignist even though it’s not even what you’re talking about, like it was a solid fact being put forward to prove your point. A bit lame, I thought it was a CPC thing to rely on thrash-talking to get attention… oh, right, you were conservative!
Regards.
Pascal Marier-Dionne
Québec City, Québec
Garth:
I saw your pathetic attempt to excuse your racist, bigoted, anti Alberta, anti Quebec
intolerant, corrupt, tyranical Liberal comments!
You are a pathetic excuse for an MP and even for the Liberal Party as corrupt as they are, they do not deserve your crap.
You have stoked the fires of Canadian seperation.
You need to resign!
Idiot!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
28 federal seats in Alberta, 28 Conservative MP’s.
ZERO Liberal MP’s.
Need I say more?
Alberta: 100% rat free!
It is likely that some folk won’t ever see the forest for the trees, or refuse to look beyond the end of their noses and find out what is there.
About 12-18 months ago, with great fanfare Kelowna city council announced that the airport runway was to be increased in size; work began, so direct flights from Frankfurt and London would come straight here, primarily for the skiing season.
A few days ago, Air Canada announced that it would stop their daily flight from Toronto – Kelowna – Toronto on Oct. 25.
No word as to whether this will extend to other airlines, but with the economy (skiing) downhill, my guess is they won’t even start.
So we now have an extended runway — soon to be completed — which probably won’t be used for a few years. We get to pay for it, as our property taxes will go up next year.
Our present council has been spending as if there is no tomorrow, and with all of us old farts not getting any younger, who will cover all these costs?
It won’t be us, that’s for sure, as we will all be pushing up the daisies soon!
****************************************
Part of one para. from John Thompson’s column on castanet.net yesterday:
“. . . more of us held credit cards this past year and we are using them more than ever for everything. Too many Canadians never pay off that monthly balance. That fact never seems to change. Right now the credit card companies are trying new products in their card rosters to get us to use the cards more often. Retailers are paying more for the privilege of Canadians using their cards to pay the bill. The new Infinite cards are the rage today.”
Now, who is The Greater Fool here? The CC companies for trying to entice us to buy more, or us for doing precisely what they want?
Paying off one’s bills every month requires self-discipline — go without something, but don’t ever get further into debt.
Seems as if a number of people are as blind as bats. Too bad for their children, as they are the ones who will end up taking the fall.
****************************************
To jump from the frying pan into the fire, how burnt (or completely stupid) can one be?
http://tinyurl.com/6z2v54
And don’t count on that moronic carbon tax of yours to help win you new members… seriously, that tax (and the very idea of such a tax) is the dumbest thing I’ve heard in a long time.
By Claude Gelinas on 07.05.08 7:10 pm
If I can extrapolate, it means what you are saying is that you haven’t read anything, just reacted on what you “heard”?
If you are interested in debating what I’ve read and what you’ve heard, by all means, lets debate and you can explain to us why what you’ve heard is the dumbest thing you’ve heard in a long time… in detail this time.
By Pascal Marier-Dionne on 07.05.08 7:25 pm
“No offence, M.Turner, but anyone who can label all those sharing a political opinion like this is nothing but a bigot.” – Pascal Marier-Dionne
No offense… uh huh… in a sense, I thought that “self-aggrandizing, hostile, me-first, greedy, macho, selfish and balkanizing” desribes bigot’s quite well
“You insult and generally show contempt toward Sovereignist even though it’s not even what you’re talking about, like it was a solid fact being put forward to prove your point.” – Pascal Marier-Dionne
Please enlighten us as to what it was that Garth was talking about then. And please tell us why you believe Eastern/western sovreigntists have motives as pure as the driven snow in wanting to tear this fine nation apart. Please tell us just where, how what and why the feds have done to the citizens of this wonderful nation such major injustices that entire provinces with their whole populations must separate in protest.
Please expand on this, as I’m sure it is more than just me who wants to hear the major injustices and justifications for such large groups of the population to separate from the nation of Canada. Please enlighten us all as to why sovereignty is such a needed, noble pursuit, I’m sure we would all like to hear just why that is.
By brain on 07.05.08 7:16 pm
Hello Brain
So have you looked at butanol? Brain, I worked for a gasoline retailer that introduced ethanol in the mid-80’s in Western Canada, mainly BC.
The hard reality is that the P.M. is introducing a program that will not save one tailpipe from polluting because 5 – 10% ethanol does nothing according to Environment Canada.
You know, those pesky scientists that strive to report facts are being muzzled.
True, I cannot provide a full precise because Baird shutdown the Environment Canada Department scientists after a CBC report in 2007.
Comments, Brain?
Hi Garth,
I just wanted to let you know that there are many, many Canadians who share your views about the selfishness of demands for separatism, and I certainly am one of them. I admire your courage to speak out about issues that affect Canadians, and I lament the fact that separatism is still even on the agenda these days. As someone who considers herself a patriot, I find it insulting that citizens of this country still see separatism as a viable option.
Thank you for speaking up for those of us who love our country enough to stand up for strong national unity. It is a sorry state of affairs when a person (an MP no less), is so publicly lambasted for doing the right thing.
Cheers,
Alison
I’m a Quebecker, I agree with your comments, and it always ticks me off to see me lumped in as part of the homogenous whole as being offended or being whatever.
good for you Garth! Christ i just read that “john Baird” is asking for a retraction…….now isn’t that something
That block headed idiot would be lucky to find a job in a car wash if he wasn’t in politics 
28 federal seats in Alberta, 28 Conservative MP’s.
ZERO Liberal MP’s.
Need I say more?
Alberta: 100% rat free!
By Tim on 07.05.08 7:59 pm
Tim – more like brain dead.
Seriously, My DH and I had always wanted to drive across Canada, without an agenda. From the comments that I read from those in Alberta & Sask, with a few exceptions, I’d rather take the southern route through the US to get to BC. There’s more to it than the NEP – an inferiority complex perhaps.
The name of the party and the people who put “X’s” through the faces of BlOC members running for Federal election in Quebec seems to have escaped me…Was it Reform later Alliance and now Conservative, perhaps our kind Quebec people can remember?
By brain on 07.05.08 7:16 pm
By Bonnie N BC on 07.05.08 8:22 pm
Hello Brain
So have you looked at butanol? Brain, I worked for a gasoline retailer that introduced ethanol in the mid-80’s in Western Canada, mainly BC. – Bonnie N
To be honest, I haven’t looked into butanol. I’m guessing (but believe it to be a good hypothesis, lol) that most haven’t. If you can provide any informational links that best suit the idea of giving it a major look, by all means (meanwhile, I’m see what I can find).
“The hard reality is that the P.M. is introducing a program that will not save one tailpipe from polluting because 5 – 10% ethanol does nothing according to Environment Canada. – Bonnie N
It doesn’t do anything for C02, but it is a cleaner burning fuel in other ways. Ethanol in the way we are currently generating it is, well, inefficient. We should be growing sugarcanes instead of corn/wheat for ethanol. The advantage to ethanol is not so much environmental as it is with price fixing and easing peak oil demands. As I also recall, ethanol is not solely a Harper initiative but goes back to the Martin government.
My point is that with today’s high prices of energy, consumers need a break and that break can come with ethanol if farmers switch to sugar for ethanol production the way Brazil has. There are, of course, questions that remain including the growing season required for sugar cane and the amounts of rainfall needed but the argument that ethanol is creating food shortages… that one is moot if we look at growing a crop that is 7 times more productive in terms of producing hydrocarbons than corn. Potatoes is also something worth looking into, but I don’t have details to share with you at this time.
“You know, those pesky scientists that strive to report facts are being muzzled.” By Bonnie N
Talk about sad, eh what?
“True, I cannot provide a full precise because Baird shutdown the Environment Canada Department scientists after a CBC report in 2007.” – Bonnie N
Yeah… U.S. multinationals dictate the Harper party agenda now… just glad there are a few MP’s out there who practice true democracy with forums like this where fresh ideas/facts has a chance of getting on the radar of MP’s, journalists, writers and other various intellectuals that can soon turn into true policies that this world/nation needed oh… decades ago?
As always, a pleasure to address and read your posts, Bonnie.
Mr. Turner
Thank you for calling the situation as it is. Separatists are traitors to the country of Canada, plain and simple, and should be dealt with as the traitors that they are.
As for the “damage” done by your honest and accurate assessment of these traitors:
Seems to me you pissed off a few separatist TRAITORS who would never vote Liberal anyway.
Let the arrogant TRAITORS whine all they want. They deserve no respect, in fact zero tolerance would be more appropriate.
No, you didn’t loose any votes for the Liberal party. Not one vote lost.
You might however have won a few from the millions of Canadians who are sick and tired of watching whining separatist TRAITORS getting special treatment.
Thank you Mr. Turner, for standing up for CANADA!
Bravo!
The provinces of Quebec and Alberta are, and will remain PART OF CANADA
Anyone reading this who doesn’t want to be a part of this glorious nation of ours, you are welcome to leave our Canada and find somewhere else to live.
Real bigots can be distinguished from mere partisans or zealots by the fact that they refuse to learn alternatives even when the march of time and/or technology is threatening to obsolete the favoured tool. It is truly said “You can tell a bigot, but you can’t tell him much.”
By Bonnie N BC on 07.05.08 12:34 pm
There might be an answer with ethanol but its not with what we are currently producing ethanol from.
Brasil has no small population and 40% of the fuel consumed by transport is from sugar cane produced Ethanol. Sugar canes, as most probably don’t know, produce 7 times the hydrocarbons that corn does per acre. Their veichles are “flex” carborated to adjust to varied mixes of Ethanol/gas fuels.
There is a major push to reverse the Ethonol initiatives by the U.S., but the reality of it is that Ethanol’s success is going to be decided by whether or not ethanol producers decide to go with growing sugar canes over corn and if producers can’t make the switch from corn to sugar, then the North American society is far more dumbed down than I originally thought.
By brain on 07.05.08 7:16 pm
I have heard hemp would make for a much much better ethanol producing plant. Hell, hemp has a million uses. To bad it has such a bad name.
(JP – How long have you been reading Garth’s blog? Since yesterday.? I’ve never seen you post before. I’m actually beginning to wonder if most of these comments aren’t coming from the CRAP youth group – the ones wearing those T-shirts in front of the Langevin Block the other week.
By kpn on 07.05.08 6:17 pm
Ah, back after a marvelous day at the Antique & Classic Boat Show in Gravenhurst in the warm sun sipping down Muskoka Pale Dry Ginger Ale and a Stella Artois. Fine craftsmanship (an almost lost concept), best friends, fine brew, and single malt, and a dinner to remember forever at the Top 10 rated Wabora Japanese Fusion Steak House.
Yeppers! Sounds like the ‘I know everything because I have a T-shirt groupies’ have been dialed up by the CPC Death Star to come here. Man, like I am really looking forward to the Eagles’ Concert at ACC in two weeks. Blow it out, and TRUTH reigns admist all the BS!
Isn’t is odd how so many real Canadians, aka Quebecers have come here to speak their mind? Isn’t it marvelous that the MSM (norlally brain dead or in a political coma) have wrapped their widdle minds around all of this?
Oh yeah, there be a HAPPENING here! I haven’t seen that since Woodstock, and NO, I have never done drugs, just observed history, and this is a MOMENT!
I think the saying is ‘Shit or get off the pot!’ Meaning the One Holer.
Peace and joy mas ami!
You are right, Pascal Marier-Dionne, the quote that Madame Payette chose to portray her feelings towards the people of Quebec (“you are all a bunch of sickos”) has nothing to do with Garth Turner: it has everything to do with the self-aggrandizing attitude of the separatist elite towards the Quebec people which Garth has aptly and correctly identified. Clearly, Quebecers are not good enough for Madame Payette’s ambitions. For years, the separatist clique has been belittling millions of Quebecers, portraying federalists as retarded, corrupt persons, Elvis Grattons who must endure the ridiculing and bullying tactics of the separatists or else they are labelled as traitors. Garth Turner would refer to this as being hostile and macho and I would agree with him.
How often have you read or heard separatists claim that English Canadians have no culture? How much more self-aggrandizing than that can you get ! I would add ignorant.
Haven’t you noticed, Pascal Marier-Dionne that the separatist clique’s behaviour has only helped to balkanize the debate in Quebec ? Isn’t the Parti Québécois now a third-party in the National Assembly ? Isn’t support for separation stagnant ?
Obviously, Garth Turner has touched on a raw nerve. He has apologized. On the other hand, Lise Payette has not, and never will apologize for expressing her loathing of her own people in her July 4th column in Le Devoir.
le plus drole cest que je suis sure que jai ben beau écrire n importe quoi ils vont me publier pareille,ya pas un criss qui vas prendre la peine de vérifier ques que sa veux dire ..
patriotiste canadien ou quebecois ,de toute maniere ,ont est toutes entrain de ceux faire fourré.
reveillez vous barnak! le nouvelle ordres mondial arrive ,pis vous vous ostiner encore sur sa…informée vous et faites passer l info ,faut pas ceux laisser faire ,cest notre derniere chance,attendez vous d avoir une puce de planté dans le culs ,parce que un coup rendu la ,il seras trop tard…
reopen911@
I have a question for you all regarding this separation talk that rears its countenance from time to time in Quebec. Why do you never hear any of the Franco Americans in upstate New York, Vermont, New Hampshire and Maine talk about separation and even in New Brunswick & Nova Scotia or Newfoundland, for that matter? Are they totally content and complacent with the status quo? Even Northern Ontario’s Francophone community does not join in this foolish debate, except in the far Northwestern Ontario where they have hinted they would be much happier to be part of Manitoba! Maybe Quebec needs to be split up into more manageable pieces that can properly address their needs and desires. If the vast stone desert of the Northern 3/4 of Quebec were to form their own Territory or Province under their Indigenous Leaders and rightful owners, then the residual St. Lawrence River Counties could tend to their real problems of infrastructure and commerce with better direction from within.
Alberta separatism on the other hand, is based on other than cultural/language based issues. Traditionally, Western farmers and ranchers have not received proper remuneration for their produce. Now they have a political party running their province that is not charging the full proper royalties for the oil resources and is not protecting the land from the pollution it is creating. Plus these same politicians point the finger at outsiders for interfering or criticizing their record. I personally saw as a child growing up in these oil fields the wanton spillage of oil, salt water, and toxic fumes. The governments were slow to act but did form Oil & Gas Conservation Boards to require clean ups and reclaimation measures. Recent political intervention has gutted the legislation and made these boards toothless to a degree. At one point the Alberta Government mailed us dividend cheques from the royalty revenues but this $25 silliness stopped when many fingers pointed to the use of this “found bonus” for alcohol by the few. By comparison with other jurisdictions like Norway for example, our politicians have not been good stewards of the revenues to date.
Would Alberta or Saskatchewan be better off if they separated? Not by a long shot, and you only need to go to North Dakota and Montana or Wyoming to see if they are better off from their oil fields. The Western Separatism is in my opinion, self inflicted injury that they are blaming on any body but themselves. When it is discovered that your rights and freedoms have been impinged on by either oil companies, grain companies, or packing plants, then have the gonads to launch a class action lawsuit with EVERYONE on board! The fact that the current Premier renegotiated the royalty rates too low should be taken as an insult to the intelligence of the general population and they should demand that he resign.Tthe complacent attitude on this issue alone tells it all. No guts, no gumption, and no gonads!
By SJ on 07.05.08 9:37 pm
There is a major commercial hemp farm in Oro-Medonte Township Ontario. Check them out.
Franchement, je crois que ce que vous avez déclaré est irrespectueux et stupide. Je vous écrit en français parce que de toute façon vous êtes suposé le comprendre. Je suis un Québécois et fier de l’être. Vos propos ne font que me montrer que j’ai raison de vouloir que mon pays se sépare et que nous n’avons aucune valeur à vos yeux.
Sincèrement, Marc-André
By SJ on 07.05.08 9:37 pm
I meant to add, Sear advertiused Cocaine Kits complete with syringe, a vial of coke, and all the accessories in their 1890 catalouge back when it was ‘fashionsable’! LOL
Oh yes, Bentley had their Cockmobiles on display today as well. Speedo went to 210 (350kph) miles per hour. Like the ‘Crazy People’ ad said ‘Porsche: When you need really good head’ LMAO!
For those who have more money than intellect!
the cpc made deals all the way through with the bloc – now THAT is DEFINITELY a separatist party – and no one takes them on – the journalists treat them like they are a legitimate canadian political party which they are not – don’t even run candidates outside of quebec
so, i say, go get ‘em – better to have it out in the open instead of swept under the rug
Stephen Harper and John Baird: In bed with separatists.
Stéphane Dion and Garth Turner: Not in bed with separatists.
I know where my little X is going.
Yes, Garth, neither those bent on culture and language, nor on physical resourses (especially oil) should have the “right” to set themselves apart from the rest of Canada, for any “reason” (or feeling, either). This is Canada, and anyone who attempts (in any way, to declare themselves “exempt” from any Canadian policy are the onew who are trying to rip Canada apart. We, as Canadians need more unity, and this includes language, culture, and resourses, both natural and human.
Thank you, so much, for not just taking a stand on this, but for upholding this stand against all the hecklers and harrassers who are not willing (or completely unable) to understand your message…for all Canadians of all races, languages, economic backgrounds… Yes, Canada’s main asset is it’s diversity, but this diversity does need cementing together, for the good of the country, as a whole!
Boring !
I’m not your biggest fan, but I’m an even less bigger fan of faux outrage and oversensitivity. Reading your blog every once in a while for so long I’m surprised that all of a sudden it’s in the news.
P.S. please write a blog post about the satellite Canada will be sending up in 2010 to detect asteroids that may hit the Earth. Canada may save the world from destruction with this, you know.
Peut-on trouver une caricature plus parfaite du séparatiste macho et hostile que Sylvain Racine qui prétend que je n’ai pas de vie, que je serais mal ou pas baisée et qui m’invite à foutre le camp du Québec !
And where is that written? The caucus has not seen it. — Garth
Here it is for you Garth. I am surprised you haven’t seen it before.
http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=633027
By Van on 07.05.08 4:53 pm
I was curious, so I did a bit of a search on this quote. Every single article on the internet references Kilgours book as the source of the quote… yet in Kilgours book, he states “Indeed Marc Lalonde in a candid moment later confessed:”
To whom, exactly did he confess this? When did he confess this? Where did he confess this?
I can’t really question Kilgours quotation per say, as no one else seems to have bothered to question it’s authenticity and Lalonde at no point appears to deny it. Still seems strange to me that no one else carries the direct quote from Lalonde but a western, I can’t really say separatist (as I don’t know if he feels that way), but at the very least, western biased journalist (at the time).
Can’t really say much more than I think it’s fishy.
First of all i think that people from Quebec should simmer down. You essentially have your own country save for federal law which you would have anyways…. The same laws just on a smaller scale when it comes to taxes. Actually if you think about it you would probably end up paying more in taxes.
Now for the Albertans, relax.
The oil patch isn’t going anywhere. I work in the oil patch. I love the oil patch, I think we could cut emmissions if we worked towards zero emissions by using inert gasses to avoid venting to atmosphere and flaring. Whats the environmental impact of nitrogen (azote) bien oui je suis francais. That can be used to purge gasses back down the wells. Wells can be tied in to pipelines before they are perforated, instead. This eliminates the need for flaring. The fact of the matter is that we arn’t utilizing the brains we have to eliminate global warming.
If people think global warming is a joke, i live in the Yukon when i was 11, and noticed that the average temperature of 20 deg celcius in july to what seems like 28 as an average for my children to play in outdoor pools in the back yard today, 15 years later.
I SUPPORT Garth Turner!!!
By SJ on 07.05.08 9:37 pm
I meant to add, Sear advertiused Cocaine Kits complete with syringe, a vial of coke, and all the accessories in their 1890 catalouge back when it was ‘fashionsable’! LOL
Oh yes, Bentley had their Cockmobiles on display today as well. Speedo went to 210 (350kph) miles per hour. Like the ‘Crazy People’ ad said ‘Porsche: When you need really good head’ LMAO!
For those who have more money than intellect!
By Bill-Muskoka on 07.05.08 10:10 pm
Heh, The good ol days eh? lol
Look up ethanol hemp on google, interesting reads there. Apparently we can even make the body of the car from hemp. Hemp built car runs on hemp fuel. TALK ABOUT GREEN! lol we could get cheech and chong to advertise it
I totally agree with you Mr. Turner.
Then it also must be selfish to keep us in it against our will… BY DE LORIMIER ON 07.04.08 10:41 PM
Mange de la marde hostie de chien sale
BY MICHEL ON 07.05.08 12:24 PM
Who can argue with snappy comebacks like these?
I gather these aren’t members of the Quebecois intelligentsia. I’m in no position to correct anyone’s French but isn’t it merde?
The fruitcakes have come out of the woodwork on this one Garth, you done good.
Hi JWP…It would be too time consuming to go into complete details as to why I believe that Conrad was railroaded. I’m not saying the guy is an angle by any means…
By Leasa on 07.05.08 2:44 pm
Oh, great comment Leasa … Is Connie an angel with an angle or, maybe an angle waiting for the angels? I suspect your “too time consuming to go into complete details,” means you’ve confused yourself with your original argument.
That “angle,” of whom you speak so affectionately, has been granted 6 1/2 years in the slammer for financial misrepresentation and fraud. He’s exhausted all opportunites for appeal and should exit the ‘big house’ sometime in September 2013. In the end, he will be ‘Laird over all he surveys’ with a much-reduced empire to survey. At this point I think his citizenship is the least of his concerns.
You should write to Connie. I’m sure it would cheer him up … Maybe tell him you think he’s an angle … Tell him you’re an honorary member of DENSA who’s prepared to organize a fan club.
As C.R.A.P. members have proved, time and time again, S.H.I.T. happens.
I’m not saying the guy is an angle by any means…
By Leasa on 07.05.08 2:44 pm
So, let me get this ’straight.’ The guy’s not an ‘angle.’ Gosh, maybe he’s just plain ‘crooked.’
It strikes me that you are a pathetic individual. Well suited for the position you’re in. Politicians themselves reiterate that in order to have intelligent people in parliament we must put a higher value on their worth. I can see why.
Good for you Garth
it’s time someone “Baird” the truth.
Keep telling it like it is Garth. You still have my vote.
The reaction to this, just demonstrates how accruate the statement is. As a Canadian citizen, I am growing very tired of people trying to stop other people from stating their opinions.
I agree with you. People that are secessionist don’t deserve te time of day. Was a time when I was taught if you tried to break up, or hurt, Canada you were committing an act of treason.
I must have missed where all that has changed.
Good on you!!! And stick to your guns.
Oh…by the way…if you’re talking to Bob Rae, tell him we are still hurting in our Ontario provincial healthcare thanks to his boneheaded moves. God help us if he ever becomes leader of the Liberals. We have not forgot.
By SJ on 07.05.08 11:12 pm
And Bills rippin’ it up too, LOL! Good point with hemp. Sugar cane, potatoes, hemp, as Homer would say, “sugar… sugar…” (chuckles)
My patients’ gang you are thus where? We can find a more perfect caricature of the macho and hostile separatist than Sylvain Racine who claims that I have no life, that I would be bad or not kissed and who invites me to go away of Quebec!
Literal translation of this post:
Peut-on trouver une caricature plus parfaite du séparatiste macho et hostile que Sylvain Racine qui prétend que je n’ai pas de vie, que je serais mal ou pas baisée et qui m’invite à foutre le camp du Québec !
By Loraine Lamontagne on 07.05.08 10:55 pm
What a linguistic genius !
actually, any person in thier right mind would want to get the hell out of this lame country called Canada, which was stolen from it’s rightful occupants anyway, like it or not your all descendants of thieves, but thats a moot point.
Your prime minister just celebrated the opening, of the largest Mosque, in Canada, I guess it’s bigger than all the other ones in BC, and Ontario, and your prime minster praised them, for thier religious tolerance, I did not see one women, white or otherwise, nor did I see, anyone of any other ethnic variety, so Canadians are either blind and or just plain stupid.
the largest buiding in Rutland BC is a mosque, the first thing you see upon entering Vancouver on the 3 is a mosque, and yeah muslims are tolerant all right, you just wait and see how tolerant….but not to worry, when those rampant bigots get out of hand, just call Bush he’ll take care of it…
What’s wrong with all you people , i am a born in quebec person and my great relatives are also , and i am tired of all the @#$% bullshit of the parti- quebecqois jamming down our throat wanting to separate from the rest of canada, someone needs to calm the separist down & if it pisses them off than all the more power to them , it has gotten out of control ( the language debate that is ) I had to fake my way through an interview to get a job, even though i was well over qualified for it , and had to fight to get it,just because i was not bilinguil in french, ( which did not involve any interaction of speaking french for this job )i wish that someone would step up and actually protect the rights of the english quebec people , rather than trying to bury us in a hole, oh yeah, eventually the PQ will probably get the vote to separate after years of brainwashing every child that has been born since the 80’s in quebec, it takes a good brainwashing like waco texas, to tell everyone this is the way to go, no matter what the outcome is in the end. I should know i live with a separatist and hear all the comments about why it would be good to separate , but he still hasn’t convinced me that it is the right choice to make.
Gord,
Re: your comment…
Fishing for hypocrisy where it doesn’t exist…..keep on fishing snapper-head.
Daryn
As usual the non thinkers are spouting off about something they though you said without really knowing what you were saying. I wish more so called representatives had cojones to say something about anything without having censors from their keepers ok their thoughts, assuming of course they do have thoughts of their own.
As a westerner I would not hold Kaybec back if they wished to leave. Perhaps we could sell it to Louisiana and throw in Ottawa for good measure.Nothing but a drain on the economy with all the money they suck from us, all the while whinning and sniveling about disticnt society status.They are no more distinct than any other immigrant who made this country what it is. As far as I’m concerned the only distinct society in this country are the natives who were here when we stole it from them.
Now you Kaybecers can pick on me and let Garth try and do a job for you.
Garth,
As I said in an earlier post. If you feel stress, a good bike ride will do you good.
Daryn
Seriously, My DH and I had always wanted to drive across Canada, without an agenda. From the comments that I read from those in Alberta & Sask, with a few exceptions, I’d rather take the southern route through the US to get to BC. There’s more to it than the NEP – an inferiority complex perhaps.
By kpn on 07.05.08 8:51 pm
How old are you kpn? Do you actually think that Albertans or Saskachewans feel that they are inferior to Easterners? Get over it.
However, when thousands of people lose their jobs and their homes because of Trudeau’s (Liberals) ideology, how are they supposed to feel about the Big Brother in Central Canada? They don’t trust the Big Brother!
kpn, the west was settled and built by hard working self reliant people!
kpn, maybe you should travel and speak to them to get to know them. Then you may have a different point of view.
Welcome to the new Canada. Don’t ever speak your mind or have a differing opinion than someone else lest you might insult or insult them. Grow some backbone people and just get over it. I wasn’t a real fan of yours when you switched to the Liberals but anyone who has the balls to say how they really feel has my respect. Hey…is that the Thought Police at my door?
Well said Garth!…and it’s about time. I spent several years in Alberta where the people continuously voted in “King Ralph” and his bandits. Needless to say, nothing was accomplished. They decided to vote in Stelmach who won a majority based on the lowest voter turn-out in history. Ask any Albertan (40 years old or younger) on how we could tackle the issue of escalating fuel costs. Each and everyone of them will suggest that we use our own oil and gas at discounted prices. Sounds like the NEP to me, doesn’t it? Something to chuckle about?
We’re in Montreal now for school. Montreal is an island in more ways than one. It’s a mess and that’s nothing to be proud about. Some french Montrealers have said “if you don’t like, leave!” I respectfully ask them to “lead the way.”
Ironic isn’t it?
If we dissect all of the provinces, we will find a vast variety of people. Happy people and people full of piss and vinegar. It’s the nature of the beast. Quebec and Alberta are just pissed because their incompetence is being exposed at the moment while the other provinces are laying low.
Nobody wants to be pissed on, so don’t antagonize the spout. That being said, Happy 400th to Quebec City!
Mr. Turner. You should be ashamed of yourself and your racist comments. I’m a staunch liberal supporter but will not vote liberal next election because of your silly comments. Nobody wants to see this country ripped apart by any means. So as someone else said “get over yourself’!!
Racist? Since when are separatists a race? — Garth
Well done Garth,
Those Socialist Separatist deserved a lot worst dont be so gentile the next time around kick their spirits for good.
@ JOE HUEGLIN
The French Revolution occurred a generation after Canada was lost to France.
- Pis? (So what?)
@ PYOTR PETROBITCH
le roi Louis le quinzième, le seizième et Napoleon de Napanee et tous les autres?
- Phrase incompréhensible en français??? (Don’t bother TRYING to write in French)
@ BILL-MUSKOKA
One thing that I find really nice about the French comments is I can skip right past them and not blink an eye. LOL
Some may even be complimentary to Garth, but who knows?
- You need to add more RAM to your brains in order to be able to understand just ANOTHER language. Ciao!
@ BONNIE N BC
Thank you for your English post. You’re absolutely correct. Since we had very token French language classes in the 60’s sadly, my French is non-existent. Things are very different now; my niece has been in French emersion school since grade school here in BC.
– Obvioulsy an asset for her future.
Would you care to comment further Austerlitz on the Green Shift Plan?
- In my opinion its a good shift towards the right direction. Dion is man of idea, not marketing.
@ MARC
I have absolutly no use for French other then knowing how to order a beer or a burger in France or Belgium.
- There is no doubt in my mind you are stupid enough to eat burgers in France and Belgium. I would rather suggest une Entrecôte bordelaise. It’s not a mvie title and you don’t know what you’re missing…
@ BEN
Anyone reading this who doesn’t want to be a part of this glorious nation of ours, you are welcome to leave our Canada and find somewhere else to live.
- Glorious? You mean Canada won all medals at the latest Canadian Games? Quite and achievement… Oh, I forgot the Canada Cup (cos the Stanley Cup is yet in the US) Keep on bowing to a queen, laquais.
Hej, Garth, I just want to make sure you understand that Stephane Dion will get less then 15% of the votes in Quebec at the next elections.
I can tell you that the Bloc Quebecois will get more seats and the PCC too.
I can also tell you that Quebeckers, separatists or not, do not give a damn of Canada. The one who are not separatists just enjoy the statu quo and live up on the pseudo good reputation that Canada has. People in the media try to make look the separatists as retards and unintelligent. Good! But separatists think exactly the same of the people who voted for Trudeau, Chrétien, Harper, etc. And separatists, we are laughing to dead since the Libs put Dion at the head of the party. What a bunch of morons. And seriously Garth, you are just a puppet, going from the Cons to the Libs.
Also, if some English Canadians hated Trudeau and Chrétien, you have to blame the federalists in Quebec, not the séparatists. Gilles Duceppe is so far the best deputy you have had in Ottawa in the last 13 years. If you deputy and Minister would work as hard for you interest in your own provinces, it would maybe go better in Canada. Instead, you complaint against the separatists. MAn, you are the ones who do the centralisation in Ottawa by electing morons from Quebec who screw either Quebecois or the Rock. All this, it is not separatists, it is yours deputy and the non-caring loving statu quo of French Canadians morons in Quebec like Lorraine Lamontagne.
Having had the opportunity to see first hand how nationalism flourished in Scotland and to a lesser extent Wales, as well of course as the partisan politics of Northern Ireland, I think you should be a little more careful in your public statements. While of course it currently seems as though your party has little hope of any electoral gains in Alberta, I imagine a number of Liberals there, much embattled, are wishing you had kept these thoughts to yourself or used some modicum of political judgment. Smug comments from English politicians in London simply fed the ire of Scots and reinforced already entrenched views. They helped feed the growth of separatism, rather than retard it.
So too here in Alberta, for all you have done is to provide your opponents in this province with further evidence of the disdain that is presumed to exist in the east towards Alberta, its people and its economic success. Comments like these, ill-judged, unnecessary and in the end having more to do with political grandstanding (“Look at me, look at me, I have something noteworthy to say”) than political groundbreaking, do nothing to advance the cause of your party in Quebec or Alberta.
Freedom of speech goes hand in hand with the freedom to shoot your party in the foot. I suspect your party will have cause to cringe at future points in the electoral seasons to come, when your quotes here are dragged out again in both provinces.
I doubt that Canada is in any danger of breaking apart so this tirade was somewhat pointless, but your party here has almost been totally exterminated politically and you have done nothing to further its revival. As for Quebec, well I imagine it is much the same there.
Regardless of the veracity of what you said, delivery is all and in politics trundling around like a verbal bull in a china shop is wonderful stuff in the moment, and a great headline grabber, but substance-wise in respect of the important issues at the core of your posts, well you should have been more astute. Curbing the excesses of your tongue and typing fingers is not curtailing your right to express yourself, it is simply sir evidence of sound, mature political judgment. If your party is successful and returns to power, a big “if”, your comments here may also have condemned you to life on the backbenches, for what Prime Minister would wish to risk giving you a larger and bigger soapbox to stand on for your rants?
Frankly I chuckled when I read about this as it is likely to just help seal the fate of the Liberals in Alberta. Obviously a number in your own party are not chuckling and you may want to give pause and consider the ramifications of ill-disciplined public ranting, before you type. Then again, keep typing
Turner, you are about to be left aside by the Libs: http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20061018/turner_suspended_061018/20061018?hub=TopStories
With this kind of coverage by CTV, the Libs cannot afford to keep you. And be sure that the separatists blogs are going to use you to make look the Libs fool. You can try with the NDP now
Man, you make look the English Canadians so supid and helpless toward nous, les Québécois, ayant une longue histoire, une très riche culture et une province hautement charmante. We do not need you!
Hey, Lucien buddy, hate to break to it you, but that story is two years old. The Conservatives do not allow free speech, you are quite right, unlike the Liberals. What’s the Bloc position? — Garth
Why are so many people upset about your personal opinion concerning the minority of individuals in this country who do in fact cause so much of our disharmony? They seem to have no problem resorting to name-calling and use of profanity against you. They need to get a grip. Fortunately, the younger generations are seeing how wonderful this country really is and how we get along for the most part in spite of our diverse mosaic. Either that or they don’t dive a damn – which I suppose isn’t that bad a position either since there are really bigger issues to worry about in this world.
Garth, its liberals like yourself and Dion that are going to get Harper a majority. So, keep up the good work. You expose the liberals for the blind ideologues that they are.
Although I dont agree with the religious backing behind some of the conservative MP’s I do agree with their determination to pay down the national debt. Of course right now they can take those steps because they are unpopular and the liberals and NDP would rile at such gutting of social programs.
check this out, Garth, and put it in your carbon tax grab bag …Dion is going down, so you had better hang on!
Cap-and-trade is not a market mechanism
Diane Katz, Financial Post Published: Friday, June 27, 2008
The premiers of Ontario and Quebec are preparing to impose stricter limits on emissions of fossil fuels to combat climate change. They and others favour an approach dubbed “cap-and-trade,” which is frequently described as a “market” solution to pollution. In Ottawa, Liberal leader Stephane Dion is promoting cap-and-trade in his Green Shift plan. The Conservatives, too, are touting cap-andtrade as part of their plan. Despite their claims, there’s not much that is market-friendly about cap-and-trade, and no amount of rhetorical masquerading can conceal the costly consequences that enactment would inflict on Canadian citizens.
For Quebec and Ontario, the two Liberal premiers signed a memorandum of understanding on June 2 that calls for “strong, immediate and sustained actions to minimize the risks posed by climate change.” They characterize their proposal as a “flexible, market-based mechanism.”
Under cap-and-trade, the government sets an overall limit (cap) on emissions. Based on that cap, quotas are imposed on sources of emissions, such as utilities and factories. The government allocates “allowances” to each facility that represents the volume of their quota. A facility must either reduce emissions to meet the quota or purchase allowances from those that have exceeded their required reductions (trade).
Europe adopted cap-and-trade in 2005 and the results were far from stellar. The Washington Post described it as “a bureaucratic morass with a host of unexpected and costly side effects and a much smaller effect on carbon emissions than planned.”
Cap and trade does sound friendlier than ” CO2 rationing” or “carbon taxes.” But this regulatory regime encompasses both. It is based upon the creation of a scarcity by government fiat (the cap on CO2 emissions) and the rationing of remaining supply through government-imposed quotas. The cost of compliance constitutes a tax by raising the cost of carbon-based fuels to curtail use.
The levels at which the cap and the quotas are set are arbitrary. No matter what politicians or the media claim, no one knows the amount of emissions that would make a difference in global temperatures. Therefore, there is no “correct” cap to address climate change. That leaves politicians and lobbyists for all sorts of special interests to haggle over
the quotas. And that makes cap-and-trade a political mechanism, not a market mechanism.
We are thus left to hope that regulators make a small mistake instead of a big one. For example, a low cap (requiring significant emissions reductions) would be costlier and thus create economic hardship throughout the economy. Conversely, a high cap (requiring smaller emissions reductions) would waste resources because the cost of emissions reductions would be greater than the benefit — to the extent that there would be any benefit at all.
Big corporations are likely to weather the regulations better than small firms — especially if the government allocates emissions allowances free of charge. The cost of emissions control technology or the purchase of additional allowances would likely be paid by consumers in the form of higher prices. But there’s no additional product or service provided in return, nor are the emissions reductions likely to produce any tangible benefit. Consequently, cap-andtrade constitutes a massive wealth transfer from consumers to businesses.
The worst effects will likely be felt by those trying to break into the market after cap-and-trade is launched. Newcomers will face a competitive disadvantage before they even open their doors. Having not obtained free allowances from the government, their costs will be greater than those of their competitors. Simply put, cap-and-trade raises barriers to entry in a most un-market-like fashion.
Proponents point to the use of cap-and-trade in reducing emissions of sulphur dioxide as proof of its utility. But there are significant differences between the two applications. In the case of sulphur dioxide, the technology for capturing emissions was commercially available when the cap-andtrade program was imposed– unlike emissions controls for carbon dioxide. Moreover, the emissions strictures were imposed on only one sector — power plants — unlike the CO2 limits that would encompass all segments of the economy
Because control technologies for CO2 are nascent, the actual costs of emissions reductions are unknown and likely to fluctuate over time. This will create volatility in the price of allowances, thereby adding greater uncertainty to investment decisions. Most economists recognize that uncertainty repels rather than attracts investment.
The market already is responding to claims of climate change — with hybrid cars, green power programs, voluntary emissions reductions and the like. Government rationing of carbon-based emissions should not be confused with voluntary conservation options. The principle difference is that under cap-and-trade, the government would not offer citizens the choice of participation and would force us to pay the cost. That’s not how the market works.
-Diane Katz is director of risk, environment and energy policy studies for the Fraser Institute.
thank god for politicians like you who are not afraid to speak their mind, even – and especially – when their message is unpopular.
i agree with you 100%
Garth,
You once again have affirmed why Alberta and Quebec have such a hard time voting Liberal. You arrogant, self righteous, ass hole. your right if anyone is against growth in Ontario and is for growth outside of Ontario they are labeled separatist. I love Canada but also believe that Ontario is not the only place in Canada. They do not represent me at all. I live in Alberta I am not a redneck and I am tired of Ottawa and the Liberal politicians stand on Quebec and Alberta. Yes we love Canada, no we do not love taking shit and we will not stand for it. Resign now.
Nice speech. But my comments were not aimed at all Albertans, only those who mutter about secession. — Garth
separatists, who put regional and self-interest ahead of the national cause
says Garth.
But separatists are especially good at sacrificing themselves for what they believe to be “the national cause”. It’s just that their nation is Quebec! Is it so hard to understand?
Mr. Turner, you represent exactly what the Quebec and Alberta separatists want to separate from: A liberal WASP of Ontario who was born and raise thinking that this country, centrally controlled both economically and politically by his home province, was to work endlessly in favor of his own and sole interests.
This time is fortunately over. We are now enjoying a new era of regionally splitted power, and Canada, a country that was to remain crystallized until the end of times under the liberal leadership, is now reforming and adapting to the future. For the sake of ALL Canadians, not only the narrow-minded, macho, greedy, me-first, selfish, sovietizing WASP like you that reside in Ontario.
Couldn’t agree with you more. Sometimes people are afraid to speak the truth for fear of harming someone. Unfortunately, those people only harm themselves by being too timid to be truthful.
Regardless of what political persausion a person may be does not give anyone the right to question their motives.
These people in Quebec and the West pay taxes to the government similar to all the others that did not fall into the category you took pride in critizing.
These same people contribute to your wage and your employment. As an MP you do not have the right to question what individuals may stand for. It is up to political parties to persaude people that their view may not be in the best interest of Canada as we know it.
To call these individuals names and to insult their beliefs is beyond the pale.
If Mr Dion had any balls he would have kicked your sorry ass out of the Liberal party. I will be e mailing him recommending that course of action.
It will be intersting to see the polls in Quebec on how they view the Liberal party after your comments. You could do this party a big favour by leaving before you cause anymore grief for the leader.
Recently you said you were finished with this blog. If you want to defend separatists, go visit Blogging Tories. — Garth
@ Lorraine Lamontagne : vous choisissez vos combats c’est bien évident. Continuez vos diatribes, manifestement vous ne répondez que si vous croyez avoir raison. Dites-vous que ce blogue est bien innofensif et que l’on fait beaucoup plus pour la cause souverainiste (c’est si difficile à dire n’est-ce pas !) dans nos salles de classe par exemple. Je dois avouer que j’ai moi-même contribué à l’endoctrinement (pour user de votre langage!) de milliers de cégepiens et d’universitaires par le truchement de suggestion de lecture et par un retour à l’histoire de notre peuple. Car nonobstant votre penchant pour le conquérant, beaucoup de mes collègues palient le manque de culture historique par un juste rappel des faits. N’est-ce pas normal que les nôtres sachent combien de leurs ancêtres ont été pendus arbitrairement en 1837-38, n’est-ce pas normal que les nôtres sachent ce qu’il en coûté à la collectivité québécoise (canadienne à l’époque mais le conquérant nous a usurpé notre identité…)que la crise de la conscription, n’est-ce pas normal que les plus jeunes sachent comment leurs parents ont été traités pendant la crise d’Octobre en 1970, les arrestations arbitraires, l’emprisonnement illégal de plus de 500 québécois, enfin, n’est-il pas essentiel que les nôtres se remémorent comment la colonie a été abandonnée en 1754 par la mère patrie et comment les descendants français ont fait l’objet d’un troc sur l’autel des des royautés du vieux-monde…
Mais non. Ce n’est guère important. Selon vous il n’importe que la disparition au plus vite des méchants séparatisses (cela ne vous avantage guère que ce truchement du langage par Ti-Jean Chrétien) et enfin de ce foutu langage, cette foutue culture qui empêche le melting pot multiculturel, cette bouette canadienne… J’imagine que pour vous les wallons sont des méchants séparatisses, comme les catalans, les irlandais, les tibétains, etc…
Selon le centre pour la sauvegarde du partrimoine mondial de l’UNESCO, chaque fois qu’une langue, qu’une culture, qu’un peuple s’efface devant les assauts d’un peuple conquérant, devant les impératifs d’une mondialisation qui ne favorise, en fin de compte que les possédants, c’est une partie de son bagage génétique social que l’être humain atrophie. La lente marche vers le déclin. Et vous êtes là, à donner les premiers coups… si pathétique…
What’s really frightening is that this attitude seems to prevail in Central Canada-even though Alberta punches way above its weight in propping up the country we are always the bad guys.
It’s really easy to attack Alberta and our Eastern media is way ahead of the curve on that but it’s lot harder to understand us.
I can tell you this-another transfer of wealth via a carbon tax designed more to perpetuate social programs under the guise of being eco-driven will be a huge mistake.
I’m not sure if Steady Eddie Stelmach has the stones to back off a grasping money hungry program like the green shift-Klein and Lougheed sure didn’t.
However, this is a different Alberta than the one that Trudeau raped in the early 80’s and even though you Easterners choose to marginalize Alberta we will not roll over this time-there’s way too much at stake and even if our Premier doesn’t have the stones poeple who lost so much during the last major attack on Alberta via a Liberal program aimed at Alberta do..
You’re a pompous ass Garth, a big mouth that doesn’t have to answer for anything he says. Canada is fed up with self proclaimed ‘leaders’ like you, and the current polarization of the nation reflects that.
For decades most Albertans wanted in on Canada and its decision making progress and your liberal cronies wouldn’t have it. Fine – many of us now want out.
Albertans do not suffer fools lightly and we have pretty much had it with the likes of you.
What’s the threat? I’m unclear. — Garth
Much ado about nothing – the Cons trying to grab onto something and make it a wedge issue. Especially funny to see that big mouth gas bag who is always saying nasty things, chastizing
Garth – talk about the pot calling the kettle black, meaning John Baird of course.
Mr Turner
Whether I left or not I give you the truth along with the facts and I stand behind my name and not use a phoney title.
After catching the news and seeing you being interviewed I checked your blog to see what all the fuss was about.
On reading what you had to say about your fellow canadians especiallly in and around Canada Day was somewhat surprising and out of line. We all want one Canada and it is all our jobs to persuade everyone to stay united and work together.
If the truth was know even the Bloc wants a united Canada. They are just afraid to say it as they like their seat as an MP. If they did not why then would they partake in the debates and as members of the committees.
I never followed your blog until you became a Liberal and I wanted to see what everyone was talking about. Now I can see why you had a problem with Mr Harper. The only difference with him and Mr Dion he would not tolerate your nonsense.
Mr Dion cannot get rid of you as it would not look too good for him. However, I recommended that he should have cut you loose some time ago. It is obvious that you are not a team player. The statements that can be attributed to you the past six months has had an affect on the Liberal brand. You are the best asset for the conservatives as everytime you open your mouth you put your foot in it.
I believe you love the TV lights.
Maybe you should just cool it and stick to politics and the issues at hand and stop shooting from the lip.
Thanks. Never thought of that. — Garth
Garth: I’m a Western separatist.
Thank you, thank you, thank you … you are dream come true.
Garth,
Albertans are so paranoid about outsiders harming their economy. Separatism would do more harm the the NEP could ever do.
Daryn
As a French Canadian and ex-Québécois, I do not consider the comments “racist”, and I actually agree with several epithets. Chers Québécois, j’aimerais tant que vous vous calmiez les nerfs! Ça fait vingt ans que j’ai quitté le Québec, mais c’est toujours le même discours parano! Ben oui, c’est ça, nous sommes un peuple conquis, brimé, menacé, et quoi encore! Les hurluberlus d’Impératif français et de la Société Saint-Jean-Baptiste, ils vous représentent, peut-être? Et moi, combien de commentaires désobligeants de votre part ai-je entendus sur le Canada anglais! Alors le numéro des vierges offensées, ça suffit. Réveillez-vous, regardez les choses en face et ouvrez-vous un peu au reste du monde.
Back from three glorious sunny days working my ass off at the internet-less cottage, and have caught up on the nearly 300 comments added since my departure.
What you have done here, Garth, is to hold up a mirror in which commenters reflect and reveal themselves. We now have some pretty ugly, purpose-driven people in this country. Thank God for the mass of common sense Canadians, or the Peaceable Kingdom would be history.
P.S.: Catherine, I know it’s Stampede time, but do get off the round-up horseshit.
François,
we do not miss you. One Elvis Gratton less in the lot!
Hello Garth,
While many people may be tying up your phone lines and flooding your inbox with complaints, this gentleman intends to do the opposite.
I congratulate you on having the fortitude to make those comments and to not back down about them; it takes a backbone to stick to one’s guns, even if half the country finds them unpopular and *chuckles* “racist.” Last I checked with your blog, I saw no racist words in any way, shape or form.
I support those comments of yours wholeheartedly, when it comes to the issue of Separatists in Quebec. I have nothing against people from Quebec, I have a problem with the Separatists and their selfish attitudes. Keep sticking to your guns, Canada needs more open and honest politicians.
Thank you!
L’indépendance du Québec est une idée politique. Nous devons respecter les diverses idées politique. Peut-être que tu es trop stupide pour comprendre cela…
I can’t wait until this country broke apart. We don’t have anything in common.
Fuck you garth turner
F.C. Morrisette
Je préfère devenir un pays de merde que de rester avec le Canada même dans l’insouciance de ma jeunesse. Sérieux j’men fou que tout le monde me prenne pour une fou c’est reconnu le monde aime pas les souvrainistes on répresente une menace pour la société
Je préfère mourir debout que vivre à genoux j’emmerde toutes les torontois qui m’insultent et tous les québécois qui sont pas foutus d’être fiers de ce qu’ils ont et de ce qu’ils sont. Je veux dire pas du genre Idylle mais plus du genre martin ou CFM.
Pour ce qui est de faire de gagnants et des perdants avec l’indépendance le Canada je ne suis pas sur s’il serait perdant ou gagnant mais ce qui est sur c’est que le Québec sera gagnant. La liberté de notre peuple est le combat de ma vie.
A mon avis le vrai défi du canada de demain sera de se définir comme peuple face au États-unis sans le Québec. Ce n’est pas seulement avec le Hockey et Avril Lavigne qu’un peuple se définie. Il faut que le Québec et le Canada soit différents du peuple des USA parce que sinon ce sont les USA qui vont nous assimiler avec des bulldozers.
Au Québec on est consient de la menace d’assimilation a la majorité anglophone, voila pourquoi nous tentons de nous protéger en nous donnant un État. Mais la définition de notre peuple est clair face au rest of canada
- nous ne parlons pas la même langue,
-nous n’avons pas la même culture,
-pas la même histoire
- pas la même religion,
-institution publique différente
-idéologie politique généralement plus progresiste que nos amis Canadiens ou États-Uniens
Les différences sont claires mais entre le Canada est les States ? a part le Hockey c’est pas évident et pourtant les canadiens ne voudrait pas être américains même s’il sont presque pareil on mérite peut être plus d’être souverain que les canadiens face au américains. Entk on est plus différent.
Respectueusement cher voisins Canadiens
Si au moins tu avais eu la grâce “monsieur Turner” d’écrire en anglais et français ton message, nous aurions pu voir qu’il y a une particule de vous qui a une minime ouverture d’esprit et ça n’a pas l’air d’être le cas.
Al Gore is not only a liar and hypotcrit by a sore loser why dont he just go home and SOAK HIS HEAD IN BUBBLEBATH
cARBON TAXES JUST ANOTHER RIP OFF FROM A BUNCH OF GREEDY BURICRATS LOOKING TO ROB THE PUBLIC WITH WORTHLESS TAXES AND ESPECIALY THAT SCUMBALL al gore